it would be wrong to simply turn these kids loose on the streets, too. We were and are not really prepared for this particular set of informal immigrants. So, they're being kept in what are clearly substandard facilities. There really aren't any facilities available that are properly set up for thousands of unaccompanied minors who are entering the US.

So, they're not prisons. But, these minors have to be housed, fed, and kept safe from a variety of things that might happen to them if they were simply ignored and allowed to wander.

Finding their parents or other competent relatives in their home countries will be very difficult, and it is those parents and relatives who have encouraged their children or relatives to leave those home countries, where it's even less safe.

So what the heck do we do with these kids? I confess that I have no idea. Barracks at Lackland AFB probably are not the ideal answer, nor are facilities not designed for indefinite stays by minors. There aren't enough foster families available, either. So, I don't know what to recommend for this group. I truly don't.

Clearly, the facilities they are staying in are makeshift solutions. Lackland, for example, does have decent living quarters and facilities for preparing food in the needed quantities. That's something. Sending them back to their home countries won't work well, unless there is some assurance of their safety there. It's a real problem.

You know, I saw a couple of interviews of kids who have come here. They said that they'd likely be killed if they stayed where they were. That doesn't surprise me. They're kids. One of the kids interviewed was just 12 years old.

What's your suggestion? I don't have one. It's a mess. It's not enough just to condemn the facilities where they are. What's your suggestion for an alternative that is actually available? I'm all about reality, not ideals, in situations like this.

These kids are safe, out of the weather, and are eating regularly. Now that those requirements are met, a better solution can be figured out. It's not something that was anticipated, so there isn't an existing system all set up to deal with it.

I'm sure there are people working on this, trying to find a better solution. In the meantime, the kids are safe and fed.

Unlike you, I have not been in a juvenile prison. I have, however, been at Lackland AFB, during USAF Basic Training. It wasn't pleasant, but it also wasn't a prison. It was safe, warm, and I got plenty to eat. I wasn't in charge of every aspect of my life, but the whole thing was far from being in prison. These kids are not prisoners. They're wards, being temporarily housed and fed while solutions are being investigated.

It's not a juvenile prison.

This has always been a problem for countries trying to care from people fleeing from violence in other countries.

But you can bet your next paycheck that the instant someone figures out how to make a buck off these kids, that tune will change, and they will be welcomed with open arms.

And the responsible adults/family live IN the USA.

is that if you just turn these kids loose with a language and cultural barrier, not to mention vulnerability due to severe poverty, they are ripe for all types of exploitation such as sexual slavery, abusive working conditions if they are in anyway able to work, and human trafficking to other countries.

This is a horrific situation, and honestly, I don't see a very good solution to any of it. I do know that if the US opens the floodgates to minors without parents flooding into the country unsupervised, it won't end well for the poor kids.

of dangerous activity. Sending kids across the border alone, is a recipe for disaster. This is not something the US should be helping along by making it alright, by not trying to send them back to their parents.

For the reasons you just outlined.

in their war torn country. A much more dangerous situation than what is currently in any Central American country. It wouldn't be fair to encourage the illegal immigration of children from one part of the world (and under horrific travel conditions involving severe child neglect) and disregard the desperate needs of other children in the world.

Oh, it's Fox. Latino Fox.

The rest of the story carefully digresses into a laundry list of the GOP's Latino talking points. Sad.

It's not like families are choosing to send their kids off to a dangerous summer camp. many of the children are fleeing violence and/or looking for their families in the US.

This is a situation where there is no good solution short of finding their relatives, but considering that they got shipped over the border by their relatives in many cases, it's a really messy situation.

These poor children are already vulnerable due to poverty and language barriers, and roaming around with no parents makes them ripe for exploitation. Just horrible.

with, "Should these children be given driver's licenses when they come of age?"

That would have thrown her for a loop.

However, she missed the opportunity to explain the causes of illegal immigration. Namely, the poverty (created in large part by NAFTA ), and the gangs and violence created by the failed war on drugs.

She cites violence, without explaining its connection to the drug trade. And she didn't mention the extreme poverty, caused in part by US agriculture corporations putting local farmers out of business in largely agricultural economies. That is due to NAFTA. If you look at the timeline of the surge in illegal immigration, it began shortly after NAFTA was signed.

Re-watch if you missed it.

NAFTA applies to Mexico, but not Central America, IIRC.

Is there a similar trade agreement covering those countries, or is the NAFTA relationship more complex?

NAFTA is for North America. Drug trade violence is all over.

The thirty plus war in Guatemala and El Salvador.

Much of the conflict is drug related to various degrees. Drug profits buy guns, which are used against govt trying to stop drugs. Thats a simplistic explanation, but remove drug profits and the situation through Mexico, Central, and South America is much improved.

10 million minors a day?
10 thousand?
10?

How do you determine the 'responsible adults in their families?'
Put ads on Craigslist?

Let the stupid campaign questions begin...

From your link:

There has been a huge recent surge that is overwhelming available resources. I imagine there is difficulty locating parents, and determining if its even safe to send the children home. Nobody wants this situation.... coping with it is more difficult than imagined.

Perhaps the parents would think twice before sending them or maybe even the kids themselves would.

.. is so dire the parents are willing to take a chance.

Sorry for not having a link at hand. The parents are being told the kids will get amnesty.

Try this for starters: http://www.vox.com/2014/6/16/5813406/explain-child-migrant-crisis-central-america-unaccompanied-children-immigrants-daca

The system is designed to handle 6-8000 kids per year. Average is 7000. The projected number for 2014 is about 70,000. Thats a 10-fold increase. My estimate is close, unless your math doesn't compute 7,000 X 10 = 70,000.

The increase "in the past year or so" is not tenfold. There is a 92% increase in the number of unaccompanied child immigrants (apprehended at the border) since this time last year. What you should have said is that there is about a tenfold increase in the number of unaccompanied child immigrants from Central America since 2011. The projected number for this year is 52,000 (the 70,000 projected figure includes children from Mexico). In 2011 it was somewhere around 6,000 (I don't have the exact figure.)

My main complaint, though, was your unsubstantiated claim that the increase is due to the expectation of amnesty. The evidence suggests that most of the kids from Central America are not coming for that reason.

I didn't make a claim. I made an estimate, based on an article I read. There was a 10-fold increase, so it started a year or so earlier. Yes it included kids from Mexico... they have to be fed and taken care of too, right? Or you just going to ignore them? My point stands that the system is overwhelmed far beyond what it was intended to handle. Do you dispute that also?

What pissed me off was your bullshit right wing talking point about why there has been a dramatic increase. Yes, I do want to fight about that because I deeply care about the well-being of immigrants. It is my "pony" issue.

I made absolutely no comment (RW, bullshit, or otherwise) about the reason for the increase, in the post you responded to. Furthermore, the numbers in YOUR LINK are essentially the same as I estimated... only the time frame was slightly longer.

Now, if you want reasons, I have given them elsewhere. Its poverty and violence at home. I don't know how you can make that a RW bullshit talking point, but you're welcome to look the fool and try.

That is usually said by right-wingers who want to attack immigration reform and blame the increase in unaccompanied migrant children on Obama. Maybe you didn't intend it that way. If so, I apologize.

I don't see what that has to do with RW, LW, or anything. If the parents believe the kids will get amnesty, how is that a RW talking point? Do the parents listen to Rush Limbaugh? And I didn't even cite that in the original post you responded to, as the post I was responding to simply asked the kinds of numbers we're talking about and I answered to my best recollection.
Seriously, it looks to me you're just looking for an excuse to make baseless RW accusations and argue. Good day to you.

You say: "And I didn't even cite that in the original post you responded to, as the post I was responding to simply asked the kinds of numbers we're talking about and I answered to my best recollection."

The original post I responded to was post 21 in which you say, among other things, "The parents are being told the kids will get amnesty."

The claim, as my original reply suggested, is mistaken.

First, the rapid increase in unaccompanied children migrants started well before the rumor of permisos. Second, the rumor is that there are permisos for women accompanied by children, not for unaccompanied children. Third, the border patrol memo was based on interviews of all apprehended immigrants in that area. I still agree with the Obama Administration view that increased violence and poverty in Central America are the primary reasons for the increase in unaccompanied minors coming to the US.

The people in this country with a little money, Democrats and Republicans alike, have decided that they simply no longer want to pay for society's collective obligations. They prefer granite countertops in their McMansions, a new Lexus or Jag, and they want to travel the world and surf 300 channels of cable. It's not that they no longer care about social issues, they are quick to assure you that they still care passionately, but it's a distant sort of caring -- like flooding in a country you cannot find on a map.

I call it trickle down indifference and greed. It starts with the Boomers and flows downhill from there.

VA, infrastructure, schools, you name it. The 1% has successfully turned the government into a giant piggy bank for themselves, and screw every one else. It is not surprising that people get angry if they think someone else is getting something 'for free'. Hell, we have brainwashed people so much that food-stamp recipients vote for the same party that vows to cut/eliminate food stamps. They are brainwashed to think that we don't have the money for it, while the 1% chugs merrily along with their billions in tax cuts and trillions in non-functional war toys.

Can you imagine the outrage by some here if she said the children should be put in the foster care system. People would be outraged at how she supports minors crossing the hot and extremely unfriendly border on their own. How it would tax our foster care system. How it would be the death of children. Damned if she does, damned if she doesn't.

He's working on it that way. Hmm. Guess he is her potential rival though.

As you said, possible potential rival. Couldn't say it. Love Biden. I think vast amounts of our energy needs to be directed south of the border. It has an enormous effect on us. Men, women and children are dying every day. Some to try to make it here. Human trafficking. Drug trafficking. Corruption. Overwhelmingly the people are very good people. Its just the bad ones have so much power.

there. Otherwise they'll be swayed towards China. The USA is so weak on Latin America, history of disrespect I guess..

for President and starting to suck the air out of the 2014 Midterms. I hope that changes.

but it would be great to hear him more often.

say what he's up to.. I get my news about Joe and the O Admin from The Obama Diary.



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TOD

We all ought to be careful forming opinions based on a snippet of an answer. Watch the video.

Go down to the video named immigration:

http://time.com/2891821/hillary-clinton-2016-gun-control/

good if she mentions Biden's efforts in Central America

I bet we will see that quote again.

the next to xenophobes. Tomorrow is anyone's guess.

Why are they being sent alone? Do they have relatives here who can assume responsibility for them? Encouraging children to cross the border alone is extremely dangerous. How many people die every year trying to cross the border? It's not easy on an adult, let alone a child.

Parents probably think crossing the border gives their children a better chance then staying in the country they are from and being shot. You are right though, it is very dangerous though and given they are kids they would be in all kinds of abuse. Not to mention the gun nuts on our side of the boarder.

Most of these children are from Central America. How do they even cross Mexico? I have read reports and seen documentaries about the brutality that confronts Central Americans attempting to travel through Mexico to get to the US. Criminals prey ion them because they are easy targets and carry a bit of money. The men are robbed, even killed. The women are summarily raped. There's also a mandatory 2 year jail time for illegal immigrants caught in Mexico (ironic, isn't it?). A lot of these people travel on top of cargo trains. That's where most of the worst crimes occur. They treat their fellow Hispanic brothers and sisters terribly, far worse than we do here.

wherever they are, should have custody.

I don't like the chances for a good life of a parentless child in a foreign country where they might not even speak the language. The chances that the children will end up abused and/or exploited are very high.

The law requires placing these children with family members if possible and even if these family members are in the United States. If responsible family members cannot be found, foster care is required. That is the only humane alternative. Just sending them back to their home country would be unconscionable. Many of them are either fleeing violence in their own countries and/or trying to find their families in the US. Unfortunately, even those children who are placed with their parents in the US must appear for deportation proceedings that can threaten their own and their family's well-being. Also, especially because of the recent surge in numbers, the conditions under which they are housed while the attempt to find family members is made are substandard.

I don't know what solutions are currently in the works, but it takes time to implement. A site must be located, housing and infrastructure constructed, staff vetted hired and trained, investigators hired and trained. Not possible to wave a magic wand and make it all instantly happen, as much as we'd like to.

These facilities are not safe.

My point was that whenever the decision is made to DO something, whether now, a month from now, or 2 months ago... that there is going to be a time lag before the decision becomes reality on the scene. The govt probably couldn't predict a sudden 10-fold increase in child illegal immigrants, and had no plan in place for an unforeseen circumstance. I presume the people on the scene are doing all they can while being completely overwehelmed. As for what is in the works, I guess call your congresscritter's office and urge them to help agencies respond to the crisis.

publicized more. There are people/individual families who are willing to take care of children in need of shelter.

than "ship 'em back".

Jesus H Fucking Christ! We can come up with billions in an eyeblink to bomb the shit out of some third world country, but take decent care of some kids? Well, fuck that shit.

I'm having one of those "there is no difference" moments; I so wish there will be a real progressive with an actual chance at winning, but I'm afraid we are going to get Hillary instead.

I´m living in Mexico right now, as I often do temporarily for research.

The poverty here is unfuckingreal. It takes a very twisted person not to be completely torn apart by the sight of little kids selling things on the streets to help their families make ends meet.

It´s not as easy as "their parents should stop sending them alone." #1 many are trying to connect with family here because they have next to NO ONE at home. #2 The parents often have little choice but to seek a better life for the kids.

I urge people to watch a great documentary called "Which Way Home." Mind-blowing. It examines Central American child migrants and their quest to reach the US.

She recognized the difficulty. A) Finding their parents. B) Determining if home was safe. C)Finding an alternative if home wasn't safe.

If its safe to return them home, then that is the best solution... that was how I interpreted her comment. Obviously things are much more difficult to resolve if home isn't safe.

such as a father or a mother, that is one thing. If their parents, who are citizens of another country are sending them up here, essentially using their own children as a stepping stone so they in turn can follow them up here and be granted amnesty, that is another thing altogether. No one can blame any parent for wanting a better life for themselves or their children, so I think the answer may be that perhaps the U.S. needs to stop exploiting lesser developed nations, but hell, we can't even stop exploiting our own poor for the benefit of the very rich, so what are we to do? People who scoff at "illegals" lack empathy and basic human compassion, because if they were on the other end of things, you can damn well bet they'd be sneaking over the boarder. I've lived on the boarder, and to see cardboard houses on one side of the Rio Grande, and upper middle class housing on the other is eye opening. What human being wouldn't want to reach towards what they perceive to be the better life? Income disparity is one of the most destabilizing things on the planet. Greed vs Need are incompatible.

They are sending kids here mostly to escape poverty and violence at home. Some kids may have relatives in US, if they can be located. Parents are being promised by traffickers that their kids will get amnesty and be allowed to stay.

"“They should be sent back as soon as it can be determined who responsible adults in their families are,” Clinton finally admitted. "

Because otherwise you are sending minors into...

That is pure fantasy.

The situation is appalling, but I'm waiting for workable solutions to be broached.

Should the children be gathered into orphanages on this side of the border? Then parceled out to American families for adoption, thus losing their heritage and any possible hope of reunion with their birth-parents?

That has the advantage of making Americans feel all good and righteous, yes? The kids would get fed and educated and churched, too.

Of course it would be really hard to adopt out the teenagers, and equally hard to prove their ages once it became known to them that being 18 makes you an adult and legally liable for whatever illegal immigrants are liable for.

Maybe their green cards could be fast-tracked -- contrary to rumor there ARE jobs Americans are unwilling to do.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Or maybe ...

Or maybe we could look to conditions on the other side of the border, i. e. "Where they came from."

And figure out a way to reunify them with their parents, i.e. "responsible adults in their families".

How does that sound?

Now that would really help reduce their incentive to come to America illegally. /s

It's a terrible dilemma with no easy answers.

to be on TV just because of who your parents are. I admire Mrs. Clintons ability to be as much an asshole as any man. Presidential material for sure.

What the hell? Your statement makes no sense, and only shows that anyone will attack Clinton for anything.

why don't you put up or shut up: take a couple of the kids into your home until their parents are found. Or, is it just Clinton who must act?

foster home type system put into place? We Americans could step up and take the children in until their families are found.

It would cost a bundle for government to set up the system, put safeguards in place, etc.

Some of the kids have their family info pinned to their clothes. There is no need to place these kids in border prisons. There could be as many as 3,000 more children in the next month. The children should be sent directly to their families, "responsible adults" and then deal with them through our official immigration system.

Our borders in most parts are not set-up to keep people totally out. Our border prison system is mostly run by the 'for profit' industry. They want people to cross over into USA so they can get them into their detention centers for the ~$47 a day. Then they wait for the official immigration system to hear their case, sometimes for months.

The 'for profit' detention centers should not be used to hold children, its bad enough for the adults they pack into those 'for profit' holding places. And for darn sure do not let the 'for profits' open childrens detention centers.




.

As it was upthread <rolleyes>.

because these kids, if they don't get picked up by authorities, then are highly vulnerable to all sorts of exploitation - work abuses, sexual abuse and trafficking to other countries.

Horribly sad. I wish I had a solution - I don't. Poor children

Aren't there already plenty of children in the U.S. who are waiting for adoption? What can we do with so many more? But there's probably no good place back home for these kids either. It's just a mess.