I hope the Supreme Court hears you.

Last edited Tue Mar 26, 2013, 12:21 PM - Edit history (1)

into other people's private business, like their marriages. Especially when a person's choice of marriage partner does not affect them in ANY way except their own imaginations.

Why do they get so freaked out about normal human behavior like loving another human being?

And why don't these busybodies get worked up when they see people hating or acting hateful to fellow humans?

I hope the Supreme Court does right by LGBT people.

You know,...because their God needs help from the Mob.

This was really written from the heart. I hope that the Supreme Court does the right thing.

Thank you.

and sorry for your personal losses as well.

This means a lot.

to so many of us here at DU. I am really at a loss for words other than to say I am begging with you. Please oh please let it be.

I'm just sorry there was ever a debt that had to be paid. There should not have been.

I hope the SC hears you today!

I'm sorry for your struggles and your heartbreak. I hope they do the right thing.

Justice may be blind, but she can sure hear.

Equality for all!!!!!!

that you had to live those years in so much fear and pain..


Thank you for helping us realize how important this is for your family's life and future.


Tikki

Our family has also long paid its debt.

I have been a leader in a national LGBT faith organization and, back in the 80s before anyone really knew who Fred Phelps was, his monitoring of all the paper publications of LGBT officers resulted in a hate-filled postcard arriving in my mailbox (yes, he knows where I live; part of what I agreed to when I accepted the role was publication of contact information - then a real life address).

We were the first couple married in our faith community. It took eight years of work with our meeting, while our marriage was under a microscope few marriages are subjected to. That our faith community recognized our marriage was not sufficient to make us married in the eyes of the law, which rejected my wife's efforts to adopt our daughter a few years later expressly because we were not married.

That attempt at adoption is the only published opinion in Ohio on the matter. ( http://caselaw.findlaw.com/oh-court-of-appeals/1442430.html ) That case is cited in at least one amici brief to the cases being heard today. ( http://www.scribd.com/doc/127642512/Utah-Pride-Red-State-Amicus-Brief )

Between those bigger events, we have been out as a family for 31 years changing hearts and minds of everyone we meet as they find they can't reject the three dimensional people they come to know us as and are forced to reject the caricature they were raised with, instead. We raised our daughter openly in the conservative school district in suburban/rural Ohio. Just this weekend we were back (5 years after she graduated) taking photographs for the school play, my wife beaming as kid after kid she has coached in Mock Trial comes up to share tidbits of information about their lives with her. There was a brief (comic) on-stage kiss between two males, one of whom she has coached for four years on mock trial. I like to think our decades of involvement in the school system, beyond just being parents, made that a non-event for the actors in those roles.

And, of course, the money spent globally and personally on securing things others take for granted. We're slowly paying Lambda back for the investment they made in our case, and we have had to draft documents to create legal rights as close to a marriage as we can get - and those aren't free. We paid around $5000 extra in taxes two years ago because our marriage is not recognized; I hadn't had the hear to calculate them previously - or since.

Thank you for your investment, and yes - it is time.

With David's family after his death (I thought we had iron clad wills, not according to Florida).

Although I eventually won, the legal fee's were astounding.

Thanks for sharing your story.

When we put stories to all this, I believe that is whats going to help make change.

Heres to a brighter future for all!

If I had a nickel for every time I've been asked why my wife and I don't just file joint tax returns (including occasionally by attorneys), it might cover the extra it costs to be in an LGBT family.

Re your legal costs - people also assume that the LGBT organizations will be willing to pick up legal costs for establishing our rights. Sometimes they are - but more often not.

Even though we were the perfect test case from day 1 (donor insemination so no potential challenge from anyone; by then a 13 year marriage; family support; marriage recognized by our faith community; stable jobs in respected professions; active in community activities; and known and well respected by community leaders), we could not convince Lambda to support us in a test case. All of the trial stage costs for the attempt to have the relationship between my wife and our daughter recognized were out of pocket to us - Lambda joined us at the appellate stage. It was the best opportunity in years due to court composition and recent decisions, but also in part because it was clear that a precedent would be established since we were going ahead with or without them, and they wanted to ensure the best potential for a good outcome (and we concurred in the assessment they helped us make that it was not worth establishing state-wide precedent after we lost at the appellate level).

Which is another piece people don't realize. Sometimes you have to make personal sacrifices to avoid creating bad law. I have to admit the California case scared me to death when it was filed. I was angry that the individuals involved didn't think beyond their own interests. When are the first case, it doesn't impact just you; it is binding on everyone and bad case law is worse than no case law. I knew it would go to the Supreme Court, and my assessment was that we were about two years ahead of it being good timing. It still scares me, but not as much because things have changed more quickly than I expected - unfortunately the court composition has not. We will see.

I hope the Supreme Court does the right thing.

Once again DU never fails.

Hand salute.

and all of the LBGT community your rights that have always been yours!

I have a close friend, who had two brothers, who were both gay. One passed from aides. It is interesting to hear a similar family story from a different angle. Bless you for all your struggles.

You have fought the good fight.

Someday, hopefully in our lifetime, your story will be a memory of what was and not what is. Peace to you Brother.

The horrors you have experienced have been brought home to me in such a strong, vivid way...

May the Supreme Court hear you today.

No justice, no peace. K&R my friend.

America needs to grow up.

But you didn't pay a debt. You paid your dues. You earned more respect than any straight person who gets it automatically around this issue.

I stand with you.

I know a man who recently lost his partner of 38 years. They never married, but at least in our state, they did have that choice. just as hetero couples do.

The time has come for society to change.

Forgive me, for I am one of those who didn't, at first, understand.

I'm in my mid-fifties, and grew up in a very red state, surrounded by people who taught me that LGBT people were "bad". I heard all of the same arguments that you cite in your post. And while I don't remember doing anything myself to harass or embarrass anyone who was LGBT, I grew up a product of my own limited environment and I didn't understand what it was all about at first.

It took moving away from that environment and learning more about people of ALL types, in general, before I really came to understand that I honestly DO believe that every person is equal, is entitled to live his/her life the way he/she chooses and SHOULD be able to spend his/her life with the partner of choice with all rights and remedies that any other human being would/should have.

So, forgive me for getting late to the party, but know that once arrived, I am a strong and constant supporter of ALL rights. It is my great hope that the Supreme Court will allow the peace and harmony that you desire. You have a RIGHT to have that.

There is such a huge price that our LGBT brothers and sisters have payed, and continue to pay, and the thing is-you (all of you) have done nothing to deserve any of the injustices.[/b

Keep fighting, William. A growing number are on your side.

k&R

Everyone in this country pays a debt for being free.
But you have paid too much and you aren't as free.
I commend your public service. You deserve better from those you've served.
You have suffered needlessly in your personal life. Though others suffer, they often have the comfort of a spouse at their side, "allowed" to be present, be it at the school, or the hospital or hospice - a spouse as legal partner to make decisions and share the pain. I know in my own life, my husband and I married so that we could stand for each other in the legalities of the end of life.

My fervent hope is that you will see the day when you are completely free here.

Namaste.

Thank you so much for sharing...and please accept my sincere condolences on losing the 2 people in the world that meant so much to you, David and Philip were lucky to have you. And a big thank-you for fighting on behalf of so many folks out there who may not have a voice.

I know this will all turn out right eventually, I hope it turns out right NOW.

I know many stories such as yours of devoted same-sex couples, including two men whom I recently learned have been together for forty years.

I am so sorry, you have endured so much in your lifetime. Most of it, outside forces trying to make you live and be a certain way that was counter to your soul. Thank you for never giving up, thank you for being a voice for those that are terrified, thank you for sharing your story. I do not know if you write a lot, but you are very good at it.

That is a very powerful message you are sending, with some very powerful writing. There is no defense against social injustice. None.

Marriage is between two people that love each other.

Period.

Okay? Got that?!?

xoxo, honey!

Heartfelt, honest stories always matter.

I knew of your story, William, but not the details you just provided. Thank you.

For what it's worth, I've had this intuition that the Supremes will rule favorably in both of these cases.

Discrimination is always ugly, no matter what it's form. For me, it was that I was from a poor family. It didn't matter how smart I was, I didn't have good clothes, just homemade ones, and I couldn't afford to participate in so many activities, some that would truly have enriched my life, and though my home was pretty clean, it was not a nice one as the other kids had. Isn't it funny, that what I most remember were jibes at church alluding to my lack of proper clothing, etc. Boy, christianity has a lot of 'splaining' to do when it is forced to grow up.

I too, have been through some of the same shit. I have shared that story elsewhere. It is too late now, for the rights of marriage for me, but it is very important that it happen for our younger brothers and sisters. I know that you feel the same way. It was worth it, yes, every damned bit of it. I just saw on fb that my pastor is sporting the new red logo from HRC. Our tree is not a fig tree.

I'm sorry for what you had to suffer with growing up. While I never had the exact same problem, I was a very.. "different" sort of child, I know what it's like to be outcast, to be misunderstood, to be judged and damned by a bunch of ignorant fools... to be surrounded by them. I know what it's like to have hidden for so long in shame, only to later realize there was nothing to be ashamed of. To have lived in a world that makes a prisoner of you, that makes a demon of you.

You grew from your suffering, you turned your pain into something positive, courageous, powerful and admirable. Activism - the pursuit of a better life and a better world for so many people. Straight or gay, we are not so different. Remember that there's a whole lot of us with you in this fight... whatever the Supreme court decides, I personally admire you and applaud your courage and strength. I personally will support your rights throughout my life - and I will always struggle to make sure more children don't have to grow up like we did.

Hell with the supreme court. As far as I'm concerned, they have no more right than anyone else to tell anyone who they can and cannot marry. Marriage is a civil right, an equal right... it either applies to all of us or to none of us. Should the supreme court make the wrong decision here, I suspect the honorable twits (Roberts, Scalia, etc.) might be in for a rude awakening when Americans increasingly decide that they are irrelevant.

yes, you have paid. you deserve all the rights we all deserve.

yes INDEED

I'm fortunate indeed to hear your voice. We all are.

I am cheering for you. And I am sorry you lost your life partner.

for my daughter and her partner. And I thank you for that. Thank you for all you have done to make our world a better place.

Last edited Tue Mar 26, 2013, 10:27 PM - Edit history (1)

rather than being macho? But thank you for making a difference in people's lives whether by serving as a police officer or being an activist!

I was very good at what I did, I was just being honest in my motives for the field.

My thinking at the time was it was a "man's" job.

thinking back to all of the friends I lost to AIDS....I worked with Alvin Ailey way back when, including when his AIDS was hidden from the public because of the stigma, which left many members of the staff & dancers who got sick without the support they should have gotten.....there was so much irrational fear back in the 80s when they died.....but plain tears & sadness for you, David and the loss the two of you experienced when Phillip was killed, the toughest trauma any parent has to go through. Oh, Bill.....even the right-wing creeps on SCOTUS should be able to see their prejudices for what they are and for the wrong they perpetuate in terms of very basic rights. Should. Oy, am I asking way too much of these right-wing creeps who are considering removing the protections of the Voting Rights Act, one that I never fucking imagined we'd have a Supreme Court that would REMOVE those protections and scale back voting rights......


I'm still keeping hope alive that the majority will do what's right. I have to. Sorry, I'm rambling.....going to bed and hoping I'll wake to some good news tomorrow.

In the meantime.......

Yep.

Love you, Bill.

You know William..Discrimination in any form is Wrong. Its just really sad that something so simple becomes something so hard to obtain. Best of luck to you an hope you get your dream...

That was so very moving.

Hekate

Thank you for being such an Activist for Equality!

May the SC make the right Decision.

on top of not even having being granted the recognition of your relationship had to feel like you were being taken a crap on. I think all you can do is continue to fight for change and do that on behalf of your dearly departed. AIDS is an awful disease that has taken so many lives. My uncle died of AIDS in either 1993 or 1994. I barely knew him unfortunately (that wasn't my choice as I was only in my teens the last time I saw him).

Drunk driving is a whole other matter and I think that ruins so many lives. My first wife's brother was an alcoholic and had multiple DUIs in two different states and still had a license. One night he was driving time home on a road with his girlfriend drunk going 80mph on a very curvy road and wrapped his car around a telephone pole. She died, he lived. What a complete waste. Even though he was family (at the time) I had a hard time having any sympathy for him. My (then) wife asked what to do and I replied "get him a good lawyer". He was convicted of manslaughter and sentenced to 15 years in prison.

I hope you find peace and that the change will come in time for you to at least witness it.

Laws derived from homophobic emotions and ideals are going to be destroyed. Those individuals and groups that persist in believing in, and supporting homophobic bigotry and basic civic unfairness will be viewed in the future as un-American and inhumane. Keep on fighting the good fight- America's future depends on it.