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apples and oranges

(1,451 posts)
Thu Jun 5, 2014, 11:42 AM Jun 2014

Hillary Clinton really needs some new advisors

While I strongly believe Clinton is our best option for 2016, she's already repeating the same mistakes she made in 2008. I don't know if it's Clinton or her advisors, but when they come out of the woodwork to say how Clinton would have done things different than Obama, which audience are they hoping to appeal to? Teabaggers? PUMAs? Why does she think that piling on Obama will help her campaign?

If any Clinton advisors are reading this, here's some advice: Kicking republican ass is good. Kissing republican ass is bad. Follow those rules and you'll win.

43 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Hillary Clinton really needs some new advisors (Original Post) apples and oranges Jun 2014 OP
That's no excuse FiveGoodMen Jun 2014 #1
When I think of 2016 I lose all enthusiasm..n/t monmouth3 Jun 2014 #2
Why are you blaming Hillary for what WH former advisors told the Daily Beast? Beacool Jun 2014 #3
She needs to tell her everyone in her circle, including Bill, to stfu apples and oranges Jun 2014 #8
Do you understand the concept of a WH advisor? Beacool Jun 2014 #14
Bill should be at the forefront AgingAmerican Jun 2014 #24
I suspect IF these advisers are real, they are the Clinton people karynnj Jun 2014 #21
The media don't report news anymore, they manufacture the news. Beacool Jun 2014 #22
Really? ananda Jun 2014 #4
There's a tactful way to get that point across without apples and oranges Jun 2014 #7
Nonsense. Beacool Jun 2014 #12
What is she saying? Because from where I stand 2014 is Looming fast and it's not a good time Cha Jun 2014 #31
The fastest way for Hillary to lose JayhawkSD Jun 2014 #5
Al Gore tried distancing himself and it failed. Miserably. apples and oranges Jun 2014 #6
Al Gore didn't fail because he distanced himself. JayhawkSD Jun 2014 #10
Yeah, too bad he's never talked about climate change, huh? Pathwalker Jun 2014 #15
What does that have to do with anything? JayhawkSD Jun 2014 #30
Go back and do your homework. GeorgeGist Jun 2014 #37
From Clinton's book.. "distancing herself from Obama".. Cha Jun 2014 #34
Another reason I won't vote for her in the primary. LLD Jun 2014 #36
No one is suggesting a fucking "clone". President Obama has a lot of supporters Cha Jun 2014 #32
Doesn't sound like she's trying to appeal to the minority vote. Baitball Blogger Jun 2014 #9
Is there a clue what she or her reps have actually said? It's hard to comment on this, Cha Jun 2014 #33
It was a knee jerk comment. Baitball Blogger Jun 2014 #40
No Hillary needs to retire and stay out of politics Exposethefrauds Jun 2014 #11
Then vote Republican. Beacool Jun 2014 #13
Voting for Hillary IS voting Republican Exposethefrauds Jun 2014 #16
Ridiculous assertion. Beacool Jun 2014 #20
If you say so however it is true. Like it or not. Exposethefrauds Jun 2014 #23
No, it isn't true. Beacool Jun 2014 #27
Name one Republican who is running for President dsc Jun 2014 #26
Post removed Post removed Jun 2014 #17
lol. Yeah, that's about all I got for this one. nt. NCTraveler Jun 2014 #18
Actually, I'd be willing to bet she's pretty happy with her people. progressoid Jun 2014 #19
What exactly is Hillary's stance on the new round ofd trade agreements JEB Jun 2014 #25
There's one mistake she's guaranteed not to repeat customerserviceguy Jun 2014 #28
I just don't think Hillary is Presidential timber Demeter Jun 2014 #29
Especially when the 2014 Election is much more Important RIGHT NOW.. From Clinton's book.. Cha Jun 2014 #35
There was lots of fodder to attack Palin because she was a moron... Whisp Jun 2014 #41
That quote from her book sounds downright stupid the more I think about it.. is she trying Cha Jun 2014 #42
She's not gonna run in 2016 struggle4progress Jun 2014 #38
Hillary's time has come and gone. reformist2 Jun 2014 #39
I doubt Hillary runs. Tuesday Afternoon Jun 2014 #43

FiveGoodMen

(20,018 posts)
1. That's no excuse
Thu Jun 5, 2014, 12:04 PM
Jun 2014

You can't put someone in charge of the world's largest economy AND military if they can't figure out what's the right thing to do on their own.

Advisors is no excuse.

Beacool

(30,244 posts)
3. Why are you blaming Hillary for what WH former advisors told the Daily Beast?
Thu Jun 5, 2014, 12:16 PM
Jun 2014

There are a lot assumptions going on around here that have no basis.

Beacool

(30,244 posts)
14. Do you understand the concept of a WH advisor?
Thu Jun 5, 2014, 01:03 PM
Jun 2014

These people were not her personal advisors, they worked for the WH. Ergo, they worked for Obama.

Get the difference?



karynnj

(59,475 posts)
21. I suspect IF these advisers are real, they are the Clinton people
Thu Jun 5, 2014, 01:54 PM
Jun 2014

from the State Department who left shortly before or after she did.

My take on the article is that it is going in all directions - except with Obama. As you said, it is not likely that this is Clinton approved. I also question it because it looks like he tried to sew together many incompatible (dishonest? or simply their guess) things. Note the many contradictory memes:
-HRC did not approve a similar deal
-HRC negotiated a tougher deal ( question - if so, did OBAMA reject it or the Taliban - in which case, she did NOT negotiate a tougher deal - she proposed one.

One meme argues that HRC would not negotiate with "terrorists" - ignoring their was a public goal that they would assist in a peace deal that involved reconciliation. (After all you can't get peace - if you stay permanently at war with the Taliban.)

The other merely disses Obama and the current team - saying she was better at getting a deal.

I think this is a journalist wanting a story that gets attention - and HRC gets attention.

Beacool

(30,244 posts)
22. The media don't report news anymore, they manufacture the news.
Thu Jun 5, 2014, 02:01 PM
Jun 2014

Hillary has publicly supported Obama's decision, but the media has to find a way to create a wedge between the two of them where none exists.

I just love how anything Clinton around here is enough to start ridiculous OPs like this one. It's the kind of nonsense that one reads at RW sites.

apples and oranges

(1,451 posts)
7. There's a tactful way to get that point across without
Thu Jun 5, 2014, 12:38 PM
Jun 2014

looking desperate, sneaky and opportunistic. That's why McCain, Clinton, and Romney ultimately lost against Obama.

Cha

(295,926 posts)
31. What is she saying? Because from where I stand 2014 is Looming fast and it's not a good time
Fri Jun 6, 2014, 01:38 AM
Jun 2014

to be talking trash about the Dems in Office now.

 

JayhawkSD

(3,163 posts)
10. Al Gore didn't fail because he distanced himself.
Thu Jun 5, 2014, 12:48 PM
Jun 2014

Al Gore failed because he had zero personality and no discernable policies.
And he distanced himself from Clinton, not Obama.

 

JayhawkSD

(3,163 posts)
30. What does that have to do with anything?
Fri Jun 6, 2014, 01:33 AM
Jun 2014

His climate change cause, which I applaud, came about long after his failed bid for the White House, and is irrelevant to presidential campaigning.

Cha

(295,926 posts)
32. No one is suggesting a fucking "clone". President Obama has a lot of supporters
Fri Jun 6, 2014, 01:39 AM
Jun 2014

and it's not a good idea to alienate them or really anyone while the 2014 Midterms are coming up fast.

Cha

(295,926 posts)
33. Is there a clue what she or her reps have actually said? It's hard to comment on this,
Fri Jun 6, 2014, 01:41 AM
Jun 2014

although I have, without knowing what was said.

Baitball Blogger

(46,576 posts)
40. It was a knee jerk comment.
Fri Jun 6, 2014, 11:37 AM
Jun 2014

If Clinton runs for office, she has my vote. But from here to there, she does have a perception problem to deal with. The worst form of Democratic government is not a two party system with adversarial platforms. It is a two party system with a lot of bipartisan agreement.

Republicans are very happy with bills that fall short of their purpose, as long as they continue to destroy the federal government's benign purpose. That's because Republicans have an entirely different way of enriching themselves. They benefit from Wall Street deregulation, because the banks take care of their important clients, while they screw over everyone else. They benefit with military expansion because the private corporations who get the military contracts are usually their supporters; They benefit when schools are built, because the companies that build those schools are Republican campaign donors. And this is what can be seen and measured if journalist actually try. What is harder to do, is find how they work around the system, using backroom deals that generally escape public scrutiny.

So, each time a Democrat thinks they have done a wonderful thing by compromising with Republicans, they are actually only sending pennies on the dollar to their base in the form of charity, while Republicans are getting paid handsomely with public money for building the infra-structure to execute those programs.

And I might add, that the few times that Democrats have joined that gravy train, it didn't go over very well. It made it difficult to demand accountability without shooting our own.

So, that's Clinton's perception problem. We know she's so entrenched in that inside circle, that she will probably give us more of what we've already seen. She needs to get angry, break ties with people who want their fiefdoms protected, and find a better way.

Until then, those of us with the least resources are the ones that are left to expose the gaps in the system.

And after that rant, I can say that I support your effort. Keep the discourse honest, but you have an uphill climb.

 

Exposethefrauds

(531 posts)
11. No Hillary needs to retire and stay out of politics
Thu Jun 5, 2014, 12:48 PM
Jun 2014

America would be better of if she retired

She runs i will not support her and I know I am not the only one.

Beacool

(30,244 posts)
13. Then vote Republican.
Thu Jun 5, 2014, 01:02 PM
Jun 2014

All these people who claim they will not vote for her no matter what, deserve to end up with a Republican Tea Bagger for president.

 

Exposethefrauds

(531 posts)
16. Voting for Hillary IS voting Republican
Thu Jun 5, 2014, 01:16 PM
Jun 2014

Just because they have a D after their name does not mean the person is liberal or progressive.

dsc

(52,130 posts)
26. Name one Republican who is running for President
Thu Jun 5, 2014, 02:34 PM
Jun 2014

who has her positions on gay and women's rights. Or don't those matter?

Response to apples and oranges (Original post)

progressoid

(49,827 posts)
19. Actually, I'd be willing to bet she's pretty happy with her people.
Thu Jun 5, 2014, 01:44 PM
Jun 2014

They probably push her corporate friendly, centrist ideals just the way she wants.

 

JEB

(4,748 posts)
25. What exactly is Hillary's stance on the new round ofd trade agreements
Thu Jun 5, 2014, 02:22 PM
Jun 2014

or does she have one she is willing to share with us working stiffs? Drone killings? Bank regulation? Patriot act? NSA over reach? All I have are questions that I want clear and defined answers to before I can consider casting any votes.

customerserviceguy

(25,183 posts)
28. There's one mistake she's guaranteed not to repeat
Thu Jun 5, 2014, 06:32 PM
Jun 2014

She's not going to draw a primary opponent who stands to be "The First (fill in the blank) POTUS", which took precident over her being "The First Female POTUS". I don't see anyone (besides her, of course) other than white men running for the job in either party.

 

Demeter

(85,373 posts)
29. I just don't think Hillary is Presidential timber
Thu Jun 5, 2014, 10:09 PM
Jun 2014

Regardless of her connections, her name recognition, her experience.

Hillary Clinton doesn't have the qualities that I look for in a leader: a strong democratic compass, a great BS detector, a burning desire to fight for ordinary people and strong support from other people of the same character.

She isn't Bill. He was slick, but he had some of that. And there hasn't been another like him, even though towards the end he betrayed the cause.

Cha

(295,926 posts)
35. Especially when the 2014 Election is much more Important RIGHT NOW.. From Clinton's book..
Fri Jun 6, 2014, 02:17 AM
Jun 2014


Can't imagine the "Obama camp reaching out" to Clinton in this way but whatever.

TOD

thanks apples and oranges
 

Whisp

(24,096 posts)
41. There was lots of fodder to attack Palin because she was a moron...
Fri Jun 6, 2014, 11:47 AM
Jun 2014

I can't see Obama or his leadership approving an attack on her gender - they didn't have to and surely they would have known that was not the right angle to take.

That quote doesn't sound right at all -- more like a sleight of hand thing.

Cha

(295,926 posts)
42. That quote from her book sounds downright stupid the more I think about it.. is she trying
Fri Jun 6, 2014, 05:23 PM
Jun 2014

to get palin voters and lose Obama supporters. 'Cause good luck with that. There would be no attack on palin's gender.. and I can't see them "reaching out to" Clinton, either.

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