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Is there anyone who is pro-Snowden and against the Bergdahl prisoner exchange? (Original Post) apples and oranges Jun 2014 OP
I know onecaliberal Jun 2014 #1
Here is the link to the article. Could you please read it and tell me where Luminous Animal Jun 2014 #8
I saw an interview onecaliberal Jun 2014 #9
I doubt he'd take such a stance. joshcryer Jun 2014 #10
I will try to find it. onecaliberal Jun 2014 #12
You almost certainly misheard. joshcryer Jun 2014 #13
I am no fan of Greenwald, I will give you that. onecaliberal Jun 2014 #44
Prevaricate? Your link goes to this: No - I'm against the detention of anyone without charges and a Luminous Animal Jun 2014 #17
You'll never get him applauding Obama for releasing them. joshcryer Jun 2014 #20
Why should he? If, apparently, Obama had the power as CiC, why are others suffering indefinite Luminous Animal Jun 2014 #22
Will the UK accept him? joshcryer Jun 2014 #23
The Uk is as much complicit in this mans's torture to bar him from returning home to his family. Luminous Animal Jun 2014 #27
Has Greenwald condemned the UK for this? joshcryer Jun 2014 #28
Yes. Luminous Animal Jun 2014 #30
Good. joshcryer Jun 2014 #32
They say they will, but there appears to be a lot of buck-passing going on muriel_volestrangler Jun 2014 #46
So now we are down from "Greenwald trashed Obama" to "Greenwald didn't applaud Obama"... redgreenandblue Jun 2014 #40
Far be it for Greenwald to show one iota of respect. joshcryer Jun 2014 #41
No you did not. Greenwald has been an unrelenting advocate to letting the prisoners go. Luminous Animal Jun 2014 #11
Has he said anything positive about this release? joshcryer Jun 2014 #14
Why should he since he's written positive reams advocating for their release for many years. Luminous Animal Jun 2014 #18
Why not? joshcryer Jun 2014 #19
How would it help those who have been cleared for release? Men. In prison. Cleared of ay charges. Luminous Animal Jun 2014 #24
It would show support for good actions? joshcryer Jun 2014 #25
Imperfection? Human beings? Cleared for release but imprisoned for 12 years? Luminous Animal Jun 2014 #26
Obama can't magically make things happen. joshcryer Jun 2014 #29
Except in this case. Magically he released 5 Taliban. Luminous Animal Jun 2014 #31
To a country that accepted them. joshcryer Jun 2014 #34
Syria is accepting 5. We won't release them. The fact that England won't accept one is a tragedy Luminous Animal Jun 2014 #36
You advocate sending them to Syria? joshcryer Jun 2014 #37
That's right, josh.. it wasn't "magically".. this took a lot of years and planning and the Cha Jun 2014 #33
I have to wonder if he's fighting behind the scenes on a UK deal. joshcryer Jun 2014 #35
That is a flat-out lie. Maedhros Jun 2014 #38
I'm pro-Whistle Blowers, all of them, Ellsberg, Binney, Drake et al AND pro the prisoner swap. sabrina 1 Jun 2014 #2
Yes. Cleita Jun 2014 #15
That's precisely where I am, sabrina. Uncle Joe Jun 2014 #16
Pro both here. ananda Jun 2014 #3
Libertarians. tridim Jun 2014 #4
could you point me to where Greenwald says he is against the prisoner exchange? grasswire Jun 2014 #5
That is precisely his argument. Luminous Animal Jun 2014 #7
Greenwald is not against the prisoner exchange. Luminous Animal Jun 2014 #6
Just an opportunityfor GG to whine about "Obama and the Democrats" and of course the "loyalists" Cha Jun 2014 #21
Nice straw man argument there. Live and Learn Jun 2014 #39
Have yet to see a post against the prisoner exchange on DU eridani Jun 2014 #42
Yes, you have to have a country willing to take them. In this case it was Qatar. We've been making okaawhatever Jun 2014 #45
Shameless flamebait post pinboy3niner Jun 2014 #43

joshcryer

(62,265 posts)
10. I doubt he'd take such a stance.
Thu Jun 5, 2014, 11:45 PM
Jun 2014

He prevaricates more than any other journalist out there. He tweeted that they shouldn't be in gitmo in the first place. He can't say "I'm glad they were let go" because that would break the narrative and mean he is saying something positive about the government, which is rare.

joshcryer

(62,265 posts)
13. You almost certainly misheard.
Fri Jun 6, 2014, 12:38 AM
Jun 2014

Because of his writing and speaking style there's a lot of room for interpretation. That's what gets him clicks.

onecaliberal

(32,484 posts)
44. I am no fan of Greenwald, I will give you that.
Fri Jun 6, 2014, 12:37 PM
Jun 2014

But I am also no fan of the NSA collecting and listening to everything we do either. The non stop bashing is completely pathetic.

Luminous Animal

(27,310 posts)
17. Prevaricate? Your link goes to this: No - I'm against the detention of anyone without charges and a
Fri Jun 6, 2014, 12:46 AM
Jun 2014

trial.

You just prevaricated.

Luminous Animal

(27,310 posts)
22. Why should he? If, apparently, Obama had the power as CiC, why are others suffering indefinite
Fri Jun 6, 2014, 01:39 AM
Jun 2014

detention? There is a man, cleared for release, who has a family in England, his wife is a British national, who was swept up and sold for a $5000 bounty and has been cleared for release. He wants to go home to his family in England. England will not except.

Cleared. Wants to go home. Not allowed.

He is now on a hunger strike and being force fed (which, by the way, is considered torture).

These are THE HUMAN BEINGS THAT GREENWALD HAS ADVOCATED FOR MANY YEARS.

Obama didn't release those prisoners but it is the right thing to do.

joshcryer

(62,265 posts)
23. Will the UK accept him?
Fri Jun 6, 2014, 01:51 AM
Jun 2014

If not what can Obama do? Send in troops to the UK, fly the guy in, and then have him put under US occupying forces guard indefinitely?

"England will not except." You meant "accept"?

Obama should get credit for releasing these 5 guys, Greenwald prevaricates by not saying "hey, I'm glad they we released." I mean, it's so damn simple.

Luminous Animal

(27,310 posts)
27. The Uk is as much complicit in this mans's torture to bar him from returning home to his family.
Fri Jun 6, 2014, 02:08 AM
Jun 2014

Cleared of being a terrorist, unable to return to the love of his family, he has chosen death. And he has been barred from even that dignity and is now being tortured with force feeding.

joshcryer

(62,265 posts)
32. Good.
Fri Jun 6, 2014, 02:20 AM
Jun 2014

Did he absolve Obama because Obama isn't a magical dictator who can magically make the UK accept this guy?

muriel_volestrangler

(101,153 posts)
46. They say they will, but there appears to be a lot of buck-passing going on
Fri Jun 6, 2014, 01:25 PM
Jun 2014
Aamer has never been charged with any wrongdoing, has never received a trial and his lawyer says he is "totally innocent."[12][13] He was cleared for release to Saudi Arabia by the Bush administration in 2007 and the Obama administration in 2009.[1][13] He has been described as a "charismatic leader" who spoke up and fought for the rights of fellow prisoners. Aamer says that he has been subject to torture while in detention.[14]

Aamer's mental and physical health has been declining over the years, as he has participated in hunger strikes to protest detention condition and been held in solitary confinement much of the time. He claims to have lost 40 per cent of his body weight in captivity but did not disclose his actual weight.[15][16][17] After a visit in November 2011, his lawyer said, "I do not think it is stretching matters to say that he is gradually dying in Guantanamo Bay."[18] The UK government has been demanding his release for years, and many people there have repeatedly called for his release.[6][7]
...
The United Kingdom government initially refused to intervene on the behalf of Guantánamo detainees who were legal British residents without being British citizens. In August 2007, Foreign Secretary David Miliband requested the release of Aamer and four other men, based on their having been granted refugee status, or similar leave, to remain in Britain as residents prior to their capture by US forces.[21][37][52][53] With the repatriation of Binyam Mohammed in February 2009, all British citizens and residents other than Aamer have been released. [54][55][56]

The UK government officials have repeatedly raised Aamer's case with the Americans. On a visit to the United States on 13 March 2009, when asked about Guantánamo captives, Home Secretary Jacqui Smith said that the U.S. administration has said they do not want to return Aamer to the U.K. William Hague, the Foreign Secretary, raised Aamer's case again with Hillary Clinton, US Secretary of State, in November 2010,[57] followed by meetings with other United States officials. At the time, the US government had reached settlement with former detainees as a resolution for damages due to the use of torture in interrogation.[57]

In September 2011, Foreign Office Minister Alistair Burt said that the negotiations are ongoing and confidential.[58] Supporters of Aamer have criticized the UK government for not doing enough on his behalf; they urged the government to step up their efforts.[13] In January 2012, The Independent revealed that the British government has spent £274,345 fighting in court to prevent Aamer's lawyers from gaining access to evidence which may prove his innocence.[15] The newspaper reported that Aamer has several serious medical complaints from years of "inhumane" detention conditions, and that the UK gave false hope to his family.[38]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shaker_Aamer

redgreenandblue

(2,088 posts)
40. So now we are down from "Greenwald trashed Obama" to "Greenwald didn't applaud Obama"...
Fri Jun 6, 2014, 04:05 AM
Jun 2014

The case for Greenwald being a malicious Obama-hater just got weaker.

joshcryer

(62,265 posts)
41. Far be it for Greenwald to show one iota of respect.
Fri Jun 6, 2014, 04:26 AM
Jun 2014

I wasn't alleging he was an Obama hater, that is silly. He's a prevaricating click-bait journalist saying whatever fucking shit that's controversial.

I know he is probably glad those guys were released, but he can't say it.

Luminous Animal

(27,310 posts)
11. No you did not. Greenwald has been an unrelenting advocate to letting the prisoners go.
Fri Jun 6, 2014, 12:35 AM
Jun 2014

Every single thing he has ever written about GitMo is that they should be allowed to secure their freedom.

Every single thing.

In fact, western Muslims have remarked to him that it is ironic that a gay American is the most fierce advocate for releasing Islamic imprisoned fundamentalist.

He has done nothing but advocate for their release.

joshcryer

(62,265 posts)
14. Has he said anything positive about this release?
Fri Jun 6, 2014, 12:39 AM
Jun 2014

Without using it to prop up some other argument?

Something as simple as "I'm glad they were released."

Luminous Animal

(27,310 posts)
18. Why should he since he's written positive reams advocating for their release for many years.
Fri Jun 6, 2014, 12:55 AM
Jun 2014

Nobody here focuses on the continued torture of indefinate detention and force feedings. Geeneald does He champions the human and civil rights of Arab Americans and Arabs.

Luminous Animal

(27,310 posts)
24. How would it help those who have been cleared for release? Men. In prison. Cleared of ay charges.
Fri Jun 6, 2014, 01:54 AM
Jun 2014

Versus the President of the United States.

Who needs mad props?

Luminous Animal

(27,310 posts)
26. Imperfection? Human beings? Cleared for release but imprisoned for 12 years?
Fri Jun 6, 2014, 02:01 AM
Jun 2014

Holy hell. That is torture. You grossly underestimate the anger that GitMo prisoners activists have for their continued torture.

Luminous Animal

(27,310 posts)
36. Syria is accepting 5. We won't release them. The fact that England won't accept one is a tragedy
Fri Jun 6, 2014, 02:26 AM
Jun 2014

not a justification. A human being. With a loving family. Cleared of being a terrorist. Not allowed to go home. Has chosen death.

joshcryer

(62,265 posts)
37. You advocate sending them to Syria?
Fri Jun 6, 2014, 02:37 AM
Jun 2014

Link? This sounds like it won't go well at all.

The UK is complicit, no doubt. Don't see how it's Obama's fault when he's clearly made many efforts to close down gitmo.

Cha

(295,907 posts)
33. That's right, josh.. it wasn't "magically".. this took a lot of years and planning and the
Fri Jun 6, 2014, 02:20 AM
Jun 2014

circumstances to make it happen right freaking Now.

Too bad about those who want everything to appear "Magically".. it ain't gonna happen. They can whine all they want but that's not reality.

joshcryer

(62,265 posts)
35. I have to wonder if he's fighting behind the scenes on a UK deal.
Fri Jun 6, 2014, 02:21 AM
Jun 2014

Of course if that release ever happens due to some diplomatic leveraging, I'm sure that Obama won't get one iota of credit.

Cleita

(75,480 posts)
15. Yes.
Fri Jun 6, 2014, 12:41 AM
Jun 2014

Also, trying to get these young men tried for treason, on television, when guys like Bush, Cheney, North et al are running around free, getting richer and dumping on the poor soldier POW and his family is especially heinous.

Those whistleblowers aren't responsible for the deaths of millions around the world and at home.

Uncle Joe

(58,112 posts)
16. That's precisely where I am, sabrina.
Fri Jun 6, 2014, 12:45 AM
Jun 2014






P.S. I would also appreciate it if the federal government would legalize cannabis.

grasswire

(50,130 posts)
5. could you point me to where Greenwald says he is against the prisoner exchange?
Thu Jun 5, 2014, 03:46 PM
Jun 2014

I must have missed that.

I thought his argument was that Obama could have released prisoners and closed Gitmo on his own order, without Congressional approval.

Luminous Animal

(27,310 posts)
6. Greenwald is not against the prisoner exchange.
Thu Jun 5, 2014, 05:21 PM
Jun 2014

In fact, he has been advocating for years that ALL the prisoners in GitMo either be given a fair trial or be released.

Cha

(295,907 posts)
21. Just an opportunityfor GG to whine about "Obama and the Democrats" and of course the "loyalists"
Fri Jun 6, 2014, 01:30 AM
Jun 2014

as he fucking puts it. Greenwald: "Obama and his loyalists.. "

eridani

(51,907 posts)
42. Have yet to see a post against the prisoner exchange on DU
Fri Jun 6, 2014, 04:33 AM
Jun 2014

Some have said that if you can get rid of five, why not all, but that's an entirely different matte.

okaawhatever

(9,453 posts)
45. Yes, you have to have a country willing to take them. In this case it was Qatar. We've been making
Fri Jun 6, 2014, 12:48 PM
Jun 2014

deals with countries for a bit now to get them to take some of these prisoners. There were close to 100 whose birth country wouldn't take them back. I know Uruguay signed up to take a prisoner or two a few months back. I think that took some arm twisting. The country didn't want the guys there.

pinboy3niner

(53,339 posts)
43. Shameless flamebait post
Fri Jun 6, 2014, 04:40 AM
Jun 2014

There is no logical reason to connect the two except to promote a particular point of view and stir shit.

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