Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

Ellipsis

(9,124 posts)
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 12:11 PM Jan 2019

Salvator Mundi a $450 million painting and the Mueller investigation collide.

What an intriguing read.

https://narativ.org/2019/01/02/salvator-mundi-art-of-the-deal-the-lost-davinci/

Saudi Arabia’s Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman appears to have ‘lost’ the world’s most expensive painting. The Leonardo da Vinci masterpiece, Salvator Mundi, may hold the key to the Trump-Russia investigation. And, the artwork itself could be evidence of collusion.

Leonardo da Vinci’s ‘last’ masterpiece was to be unveiled on September 18 at the spellbinding new Louvre in Abu Dhabi, but the exhibit was put on a temporary hold, amid rumours the painting was lost.

The art world has become increasingly alarmed. After all, Salvator Mundi is the most expensive artwork ever sold. “Nobody outside the immediate Arab hierarchy knows where it is,” Da Vinci scholar Martin Kemp told The Times.

Questions are being raised. First, why did the Crown Prince of Saudi Arabia, an art novice, buy the masterpiece? Secondly, why did he overpay for it by $300 million? Even for the stupendously wealthy Prince Mohammed bin Salman, that’s not just a simple rounding error. How do you misplace a $450 million painting anyway?

44 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Salvator Mundi a $450 million painting and the Mueller investigation collide. (Original Post) Ellipsis Jan 2019 OP
Savior of the World, hear my plea Achilleaze Jan 2019 #1
...ironic isn't it. Ellipsis Jan 2019 #2
Cozmically ironic Achilleaze Jan 2019 #3
This! Anon-C Jan 2019 #5
It certainly puts a twist on the second coming of christ. Ellipsis Jan 2019 #30
Howling with laughter malaise Jan 2019 #4
and I yours Ellipsis Jan 2019 #29
Thanks malaise Jan 2019 #32
Errr...that's not how it goes TrogL Jan 2019 #10
Somehow that does not translate well to Latin - but I bet it could hav a nice ring to it! csziggy Jan 2019 #27
Trump's massively complex conspiracy is unraveling... Read procon Jan 2019 #6
I love/hate this story superpatriotman Jan 2019 #7
I know what you mean! Pacifist Patriot Jan 2019 #21
you're not looney, they're extra greedy Hermit-The-Prog Jan 2019 #38
Psy-Group scumbaggery superpatriotman Jan 2019 #8
Did anybody check under the sofa cushions? tclambert Jan 2019 #9
Okay my mind is spinning yet again PatSeg Jan 2019 #11
If somebody wrote a book murielm99 Jan 2019 #13
And how many volumes would the book have to be?! Pacifist Patriot Jan 2019 #20
Seriously PatSeg Jan 2019 #23
Oh, I agree PatSeg Jan 2019 #22
K & R malaise Jan 2019 #12
I hate it when that happens matt819 Jan 2019 #14
Fascinating. I just recently rewatched this auction on YouTube. Mrs. Overall Jan 2019 #15
These wealthy people and their attempts to launder dirty money/pass dirty money to each other/... SWBTATTReg Jan 2019 #16
damn!, Damn!, DAMN!!! OneBro Jan 2019 #17
Oh my. . . matt819 Jan 2019 #18
"...until it eventually sold for a mere 45 Pounds at a Sotheby's auction in 1958" sandensea Jan 2019 #19
K/R BadgerMom Jan 2019 #24
Thanks for sharing, this is a good read. Hotler Jan 2019 #25
I can't find a single reputable broad-based news source reporting on this. TygrBright Jan 2019 #26
Pearls before swine Blue Owl Jan 2019 #28
I don't think the painting existed...I think this was all a scam to launder money cbdo2007 Jan 2019 #31
K&R Scurrilous Jan 2019 #33
their have been several deep dives into the Dmitry Rybolovlev/Yves Bouvier saga dixiegrrrrl Jan 2019 #34
Bank of Cyprus -Dimitry-Wilbur Ross-Putin connection: dixiegrrrrl Jan 2019 #35
Thanks for posting dixiegrrrl. Ellipsis Jan 2019 #37
Have you ever read this book? UpInArms Jan 2019 #39
Wow....sounds like a good read. dixiegrrrrl Jan 2019 #40
It is riveting UpInArms Jan 2019 #41
Just bought a hardbound copy for 5.00 on amazon dixiegrrrrl Jan 2019 #43
Me, too, on buying used UpInArms Jan 2019 #44
big enough and complex enough to succeed Hermit-The-Prog Jan 2019 #36
We're all living in a Robert Anton Wilson novel... First Speaker Jan 2019 #42

Achilleaze

(15,543 posts)
1. Savior of the World, hear my plea
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 12:17 PM
Jan 2019

"Reveal Thou the Total Truth. Save us pitiful earthly peeps from all the skanky, stanky KGOP republican perfidy, deceit, abomination, collusion, theft, treason, and all the other evil shit they are pumping into the Mundi."

Sincerely, Yr. 'umble petitioner

csziggy

(34,136 posts)
27. Somehow that does not translate well to Latin - but I bet it could hav a nice ring to it!
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 03:46 PM
Jan 2019

At least with Google Translate:

Summa est veritas es revelare. Miserandam terrenis omnibus salvare peeps skanky, popularem stanky KGOP perfidiae dolos abominationem collusionem furto insidiarum et stercore quod malis in elit mundi.

procon

(15,805 posts)
6. Trump's massively complex conspiracy is unraveling... Read
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 12:40 PM
Jan 2019

the article to the end to grasp the extent of his efforts to defraud the US and receive voters.

superpatriotman

(6,247 posts)
7. I love/hate this story
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 12:42 PM
Jan 2019

On one hand it makes perfect sense and, if true, is provable in a court of law.
On the other, it makes me feel like a loony conspiracy theorist.

In March, The Daily Mail revealed the counter-bidder was Abu Dhabi Crown Prince Mohammed bin Zayed (MbZ). The princes claimed they had no idea the other was bidding and dismissed the whole thing as a mistake.

To be clear, these are the very same crown princes George Nader represented at the August 3rd meeting with Donald Trump, Jr. and whom, Nader promised, would pay for the social media campaign

Hermit-The-Prog

(33,321 posts)
38. you're not looney, they're extra greedy
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 10:06 PM
Jan 2019

Enormous amounts of money are at stake, along with the power to keep sucking it in.

PatSeg

(47,397 posts)
11. Okay my mind is spinning yet again
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 02:19 PM
Jan 2019

This whole story is getting more and more complex all the time. The last two years has been like one long mini series.

murielm99

(30,733 posts)
13. If somebody wrote a book
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 02:35 PM
Jan 2019

with all this crap in it, it would never be published. Too improbable. Too over the top.

PatSeg

(47,397 posts)
22. Oh, I agree
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 03:21 PM
Jan 2019

I wouldn't be able to get past the first chapter or two. Much too absurd even for fiction.

matt819

(10,749 posts)
14. I hate it when that happens
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 02:35 PM
Jan 2019

First I can't remember where I put my coffee.

Then I can't find my phone.

Then I misplace my $450 million painting.

Getting old sucks.

Mrs. Overall

(6,839 posts)
15. Fascinating. I just recently rewatched this auction on YouTube.
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 02:39 PM
Jan 2019

Can't wait to see how this plays out...and where in the hell is that painting?

SWBTATTReg

(22,112 posts)
16. These wealthy people and their attempts to launder dirty money/pass dirty money to each other/...
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 02:40 PM
Jan 2019

and all of the other methods and so forth via buying 'clean assets' w/ dirty money, etc. is almost like a comedy sketch, but one that isn't funny. If this describes the act of just a few wealthy people to escape taxation/escape having their money traced/tracked, etc. responsibility (rump, Saudi Arabia, Russia), then think of this scary scenario, that many wealthy people/entities have engaged in this practice multiple times, year after year.

This practice among w/ others is what rump seems to claim in his so called ability to avoid paying taxes and I think this is the big reason why he doesn't want to show us his tax returns. This is not a privacy issue, this is a criminal issue and it needs to be acted upon.

These schemes are ripping ALL of us off big time. I love to know the excuses that republicans will use in order to deflect or defeat efforts to continue to defund the IRS. If anything, the new House of Representatives should pass beefed up tax collection efforts (or at least the states should) to go after these people/entities. If the Senate votes no on this issue, I'd love to hear their rationale as to why, and then thrown them in jail after due process, for failing to perform their basic duty to the US and their oaths.

Remember the Panama Papers? It detailed numerous accounts of offshore LLPs setup solely for the purposes of tax avoidance. I know that (or least I think we do) that the IRS has in place a system of awards should someone/some group id tax avoidance schemes be identified to the IRS and tax revenues recovered.

This needs to be beefed up in serious terms, w/ severe tax penalties being imposed (seize estates if need be (this already happens w/ drug dealers today)), awards being massively increased and the authorities of independent entities increased so they can all go after these crooks instead of just the IRS.

To protect ourselves, thresholds be established so abuses won't occur during the execution of this new or enhanced process, such as estates over $100 Million dollars or more are subject to this kind of collection effort.
Once setup, a competent group of international tax lawyers, forensic accountants (all common US citizens) could work for our government (and us thus), and scoring a commission on recovered tax revenues. We all would win.

OneBro

(1,159 posts)
17. damn!, Damn!, DAMN!!!
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 02:43 PM
Jan 2019

I had a chance to buy that thing at a garage sale two weeks ago for $60 but the guy refused to throw in the frame. Man, it would have looked so good in my storage unit.

matt819

(10,749 posts)
18. Oh my. . .
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 02:45 PM
Jan 2019

From The Washington Post in Dec 2017:

--- snip ---

New York-based art collector and da Vinci expert Robert Simon and art dealer Alexander Parish found the painting in Louisiana in 2005 and purchased it for $10,000.

It then underwent a six-year restoration and verification process.

In 2013, a consortium of dealers including Simon, Parish and Warren Adelson sold “Salvator Mundi” for $80 million to a company owned by a Swiss businessman and art dealer Yves Bouvier, Bloomberg reported. Bouvier, in turn, sold it to Russian billionaire Dmitry Rybolovlev for $127.5 million in 2014.

Rybolovlev owned the painting until Nov. 15, when Prince Bader made it the world’s most expensive painting by shelling out $450,312,500 for it.

--- snip ---

Rybolovlev bought trump's Florida property in 2008 for $95 million, overpaying by tens of millions of dollars. Just as MBS and/or Abu Dhabi bought the painting for probably $200 million more than they should have.

Money laundering anyone?


sandensea

(21,624 posts)
19. "...until it eventually sold for a mere 45 Pounds at a Sotheby's auction in 1958"
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 02:58 PM
Jan 2019

There you have it. Ours is indeed a humorous God.

BadgerMom

(2,770 posts)
24. K/R
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 03:29 PM
Jan 2019

Fascinating, frightening and infuriating.

Apropos of nothing, the story in the link mentioned Rybolovlev’s Monaco penthouse, La Belle Époque. The only other time I’d read about a Monaco penthouse was when stories about the mysterious fiery death of Edmund Safra were in the news. After visiting just a few sites, I found the Rybolovlev penthouse and the Safra penthouse are one and the same. And, for the cherry on top, Safra was a partner of Bill Browder.

Damned tangled web.

TygrBright

(20,756 posts)
26. I can't find a single reputable broad-based news source reporting on this.
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 03:37 PM
Jan 2019

It's also not being reported on in the more reputable and usually accurate, well-informed sources tracking the Mueller investigation.

While money-laundering in the art world is a well-known phenomenon and the story so far on Salvador Mundi in particular is all kinds of weird, I'd hesitate to connect the two until there's a bit more information from generally reliable sources.

skeptically,
Bright

cbdo2007

(9,213 posts)
31. I don't think the painting existed...I think this was all a scam to launder money
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 04:52 PM
Jan 2019

I mean, it may have existed previously, but if you were going to launder money wouldn't it make sense for someone to find this long lost painting and then someone overpay for it by hundreds of millions of dollars, and then it just disappear???

NOTHING about this story adds up, but the media just goes along with it all because they love the sensationalism of the whole thing.

dixiegrrrrl

(60,010 posts)
34. their have been several deep dives into the Dmitry Rybolovlev/Yves Bouvier saga
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 05:33 PM
Jan 2019

Google Yves Bouvier + Dmitry Rybolovlev should bring up the more recent ones, all very very interesting.

It seems dimitry was laundering money and Bouvier was over-charging Dimitry for the paintings he sold him, so everyone got screwed to the tune of millions.

also interesting is this tale is the subject of quite a few stories of late.

dixiegrrrrl

(60,010 posts)
35. Bank of Cyprus -Dimitry-Wilbur Ross-Putin connection:
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 05:51 PM
Jan 2019

In 2014, Ross led a €1bn takeover of the Bank of Cyprus, a favoured destination for Moscow oligarchs seeking to store their wealth. Until 2013, the bank’s biggest shareholder was the Russian billionaire Dmitry Rybolovlev.

Also invested in the bank takeover was the billionaire Russian industrialist Viktor Vekselberg. Vekselberg, who owns the world’s biggest collection of Fabergé eggs, attended the now infamous December 2015 dinner in Moscow for the Kremlin TV channel RT, where Trump’s future national security adviser Michael Flynn was photographed next to Putin.

Ross sat on the senior leadership team of Bank of Cyprus alongside Vladimir Strzhalkovsky, a former KGB colleague of Putin’s who is also on the board of several state corporations in Moscow.

And in 2015, while Ross was vice-chairman of the bank, its Russia-based businesses were sold off to Artem Avetisyan, a Russian businessman who had been appointed by Putin to lead an agency responsible for strengthening ties between the Kremlin and business.
https://www.theguardian.com/news/2017/nov/05/trump-commerce-secretary-wilbur-ross-business-links-putin-family-paradise-papers

UpInArms

(51,280 posts)
39. Have you ever read this book?
Tue Jan 8, 2019, 08:58 AM
Jan 2019
The Outlaw Bank: A Wild Ride Into the Secret Heart of BCCI

The Outlaw Bank goes straight to the corrupt heart of the most spectacular financial scandal in history: the collapse of the Bank of Credit and Commerce International. A riveting mix of Dr. No and All the President's Men, The Outlaw Bank tells the story of the collapse of the BCCI in a unique, revealing - and unforgettable - way. Time correspondents Jonathan Beaty and S. C. Gwynne didn't just report on the BCCI story; from the first tip, they became players in a game of journalistic three-dimensional chess - full of murky leads and shady sources who often were not what they seemed. Through their fastpaced, firsthand account, we are there as Beaty and Gwynne arrange back-channel rendezvous; find a way around government stonewalling; and slowly begin to trace the web of kickbacks, corruption, and cover-ups that spanned three U.S. administrations and ensnared politicians and business figures around the world. The Outlaw Bank shows how the BCCI was more than a bank with a portfolio of bad loans and nasty clients like Manuel Noriega and the Medellin cartel. With offices and agents in every corner of the world, the BCCI had become a clearinghouse for almost anything: political bribes, untraceable cash, guns, tanks - even nuclear weapons. Beaty and Gwynne tell the real BCCI story with all of its amazing detail and mysterious characters. They go inside the mind of Agha Hasan Abedi, BCCI's messianic founder, whose vision of a Third World bank became twisted into a financial evil empire that moved effortlessly across national borders. They show how Manhattan District Attorney Robert Morgenthau and others mounted a massive inquiry - in the face of opposition from the U.S. Justice Department - thateventually led to the indictment of both the bank and former Defense Secretary Clark Clifford. They reveal how they unraveled the BCCI's labyrinth of connections in Africa, Europe, and the United States, and with the CIA - and how their investigation broke through the Washington cover-up that had protected the BCCI for so long. The authors explain why top White House figures in the last two administrations knew about the BCCI's criminal activities yet remained silent as the bank built an empire to service drug dealers. The Outlaw Bank is also the first book to go inside the BCCI's "Black Network", a shadowy organization that handled the bank's most sensitive transactions, including arms sales to Iraq, Syria, and other bellicose nations; stolen military secrets; drug deals; and even terrorism. Beaty and Gwynne show dramatically how the BCCI used the Black Network to export its special brand of corruption to the most powerful circles in countries around the world. Brilliantly detailed and wonderfully readable, The Outlaw Bank is the most authoritative account of one of the largest and most disturbing criminal conspiracies in history. It is also a detective story crammed with spies, mercenaries, and crooked bankers.


Absolutely horrifying and fascinating.

dixiegrrrrl

(60,010 posts)
43. Just bought a hardbound copy for 5.00 on amazon
Tue Jan 8, 2019, 05:39 PM
Jan 2019

Most of my way too many real books I buy "used-in good/very good/like new" condition via Amazon used book store.

Luckily, this one was available.

UpInArms

(51,280 posts)
44. Me, too, on buying used
Tue Jan 8, 2019, 06:28 PM
Jan 2019

And ... I am excited for you to read this book ....

Well written and ... wow ... the information is incredible

👍🏼

Hermit-The-Prog

(33,321 posts)
36. big enough and complex enough to succeed
Mon Jan 7, 2019, 06:20 PM
Jan 2019

This global criminal conspiracy is too big and complex for the general public to grasp from the tiny snatches of information conveyed between commercials on television. If the House waits until there is public consensus for impeachment, the criminals will succeed -- game over.

Latest Discussions»General Discussion»Salvator Mundi a $450 m...