Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

Fred Sanders

(23,946 posts)
Thu Jun 5, 2014, 07:16 PM Jun 2014

Taliban relatives and fighters celebrate release of POW's, like civilized people do.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2646222/Taliban-leaders-given-heros-welcome-footage-claiming-prisoners-arriving-Qatar-Guantanamo-release-no-American-presence-sight.html

--------------------

The Taliban commander told NBC News the exchange was the first time its 'enemy' had 'officially recognized our status.'
He said: 'Once we confirmed the arrival of our five heroes back in Qatar, celebrations started everywhere in Afghanistan and the neighboring Pakistan.

--------------------

The mostly mid- to high-level Taliban officials were detained early in the war in Afghanistan (2001-2003) because of their positions within the Taliban, not because of ties to al Qaeda, CNN reported.

--------------------

In response, the White House said that officials considered what they called 'unique and exigent circumstances' and decided to go ahead with the transfer in spite of the legal requirement.
And Hagel, who was traveling to Afghanistan to meet with U.S. troops, said the action was not relayed to Congress because of its urgency. He said intelligence indicated that Bergdahl's 'health was deteriorating.'
At Bagram Air Field, Hagel thanked the special operations forces that participated in the rescue.

(Celebration of real soldiers at Bagram)

Gen. Joseph Dunford said there was a sense of excitement in the headquarters as the news spread.
'You almost got choked up,' he said. 'It was pretty extraordinary. It has been almost five years and he is home.'
----------------------

P.S. What happens after Qatar transfers the Taliban to Afghanistan? I assume the Afghan government is not going to be all that kind to them.
24 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Taliban relatives and fighters celebrate release of POW's, like civilized people do. (Original Post) Fred Sanders Jun 2014 OP
Not here, here we attack you if you are in anyway related to the Black prez admin randys1 Jun 2014 #1
Ironic. n/t wandy Jun 2014 #2
Should it be celebrated that killers and religious fanatics are back in the world? CAO Jun 2014 #3
The old boring straw man set up - congrats to your uncle Joey. Fred Sanders Jun 2014 #4
That's a pretty A to B argument I think... CAO Jun 2014 #15
You do realize... Chan790 Jun 2014 #16
Thinking like you requires abstract thought and looking at the big picture. Fred Sanders Jun 2014 #17
As someone well acquainted with Afghan culture and their ability CAO Jun 2014 #18
Is there any evidence they killed anyone? There was no trial. arcane1 Jun 2014 #5
One of them is a suspect in an alleged genocide, two were arrested when they tried to cooperate Fred Sanders Jun 2014 #6
Thanks! arcane1 Jun 2014 #7
Heard that some senator is trying to get the full files released... CAO Jun 2014 #8
Full files released on POW's is a dangerous notion. Think about it. How is your uncle? Fred Sanders Jun 2014 #9
Welcome to D.U. that's a nice cake. Uncle Joe Jun 2014 #10
Obama is once again seeing the big picture while talking heads waggle...in the end the GOP are Fred Sanders Jun 2014 #13
Calling the Taliban civilized on DU? former9thward Jun 2014 #11
I am not calling the Taliban civilized, but they celebrate like obviously civilized America doesn't Fred Sanders Jun 2014 #14
When I click on your link, it just states there is an error page. Uncle Joe Jun 2014 #12
The Taliban are almost stone aged savages. AngryAmish Jun 2014 #19
Stone age savages don't create complex social networks with independent cells... CAO Jun 2014 #20
Once we loved them and broke bread with them in the White House, so there's that. Fred Sanders Jun 2014 #21
"Broke bread with them in the White House" - Name one. ieoeja Jun 2014 #22
The Taliban are NOT civilized, in any way shape or form. Sheldon Cooper Jun 2014 #23
Once again, celebrating like civilized people does not absolve them of all faults, but they do Fred Sanders Jun 2014 #24
 

CAO

(20 posts)
3. Should it be celebrated that killers and religious fanatics are back in the world?
Thu Jun 5, 2014, 07:53 PM
Jun 2014

You can argue that it was a legitimate price to pay for Bergdahl but very few will/should argue that it is a good thing that these assholes are out and about...

This is not a good thing...

"Yay... Murdering Uncle Joey is back with us after his most recent stint in the big house!"

 

CAO

(20 posts)
15. That's a pretty A to B argument I think...
Thu Jun 5, 2014, 10:04 PM
Jun 2014

Do you consider it unfair to consider the fact that these are not nice people and the world at large would likely be better off if they couldn't plan and enact methods of killing people?

 

Chan790

(20,176 posts)
16. You do realize...
Thu Jun 5, 2014, 10:27 PM
Jun 2014

that they've been released to Qatar where they remain under supervision and detention.

That even at the end of the year when they can leave Qatar, they aren't free to go as free men back to Afghanistan...if they choose to return, they will likely be arrested by Afghan customs or law enforcement upon entry into Afghanistan. For what they're accused of, it's nearly-certain that at-least two of them would be facing the war-crimes tribunal of the Afghani regime and be executed upon conviction? (You don't really think Karzai is going to pardon genocidal enemies of the regime, do you?)

To put it another way, they were released from Gitmo to a likely life of exile from their homeland and detachment from their former political movement. Not really that terrifying.

Fred Sanders

(23,946 posts)
17. Thinking like you requires abstract thought and looking at the big picture.
Thu Jun 5, 2014, 10:42 PM
Jun 2014

Afghanistan will likely try and execute two of them as you say. They are no longer POW's. But they face justice just like Bergdahl may.

 

CAO

(20 posts)
18. As someone well acquainted with Afghan culture and their ability
Fri Jun 6, 2014, 06:12 AM
Jun 2014

... To try and then punish what we would think of as negative influencers...

My first thought was to find an video of someone laughing themselves to death.

Then I realized that it is just a pure form of naivety....

These guys will be fine...

 

arcane1

(38,613 posts)
5. Is there any evidence they killed anyone? There was no trial.
Thu Jun 5, 2014, 08:09 PM
Jun 2014

According to the link:

"The mostly mid- to high-level Taliban officials were detained early in the war in Afghanistan (2001-2003) because of their positions within the Taliban, not because of ties to al Qaeda"

Fred Sanders

(23,946 posts)
6. One of them is a suspect in an alleged genocide, two were arrested when they tried to cooperate
Thu Jun 5, 2014, 08:15 PM
Jun 2014

with the new invading American army, same as some did switch when it was an old invading Russian army.

All of them were ministers or aides or some position in the Taliban government that ruled in 2001, full details in the article.

 

arcane1

(38,613 posts)
7. Thanks!
Thu Jun 5, 2014, 08:23 PM
Jun 2014

Looks like at least one of them could still be in trouble, too. I didn't realize they'd released so much info about them.

Uncle Joe

(58,355 posts)
10. Welcome to D.U. that's a nice cake.
Thu Jun 5, 2014, 08:34 PM
Jun 2014


http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025048897


The trade for Bergdahl should improve the chances of negotiating a peace treaty in Afghanistan.

The five Taliban members traded were a key sticking point in earlier peace negotiations.






http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mohammad_Fazl

Release negotiations

Most Afghans had been repatriated to Afghanistan by 2009. Throughout the fall of 2011 and the winter of 2012 the United States conducted peace negotiations with the Taliban, and widely leaked was that a key sticking point was the ongoing detention of Fazl and four other senior Taliban, Norullah Noori, Khirullah Khairkhwa, Abdul Haq Wasiq and Mohammed Nabi. Negotiations hinged around sending the five men directly to Doha, Qatar, where they would be allowed to set up an official office for the Taliban.

In March 2012, it was reported that Ibrahim Spinzada, described as "Karzai's top aide" had spoken with the five men, in Guantanamo, earlier that month, and had secured their agreement to be transferred to Qatar. It was reported that Karzai, who had initially opposed the transfer, now backed the plan.

Release

On June 1, 2014 Fazl, and the other five Taliban prisoners in Guantanamo Bay, were released in Qatar in exchange for U.S. soldier Bowe Bergdahl who had been captured by the Taliban nearly five years previously. Fazl and other members of the Taliban five, as part of the conditions of their release, were prohibited from leaving Qatar for one year.





Fred Sanders

(23,946 posts)
13. Obama is once again seeing the big picture while talking heads waggle...in the end the GOP are
Thu Jun 5, 2014, 09:33 PM
Jun 2014

going to regret this is the issue they went fully crazy with.

McCain lied that they are AQ/Taliban, even used "slash", because he is being so clearly exposed as a hypocrite he has now resorted to simple lying.

former9thward

(31,987 posts)
11. Calling the Taliban civilized on DU?
Thu Jun 5, 2014, 08:36 PM
Jun 2014

What exactly is civilized about them? When they stone women for adultery?

Qatar is not going to transfer anyone anywhere. They have said the Five are free to travel. They will travel back to Afghanistan at a time of their choosing and join the fight. In the meantime they will help direct Taliban operations from Qatar. Your comment about the Afghan government is really funny. The Afghan government controls parts of Kabul and that is it.

Fred Sanders

(23,946 posts)
14. I am not calling the Taliban civilized, but they celebrate like obviously civilized America doesn't
Thu Jun 5, 2014, 09:35 PM
Jun 2014

with the release of a POW. Ironic is what it is.

 

CAO

(20 posts)
20. Stone age savages don't create complex social networks with independent cells...
Fri Jun 6, 2014, 06:49 AM
Jun 2014

... advanced explosives or participate at the international levels of diplomacy with the USA.

Anyone who thinks they are stupid will be proven wrong... quickly...

You can't be stupid and survive in that social and physical shithole...

They are ethically backwards by our standards but have layers of complexity and subtlety in their culture that we never even scratched the surface of....

Fred Sanders

(23,946 posts)
21. Once we loved them and broke bread with them in the White House, so there's that.
Fri Jun 6, 2014, 10:32 AM
Jun 2014

Oversimplification and generalization to hatefully paint a broad brush across an entire ethnicity. claiming them to be sub-human, what would one call that.

 

ieoeja

(9,748 posts)
22. "Broke bread with them in the White House" - Name one.
Fri Jun 6, 2014, 11:18 AM
Jun 2014

I know the head of the Mujhadeen fighters was not Taliban. Al Qaeda assassinated him on behalf of the Taliban on 9/8/11.

What about the rest of the Afghans who met with Reagan? Did any of them actually go on to become Taliban? Or do people just keep making that assumption?

It is a pretty reasonable assumption. Given that the Taliban became the strongest splinter group after the Democratic Republic of Afghanistan came to an end, I would expect some of the Mujhadeen leadership to have joined the Taliban. But the only one I actually know about did not.

Sheldon Cooper

(3,724 posts)
23. The Taliban are NOT civilized, in any way shape or form.
Fri Jun 6, 2014, 11:33 AM
Jun 2014

Any group that perpetrates the level of violence directed at girls and women such as the Taliban do, cannot be called civilized in anyone's standards.

Fred Sanders

(23,946 posts)
24. Once again, celebrating like civilized people does not absolve them of all faults, but they do
Fri Jun 6, 2014, 12:15 PM
Jun 2014

celebrate release of THEIR POW's, but America does not, that is the irony.

Latest Discussions»General Discussion»Taliban relatives and fig...