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cali

(114,904 posts)
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 03:59 PM Jun 2014

Not waiting for Hillary: Sen. Bernie Sanders heads to New Hampshire

Sen. Bernie Sanders, I-Vt., is revving up for a possible 2016 presidential bid, heading to New Hampshire this weekend to give two speeches laying out his agenda.

While other potential 2016 Democratic contenders appear to be waiting for a sign from Hillary Rodham Clinton on whether she is in or out, Sanders has been clear that he will get in to the race if he feels nobody is standing up for a progressive economic agenda. He told The Nation Magazine in March, “I don’t believe that I am the only person out there who can fight this fight, but I am certainly prepared to look seriously at that race.”

Sanders’ Senate campaign announced Tuesday that the “potential presidential candidate” will be in New Hampshire on Saturday to talk about “the grotesque level of income and wealth inequality” in the nation and “the need for a constitutional amendment to overturn the disastrous Supreme Court decision in the Citizens United case which allows billionaires to buy elections.”

Sanders was also in Iowa in May talking to liberal activists about his potential candidacy.

<snip>

http://onpolitics.usatoday.com/2014/06/24/not-waiting-for-hillary-sen-bernie-sanders-heads-to-new-hampshire/

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Not waiting for Hillary: Sen. Bernie Sanders heads to New Hampshire (Original Post) cali Jun 2014 OP
Yowza!! K&R Tierra_y_Libertad Jun 2014 #1
Good for him. I hope his trip is successful. hrmjustin Jun 2014 #2
Yes, the more candidate voices to counter those of corpratist, warmongering types the better. InAbLuEsTaTe Jun 2014 #17
I agree there needs to be a primary. hrmjustin Jun 2014 #54
I just don't trust Hillary. ?See her as corporatist bjobotts Jun 2014 #168
I definitely see the difference; plain as the nose on your face. InAbLuEsTaTe Jun 2014 #173
It's About Issues billhicks76 Jun 2014 #41
No matter who we nominate we will have a difficult time winning a third presidential term. hrmjustin Jun 2014 #57
Not if we tell the American people, "The GOP is the party of war." We wouldn't be lying. Enthusiast Jun 2014 #82
From your lips to God's ear! hrmjustin Jun 2014 #88
And then Bickle Jun 2014 #149
The War Against Education/FairPay/GunSense/Peace/etc. n/t Beartracks Jun 2014 #153
This message was self-deleted by its author Beartracks Jun 2014 #154
It's 2014, two years from now and everyone is claiming that Hillary is the de facto Aerows Jun 2014 #86
There will be a competitive primary. hrmjustin Jun 2014 #92
All this premature Aerows Jun 2014 #94
Good point. I hope we can all support the nominee. hrmjustin Jun 2014 #101
Absolutely! n/t Aerows Jun 2014 #109
So what do you suggest? I want to go down fighting not hanging desperately to the Status Quo. nm rhett o rick Jun 2014 #140
A good healthy primary. hrmjustin Jun 2014 #141
Yes I am certainly for that. nm rhett o rick Jun 2014 #142
Hopefully he can pull the national discussion Phlem Jun 2014 #3
that is his intent. he knows he can't win, but he also knows he can influence the debate cali Jun 2014 #7
I think he can win and hope he does. n/t A Simple Game Jun 2014 #42
Never say never Demeter Jun 2014 #61
He might be pleasantly surprised. JDPriestly Jun 2014 #63
I want this more than anything (save for Ms. Warren getting in!) Plucketeer Jun 2014 #79
Love him, but the populist movement is behind Warren. Dawgs Jun 2014 #4
If Liz won't run, I'll support Bernie. I'm savoriong this for Bernie! Maybe Liz will clarify now? TheNutcracker Jun 2014 #46
She's said a hundred times that she's not running. Bette Noir Jun 2014 #96
The day someone other than Elizabeth Warren is elected President Aerows Jun 2014 #121
Yes. But Warren needs to run. JDPriestly Jun 2014 #64
agree Dawgs Jun 2014 #70
Yay!!! Run Bernie Run! nt riderinthestorm Jun 2014 #5
In order for this to matter to me ... 1StrongBlackMan Jun 2014 #6
right. and if he runs, he will become a dem. Bernie is a very pragmatic guy. cali Jun 2014 #9
I'd want him to declare first. eom. 1StrongBlackMan Jun 2014 #11
That is right lostincalifornia Jun 2014 #15
He will. grahamhgreen Jun 2014 #10
WooHoo!!! The game is on - Buh-Bye Hill (again, lol) CONTRIBUTE: grahamhgreen Jun 2014 #8
Yes. I argue against Hillary as a candidate, and I would not vote for her for president, JDPriestly Jun 2014 #66
Then you are not really a Democrat if you don't support whoever wins the primary... VanillaRhapsody Jun 2014 #111
No. I am a Democrat. I've spent too many hours working the campaigns of Democrats JDPriestly Jun 2014 #118
Then you should trust your fellow Democrats.....and support THEIR decision.... VanillaRhapsody Jun 2014 #120
I live in California too and I hope even if you abstain zappaman Jun 2014 #132
Stop with the Democratic Party Purity Bulls@#$!! Strat54 Jun 2014 #137
Hyperbolic much? VanillaRhapsody Jun 2014 #139
nope, that's purity crap... its borderline masochist looking at the alternative... uponit7771 Jun 2014 #179
^You are right. NOT a hard choice in the general. Strat54 Jun 2014 #198
Who do you think you are telling him what he is or isnt. I disagree with you. I will always rhett o rick Jun 2014 #143
OMG VanillaRhapsody Jun 2014 #145
These are your words, "Then you are not really a Democrat " That's audacity telling someone in DU rhett o rick Jun 2014 #146
No...voting for whom your fellow Democrats select....is being "Democratic" otherwise... VanillaRhapsody Jun 2014 #147
Beating Republicans isnt important as maintaining Democratic principles. Dont give up your rhett o rick Jun 2014 #167
That poster spends most of his/her time telling others they are not Democrats or they shouldn't post Dragonfli Jun 2014 #158
Yeah, I'm sure it won't be long before we get the "friendly" "TOS reminder".... beerandjesus Jun 2014 #176
"Who do you think you are telling him what he is or isnt." zappaman Jun 2014 #164
You are once again so wrong. Authoritarians are those that worship their authoritarian rhett o rick Jun 2014 #166
Pot zappaman Jun 2014 #169
Once again your response reveals so much. Using Sid's ridicule emoticons is soo childish, but he rhett o rick Jun 2014 #170
Kettle. zappaman Jun 2014 #171
i agree haydukelives Jun 2014 #76
At his age it is now or never for him. former9thward Jun 2014 #12
I welcome them ALL to the race. InAbLuEsTaTe Jun 2014 #18
I would like to vote for someone not on Social Security. former9thward Jun 2014 #20
I'd like to vote for someone who won't offer to cut it, regardless of their age. Skeeter Barnes Jun 2014 #40
What Skeeter Said!!!! Bette R. Daize Jun 2014 #44
Ditto TheNutcracker Jun 2014 #55
Ahhh, someone that can think for themselves, good. A Simple Game Jun 2014 #48
You win! Enthusiast Jun 2014 #83
That's because she thinks she's the middle class Dragonfli Jun 2014 #159
Elizabeth Warren isn't middle class either. Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin Jun 2014 #190
But she doesn't think she is, or that raising the cap would hurt all those SIX and SEVIN FIGURE Dragonfli Jun 2014 #193
+1 leftstreet Jun 2014 #87
^^^AMEN!!!! Strat54 Jun 2014 #138
Can you name a good Democrat who isn't older? JDPriestly Jun 2014 #68
Martin O'Malley former9thward Jun 2014 #71
Neither can the majority of the electorate. Jackpine Radical Jun 2014 #72
Yes, O'Malley and Grayson. Cal33 Jun 2014 #97
Jeff Merkeley, junior Senator from Oregon. Bette Noir Jun 2014 #99
yes, merkley works hard for the people hopemountain Jun 2014 #161
Either Castro brother... VanillaRhapsody Jun 2014 #102
Good. We really need a much wider audience for voices like his. nt redqueen Jun 2014 #13
Bernie, THANK YOU. woo me with science Jun 2014 #14
Humongous K & R !!! WillyT Jun 2014 #16
Go Bernie! democrank Jun 2014 #19
Going to have a good laugh when Bernie puts his support behind the Democratic Primary winner... VanillaRhapsody Jun 2014 #21
oh c'mon. do you really "love.... Bernie"? cali Jun 2014 #26
Sure I do....and he is not going to run as a Dem....nor would he win the Primary even if he did...k VanillaRhapsody Jun 2014 #28
OK. I think I know just a tad more than YOU, 'nilla. He's my Senator. I know him cali Jun 2014 #34
BOOM I didn't say I knew ANYTHING about Bernie...other than he is NOT a Demcrat VanillaRhapsody Jun 2014 #98
Well people should stop "dreaming" and get out and vote for Bernie! TheNutcracker Jun 2014 #58
Pretty much. bigwillq Jun 2014 #59
So if you lived in Vermont you wouldn't vote for him? What scares you the word Socialist? A Simple Game Jun 2014 #60
What is to laugh about? djean111 Jun 2014 #69
Looking at how many Hillary for Prez threads are on truedelphi Jun 2014 #80
Yep. djean111 Jun 2014 #81
whoa, I can hear the loosening of the bowels in the Clinton camp Whisp Jun 2014 #22
And he doesn't speak in slogans and platitudes like most politicians arcane1 Jun 2014 #52
Yes, if Bernie were to win even 20, 30% in a Democratic primary Bette Noir Jun 2014 #103
She would have to pull hard in that direction to get the nom. She will not stay there tho. Whisp Jun 2014 #110
thank you, Senator Sanders noiretextatique Jun 2014 #23
He's been THE ONE all along! Now can we get a Ready for Bernie Bus wrapped up? Follow him everywhere TheNutcracker Jun 2014 #24
Go, Bernie, go Bernie! Erich Bloodaxe BSN Jun 2014 #25
I'll vote for Senator Sanders no matter what he runs as... TheProgressive Jun 2014 #27
Then what are you doing here....this is Democratic Underground... VanillaRhapsody Jun 2014 #30
Oh yes he can be. He's supported by the dems. If he runs for the nomination cali Jun 2014 #36
Senator Sanders has more true democratic principals than most 'registered Democrats'. TheProgressive Jun 2014 #50
+1000 MissDeeds Jun 2014 #90
Then why ISN'T He a Democrat? VanillaRhapsody Jun 2014 #104
Really? TheProgressive Jun 2014 #125
And He is a Democrat how? VanillaRhapsody Jun 2014 #127
I really don't understand your issue here... TheProgressive Jun 2014 #130
Yes you do.....you understand it perfectly! VanillaRhapsody Jun 2014 #131
Ok...thanks for playing... TheProgressive Jun 2014 #134
That one thinks he/she owns the site, has been that way since first coming and disrupting here. Dragonfli Jun 2014 #160
Progressives as well as conservatives such as yourself post here you know VR Dragonfli Jun 2014 #62
That was low, but you got nothing else but insults... Whisp Jun 2014 #67
It was an observation, not an insult Dragonfli Jun 2014 #75
Labels... TheProgressive Jun 2014 #128
And so do Ideologues and wolves in sheeps clothing too.... VanillaRhapsody Jun 2014 #107
Wolves in sheep's clothing, support free trade agreements and domestic spying Dragonfli Jun 2014 #117
Really? davidthegnome Jun 2014 #181
yes, and he is out there working and getting the word out hopemountain Jun 2014 #163
I'd take Bernie over any of the corporate owned Dems any day. Skeeter Barnes Jun 2014 #29
Thanks for the heads up..... VanillaRhapsody Jun 2014 #31
Oh, I don't have you on ignore already? Skeeter Barnes Jun 2014 #38
but you looove bernie, remember, 'nilla? cali Jun 2014 #175
Bernie 2016. nt Cali_Democrat Jun 2014 #32
Got to have this "conversation", to employ an Obama-ism. Smarmie Doofus Jun 2014 #33
As an independent, so what the does for is irrelevant to Democratic candidates until Agnosticsherbet Jun 2014 #35
If he runs, he'll run as a democrat. Period. cali Jun 2014 #39
According to this article in "The Nation" he appears to lean that way. Agnosticsherbet Jun 2014 #45
Bernie is very pragmatic and determined. he doesn't do pointless cali Jun 2014 #47
The guy I'd like to see in the White House is Dick Blumenthal of CT... First Speaker Jun 2014 #37
Thereare actually a fair number of good, but hidden, democrats Armstead Jun 2014 #133
I am all for Bernie Sanders going for it. BootinUp Jun 2014 #43
Kicked and recommended. Uncle Joe Jun 2014 #49
Run Bernie run! MissDeeds Jun 2014 #51
Well, Eva, since he is your senator, sadoldgirl Jun 2014 #53
Can't he still run for Senate? He'd still win that. TheNutcracker Jun 2014 #65
Bernie was just re-elected in 2012 cali Jun 2014 #113
! pa28 Jun 2014 #56
The only way Bernie Sanders can impact the Democrats is to become a Democrat. Peacetrain Jun 2014 #73
I dunno. The New Deal happened because Dems pulled planks from the populist party platform. redqueen Jun 2014 #100
No doubt that Bernie carries a big stick as an Independent. Peacetrain Jun 2014 #105
I can not believe the number of people posting this nonsense. ieoeja Jun 2014 #188
I seriously doubt that he'll wind up running, and in this country he'd never win anyway... George II Jun 2014 #74
I'm sure the Koch brothers have a few mil set aside for Ind Bernie to a spiteful Nader in 2016. CK_John Jun 2014 #77
I fear no one that claims that challenging Hillary is being a "nader" Aerows Jun 2014 #85
If he runs as a Democrat, fine. If he runs as an Independent, he will most likely.... George II Jun 2014 #106
I believe the word "Democratic" was in my post Aerows Jun 2014 #116
Yes you did, I was just expanding on the thought and the speculation (not yours) that... George II Jun 2014 #119
I think Sanders genuinely cares about the US Aerows Jun 2014 #122
Kicked and recommended! Enthusiast Jun 2014 #78
If I hear the implication that anyone who doesn't like Aerows Jun 2014 #91
We are on the same page. Enthusiast Jun 2014 #115
Those that want an inevitable Hillary Aerows Jun 2014 #84
Good! cprise Jun 2014 #89
Go, Bernie! Bette Noir Jun 2014 #93
THANK YOU!!!! DesertDiamond Jun 2014 #95
Go Bernie Go cantbeserious Jun 2014 #108
Bernie, Liz, Md.Gov. O'Malley -anybody but Goldman-Sachs darling,HRC! Divernan Jun 2014 #112
O'Malley is awesome Aerows Jun 2014 #124
Will work out well for Clinton... Mike Nelson Jun 2014 #114
she is a center right corporate politician. and a debate might not go so well for her cali Jun 2014 #123
"Center right"? BS That is a TeaLeft statement. RBInMaine Jun 2014 #148
center right. And anyone who thinks Eleanor Cliff is "teaLeft" is fucking plumb delusional cali Jun 2014 #151
For that you can thank the teabaggers, otherwise it would be a lot of "I agree with Governor (insert TheKentuckian Jun 2014 #135
He has MY Vote! joanbarnes Jun 2014 #126
Bernie, Bernie, Bernie!!! SummerSnow Jun 2014 #129
Good. 840high Jun 2014 #136
HIP HIP HOORAY! ECHOFIELDS Jun 2014 #144
Please stay safe Unknown Beatle Jun 2014 #150
WOW - a candidate Iwillnevergiveup Jun 2014 #152
I'd consider supporting Sanders davidpdx Jun 2014 #155
This makes my day. He's running and that's just what we need. Autumn Jun 2014 #156
I would rather vote for a Democratic candidate who actually is a Democrat. n/t totodeinhere Jun 2014 #157
I feel the same way about third way Democrat/Republicans. Dragonfli Jun 2014 #162
alright! now we're talkin' hopemountain Jun 2014 #165
We need to show America the true left !! It ain't Hillary folks. YOHABLO Jun 2014 #172
Bernie!! AzDar Jun 2014 #174
K&R!! nt raouldukelives Jun 2014 #177
With the comments on this board, herding Democrates is like herding cats. olegramps Jun 2014 #178
a small, hopeful, kick (nt) Babel_17 Jun 2014 #180
What's up with this purity crap? davidthegnome Jun 2014 #182
I am a registered Independent. bullsnarfle Jun 2014 #184
Didn't learn anything from 2000 eh? BootinUp Jun 2014 #185
On the contrary. davidthegnome Jun 2014 #187
You missed a couple BootinUp Jun 2014 #189
Where did I say that? davidthegnome Jun 2014 #196
We have to make sure dotymed Jun 2014 #183
Awesome. A real Democrat to vote for. obxhead Jun 2014 #186
Sanders would be a breath of fresh air...I've grown tired of legacy politics. NorthCarolina Jun 2014 #191
Talk about a dream come true! mentalslavery Jun 2014 #192
I would vote for Bernie in a nanosecond!!! n/t RoccoR5955 Jun 2014 #194
K&R woo me with science Jun 2014 #195
kick woo me with science Jun 2014 #197
 

bjobotts

(9,141 posts)
168. I just don't trust Hillary. ?See her as corporatist
Wed Jun 25, 2014, 12:52 AM
Jun 2014

Every since I watched her side with John McCain and join with him in saying Obama just lacked experience I thought to myself you just don't side with the opposition to try to make a fellow candidate look bad. Then there was her healthcare plan as first lady that made me feel she was to eager to please. I really wonder how she is now...but I know how Bernie Sanders is and what he really stands for...not what he thinks I want him to stand for. See the difference. Republicans are told what to stand for.

 

billhicks76

(5,082 posts)
41. It's About Issues
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 04:57 PM
Jun 2014

If we nominate a corporate stooge they will lose. The Repubs would have to hack a lot of voting machines or tabulators to steal the election.

Enthusiast

(50,983 posts)
82. Not if we tell the American people, "The GOP is the party of war." We wouldn't be lying.
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 06:07 PM
Jun 2014

We should say, "The Democratic Party is the party of the middle class. We are for marijuana decriminalization. American jobs. Holding Wall Street accountable! Higher taxes on the wealthy and corporations. No foreign entanglements. Zero interest student loan rates"

If we say that, we win. Hands fucking down

Bickle

(109 posts)
149. And then
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 10:08 PM
Jun 2014

The Republicans suppress the vote, change e-vote totals, spread lies, pass voter I'd and ludicrous tine and registration laws

This s not a level playing field.

The one word tha Dems need to learn : Arrest

Response to Beartracks (Reply #153)

 

Aerows

(39,961 posts)
86. It's 2014, two years from now and everyone is claiming that Hillary is the de facto
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 06:18 PM
Jun 2014

Democratic candidate. Rush to judgment apparently isn't a commodity possessed solely by one party.

 

hrmjustin

(71,265 posts)
92. There will be a competitive primary.
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 06:24 PM
Jun 2014

Either Brown if OH or Warren coukd beat her in the primary now.

 

Aerows

(39,961 posts)
94. All this premature
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 06:29 PM
Jun 2014

"You are for Hillary or you are for Nader" tripe is ridiculous. I get that a lot of people support Hillary Clinton for President. I'd suggest that other people get that some folks want to widen the door for people other than Hillary Clinton to run, too, and they aren't traitors to the Democratic Party.

Sheesh.

 

cali

(114,904 posts)
7. that is his intent. he knows he can't win, but he also knows he can influence the debate
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 04:08 PM
Jun 2014

if he becomes a dem. And if he decides to run, I'm quite sure that's what he'll do.

JDPriestly

(57,936 posts)
63. He might be pleasantly surprised.
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 05:28 PM
Jun 2014

I would vote for him if Elizabeth Warren does not run. Hey! I might vote for him even if she does run. I would like to see a real debate in the primaries. What we usually get is just one pro-Wall Street mouthpiece after the other. I really want Bernie Sanders to run.

I like the fact that for him, politics is not about his ego. It's about the American people and our country. He is just about the least egotistical person in American politics. I love him.

 

Plucketeer

(12,882 posts)
79. I want this more than anything (save for Ms. Warren getting in!)
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 06:01 PM
Jun 2014

But just bending the language on the campaign trail - Bernie might's well stay in his senate chambers. Look what we got from a VERY liberal-sounding, president-wanna-be senator in '08. We got a racial glass ceiling shattered and we forced health insurers to play fairER. Hillary would gonna greaze on into the White House with nary a RIPPLE of change from the current, pathetic course. And the thought of Billary whispering in her ears scares me to death!

RUN Bernie - RUN like you mean it! I've got cash I can't afford to spend that'll be yours.

 

Dawgs

(14,755 posts)
4. Love him, but the populist movement is behind Warren.
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 04:06 PM
Jun 2014

Hope that he's recognized enough to push others to the left.

 

TheNutcracker

(2,104 posts)
46. If Liz won't run, I'll support Bernie. I'm savoriong this for Bernie! Maybe Liz will clarify now?
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 05:01 PM
Jun 2014

If not, if she will not run, then I'll support Bernie.

 

Aerows

(39,961 posts)
121. The day someone other than Elizabeth Warren is elected President
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 07:03 PM
Jun 2014

We have 2 good years left - I'll never give up hoping she will run.

JDPriestly

(57,936 posts)
64. Yes. But Warren needs to run.
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 05:31 PM
Jun 2014

I hope that Sanders' announcement will push Elizabeth Warren to start organizing in case she wants to run. Sanders says he will run if no other progressive runs. We shall see. As I said above, Sanders is the least egotistical politician there is.

 

1StrongBlackMan

(31,849 posts)
6. In order for this to matter to me ...
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 04:08 PM
Jun 2014

He'll have to declare as a Democrat. Otherwise, he's playing the naderistic useful idiot.

I'd far rather Elizabeth Warren be in N.H.

JDPriestly

(57,936 posts)
66. Yes. I argue against Hillary as a candidate, and I would not vote for her for president,
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 05:34 PM
Jun 2014

but she is a good person. She has a good heart, but her ties to Wall Street make her politically a non-choice for me.

 

VanillaRhapsody

(21,115 posts)
111. Then you are not really a Democrat if you don't support whoever wins the primary...
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 06:48 PM
Jun 2014

you are Independent...

Her views on Women's Rights makes her a perfect choice for me...thank you very much! And I won't waste a Supreme Court nominee to another Republican...its THAT important to me...to women's freedom. Easy for you to toss us an anvil!

JDPriestly

(57,936 posts)
118. No. I am a Democrat. I've spent too many hours working the campaigns of Democrats
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 07:00 PM
Jun 2014

to be an independent. I like Hillary's stance on women. But I did not like Bill Clinton's signing the "welfare reform" bill. As long as the economy was good and jobs were relatively easy to get, it didn't seem so bad. But as we have seen, the minimum wage jobs that the women who were affected by that bill are getting can't support a family. Women who are raising small children, whether rich or poor, need dignity and should not be doomed to the kinds of choices the bill Clinton signed places on them.

My vote yes or no won't make any difference because I live in California and a Democrat will take this case unless the Republican candidate is from California -- which he/she won't be.

So I am free to vote or abstain my conscience.

 

VanillaRhapsody

(21,115 posts)
120. Then you should trust your fellow Democrats.....and support THEIR decision....
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 07:01 PM
Jun 2014

have a little damn respect for them for a change....that's why we HAVE a Primary in the first damn place...

But you would rather risk your vote....Keep in mind if you roll craps....women can say goodbye to Roe V Wade.......

zappaman

(20,605 posts)
132. I live in California too and I hope even if you abstain
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 07:38 PM
Jun 2014

Last edited Wed Jun 25, 2014, 12:17 AM - Edit history (1)

you still go and vote for the measures and local dems!

 

Strat54

(58 posts)
137. Stop with the Democratic Party Purity Bulls@#$!!
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 08:12 PM
Jun 2014

....and PLEASE!!!! PLEASE!!!!! Stop with all of the Hillary "Inevitability" hype!!!

Geez!!! She was supposedly "Inevitable" in 2008. How did THAT turn out??
She is a seriously flawed candidate on many levels. You are allowing the GOP to goad you into nominating Hillary. We don't need any more Bushes or Clintons!!!

I will vote for Hillary (or any other Democratic nominee) in the General Election, but I hope to God (or the FSM, or whoever...) that she is NOT the nominee.

Come on now!!! We elected a Black Man president!!! HELLO!!! An African American Man!!! How in the hell was that the "SAFE" or moderate choice?? HELL!! We whittled it down to a choice between an African American Man and a Woman. No matter WHo won the primary in 2008, we were going to make history. Why in the world do we talk as if we have to chose the candidate that is most like a Republican (Hillary) in order to win the General?? It's the same garbage the Clintons trotted out in 2008!! I think, collectively, we made the right choice in 2008. I think, collectively, we will make the right choice in 2016. DON'T LET THE CLINTONS TRY TO DICTATE THE RULES OF THE GAME!!!

Heck!!! In the 2008 Primary, I voted for Joe Biden because he made the most sense on Iraq and Afghanistan and because He is a liberal on many issues. I sure as heck voted for Barack Obama in the general!!! I am NOT disappointed in President Obama!!

I get the sense of a whole "Hillary Defense Industry" that just pounces on any mention of any possibility other than HRC.


Another fact to face:
The GOP clown car will be out maneuvered by Mitt Romney again!! Mitt will be the candidate again!! (You heard it here first!) Hillary vs. Mitt is not a very stark contrast.

 

VanillaRhapsody

(21,115 posts)
139. Hyperbolic much?
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 08:30 PM
Jun 2014

....let me check the door....

....yep....yep...


Its Democratic Underground alright...

uponit7771

(90,193 posts)
179. nope, that's purity crap... its borderline masochist looking at the alternative...
Wed Jun 25, 2014, 10:44 AM
Jun 2014

... here on one side we have Hill ... on the other side we have people who support hindering people voting for the sake of winning....


not a hard choice

 

Strat54

(58 posts)
198. ^You are right. NOT a hard choice in the general.
Fri Jun 27, 2014, 07:02 PM
Jun 2014

Just like it wasn't a hard choice to vote for Obama in the general. But the Hillary "Purity Crap" reminds me of 2008. Remember when the media was trying to find Hillary supporters who said they would vote for McCain if Hillary wasn't the nominee??

But in the primary, we DO have a choice. I chose to make that choice count. They can trot out all of the "Hillary Inevitability" orthodoxy they want. I'm hoping it is someone far more liberal than Wal-Mart's former attorney.

 

rhett o rick

(55,981 posts)
143. Who do you think you are telling him what he is or isnt. I disagree with you. I will always
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 08:46 PM
Jun 2014

support Democrats, but I will never support DINO's. You see, I always have a choice and unlike some, I dont walk lockstep with anyone.

H. Clinton proved she was not a good Democrat when she betrayed not only her constituents, not only her nation, not only the fracking world, but the innocent children of Iraq that have died horrible deaths at the hands of the warhawks.

 

rhett o rick

(55,981 posts)
146. These are your words, "Then you are not really a Democrat " That's audacity telling someone in DU
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 09:15 PM
Jun 2014

that they are not really a Democrat. And now calling some DU'ers "ideologues". If following Democratic principles is an "ideologue" then I am guilty.

But I notice that there is a particular GROUP that wont comment on the TPP. This same GROUP all, each and every one, will shout hatred of Snowden, but not one comment about the TPP. What ideology is that?

 

VanillaRhapsody

(21,115 posts)
147. No...voting for whom your fellow Democrats select....is being "Democratic" otherwise...
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 09:18 PM
Jun 2014

its sour grapes....I don't play Chicken when it comes to Republicans....I want to beat them all to hell.

 

rhett o rick

(55,981 posts)
167. Beating Republicans isnt important as maintaining Democratic principles. Dont give up your
Wed Jun 25, 2014, 12:38 AM
Jun 2014

principles just to "win".

Dragonfli

(10,622 posts)
158. That poster spends most of his/her time telling others they are not Democrats or they shouldn't post
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 11:48 PM
Jun 2014

here, or a combination of he two. It really thinks it runs both the party and the site for some reason.

zappaman

(20,605 posts)
164. "Who do you think you are telling him what he is or isnt."
Wed Jun 25, 2014, 12:20 AM
Jun 2014

Says the guy who calls DUers "authoritarians" if they don't do enough jumping jacks for ES or GG.

 

rhett o rick

(55,981 posts)
166. You are once again so wrong. Authoritarians are those that worship their authoritarian
Wed Jun 25, 2014, 12:36 AM
Jun 2014

leaders like Gen Clapper. They never question the authorities. Sound familiar? I notice that you didnt participate in the thread today about the TPP. Why is that? Why dont any of your friends want to discuss the TPP? Do you all support the TPP?

 

rhett o rick

(55,981 posts)
170. Once again your response reveals so much. Using Sid's ridicule emoticons is soo childish, but he
Wed Jun 25, 2014, 01:03 AM
Jun 2014

will be soo proud. Why dont you post in threads that discuss the TPP? Do you support it?

former9thward

(31,684 posts)
12. At his age it is now or never for him.
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 04:10 PM
Jun 2014

So he might as well try. That also applies to Clinton, Warren and Biden.

A Simple Game

(9,214 posts)
48. Ahhh, someone that can think for themselves, good.
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 05:05 PM
Jun 2014

It doesn't matter to me, I will vote for someone that doesn't offer to cut SS among other things.

No more lesser of two evils for me, I'm too old and did that for too long, it got me (us) nowhere.

Enthusiast

(50,983 posts)
83. You win!
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 06:11 PM
Jun 2014

There is no viable alternative to social security. We can take a look around and see that quite clearly.

Hillary Clinton is against raising the cap on higher income earners claiming it would be raising taxes on the middle class. (what bullshit)

Dragonfli

(10,622 posts)
159. That's because she thinks she's the middle class
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 11:53 PM
Jun 2014

and people like her ignore the median income and believe the middle class starts somewhere around 150 to 250 k a year and ends at less than 100 million.

Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin

(106,789 posts)
190. Elizabeth Warren isn't middle class either.
Wed Jun 25, 2014, 02:53 PM
Jun 2014

I'm not dissing her. In fact I rather admire her. Just pointing out the facts.

Dragonfli

(10,622 posts)
193. But she doesn't think she is, or that raising the cap would hurt all those SIX and SEVIN FIGURE
Wed Jun 25, 2014, 03:20 PM
Jun 2014

"middle classers".

Raising the cap would not harm the middle class, the fact that Hillary thinks it will proves her idea of the middle class is they are those in the top 10%.

My post was obviously regarding that and not the fact that She is wealthy. Read what I responded to please.

JDPriestly

(57,936 posts)
68. Can you name a good Democrat who isn't older?
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 05:36 PM
Jun 2014

Do you have anyone in mind?

The problem is that younger Democrats can't remember what it is like to be in an pre-Nixon, pre-Reagan America.

Jackpine Radical

(45,274 posts)
72. Neither can the majority of the electorate.
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 05:45 PM
Jun 2014

And that's a HUGE problem. They have no knowledge of the history of unionism, of the New Deal, the New Frontier, or the rise of Progressivism as a response to the horribly corrupt big-money politics of the 19th Century.

We did it once, and I'm hoping that we can do it again. Left unbridled, the oiligarchs will bring us to extinction.

Bette Noir

(3,581 posts)
99. Jeff Merkeley, junior Senator from Oregon.
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 06:35 PM
Jun 2014

He's a hard-core progressive, in his 50s, in good health, and looks terrific dressed up as the Brawny man.

democrank

(11,032 posts)
19. Go Bernie!
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 04:29 PM
Jun 2014

One thing is for sure....he won`t have to confer with a herd of consultants to figure out what he believes in and stands for.

 

VanillaRhapsody

(21,115 posts)
21. Going to have a good laugh when Bernie puts his support behind the Democratic Primary winner...
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 04:35 PM
Jun 2014

Love me some Bernie....but he is NOT a Democrat sorry!

 

VanillaRhapsody

(21,115 posts)
28. Sure I do....and he is not going to run as a Dem....nor would he win the Primary even if he did...k
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 04:45 PM
Jun 2014

Sorry to disappoint you....but I am a realist not a dreamer...

 

cali

(114,904 posts)
34. OK. I think I know just a tad more than YOU, 'nilla. He's my Senator. I know him
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 04:50 PM
Jun 2014

I know members of his staff. And what part of he's trying to influence the debate, is so difficult for you to wrap your mind around? Bernie will indeed run as a dem if he runs and he's a pragmatist; he knows he won't win. He wants to INFLUENCE THE DEBATE. I'm a dreamer and a realist. Bobby Kennedy was also.

You? You're a party line person who idolizes politicians but never has jack to say about policy.

boom.

 

VanillaRhapsody

(21,115 posts)
98. BOOM I didn't say I knew ANYTHING about Bernie...other than he is NOT a Demcrat
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 06:35 PM
Jun 2014

and thinking he can win the Primary is just idealistic...

BOOM backatcha CA!

 

TheNutcracker

(2,104 posts)
58. Well people should stop "dreaming" and get out and vote for Bernie!
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 05:20 PM
Jun 2014

If people are dreaming about it....then people really want him, and don't believe they can have him. T H E Y C A N !

 

bigwillq

(72,790 posts)
59. Pretty much.
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 05:22 PM
Jun 2014

Everyone is always like "he can't win" or "she can't win"
If we all vote for them, THEY CAN WIN!

It's kind of like Obama. I don't think many thought he could win but, guess what, HE DID! Because people VOTED for him. They supported him, even when no one else did. This is how it happens.

A Simple Game

(9,214 posts)
60. So if you lived in Vermont you wouldn't vote for him? What scares you the word Socialist?
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 05:24 PM
Jun 2014

I think he could easily win the New Hampshire primary and Iowa caucus then who knows?

You do know that Senator Obama endorsed him for Senator in Vermont don't you? Sanders was reelected with 71% of the vote, when people know him they like him.

When Sanders first ran for the house the Republican got 41% Sanders got 38% and the Democrat got 19%, who was the spoiler in that election? In that case DU rules say we should have voted for Sanders because the Democrat was splitting the liberal vote.

What does a realist say if he is the only liberal running for President in 2016 and is polling ahead of the Democrat?

 

djean111

(14,255 posts)
69. What is to laugh about?
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 05:38 PM
Jun 2014

Nothing can make Hillary palatable to me.
And laughing at people who will have to hold their nose to vote for her? Now, there's a club (or party) that I don't want to belong to. You seem oddly intent on insulting and pushing away those who do not care for Hillary's policies - seems almost subversive to me.

truedelphi

(32,324 posts)
80. Looking at how many Hillary for Prez threads are on
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 06:02 PM
Jun 2014

This site every single day makes me laugh.

Don't people remember 2007, when she was only a year away from totally securing the nomination of the Party?

But people did not want her then and they don't want her now. Corporate candidates are more out of favor than at any time prior to this. The internet has taken the veil down. We see these creatures for what they are. And they are not at all about us.

 

djean111

(14,255 posts)
81. Yep.
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 06:06 PM
Jun 2014

The almost shrill insistence that she is already the official candidate is getting bizarre. And the posts saying if you do not like Hillary, donate to the GOP - beyond bizarre.
She has NOT been nominated. She has NOT won any primaries. And yeah, 2007. Guess this is why the Hillary peeps don't want any primaries, seems to me.

 

Whisp

(24,096 posts)
22. whoa, I can hear the loosening of the bowels in the Clinton camp
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 04:37 PM
Jun 2014

from way over here.

Sanders and Hillary in a debate would be like oil and water. Sanders has not much to fear, but the oily ones sure do.

 

arcane1

(38,613 posts)
52. And he doesn't speak in slogans and platitudes like most politicians
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 05:11 PM
Jun 2014

It will be a refreshing primary, for sure!

Bette Noir

(3,581 posts)
103. Yes, if Bernie were to win even 20, 30% in a Democratic primary
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 06:42 PM
Jun 2014

hippie-punching would go out of style instantly. Hillary would have to pull to the left to get the nomination. Then the question would be, if she were to win the general, would she govern to the left, or revert to form?

 

Whisp

(24,096 posts)
110. She would have to pull hard in that direction to get the nom. She will not stay there tho.
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 06:48 PM
Jun 2014

It will be for show only. The fortunate thing is she is a terrible liar and she'll have to do plenty of that to be convincingly left and not the hawk and monied one she is and there will be pitfalls aplenty for her because of that. The unfortunate thing is too many just don't care enough to think harder about what the Clintons really represent.

noiretextatique

(27,275 posts)
23. thank you, Senator Sanders
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 04:38 PM
Jun 2014

for not buying into the "the country is moving right" bullshit and standing up for what's RIGHT.

 

TheNutcracker

(2,104 posts)
24. He's been THE ONE all along! Now can we get a Ready for Bernie Bus wrapped up? Follow him everywhere
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 04:39 PM
Jun 2014

Everywhere he goes! I'm in. I will leave my family. I will leave my state. To work for such a man.

Erich Bloodaxe BSN

(14,733 posts)
25. Go, Bernie, go Bernie!
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 04:41 PM
Jun 2014

Time to start pushing the party hard to the left! Let's win with the base, not the 'mythical middle'.

 

TheProgressive

(1,656 posts)
27. I'll vote for Senator Sanders no matter what he runs as...
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 04:44 PM
Jun 2014

Dem or Independent it does not matter.

He is truly a man of the people.

 

VanillaRhapsody

(21,115 posts)
30. Then what are you doing here....this is Democratic Underground...
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 04:47 PM
Jun 2014

Bernie is not a Democrat and cannot be supported on DU anymore than Rand Paul can...

 

cali

(114,904 posts)
36. Oh yes he can be. He's supported by the dems. If he runs for the nomination
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 04:51 PM
Jun 2014

he'll run as a dem. and yes, I know much, much more about bernie than YOU.

Oh, and what do you love about Bernie? Do tell, 'nilla

 

TheProgressive

(1,656 posts)
50. Senator Sanders has more true democratic principals than most 'registered Democrats'.
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 05:06 PM
Jun 2014

But, thanks for being inclusive...

 

TheProgressive

(1,656 posts)
125. Really?
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 07:30 PM
Jun 2014

Feel free to read the Terms of Service:
Below is one entry - I just happen to be a 'politically liberal person'.
Thanks, but no need for you to tell me what I can or cannot do!



Don't be a wingnut (right-wing or extreme-fringe).
Democratic Underground is an online community for politically liberal people who understand the importance of working within the system to elect more Democrats and fewer Republicans to all levels of political office. Teabaggers, Neo-cons, Dittoheads, Paulites, Freepers, Birthers, and right-wingers in general are not welcome here. Neither are certain extreme-fringe left-wingers, including advocates of violent political/social change, hard-line communists, terrorist-apologists, America-haters, kooks, crackpots, LaRouchies, and the like.

 

VanillaRhapsody

(21,115 posts)
127. And He is a Democrat how?
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 07:33 PM
Jun 2014

the sites mission is to elect more DEMOCRATS!!!!

and I quote:

"...to elect more Democrats and fewer Republicans to all levels of political office.


Thanks for proving my point!
 

TheProgressive

(1,656 posts)
130. I really don't understand your issue here...
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 07:36 PM
Jun 2014

Senator Sanders is a very decent person that is an independent who is
more democratic than others who fly the Dem flag.

Seriously, what is your real issue with Senator Sanders and my support for him?

Dragonfli

(10,622 posts)
62. Progressives as well as conservatives such as yourself post here you know VR
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 05:27 PM
Jun 2014

As much as you may find them distasteful.

Dragonfli

(10,622 posts)
75. It was an observation, not an insult
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 05:50 PM
Jun 2014

VR expends a great many keystrokes telling various progressives they do not belong here and defends every single conservative policy suggested or enacted by the farthest right of our party. Progressives have posted here for at least the decade I have been here and a newbie has no business speaking for the admins every chance he/she can about how this poster or that does not belong here.

 

TheProgressive

(1,656 posts)
128. Labels...
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 07:33 PM
Jun 2014

I am a lot of things (label wise).

Progressive, liberal, registered Democrat, FDR/JFK Democrat... what I call normal intelligent compassionate human being!

 

VanillaRhapsody

(21,115 posts)
107. And so do Ideologues and wolves in sheeps clothing too....
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 06:44 PM
Jun 2014

non-Democrats...much as you hate to admit that!

By the way....I am a Yellow Dog Democrat just like my FDR voting Grandparents I will have you know....so your insinuation is false at its core!

Realists have to deal with the Ideologues is the real problem.....

Dragonfli

(10,622 posts)
117. Wolves in sheep's clothing, support free trade agreements and domestic spying
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 06:57 PM
Jun 2014

Not progressives, you have it all backward I am afraid.

davidthegnome

(2,983 posts)
181. Really?
Wed Jun 25, 2014, 11:12 AM
Jun 2014

Bernie may not be a democrat in the sense that he doesn't have that (D) by his name, but when it comes down to it, he's a hell of a lot more of a democrat than many "actual" democrats are. He may be an independent, but he is a liberal, progressive independent that many of us here would vote for even if he did run as an independent. That includes me, by the way. Can I not post here anymore? Should I be banned for wanting to vote for an actual progressive?


I'm here in support of policies and politicians from the left - even if the mainstream party would feel more comfortable if they'd all go "underground". I'm here in support of policies and politicians that fight for what a lot of us believe in. I'm here to support the good guys. Bernie is definitely one of the good guys.

Bernie sure as hell can be - and sure as hell IS supported here.

hopemountain

(3,919 posts)
163. yes, and he is out there working and getting the word out
Wed Jun 25, 2014, 12:17 AM
Jun 2014

on current issues with a clear, progressive stance. he is the first if not one of the first to speak up in defense of social security, the diabled, the unemployed, and the working class. and, he is honest when he speaks on the issues - he does not flub the issues one bit. really appreciate that he is being a leader and stepping up to the plate as a candidate and to get the ball rolling for the primary.

 

Smarmie Doofus

(14,498 posts)
33. Got to have this "conversation", to employ an Obama-ism.
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 04:49 PM
Jun 2014

>>>Sanders’ Senate campaign announced Tuesday that the “potential presidential candidate” will be in New Hampshire on Saturday to talk about “the grotesque level of income and wealth inequality” in the nation and “the need for a constitutional amendment to overturn the disastrous Supreme Court decision in the Citizens United case which allows billionaires to buy elections.” >>>>

Time for some blunt talk and only Sen. Sanders can do it credibly.

(BTW: "Grotesque". I love it. Someone is actually prepared to employ the English language communicatively. Can we not start calling grotesque things "grotesque"?)

Agnosticsherbet

(11,619 posts)
35. As an independent, so what the does for is irrelevant to Democratic candidates until
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 04:50 PM
Jun 2014

the general election, except that he lis likely to force Democrats to move to the left.

 

cali

(114,904 posts)
39. If he runs, he'll run as a democrat. Period.
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 04:53 PM
Jun 2014

He's my Senator. I know him. He's a very pragmatic guy.

 

cali

(114,904 posts)
47. Bernie is very pragmatic and determined. he doesn't do pointless
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 05:04 PM
Jun 2014

and he is very, very different from Nader.

First Speaker

(4,858 posts)
37. The guy I'd like to see in the White House is Dick Blumenthal of CT...
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 04:52 PM
Jun 2014

...not just because I'm from CT, but because this guy is a pragmatic progressive who really is effective when it comes to dealing with corporate BS. He knows where the bodies are buried, and could put the fear of God in Wall Street circles just as well as Elizabeth Warren could. When he was Attorney General, he was untiring in protecting consumers from corporate ripoffs, something I have first-hand experience with, because Dick helped me when no one else could...a really good guy. I doubt he'll run in 2016, but I hope he does someday...

 

Armstead

(47,803 posts)
133. Thereare actually a fair number of good, but hidden, democrats
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 07:40 PM
Jun 2014

I guess they don't have the fire in the belly or the lust for the spotlight or something.

BootinUp

(46,852 posts)
43. I am all for Bernie Sanders going for it.
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 05:00 PM
Jun 2014

I think he would add a lot to the discussion of the issues.

sadoldgirl

(3,431 posts)
53. Well, Eva, since he is your senator,
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 05:12 PM
Jun 2014

what happens to his seat in the Senate, when or if he runs? Mind you, I have the greatest respect and hopes for him, but would love to keep him in at least one place, WH or Senate.

 

cali

(114,904 posts)
113. Bernie was just re-elected in 2012
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 06:49 PM
Jun 2014

He can run for the nomination and still be a Senator. Lots have. Anyway, the repub party is a mess in Vermont- to put it kindly. They hold one state wide office. They're in a "super minority" in both houses. They can't find candidates to run and they're broke. When Bernie and Pat retire, there are plenty of very progressive dems and Progressives- Vermont has a viable third party, The Vermont Progressive Party. They work pretty closely with the dems.

I think this guy would run:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Zuckerman_%28politician%29

a few others:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shap_Smith

Governor Shumlin

Howard Dean

Former Ambassador and current State Senator Peter Galbraith.

The bench is deep. The only problem with it is that there are way too few women.

Peacetrain

(22,836 posts)
73. The only way Bernie Sanders can impact the Democrats is to become a Democrat.
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 05:46 PM
Jun 2014

If he runs as a Independent which he is now.. he will not be in Democratic primaries or debates..

It will not impact how the party goes or its platform.

He will have to give that a lot of thought.

edit for spelling

redqueen

(115,085 posts)
100. I dunno. The New Deal happened because Dems pulled planks from the populist party platform.
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 06:36 PM
Jun 2014

It took their losing votes to make them do it.

If enough Democrats get behind Bernie he could very well influence the party.

Peacetrain

(22,836 posts)
105. No doubt that Bernie carries a big stick as an Independent.
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 06:44 PM
Jun 2014

He is a voice. I am just not sure how effective that voice would be third party.

I will be voting the Democratic ticket.. I am a big goverment, big party, old line liberal.

If he really wanted to shake things up.. get into the party, and debate in primaries.

As a woman, I am not going to lie.. I would like to see a woman run.. But again.. if Bernie got the nod from my party.. He would have my vote.

 

ieoeja

(9,748 posts)
188. I can not believe the number of people posting this nonsense.
Wed Jun 25, 2014, 02:06 PM
Jun 2014

You don't go to Iowa and New Hampshire preparing for the general election. You go for the primaries. And there is on such thing as an Independant primary.

He wouldn't fucking be in Iowa and New Hampshire if he was going to run as an Independant. Why would anyone who knows anything about politics think otherwise?

And yet we have a dozen DUers who apparently know that little about politics.

Amazing.


George II

(67,782 posts)
74. I seriously doubt that he'll wind up running, and in this country he'd never win anyway...
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 05:48 PM
Jun 2014

New Hampshire is just across the river from Vermont, not like he's going way out of his way to go there. It could just be a speaking engagement.

Remember, he's not a Democrat, so either he'd have to register as a Democrat (if it's not too late for 2016). Also, although it wouldn't bother me or too many northeasterners, being a "Brooklyn Jew" isn't going to play well in many other areas of the country.

 

Aerows

(39,961 posts)
85. I fear no one that claims that challenging Hillary is being a "nader"
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 06:16 PM
Jun 2014

If Hillary is the end all, be all of the Democratic Party and anyone who runs against her or supports anyone that runs against her is a traitor? I have free will and I vote Democratic. Don't you dare attempt to rob me of the right to vote for the best Democratic candidate and claim I am a "traitor".

George II

(67,782 posts)
106. If he runs as a Democrat, fine. If he runs as an Independent, he will most likely....
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 06:44 PM
Jun 2014

....be responsible for electing a republican.

I still hold Ralph Nader and his ego responsible for the deaths of about 10,000 Americans and tens of thousands of Iraqis.

 

Aerows

(39,961 posts)
116. I believe the word "Democratic" was in my post
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 06:55 PM
Jun 2014

I'm also not afraid of Democratic challengers to Hillary for the primary. In fact, I think they are necessary - we need the cream of our party's crop to run for President, and I have no problem with all of them standing up and being inspected as to whether they are up to the standard or no.

George II

(67,782 posts)
119. Yes you did, I was just expanding on the thought and the speculation (not yours) that...
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 07:01 PM
Jun 2014

....he should or could run as an Independent.

Thankfully, I think he has more sense than Nader and won't do that.

 

Aerows

(39,961 posts)
122. I think Sanders genuinely cares about the US
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 07:12 PM
Jun 2014

and Democratic ideals, even though he is an Independent. I don't think for a moment he would run as a spoiler. If he does, I won't be voting for him because my respect for him would be lost.

 

Aerows

(39,961 posts)
91. If I hear the implication that anyone who doesn't like
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 06:24 PM
Jun 2014

Hillary Clinton as the Democratic nominee is a closet right winger one more time, I'm going to blow a gasket.

I was unaware that being a Democrat meant I had to be in love with Hillary Clinton as a candidate. I wasn't overly fond of Barack Obama, either, but I voted for the man. If you want my vote, just accept it, but don't sit there complaining because I won't martyr myself for either candidate.

I don't martyr myself for any politician, but I am well within my rights to believe there are better, stronger Democrats than Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton - I won't apologize for that opinion, either.

 

Aerows

(39,961 posts)
84. Those that want an inevitable Hillary
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 06:13 PM
Jun 2014

forget we have some fine politicians. Martin O'Malley, Elizabeth Warren, Bernie Sanders and several other fine solid Democrats.

I will never consider Hillary inevitable, anymore than I consider any political race won or lost until the last vote is counted and the victor is declared.

Bette Noir

(3,581 posts)
93. Go, Bernie!
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 06:29 PM
Jun 2014

The Democrats were a lot more liberal when they had the Peace and Freedom party breathing down their necks.

Divernan

(15,480 posts)
112. Bernie, Liz, Md.Gov. O'Malley -anybody but Goldman-Sachs darling,HRC!
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 06:48 PM
Jun 2014

My dream ticket - either Bernie or Liz, w/ 51 year old Maryland Governor O'Malley in the VP
slot.

O’Malley’s persistent efforts to assist undocumented immigrants and Latinos in his state have cast him in a national light with Latino groups and campaign activists.“The guy represents the promise of American politics,” declared Javier Palomarez, the president of the U.S. Hispanic Chamber of Commerce (USHCC). “If you look at the record, he increased contracting by Hispanics 133%, which stands in contrast to the abysmal attempt by the federal government.”

Palomarez went on, “America believes immigration is the only issue on the docket for Hispanics. We’re not monolithic, it’s not just immigration reform. But if you look, [O’Malley] has led where others have not.” In February, O’Malley mentioned that he was preparing the groundwork for a presidential campaign run, and this weekend, he visited Iowa, a key primary state.


http://jpupdates.com/2014/06/23/maryland-gov-omalley-advocate-illegal-immigrants-dem-2016-presidential-candidate/ (Jewish Political News and Updates)

Meanwhile Hillary Clinton is on everyone’s hot favorite list but O’Malley seems unafraid to challenge her. This weekend, he was in Iowa.

“In the past politicians, and those who report, create checklists to go through. Labor, check this; Hispanic constituency; Irish, check this,” he said. “What we need now is a better understanding of our story together and how these pieces need to be addressed to solve the big problem that’s on the table of how do we grow the middle class, how do we create enough jobs for this generation and the next, and how do we restore our economy so it once again has a human purpose.”

Gabriela Domenzain, former director of Hispanic press for Obama For America, said “He’s going to have an actual record, where other Democratic candidates can and should be contrasted,” she said. “He can say in those debates, ...’ ‘I passed the DREAM Act,’ not ‘I support it.’”


Buzzfeed.com reveals the Irish American with roots in Mayo and Galway is hard at work with “new Americans,” as he calls immigrants. http://www.buzzfeed.com/adriancarrasquillo/maryland-gov-martin-omalley-has-been-busy-building-a-record

He passed the DREAM act in his state, allowing 36,000 undocumented to have access to in-state tuition and go to college. He has given driver’s licenses to the undocumented and has refused to have his state co-operate with deportation of immigrants who are crime free.

“On my desk, as I sit here, is a sign from Baltimore that says, ‘No Irish need apply,’” O’Malley told BuzzFeed. “My great-grandparents didn’t speak English but I think America is made better by people who come from elsewhere.”

He says that “our nation should have passed comprehensive immigration reform.”

“In the meantime what do you want?” he said. “Do you want them to be able to get to and from work or do you want them to drive without a license and god forbid you or your wife are involved [in an accident]? That doesn’t make a hell of a lot of sense.”


Buzzfeed points out that “Maryland has the lowest Hispanic unemployment rate at 5.1% (compared to 9.1% nationally), and the state has more than doubled contracts to Latino-owned businesses during his time as governor.”
 

Aerows

(39,961 posts)
124. O'Malley is awesome
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 07:16 PM
Jun 2014

If not Warren or Sanders, then our party couldn't possibly go wrong with having O'Malley as our Presidential nominee. He's a great speaker, has a strong record, and doesn't sway in the wind when a strong breeze blows. I've been very impressed with him.

 

cali

(114,904 posts)
123. she is a center right corporate politician. and a debate might not go so well for her
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 07:14 PM
Jun 2014

Bernie doesn't pull punches and he'll bring up things that aren't comfortable for Madame Corporate Crony.

TheKentuckian

(24,904 posts)
135. For that you can thank the teabaggers, otherwise it would be a lot of "I agree with Governor (insert
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 07:54 PM
Jun 2014

shitbag here)" and "we are on the same page here, right?"

Iwillnevergiveup

(9,298 posts)
152. WOW - a candidate
Tue Jun 24, 2014, 10:27 PM
Jun 2014

who's a tireless fighter and champion for the middle class and who doesn't play political games---well, that might take some getting used to.

K&R

hopemountain

(3,919 posts)
165. alright! now we're talkin'
Wed Jun 25, 2014, 12:31 AM
Jun 2014

bernie has guts fueled by an intense desire to work for the people. he has my support! best news i have heard in awhile. thanks, cali.

olegramps

(8,200 posts)
178. With the comments on this board, herding Democrates is like herding cats.
Wed Jun 25, 2014, 10:32 AM
Jun 2014

We seem to be our own worst enemy. I would surely return to the days of the Clinton administration rather than the Bush disaster and the GOP obstructionism that now has strangled our government. I can't imagine why any Democrat would contemplate not voting for a Democratic candidate. I really fear that the Republicans will get control of the senate due to our apathy. If that happens, the next two years will be absolute hell. I am reading her book and see how it demonstrates just how complicated today's world is and why in my humble estimation that it requires someone with extensive experience to be able to the control the situation. I hope Sanders stumps because it will force anyone who challenges him to address a number of critical issues that are of utmost importance although the doesn't seem to have much of a chance of obtaining the nomination or winning the election.

davidthegnome

(2,983 posts)
182. What's up with this purity crap?
Wed Jun 25, 2014, 11:31 AM
Jun 2014

It seems that there's a number of posters protesting that anyone running as an independent cannot be supported here at DU. Why? Because Nader, or something.

Mr. Sanders is not one of those politicians that clings to the middle, or frequently jumps over to the right when he feels it suits him. He is more liberal, to my knowledge, than the vast majority of our elected democrats. He has demonstrated that he is more progressive, he has demonstrated that he is the kind of guy who really fights hard for what most of us here believe in. He is an independent candidate who, at the very least, should have an honorary D - the right kind of D. Not a blue dog, not a corporate pawn, not someone who believes in pandering to the right.

If, here at DU, it is actually "against da rewelz" to support someone like Sanders, then perhaps we should petition Mr. Skinner to reconsider a couple of those rules. Are independents no longer allowed here if they actually support independents? You know, a lot of people have left the democratic party to join independents because the (D) seems to have moved a good distance to the right in recent years.

If Mr. Sanders runs for office, either as a democrat or an independent, I fully intend to vote for him unless there is someone I like better. Do I have to give up my democrat card? Am I either with us or against us?

Instead of grumbling, holding our noses, and telling ourselves that the people we actually like, who's policies we prefer... can't win... maybe we should just vote for them. Put our money, our action, our support, where out hearts and minds have been for years. When Bernie Sanders is a far better democrat than the more popular actual democrat candidates... maybe we need to reconsider our priorities.

I'll vote for the best candidate, the one who represents what I believe in. If the only candidate running that represents me is Bernie Sanders, then that's who I'll vote for. But, go ahead and alert on me or something, or call me an evil Naderbot.

bullsnarfle

(254 posts)
184. I am a registered Independent.
Wed Jun 25, 2014, 12:56 PM
Jun 2014

Ok. Let's wait a bit while any posters here who just had a heart attack call an ambulance.

Now, I'll bet there are plenty of Independents who are regular readers and posters here on DU (more heart attacks? sorry); we may be registered "I" for a variety of reasons, unique to each individual. (Personally, I just feel so screwed over and shat upon by politicians of ALL persuasions that I declared my "independence" from the party yoke).
But we would not be here at DU if we were not like-minded liberal/progressive type folks, we would be at that other site... you know, the one that starts with "f"???

And, here's something for the "my party right-or-wrong" bunch to consider is, would you vote for a "D" that would sell you down the river before you would vote for an "I" that has your back? Is that any better than the "R"'s who vote for anybody who is an "R", even though they are going to sell them out right down to their shorts?

Before you light those torches & sharpen the pitchforks, be advised that I voted for PBO --- twice. And I would vote for Bernie Sanders in a second if he runs. I believe he would bust a gut to do right by poor working slobs like myself...not just make a bunch of nice-sounding promises and then stab me in the back.

davidthegnome

(2,983 posts)
187. On the contrary.
Wed Jun 25, 2014, 01:42 PM
Jun 2014

I learned a lot from 2000. I wasn't old enough to vote yet, but I was watching, listening, reading - and paying attention. Were you?

I remember a lot of cries of, "Damn that Nader! This is all his fault!" Which turned out to be quite a convenient curtain to hide the reality of the situation. Al Gore actually won. George W. Busher however, was the one who ended up sitting in the oval office. I remember voter intimidation, I remember shenanigans, votes gone missing, electronic voting systems that were highly suspect, at best. I remember a man saying, with a completely straight face... "I want to rebuild the military to make peace."

I remember learning, at the tender age of 16, just how easy it was to manipulate a supposedly fair election system. I remember my Father being more utterly devastated than I had ever seen him. I remember Al Gore being repeatedly mocked for demanding a recount.

Has it occurred to you, that by trying to stifle the independents - even liberal independents, as if they were competition... you are not doing your party or your cause any favors? It has certainly occurred to me that the R, D, or I next to someone's name is nothing more than a letter. It's action that counts - and Bernie's so far have been pretty damned impressive.

Smart enough not to go there? Why? Because the two party system is so wonderful? Bernie, whether independent, democrat, green, or any other variation of politician, is someone I greatly respect and would happily vote for. His words and actions to me, speak far louder than any letter next to his name.

BootinUp

(46,852 posts)
189. You missed a couple
Wed Jun 25, 2014, 02:11 PM
Jun 2014

Did you buy Naders bullshit that there is no difference between the Republicans and the Democrats? If so, I can't help you.

So if its easy to manipulate the system (its too easy yes) then don't weaken the only viable alternative to the Repukes in one of the must win States when the margin of winning is going to be less than a tenth of a freakin percent.

Ask Bernie.

davidthegnome

(2,983 posts)
196. Where did I say that?
Wed Jun 25, 2014, 09:18 PM
Jun 2014

Of course there's a difference between democrats and republicans, that's why I'm here as opposed to, say, freeperland.

It IS easy to manipulate the system. I watched it happen. The idea that only democrats or republicans are electable, the only "viable alternatives", so to speak, is symptomatic of that system which is so easy to manipulate it - it promotes it, encourages it, enables it. The same damn thing happens whenever a person with more money runs for office against a poorer candidate. What happened in 2008 though, proves that someone poorer, less known, less beloved by the establishment... can actually succeed. I'm talking about Obama.

Do you think that someone's a more viable alternative merely because of a D next to their name? I mean, regardless of voting records, policies, actions and words? If so, I can't help you.

I think you missed a couple too. Where are the accusations of treachery for not supporting the established democratic party? Where's the OMG you are HELPING republicans get elected?

Your kind of reasoning is why we so very often have to hold our noses when voting.

dotymed

(5,610 posts)
183. We have to make sure
Wed Jun 25, 2014, 11:50 AM
Jun 2014
That Bernie's message is heard by everyone.
IMO, he is the only person capable of explaining and leading America out of our demise.
 

NorthCarolina

(11,197 posts)
191. Sanders would be a breath of fresh air...I've grown tired of legacy politics.
Wed Jun 25, 2014, 03:09 PM
Jun 2014

He'll have my support and my vote.

 

mentalslavery

(463 posts)
192. Talk about a dream come true!
Wed Jun 25, 2014, 03:12 PM
Jun 2014

The best!!!! And I realize that there is probably and hint of "totally unelectable" in our current electoral environment but please add a Tom Hartman VP! Can u imagine the absolute paradigm shift with bernie as prez and hartman as VP. It does have a presidential ring to it Sanders and Hartman 2016!

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