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morningfog

(18,115 posts)
Thu Jun 5, 2014, 07:09 AM Jun 2014

Obama has shown he has to power to release the detainees, he should release them all

This prisoner exchange, which I wholly support as a great and positive move, lays waste to the claim that Obama's hands are tied with respect to closing Guantanamo Bay. He could close it, unilaterally tomorrow an he should. He just showed us that he doesn't need Congress to do it. Of course, he never did.

The executive branch has been managing, transferring and releasing Guantanamo detainees since it's inception, with no input from congress.

It is the Administration which has made the decision that there detainees that cannot be charged but insists on holding them indefinitely. No act of congress is needed for the Administration to change course and do the right thing.

With respect to the criticisms, it isn't that detainees were transferred, that used to be routine. Some are taking offense to the exchange. That is a ridiculous position. As has been discussed at length. The Administration did what it could have done and should have done, but got the one captive US soldier back. Now it is time to tell the repugs, fuck you, and release or charge and try ALL the remaining detainees.

It is more than a decade overdue, we need to close this dark chapter of our history.

32 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Obama has shown he has to power to release the detainees, he should release them all (Original Post) morningfog Jun 2014 OP
Kick. morningfog Jun 2014 #1
Which part of "Fox News" do you not understand? MannyGoldstein Jun 2014 #2
As long as we keep our eyes on that bottom line! morningfog Jun 2014 #4
Sounds like you need a condescending lecture Capt. Obvious Jun 2014 #3
hmm.... President Joe Biden vs Hillary in primary? Leme Jun 2014 #5
It wouldn't change the calculus or repub efforts in any way. morningfog Jun 2014 #6
illegal ? I do not understand. Leme Jun 2014 #7
I know you don't understand. morningfog Jun 2014 #9
impeachment has just a part.... Clinton NEVEr left office and was impeached Leme Jun 2014 #10
Then why don't you tell me what the hell you are talking about? morningfog Jun 2014 #11
possible chain of events. Leme Jun 2014 #12
What are the a b c d e that ends in President Joe Biden in 2015? morningfog Jun 2014 #13
sorry, I can't help you Leme Jun 2014 #14
So your fingers type without any help from your brain? morningfog Jun 2014 #15
i just posed a question that some understand, some don't; you don't...no problem Leme Jun 2014 #19
You posed a question with clear suggestion that you now want to shy away from. morningfog Jun 2014 #20
K&R liberal_at_heart Jun 2014 #8
I say do it and close Gitmo. LLD Jun 2014 #16
"Patience, grasshopper." nt kelliekat44 Jun 2014 #17
Tell that to the detainees who have been held 12 years morningfog Jun 2014 #18
He would reflect better in the history books... kentuck Jun 2014 #21
For many of them, isn't the issue that they have no place to go? Jim Lane Jun 2014 #22
You are accurate and this is something that isn't talked about enough. PragmaticLiberal Jun 2014 #24
That is not entirely accurate. The US refuses to transger them to any place that morningfog Jun 2014 #25
kick woo me with science Jun 2014 #23
Uh he took a huge risk saving this guy.....but we know how you feel about the Democratic President VanillaRhapsody Jun 2014 #26
No, he doesn't. He had a particular legal argument to make in Berghdahl's case pnwmom Jun 2014 #27
He certainly does, he just did it. There is nothing about the swap that gave him morningfog Jun 2014 #28
Yes, I know, that's the al Jazeera line. pnwmom Jun 2014 #30
Yet, 700 other detainees had been released before these 5. morningfog Jun 2014 #31
Furthermore, he is authorized to do it under the NDAA, even without the signing statement: morningfog Jun 2014 #32
A lot of us have been saying that for a long time. Savannahmann Jun 2014 #29
 

MannyGoldstein

(34,589 posts)
2. Which part of "Fox News" do you not understand?
Thu Jun 5, 2014, 08:28 AM
Jun 2014

If Bergdahl had been left in Afghanistan, the mean things said by Fox News would be worse than the mean things they're saying now about the prisoner exchange. So the exchange was the better option.

But if the rest of the Gitmo prisoners are released, there's no upside whatsoever. Fox News will just say mean things.

As usual, our president is always thinking ahead, making sure that we minimize Fox News' ability to stop Tea Party members from voting for Democrats.

 

morningfog

(18,115 posts)
6. It wouldn't change the calculus or repub efforts in any way.
Thu Jun 5, 2014, 02:21 PM
Jun 2014

Nor would it change the Democrats in the Senate's positions. Nor would it be illegal.

 

morningfog

(18,115 posts)
9. I know you don't understand.
Thu Jun 5, 2014, 03:26 PM
Jun 2014

You seem to be suggesting that Obama would be exposed to impeachment if he were to take action, release or transfer the detainees and close Guantanamo Bay. To be impeached, he would have be found to have committed a crime, right?

Or are you suggesting something else?

 

morningfog

(18,115 posts)
11. Then why don't you tell me what the hell you are talking about?
Thu Jun 5, 2014, 04:06 PM
Jun 2014

How would releasing the detainees lead to Pres. Joe Biden in the 2016 primary? What are you suggesting?

 

Leme

(1,092 posts)
12. possible chain of events.
Thu Jun 5, 2014, 04:44 PM
Jun 2014

a-b-c-d-e

that is why I put a question mark. sorry I was not more something.


hmmm....President Joe Biden vs Hillary in primary?

 

morningfog

(18,115 posts)
13. What are the a b c d e that ends in President Joe Biden in 2015?
Thu Jun 5, 2014, 05:04 PM
Jun 2014

Because I don't see it. You must have meant something.

 

morningfog

(18,115 posts)
15. So your fingers type without any help from your brain?
Thu Jun 5, 2014, 05:30 PM
Jun 2014

Or did you have another reason to post what you did?

 

morningfog

(18,115 posts)
20. You posed a question with clear suggestion that you now want to shy away from.
Thu Jun 5, 2014, 06:30 PM
Jun 2014

I encourage you to own it! Don't be afraid to speak your mind.

 

LLD

(136 posts)
16. I say do it and close Gitmo.
Thu Jun 5, 2014, 05:32 PM
Jun 2014

If they try to impeach it wouldn't pass the Senate anyway (before November). And it could actually stir up the left getting them to turn out.

 

morningfog

(18,115 posts)
18. Tell that to the detainees who have been held 12 years
Thu Jun 5, 2014, 05:34 PM
Jun 2014

without charge and were tortured along the way.

kentuck

(111,052 posts)
21. He would reflect better in the history books...
Thu Jun 5, 2014, 07:00 PM
Jun 2014

...if he became a strong President like that. I think he should.

 

Jim Lane

(11,175 posts)
22. For many of them, isn't the issue that they have no place to go?
Fri Jun 6, 2014, 12:04 AM
Jun 2014

I'm no expert on Gitmo but I thought part of the problem was that some detainees who've been cleared for release by the U.S. are still there because there's no place for them to be released to. They're citizens of countries that don't want them back. No other country has agreed to admit them.

Congress has certainly obstructed Obama but there's also an element of inherent intractability to the problem.

PragmaticLiberal

(904 posts)
24. You are accurate and this is something that isn't talked about enough.
Sat Jun 7, 2014, 01:36 PM
Jun 2014

For many of these guys there's no place that will accept them.

 

morningfog

(18,115 posts)
25. That is not entirely accurate. The US refuses to transger them to any place that
Sat Jun 7, 2014, 05:50 PM
Jun 2014

could potentially torture them, ironically.

And, other countries condition release into their country on a US guarantee that they won't engage in terrorism. There are places for a vast majority of them to be released to. Most of the remaining detainees are Yemeni and could be transferred there.

There are still some that could be tried and sentenced. There are avenues for all of them, ultimately.

 

VanillaRhapsody

(21,115 posts)
26. Uh he took a huge risk saving this guy.....but we know how you feel about the Democratic President
Sat Jun 7, 2014, 05:54 PM
Jun 2014

yeah just set him up for an impeachment right? I am sure you would cheer for that too! Y'all don't fool me none!

pnwmom

(108,955 posts)
27. No, he doesn't. He had a particular legal argument to make in Berghdahl's case
Sat Jun 7, 2014, 05:58 PM
Jun 2014

that doesn't extend to all of Gitmo.

 

morningfog

(18,115 posts)
28. He certainly does, he just did it. There is nothing about the swap that gave him
Sat Jun 7, 2014, 06:12 PM
Jun 2014

the power to release. Rather, the authority it there, he just used the swap likely because he believed it more politically palatable. Although, we see how that turned out.

Bush released 500 or so, Obama released around 200. There was nothing special about the swap with respect to the authority to release or transfer.

Only 6 of the remaining 150 face formal charge. The rest MUST be released ASAP, and Obama could do it if he really wanted to.

pnwmom

(108,955 posts)
30. Yes, I know, that's the al Jazeera line.
Sat Jun 7, 2014, 06:22 PM
Jun 2014

But it isn't true.

http://thedailybanter.com/2014/06/right-left-attack-obama-signing-statement-rationale-bowe-bergdahl-swap/

But the Bergdahl release has resurrected an attack from the anti-Gitmo left, the notion that, if the President can use a signing statement to justify the release of these five prisoners, then he can do so for all of the Gitmo detainees. If the President can “ignore the law” in this case, then why not do the same for the rest of the detainees? MSNBC’s Chris Hayes asked that very question, on behalf of anti-Gitmo activists, on his All In program Monday night, but the premise of that question relies on the same fundamental misunderstanding about signing statements that the right relies on. They’re both asserting that the President is using the signing statement to ignore the law. Here is what President Obama said about using signing statements in 2007, at a Montana town hall campaign event:

When Hayes played that clip last night, he cut it off when Obama said “we’re not going to use signing statements,” but the rest of that sentence is “as a way of doing an end-run around Congress.”
The President’s NDAA signing statement doesn’t do that, it seeks to preserve the will of Congress, with a very narrow, well-defined exception. The test of that exception isn’t settled by the signing statement, it is settled by the U.S. Constitution, and if it is challenged, by the Supreme Court. No one has said that the Bergdahl swap would not withstand such a challenge, but a wholesale release of Gitmo detainees likely would not.

 

morningfog

(18,115 posts)
31. Yet, 700 other detainees had been released before these 5.
Sat Jun 7, 2014, 06:41 PM
Jun 2014

He can do it. He has done it. He needs to finish the job.

 

morningfog

(18,115 posts)
32. Furthermore, he is authorized to do it under the NDAA, even without the signing statement:
Sat Jun 7, 2014, 06:49 PM
Jun 2014
(Sec. 1035) Authorizes the Secretary to transfer or release any individual detained at Guantanamo to such individual's country of origin or another country if: (1) the Secretary determines that the individual is no longer a threat to national security, or (2) such transfer or release is to effectuate an order by an appropriate U.S. court or tribunal. Requires, as further determinations prior to such transfer, that: (1) actions have been planned or taken that will substantially mitigate the risk of such individual engaging or reengaging in any terrorist or hostile activity that threatens the United States, and (2) the transfer is in the U.S. national security interest. Outlines factors to be considered in making such determinations, including any confirmed cases of recidivism of individuals previously transferred to such country. Requires the Secretary, at least 30 days prior to such a transfer, to notify the defense, appropriations, and intelligence committees. Defines a detained individual as one located at Guantanamo as of October 1, 2009, who is not a U.S. citizen and is in the custody or control of DOD or otherwise under detention there. Repeals superseded authorities.


All that the NDAA added was the notice period. It does not strip the authority to transfer and release.
 

Savannahmann

(3,891 posts)
29. A lot of us have been saying that for a long time.
Sat Jun 7, 2014, 06:21 PM
Jun 2014

Usually, we're told that the Congress is preventing President Obama from doing so. I guess the Congressional Opposition magically vanished recently.

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