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Newsjock

(11,733 posts)
Fri Sep 7, 2012, 12:27 PM Sep 2012

Wells Fargo forecloses on home without a mortgage, seizes owners' possessions

Source: KCBS-TV

The owners of a modest home near Twentynine Palms lost their cherished possessions after a bank mistakenly foreclosed their residence.

A crew broke into Alvin and Pat Tjosaas’ desert home and took everything after being directed by Wells Fargo to secure the structure.

The couple, however, didn’t have a mortgage on the home.

Alvin said the deputy sheriff said, “Good news, we know who took (your possessions)…Wells Fargo. Bad news, your stuff is all gone.”

Read more: http://losangeles.cbslocal.com/2012/09/05/owners-lose-possessions-after-home-near-twentynine-palms-is-mistakenly-foreclosed/

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Wells Fargo forecloses on home without a mortgage, seizes owners' possessions (Original Post) Newsjock Sep 2012 OP
"secure the structure" -- who do they think they are, some fucking swat team? phantom power Sep 2012 #1
I don't encourage violence but Drale Sep 2012 #7
I was thinking court, but I also have wondered... phantom power Sep 2012 #18
Most people aren't like that. They blame themselves for the banks nefarious actions. jtuck004 Sep 2012 #19
I keep my parents' ashes in my house. if that had happened to me roguevalley Sep 2012 #35
I keep my husband's and son's ashes at home too. I doubt if I would have killed those crooks but, Auntie Bush Sep 2012 #41
I guess Wells Fargo feels they haven't foreclosed on enough homes the last few years... eqfan592 Sep 2012 #2
you are wrong. ChairmanAgnostic Sep 2012 #3
Lol, true. eqfan592 Sep 2012 #5
See, this is the kind of crap that underscores the distinction between corporations and persons mnhtnbb Sep 2012 #4
Exactly. eqfan592 Sep 2012 #6
+1 CrispyQ Sep 2012 #10
Ditto...and don't forget, LESS government, LESS regulations SoapBox Sep 2012 #15
I am surprised chloes1 Sep 2012 #45
+1 justabob Sep 2012 #53
The states are not working for the homeowners. Vanje Sep 2012 #54
It does depend upon the state. I know our NC State Banking Commissioner mnhtnbb Sep 2012 #65
+ a million. sarcasmo Sep 2012 #63
Yeah, it sounds like burglary and breaking and entering. pa28 Sep 2012 #11
They'll pay restitutions but nobody will do time. Spitfire of ATJ Sep 2012 #31
Chances are that abumbyanyothername Sep 2012 #57
I thought corporations were people! CoffeeCat Sep 2012 #28
They took the Curtains! The Dishes! The Double Boiler! Gidney N Cloyd Sep 2012 #8
they now own 1/3 of mortgages, & warren buffett holds 7-8% of their stock. HiPointDem Sep 2012 #40
The banksters are out of control. CrispyQ Sep 2012 #9
What did the bankers say.... "OOPS?" drlit Sep 2012 #12
I suspect there is something more to this story, i.e. an opportunistic crime slackmaster Sep 2012 #13
WTF? SoapBox Sep 2012 #14
The "crew" who did the crime probably included no actual Wells Fargo employees slackmaster Sep 2012 #16
We can't begrudge their wealth. nt OnyxCollie Sep 2012 #17
The owners need an attorney, MineralMan Sep 2012 #20
Yes. Attorney should launch an action for WF to track down & return every item immediately, Bernardo de La Paz Sep 2012 #22
Scan all your beloved photos and put them on disks in a safe deposit box or offsite with friends. Bernardo de La Paz Sep 2012 #21
Why do I get the feeling these banks just drive down the road and pick places at random? Spitfire of ATJ Sep 2012 #23
As through this world you travel you see lots of funny men; some will rob you with a six gun byeya Sep 2012 #24
It would not surprise me if Wells Fargo offered them... Tyrs WolfDaemon Sep 2012 #25
Since corporations=people, why isn't WF in jail? HooptieWagon Sep 2012 #26
They're only people when it's convenient, just like profits are private... polichick Sep 2012 #29
+1 sarcasmo Sep 2012 #64
What would happen get the red out Sep 2012 #27
There are laws that protect pets. Jim Lane Sep 2012 #37
Thank you, that is a relief get the red out Sep 2012 #39
... xchrom Sep 2012 #30
Same thing happened to my neighbor friend. mikeysnot Sep 2012 #32
WF needs and their "crew" needs to be prosecuted ashling Sep 2012 #33
A fear of squatters and business like this is why my brother is living in my empty house rent free Sen. Walter Sobchak Sep 2012 #34
First we show the banksters that they are indeed above the law, then we are surprised that they Egalitarian Thug Sep 2012 #36
Why aren't they responsible for the contents when they foreclose on a property? drm604 Sep 2012 #38
If a property being foreclosed on is abandoned, the lender has the right to take possession... slackmaster Sep 2012 #42
Good news is that Alvin and Pat are going to be able to retire in comfort, when this is over. Honeycombe8 Sep 2012 #43
They won't be made whole. They lost family possessions that cannot be replaced. slackmaster Sep 2012 #44
It'll be settled, since WF is clearly at fault. They'll get compensation... Honeycombe8 Sep 2012 #48
As I mentioned up-thread, the actual work was probably done by a contractor slackmaster Sep 2012 #49
No, it doesn't let WF off the hook. The contractor was acting as WF's agent, on its behalf. WF is Honeycombe8 Sep 2012 #61
This message was self-deleted by its author AnotherMcIntosh Sep 2012 #58
Wells Fargo should suffer the worst possible penalty! Wells Fargo, the worst! lonestarnot Sep 2012 #46
"Some men rob you with a sixgun, some with a fountain pen." - Woody Guthrie Tierra_y_Libertad Sep 2012 #47
I applied for a pre-approved mortgage at WF for the house we currently own sylvi Sep 2012 #50
More than likely it's the mistake of the vender who secured the property. RB TexLa Sep 2012 #51
Shouldn't the CEO of Wells Fargo be locked up? liberal N proud Sep 2012 #52
jumping jesus these people should be able to retire in comfort off of SOME lawsuit. annabanana Sep 2012 #55
This message was self-deleted by its author AnotherMcIntosh Sep 2012 #60
Woman tries to sell home, discovers bank mistakenly forclosed Vanje Sep 2012 #56
This message was self-deleted by its author AnotherMcIntosh Sep 2012 #59
Bankers are vile. sarcasmo Sep 2012 #62

phantom power

(25,966 posts)
1. "secure the structure" -- who do they think they are, some fucking swat team?
Fri Sep 7, 2012, 12:31 PM
Sep 2012

the fucking marines?

WF holds our mortgage. If they ever do that to me, I'll make them pay if its the last thing I do

Drale

(7,932 posts)
7. I don't encourage violence but
Fri Sep 7, 2012, 12:40 PM
Sep 2012

I am honestly surprised that there has not been violence directed at banks and the people who control them.

phantom power

(25,966 posts)
18. I was thinking court, but I also have wondered...
Fri Sep 7, 2012, 01:55 PM
Sep 2012

in an age when banksters and sociopathic CEOs outright destroy millions of lives, I keep expecting, just statistically speaking, for somebody to snap and go apeshit on some banksters.

I never know how to bring that up without somehow sounding like I would approve (which I don't). It just seems like an increasingly likely outcome, but it doesn't happen, so there's some dynamic there that maybe I don't understand.

roguevalley

(40,656 posts)
35. I keep my parents' ashes in my house. if that had happened to me
Fri Sep 7, 2012, 11:00 PM
Sep 2012

I would kill them. I would actually take a knife and kill them

Auntie Bush

(17,528 posts)
41. I keep my husband's and son's ashes at home too. I doubt if I would have killed those crooks but,
Sun Sep 9, 2012, 11:45 AM
Sep 2012

I know I'd be in jail for resisting arrest and those thieves would probably be in the hospital for a long time and not come out without permanent physical damage...maybe even brain damage as I have lots of things close by that can be bounced off ones head.

eqfan592

(5,963 posts)
2. I guess Wells Fargo feels they haven't foreclosed on enough homes the last few years...
Fri Sep 7, 2012, 12:33 PM
Sep 2012

...so they have to start going after homes with no mortgage. Now just imagine if one of us were to "mistakenly" remove all the possessions from inside a home under false pretenses. We'd be in jail in a heart beat. But if Wells Fargo does it? Just an "Oops, sorry about that."

Unbefrigginlievable.

eqfan592

(5,963 posts)
5. Lol, true.
Fri Sep 7, 2012, 12:36 PM
Sep 2012

Tho they did apologize according to the article. Not that doing so in any way makes up for what they've gotten away with.

mnhtnbb

(31,382 posts)
4. See, this is the kind of crap that underscores the distinction between corporations and persons
Fri Sep 7, 2012, 12:36 PM
Sep 2012

How do you arrest Wells Fargo for this? How do you put Wells Fargo in jail
to cool its heels while this gets sorted out?

eqfan592

(5,963 posts)
6. Exactly.
Fri Sep 7, 2012, 12:38 PM
Sep 2012

If the entity can't do the time for committing a crime, then how the hell can it be said to be the same as a person? Makes no sense.

I supposed we could always toss the people in charge in jail, but I'm more likely to grow wings and fly today than for that to happen.

SoapBox

(18,791 posts)
15. Ditto...and don't forget, LESS government, LESS regulations
Fri Sep 7, 2012, 01:18 PM
Sep 2012

...mantra of the GOPathetics and Baggers!

Anyone need more reasons to vote Dem?!?

chloes1

(88 posts)
45. I am surprised
Sun Sep 9, 2012, 12:32 PM
Sep 2012

that states don't get involved and threaten, or outright do so, remove the WF charter to bank in a given state. It is a charter isn't it? The right to operate a bank in any given state?

We can't send a corporation to jail, but we can refuse to let them operate, at least in theory.

Vanje

(9,766 posts)
54. The states are not working for the homeowners.
Sun Sep 9, 2012, 02:55 PM
Sep 2012

They're working for Well Fargo.

Politicians at all levels dance with who bought them.
....and how about that county sheriff department. I assume they enforced the foreclosure. We're they working for the house-holder?
And didnt a judge sign the order? Who the hell is he/she working for.

We're screwn at every level.

mnhtnbb

(31,382 posts)
65. It does depend upon the state. I know our NC State Banking Commissioner
Mon Sep 10, 2012, 08:59 AM
Sep 2012

stepped in to help us when our house burned down 5 years ago--and yes, you still
have to make payments on a mortgage when that happens!!!--after our insurance
company tried to buy us off with a big check that was only 2/3 the value of the
balance on the mortgage!!! We sent that check to the bank (Citi--who had just
bought the loan!) they cashed it and REFUSED to apply the amount to our
adjustable rate mortgage (reduce the loan balance upon which the interest
rate was applied). I did everything--including having our attorney contact them--and
they wouldn't even take her calls. I finally discovered a mechanism to file a complaint
with the bank commissioner in NC (which approves the charter allowing them to operate
in the state) and MAGICALLY, I get a call in less than a week from a Citi person saying,
"well, we don't know why this hasn't been fixed"! Right. After I'd spent MONTHS (making
the loan payment and after they'd cashed the insurance check reducing the loan balance
by $270,000+).

It took us more months--fighting with the insurance company (USAA)--to finally get the balance
out of them so we could pay off the mortgage.

I don't know what the NC Bank Commissioner can/will do in the event of foreclosure, but I sure
know they stepped in to help us!

pa28

(6,145 posts)
11. Yeah, it sounds like burglary and breaking and entering.
Fri Sep 7, 2012, 12:52 PM
Sep 2012

Items from the house could not be recovered but the burglars were caught.

So who gets to go to jail and pay restitution now?

 

Spitfire of ATJ

(32,723 posts)
31. They'll pay restitutions but nobody will do time.
Fri Sep 7, 2012, 03:32 PM
Sep 2012

THAT is what needs to change.

I'm wondering if they had a judge sign an order.

If so, the judge needs to be removed from the bench.

abumbyanyothername

(2,711 posts)
57. Chances are that
Sun Sep 9, 2012, 02:59 PM
Sep 2012

there is battery, assault and robbery involved too.

I mean, I am sure that the sheriffs didn't just show up unarmed.

What do you think this is, Britain?

CoffeeCat

(24,411 posts)
28. I thought corporations were people!
Fri Sep 7, 2012, 03:25 PM
Sep 2012

Corporations are people, my friend, so without further delay please cuff this Mr. Fargo and take him downtown!

Gidney N Cloyd

(19,833 posts)
8. They took the Curtains! The Dishes! The Double Boiler!
Fri Sep 7, 2012, 12:45 PM
Sep 2012

Seriously, I never heard a peep about Wells Fargo besides that Music Man song before 2008 and now anytime I hear of a really fucked up foreclosure, 9 times out of 10 it's Wells Fargo. WTF is wrong with these assholes?

 

slackmaster

(60,567 posts)
13. I suspect there is something more to this story, i.e. an opportunistic crime
Fri Sep 7, 2012, 01:14 PM
Sep 2012

The house was unoccupied (though furnished and filled with belongings) because the owners live in another city where the climate isn't so miserable during the summer. If you haven't been to Twentynine Palms, it's hot like Palm Springs only without as many interesting attractions.

I think someone who does dirty work for banks for a living somehow made this look like a mistake, when in fact they were just leveraging the absence of residents plus a foreclosure on a nearby home as an opportunity to commit a burglary.

Did Wells Fargo actually give their hired goons the wrong address? We may never know, but Wells Fargo is responsible for this crime.

SoapBox

(18,791 posts)
14. WTF?
Fri Sep 7, 2012, 01:17 PM
Sep 2012

This is criminal.

This was breaking and entering, PLANNED, as well as theft.

Arrest the company...ignorance of the law is NO excuse.

AND arrest those that signed off on the order papers. Hell, it was plotted and planned!

Making a little "mistake"...NO excuse.

 

slackmaster

(60,567 posts)
16. The "crew" who did the crime probably included no actual Wells Fargo employees
Fri Sep 7, 2012, 01:24 PM
Sep 2012

Banks hire contractors to do that kind of thing, and people who do jobs like that work for peanuts.

This was a burglary. They probably had cased the house and figured out that nobody was living in it at the time, but that it had some things in it that were worth stealing.

MineralMan

(146,286 posts)
20. The owners need an attorney,
Fri Sep 7, 2012, 02:08 PM
Sep 2012

or Wells Fargo will try to pay them a pittance for their possessions. A good attorney can force Wells Fargo to cough up a nice pile of money over this. The publicity factor should be leveraged so as to punish Wells Fargo far beyond the value of the possessions. I hope they find a really aggressive attorney who will milk WF for every possible penny.

Bernardo de La Paz

(48,988 posts)
22. Yes. Attorney should launch an action for WF to track down & return every item immediately,
Fri Sep 7, 2012, 03:15 PM
Sep 2012

... whatever the cost it takes to find them and to buy them back.

Otherwise, WF can pay through the nose, as far as I am concerned.

Bernardo de La Paz

(48,988 posts)
21. Scan all your beloved photos and put them on disks in a safe deposit box or offsite with friends.
Fri Sep 7, 2012, 03:13 PM
Sep 2012

At least you'll get to keep those if your house burns down [font size = "+1"]or is burglarized by a corporation.[/font]

 

Spitfire of ATJ

(32,723 posts)
23. Why do I get the feeling these banks just drive down the road and pick places at random?
Fri Sep 7, 2012, 03:19 PM
Sep 2012

It's like, "Oh, there's a nice place,...let's take it and resell it."

 

byeya

(2,842 posts)
24. As through this world you travel you see lots of funny men; some will rob you with a six gun
Fri Sep 7, 2012, 03:20 PM
Sep 2012

and some with a fountain pen;
As through this world you travel and through this world you roam,
You won't ever see an outlaw drive a family from their home." - Woody Guthrie

Tyrs WolfDaemon

(2,289 posts)
25. It would not surprise me if Wells Fargo offered them...
Fri Sep 7, 2012, 03:20 PM
Sep 2012

Reduced rate checking for a year or two in exchange for the 'inconvenience' of having a subcontractor taking all of their stuff. After all, they can't be held responsible, they are a large bank. They'll blame the screw up on the crew and it will end up in court where it won't get settled until their grandkids are retired.

 

HooptieWagon

(17,064 posts)
26. Since corporations=people, why isn't WF in jail?
Fri Sep 7, 2012, 03:23 PM
Sep 2012

Seems like a clear-cut case of b&e and grand larceny to me.

polichick

(37,152 posts)
29. They're only people when it's convenient, just like profits are private...
Fri Sep 7, 2012, 03:27 PM
Sep 2012

...but debts are socialized.

get the red out

(13,461 posts)
27. What would happen
Fri Sep 7, 2012, 03:25 PM
Sep 2012

if someone had pets inside and their home was illegally "secured"?????? That is really scary!

 

Jim Lane

(11,175 posts)
37. There are laws that protect pets.
Sat Sep 8, 2012, 04:28 AM
Sep 2012

I don't know about every jurisdiction, but my guess is that it's common -- even someone who has a legal right to secure a foreclosed property must safeguard the welfare of any pets that are there.

As an attorney, I once represented a landlord who was evicting a commercial tenant for nonpayment of rent. The business being evicted was a pet store that also offered short-term boarding services. Before regaining possession of the property, we had to do painstaking preparations to be able to care for any pets on the premises until they could be returned to their owners. Then we showed up and there were no pets there (obviously, the business wasn't doing well).

And, by the way, my client actually did own the property. Believe it or not, we had to document that point before getting the court order. Just a little quirk of the law in New York, I guess. Maybe Wells Fargo is trying to get it changed.

mikeysnot

(4,756 posts)
32. Same thing happened to my neighbor friend.
Fri Sep 7, 2012, 03:50 PM
Sep 2012

House was in foreclosure due to divorce. They never got a final day to move out, they were in the process of moving out, had all their stuff in the living room. The case worker at the bank told them they would let them know their final day, and would let them know that they would change the locks. She never called. Locked them out. he called every day to get access. The guys that changed the locks started looting things from the get go. The neighbor told us they were posing taking pictures with the stolen goods in the backyard.

Then showed up one day with dump trucks and clean up crews, I got in their face and told them we would sue them all if they started moving stuff out. They left, but came back and looted everything from the alley god knows when. I never saw a thing.

Everything cleaned out. No call, no apology. he called the bank they played dumb, like "whaaat happened?"

The bank?

Wells Foreclosure.

ashling

(25,771 posts)
33. WF needs and their "crew" needs to be prosecuted
Fri Sep 7, 2012, 04:09 PM
Sep 2012

for breaking and entering and burglary.

Not that I would endorse any illegal or violent activity, but I wonder what would happen if
Occupy or somebody formed anti-foreclosure crews to go into Wells Fargo branches and
remove all of the furniture, desks, and personal items (not the cash) and throw them all
in the dumpster on the property.

Now, I really hope that nobody does this, or thinks that I am advocating this,
but what if...?

 

Sen. Walter Sobchak

(8,692 posts)
34. A fear of squatters and business like this is why my brother is living in my empty house rent free
Fri Sep 7, 2012, 04:31 PM
Sep 2012

I work in Canada, when I am home I stay with my girlfriend. I couldn't sleep at night without knowing someone had their eye on it.

 

Egalitarian Thug

(12,448 posts)
36. First we show the banksters that they are indeed above the law, then we are surprised that they
Fri Sep 7, 2012, 11:06 PM
Sep 2012

are heavy handed and abusive? Please.

Perhaps if we hadn't let them walk away from the greatest robbery in history without even an apology, they might be a little more circumspect in these deals.

drm604

(16,230 posts)
38. Why aren't they responsible for the contents when they foreclose on a property?
Sat Sep 8, 2012, 11:31 PM
Sep 2012

Correct me if I'm wrong but even in a legitimate forclosure, they have a right to the house, not the contents, right?

They should have to make an effort to protect the contents and return them to the owner.

 

slackmaster

(60,567 posts)
42. If a property being foreclosed on is abandoned, the lender has the right to take possession...
Sun Sep 9, 2012, 11:47 AM
Sep 2012

...of anything left in it.

I suspect the crew who did this job treated it as an abandoned property. The owners have two other houses in other cities that are much more liveable during the summer months. I suspect they hadn't been seen for a while.

Honeycombe8

(37,648 posts)
43. Good news is that Alvin and Pat are going to be able to retire in comfort, when this is over.
Sun Sep 9, 2012, 11:48 AM
Sep 2012

Wells Fargo is going to have to pay through the nose for this.

 

slackmaster

(60,567 posts)
44. They won't be made whole. They lost family possessions that cannot be replaced.
Sun Sep 9, 2012, 11:54 AM
Sep 2012

I hope they clean WFB's clock in court.

Honeycombe8

(37,648 posts)
48. It'll be settled, since WF is clearly at fault. They'll get compensation...
Sun Sep 9, 2012, 01:18 PM
Sep 2012

for the replacement value of everything (you can't replace family sentimental possessions), and compensation for damages of the trouble they've been caussed....hotel expenses, hassle compensation, mental anguish, reputation damage. It won't be called those things, but they'll get it. WB is on the hook.

Wow, they must have idiots working at WF. I guess WF laid off the wrong employees and accidentally let the good ones go.

 

slackmaster

(60,567 posts)
49. As I mentioned up-thread, the actual work was probably done by a contractor
Sun Sep 9, 2012, 02:04 PM
Sep 2012

That doesn't take WF off the hook for either giving the contractor bad data, or hiring a bad contractor.

Honeycombe8

(37,648 posts)
61. No, it doesn't let WF off the hook. The contractor was acting as WF's agent, on its behalf. WF is
Sun Sep 9, 2012, 11:36 PM
Sep 2012

responsible. The contractor will be on the hook, too. Then WF and the contractor will battle each other to try to get money from each ohter, but that will be after the homeowners get their settlement.

Response to Honeycombe8 (Reply #43)

 

sylvi

(813 posts)
50. I applied for a pre-approved mortgage at WF for the house we currently own
Sun Sep 9, 2012, 02:06 PM
Sep 2012

I needed a quick approval so I could make an offer to Fannie Mae against another prospective buyer and my agent suggested WF. I ultimately got the mortgage through my credit union, but I'm wondering after all these stories if Wells Fargo will show up on my doorstep one day claiming the house is theirs.



liberal N proud

(60,334 posts)
52. Shouldn't the CEO of Wells Fargo be locked up?
Sun Sep 9, 2012, 02:15 PM
Sep 2012

He is responsible for his companies actions which hired thugs to break into someones home and steal their belonging.

The thugs and the CEO should share a jail cell.

annabanana

(52,791 posts)
55. jumping jesus these people should be able to retire in comfort off of SOME lawsuit.
Sun Sep 9, 2012, 02:59 PM
Sep 2012

I wish them the very best.

Response to annabanana (Reply #55)

Response to Vanje (Reply #56)

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