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Scuba

(53,475 posts)
Thu Jun 26, 2014, 07:02 PM Jun 2014

Conservatives Don't Deny Climate Science Because They're Ignorant. They Deny It Because ...

http://m.motherjones.com/environment/2014/06/dan-kahan-climate-change-ideology-scientific-illiteracy


Conservatives Don't Deny Climate Science Because They're Ignorant. They Deny It Because of Who They Are.

Such is the finding of a new paper by Yale law professor and communication researcher Dan Kahan, recently profiled in depth by Ezra Klein in a much read Vox article aptly titled "How politics makes us stupid." Kahan is becoming widely known for his research showing that political ideology interferes with our most basic reasoning abilities; even our math skills, it seems, go right out the window when political passions come into play. In this new paper, though, Kahan isn't showing how dumb we are. Rather, he's doing the opposite: Showing that if you ask the questions the right way, Americans know a lot more about climate science than you might think. (Even conservatives.) "Whether people 'believe in' climate change, like whether they 'believe in' evolution, expresses who they are," writes Kahan.

...

To understand Kahan's analysis, it helps to start where much of his prior research—extensively covered by Klein, myself, and others—left off. Kahan has defined a measure that he calls "ordinary science intelligence," which assesses how good people are at mathematical and scientific reasoning and at questioning their own beliefs. Using this survey tool, he is able to present evidence showing that (1) as people get better at science, they are more likely in general to affirm that global warming is mostly due to human activities; but (2) as soon as you split people up in to liberals and conservatives, that conclusion goes out the window. Actually, liberals get way better in their answers as their science ability increases, and conservatives get considerably worse:


...

Still, those who wish to communicate to the public about climate change will have to grapple with Kahan's assertion that conservatives really aren't ignorant about the issue—they're just highly prone to defend their worldviews when asked certain kinds of questions. If Kahan is right, the implication is that we need to talk about climate science in a way that is entirely devoid of cultural meanings that will antagonize the right.

Later in the paper, Kahan goes on to assert that precisely this strategy is working right now in Southeast Florida, where members of the Regional Climate Change Compact have brought on board politically diverse constituencies by studiously avoiding pushing anyone's buttons. Kahan even shows polling data suggesting that questions like "local and state officials should be involved in identifying steps that local communities can take to reduce the risk posed by rising sea levels" do not provoke a polarized response in this region. Rather, liberals and conservatives alike in Southeast Florida agree with such a statement, which references a major consequence of climate change while ignoring the gigantic elephant in the room…its cause.
23 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Conservatives Don't Deny Climate Science Because They're Ignorant. They Deny It Because ... (Original Post) Scuba Jun 2014 OP
This is what I want to happen... SummerSnow Jun 2014 #1
That's how using the tactics of this thread by "bananas" in your discussions and articles Uncle Joe Jun 2014 #2
People also avoid cheerleading for the Climate Change "Solutions" truedelphi Jun 2014 #3
"...entirely devoid of cultural meanings that will antagonize the right." nomorenomore08 Jun 2014 #4
well, that and because they ARE ignorant... BillZBubb Jun 2014 #5
Conservatives have a profound distrust of academia Rstrstx Jun 2014 #6
They Deny It Because... "It's Inconvenient" handmade34 Jun 2014 #7
Science gets in the way of Greed. YOHABLO Jun 2014 #8
They deny it because they haven't figured out how to profit from it. KentuckyWoman Jun 2014 #9
And because of the tens of millions of dollars spent on propaganda, sowing doubt, pretending what Overseas Jun 2014 #10
On another site I frequent, one poster referred to another as an "eco-terrorist" bullwinkle428 Jun 2014 #11
Interesting that the USGA and Pinehurst, host of the 2014 Mens and Womens Opens agrees. Scuba Jun 2014 #12
Oh! We Wouldn't Want to 'Antagonize the Right,' Would We? Leith Jun 2014 #13
What drives them is cruelty TriplD Jun 2014 #14
I've field tested this theory here in Wisconsin and it holds true only about 50% of the time. Scuba Jun 2014 #15
What Miami is doing RobertEarl Jun 2014 #16
I thought it was because the Kochs paid big bucks to deny it. Initech Jun 2014 #17
K & R Quantess Jun 2014 #18
They deny it because they are in bed with polluters who donate heavy to the GOP! B Calm Jun 2014 #19
A guy I know once told me when the subject of climate change came up "Al Gore can kiss my ass." bklyncowgirl Jun 2014 #20
Conservative bastids possibly pose the world's greatest risk to mankind, to life on this planet. indepat Jun 2014 #21
People are just finding this out now? Xyzse Jun 2014 #22
Can't it be both? alarimer Jun 2014 #23

SummerSnow

(12,608 posts)
1. This is what I want to happen...
Thu Jun 26, 2014, 07:38 PM
Jun 2014

I want Obama to get on TV and say .."I was wrong, global warming doesn't exist"

Then the Rethugs will counteract it and say, " Obama is wrong, climate change is a possibility when you look at the data involved. The POTUS is not a scientist so he doesnt know what he is talking about"

Uncle Joe

(58,282 posts)
2. That's how using the tactics of this thread by "bananas" in your discussions and articles
Thu Jun 26, 2014, 07:46 PM
Jun 2014

may be useful, there is more on the link.



http://www.democraticunderground.com/101696020

Quantum Theory Used to Explain Behavior of Survey Respondents

(snip)

“Human behavior is very sensitive to context. It may be as context-sensitive as the actions of some of the particles that quantum physicists study,” said lead author Zheng Wang, Ph.D., associate professor of communication at Ohio State University.

“By using quantum theory, we were able to predict a surprising regularity in human behavior with unusual accuracy for the social sciences in a large set of different surveys.”

In fact, the researchers found the exact same pattern in 70 nationally representative surveys from Gallup and the Pew Research Center, as well as in two laboratory experiments. Most of the national surveys included more than 1,000 respondents.



Thanks for the thread, Scuba.

truedelphi

(32,324 posts)
3. People also avoid cheerleading for the Climate Change "Solutions"
Thu Jun 26, 2014, 07:54 PM
Jun 2014

As many of those will simply give carbon tax credits to the Big Corporate Offenders, while sticking it to those who haven't yet had the money to obtain a Prius.

nomorenomore08

(13,324 posts)
4. "...entirely devoid of cultural meanings that will antagonize the right."
Thu Jun 26, 2014, 08:02 PM
Jun 2014

Because we all know that, despite their would-be "politically incorrect" reputation, right-wingers are in reality the most easily offended people on Earth.

Rstrstx

(1,399 posts)
6. Conservatives have a profound distrust of academia
Thu Jun 26, 2014, 08:17 PM
Jun 2014

I think that has a lot to do with their beliefs on the subject. The hacked emails that came out a few years ago ('Climategate') certainly didn't help. I have to admit, the way this question is worded seems like an attempt to deliberately bait people by insisting people to choose between black and white instead of allowing a grey area; if I had the choice I would say forcing is probably or even likely the main cause of recent warming but there's no such option in the survey.

KentuckyWoman

(6,679 posts)
9. They deny it because they haven't figured out how to profit from it.
Thu Jun 26, 2014, 09:16 PM
Jun 2014

Once they do Fox will change to the all climate change all the time channel.

Overseas

(12,121 posts)
10. And because of the tens of millions of dollars spent on propaganda, sowing doubt, pretending what
Thu Jun 26, 2014, 09:24 PM
Jun 2014

we all have seen has not really happened.

That they are conservatives is only part of the problem. Big oil propaganda spending is the other. Multi-faceted PR campaigns have been waged. They've gotten otherwise intelligent people to actually doubt their own eyes. Their own experiences.

bullwinkle428

(20,628 posts)
11. On another site I frequent, one poster referred to another as an "eco-terrorist"
Thu Jun 26, 2014, 09:32 PM
Jun 2014

for having the temerity to bring up the idea that we need to think about water conservation/consumption in the years to come, and perhaps not just dump countless hundreds of thousands of gallons onto golf courses just to keep them a lush green color all year long.

 

Scuba

(53,475 posts)
12. Interesting that the USGA and Pinehurst, host of the 2014 Mens and Womens Opens agrees.
Thu Jun 26, 2014, 09:48 PM
Jun 2014
http://thinkprogress.org/climate/2014/06/12/3448331/brown-is-the-new-green-golf-water/

Brown Is The New Green At U.S. Open: Water Is ‘Biggest Obstacle’ Facing Golf, Says USGA

If you tune into the U.S. Open golf championship this Father’s Day weekend, you may think you’re watching the Dubai Desert Classic or the infamous “Brown British Open.”

But the U.S. Golf Association wants you to know that what you’re really seeing at Pinehurst #2 in North Carolina is the future of golf. The Washington Post reports that USGA executive director Mike Davis said this week:

“We happen to think that, long term, water is going to be the biggest obstacle in the game of golf…. It’s not going to be a question of cost. It’s a question of: Will you be able to get it?”

Brown is the new green. Or, rather, browns are the new greens.

Leith

(7,808 posts)
13. Oh! We Wouldn't Want to 'Antagonize the Right,' Would We?
Thu Jun 26, 2014, 09:54 PM
Jun 2014

They find scientific fact antagonizing? The poor lil hothouse flowers...

Yeah, I'll take that seriously when they turn away from the likes of Ted Cruz, Ann Coulter, Rush Limbaugh, et al.

TriplD

(176 posts)
14. What drives them is cruelty
Thu Jun 26, 2014, 09:56 PM
Jun 2014

When you look at any issue and ask yourself "what will create the most suffering?" you can usually determine what conservatives will support.

Try it.

 

Scuba

(53,475 posts)
15. I've field tested this theory here in Wisconsin and it holds true only about 50% of the time.
Thu Jun 26, 2014, 09:58 PM
Jun 2014

The other 50% falls on the side of "greed".

 

RobertEarl

(13,685 posts)
16. What Miami is doing
Thu Jun 26, 2014, 11:20 PM
Jun 2014

They have a real problem in Miami. So the pragmatists, knowing that there need be a full court press to keep the damage to a minimum, is using a political maneuver to overcome opposition to the fact that Miami - if nothing is done locally- will lose billions of dollars of valuable real estate.

Locally, they need everybody to buy in and create infrastructure to keep Miami dry. There is no solution to the problem except to build seawalls and the like. The longer they argue the more it will cost.

bklyncowgirl

(7,960 posts)
20. A guy I know once told me when the subject of climate change came up "Al Gore can kiss my ass."
Fri Jun 27, 2014, 07:19 AM
Jun 2014

Don't get me wrong, I love Al Gore. I voted for him. I truly believe that if he had not been screwed over by the Supreme Court the world would be a better place. At the time he released "An Inconvenient Truth" I applauded him but by becoming the public face of global warming he gave right wingers a figure to rally against.

Let's face it. Most people are not all that scientifically literate. Even those of us who understand science are not necessarily climatologists and are not deeply engaged in the research. If 99% of climatologists believe that global warming is man made, I'm going to trust that the scientists know what they are doing because I live in the 21st century and enjoy the benefits of a civilization that was based on science.

If I'm a conservative who despises liberals with a red hot passion, no matter what the scientists say, I am not listening to Al Gore of all people. Now if Rush Limbaugh, who I do trust, tells me that all this Global Warming nonsense was drummed up by a bunch of elitist snobs who want us all to freeze in the dark so that Al Gore can get rich trading carbon credits--well I'm going to trust Rush Limbaugh.

It's all about "Who Do You Trust".

Incidentally, when I countered my friend with the fact that the overwhelming number of climatologists (with the exception of those funded by the fossil fuel industry) agree that global warming is caused by human activity and that I'd prefer to base my opinion on what the scientists say rather than what non-scientists like Rush Limbaugh--or Al Gore for that matter--say he really had no answer.

I think that the flat earthers will never change their minds but there are reasonable conservatives who are not hostile to science. The question is, how do we get around that "Who Do You Trust" thing?



indepat

(20,899 posts)
21. Conservative bastids possibly pose the world's greatest risk to mankind, to life on this planet.
Fri Jun 27, 2014, 04:00 PM
Jun 2014

But all their multitude of sins against mankind are forgiven 'cause they love Jesus and they know not (don't really care) what they do. They are eaten up with infidelitis and a gigantic, grotesque reichousness.

Xyzse

(8,217 posts)
22. People are just finding this out now?
Fri Jun 27, 2014, 04:11 PM
Jun 2014

This is why I keep saying use different terms when explaining certain concepts, as a method of getting them to agree with things that should be self evident.

It does tend to keep things civil as well. It does however require a heck of a lot more thinking.

alarimer

(16,245 posts)
23. Can't it be both?
Fri Jun 27, 2014, 04:16 PM
Jun 2014

It's called motivated reasoning and it involves denying facts that threaten cherished beliefs. We all do it to some extent, but right-wingers certainly seem to have it worse.

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