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Donald Ian Rankin

(13,598 posts)
Sat Jun 14, 2014, 02:22 PM Jun 2014

An easy way to test to see if an argument is flawed.

Don't just look at the conclusion, and assume that if it's a conclusion you agree with then the argument must be logically valid.

Instead, ask yourself "what other conclusions follow from this?".

It's especially worth doing this with your own arguments, before setting them out.

For example, if you are advancing an argument against the death penalty, look at what you have said and see if there is anything in it that specifically would *not* apply to prison sentences. If your argument could just as well be used to oppose imprisonment as execution, there *must* be something wrong with it, and you can set about working out what.

If you are advancing an argument against discrimination on grounds of sex, race etc, look at what you have said and see if there is anything in it that specifically would *not* apply to discriminating on grounds of intelligence.

If you are advancing an argument against discriminating against a certain group, reread your argument, taking out every reference to that group and substituting "murderers". If it still applies, there's probably something wrong with it.

If you are advancing an argument for abortion rights, look at what you have said and see if there is anything in it that specifically would *not* apply if foetuses were fully intelligent and capable of arguing philosophy and pleading to be spared (unless you'd still support abortion rights if that were the case).

If you are advancing an argument against American military involvement in Iraq, look at what you have said and see if there is anything in it that specifically would *not* apply to intervention in WWII or in Kosovo (assuming you think those were good decisions, of course).


Being right for the wrong reasons is all very well, but it's likely to lead to fuzzy thinking, and that's likely to lead to being wrong about other things in the future.

Of course, this approach isn't infallible; it will still produce false positives. But it's a useful check - far too often people assume that if an argument reaches a conclusion they support, it must be a valid argument.

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An easy way to test to see if an argument is flawed. (Original Post) Donald Ian Rankin Jun 2014 OP
????? BillZBubb Jun 2014 #1
No, you've completely misunderstood. Donald Ian Rankin Jun 2014 #2
I don't think I have. BillZBubb Jun 2014 #3
Partly because something else is missing. Igel Jun 2014 #4

BillZBubb

(10,650 posts)
1. ?????
Sat Jun 14, 2014, 04:39 PM
Jun 2014

Much of your post seems to be illogical. For instance:

"If you are advancing an argument for abortion rights, look at what you have said and see if there is anything in it that specifically would *not* apply if foetuses were fully intelligent and capable of arguing philosophy and pleading to be spared (unless you'd still support abortion rights if that were the case)."

Fetuses are NOT fully intelligent, not capable of arguing and cannot plead anything. Under no circumstances will they ever be. To limit your argument by allowing or pretending they might be is absurd.

Donald Ian Rankin

(13,598 posts)
2. No, you've completely misunderstood.
Sat Jun 14, 2014, 04:52 PM
Jun 2014

I'm not talking about "limiting" arguments, I'm talking about testing them to see if they're right or wrong.

And counterfactuals are a useful test to apply - if a consequence of your argument is false, your argument must be flawed, even if it also has true consequences.

The technical term is "modus tollens".

BillZBubb

(10,650 posts)
3. I don't think I have.
Sat Jun 14, 2014, 06:34 PM
Jun 2014

If I argue a fetus has NO personhood since it is incapable of thought and cannot plead for its life, your criterion would not allow me to make that case.

Igel

(35,282 posts)
4. Partly because something else is missing.
Sat Jun 14, 2014, 08:25 PM
Jun 2014

If a child is born with hydrocephaly it will never think and cannot plead for its life.

Therefore it is okay to take positive steps to kill it. Same for those that are in a vegetative state. This is different from allowing it to die.

Your conditions may be necessary for your argument but they're not sufficient. They reduce your argument to a special case, with no principled reason for limiting it to that special case.

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