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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsSalon: A left-wing Tea Party may be closer than you think
Last edited Sun Jun 29, 2014, 09:04 AM - Edit history (1)
Not every Tea Party opponent was so dismissive, though. Calling the daily vicissitudes of the battle between the Tea Party and the GOP establishment beside the point, the Washington Posts Greg Sargent wrote that McDaniels defeat obscured a more significant truth: (O)n many key issues, the business community is getting nothing for its investment in the GOP establishments picks. He went on to cite immigration reform, the Export-Import Bank, and federal spending on infrastructure as just three obvious examples. The obvious conclusion to be drawn? Maybe what Kibbe said wasnt quite so silly after all.
At the very least, those on the American left hoping to push the Democratic Party away from the centrist, neoliberal policies its embraced since at least Bill Clinton (and arguably earlier, beginning with Jimmy Carter) and more toward a more populist, redistributionist approach should be lucky to be so silly. Indeed, members of what little there is of an American far left have long admired the Tea Partys effectiveness, if not its goals. When, during last Octobers Tea Party-inspired government shutdown, Jacobins Bhaskar Sunkara wrote that Tea Party-like success
would be a tremendous advance for those looking not just to protect, but to expand, the welfare state, he wasnt playing contrarian but rather echoing a sentiment Ive heard many times from leftist friends over the past four years. (For those unaware, heres a good rundown as to why Occupy Wall Street, for all its virtues, doesnt count.)
More than anything else, its the tension evident in McCray and Dimitrijevics differing estimations of the Democratic Party that poses the biggest threat to a nascent Tea Party left. To be fair, this is certainly a reflection of Maryland and Wisconsins different circumstances and different political histories; but the underlying question of whether its better to work within the system or push it from without has been confronted by all of these candidates, and will no doubt plague future ones as well. If theres to be a left-wing Tea Party, it would have to be held together by a somewhat paradoxical consensus that the Democratic Party as it currently existed is fraudulent and corrupt, and that it was at the same time the only realistic vehicle for those looking to move American politics decidedly to the left. (Yes, Tea Partyers make occasional threats to break from the GOP and create a party of their own, but these warnings are not only infrequent but thoroughly hollow.)
At this point, however after more than five years of Tea Party disruption and rapid success we should know at least this much: If the left is going to have a Tea Party of its own, itll have to do it by making its peace with the Democratic Party and supporting grass-roots candidates willing to change it from within. So, by all means, get excited for Sanders or Warren 2016; but just remember, a dissident underdogs run for the White House cannot be seen as the end-result of so much left-wing agitation. It can only be the start.
http://www.salon.com/2014/06/28/a_left_wing_tea_party_may_be_closer_than_you_think/
I hate linking the terms 'tea party' to 'left wing'. The author used "populist, redistributionist" in the article. That suits me much better.
He does raise the issue of changing the Democratic Party from within - even with threats of leaving the party (as the tea party does to the republican party) rather than abandoning it.
hobbit709
(41,694 posts)I'm a Democrat by default but it is becoming increasingly difficult with all the corporate influence.
randys1
(16,286 posts)one percent have now...
They reap benefits from all society while we struggle
Chan790
(20,176 posts)is that it never becomes viable if nobody is willing to be the first to jump-in with both feet. It's not going to become viable unless a lot of us make that jump and work our asses off to make it viable.
Louisiana1976
(3,962 posts)DFW
(54,302 posts)The Republican Party is being torn apart at the seams by the "I'm-more-fanatic-than-you-are" crowd. It is being held together only by the fickle (if effective) glue of limitless right wing money, blessed by the smug smile of a faux-benevolent John Roberts.
Where I agree with Will Rogers' assessment of the Democratic Party, I still prefer "agree to disagree" to "agree to arrange for your political assassination." Being open to discussion is, for me, the very definition of "liberal." If I want uncompromising rigidity, I'll move to Saudi Arabia.
djean111
(14,255 posts)loyalty over policy for so long that the party no longer bears much resemblance to anything liberal, as far as economic policy goes. Social issues that cost very little are used to hide this - Hate the TPP? Well, DOMA!!!!!! As if one had anything to do with the other.
The Dems use social issues pretty much like the GOP does, just in a different manner - the GOP uses, for example, the "specter" of gay marriage to fire up the troops and hide the real agenda, the Dems use the enactment of gay marriage laws to quiet the troops and hide the real economic agenda. IMO and all that.
DFW
(54,302 posts)Those are the ones that angrily demand their own way, and have no room for people in (or with) any other position.
"My party right or wrong" is just as useless as "my party, wrong until I say it's right."
The broad economic policy, at least as it was put to me by the nominal head of the party, is a reduction in the budget deficit through reduction of bloated health care costs caused by our system, and less expenditure on fossil fuel through investment in renewable energy. The devil is in the details, as always, but that doesn't mean every detail has been suggested by the devil, or that all proposed details are not legitimate subjects for discussion.
MannyGoldstein
(34,589 posts)Ending only 18% of the Bush tax cuts and implementing HeritageRomneyObamaCare in lieu of real health insurance reform could be characterized as compromise.
OTOH, the TPP and Obama's other "free" trade deals, fighting to cut Social Security, attacking public schools and teacher's unions... those are leading the charge. The other team's charge.
djean111
(14,255 posts)Enthusiast
(50,983 posts)pampango
(24,692 posts)I am all for more progressive taxes, pro-union legislation, a stronger safety net, etc. but I don't view social issues as a distraction but a core part of the liberal message.
It is certainly true that the GOP uses social issues to fire up its base, but they also use 'austerity' and 'anti-immigration' - not just gay marriage - to do this. But the GOP uses any type of 'change' to fire up its base since the base wants things to stay the same or even go back in time to the 'glorious' 1950's.
djean111
(14,255 posts)to advance conservative economic issues. And when someone keeps saying But Doma! when others criticize the TPP, for example, that, IMO, minimizes social issues by using them as a wedge and as a smokescreen.
Scuba
(53,475 posts)Maedhros
(10,007 posts)they are busy tearing down the fundamental pillars of habeus corpus, due process of law, privacy, freedom of speech and freedom of assembly - to "keep us safe" from the "terrorists," of course.
They get lots of good press for the former (which is their motivating goal), and work tirelessly to minimize exposure of the latter (which is why there is such an effort to smear Snowden and Greenwald).
Enthusiast
(50,983 posts)rhett o rick
(55,981 posts)demands lock-step devotion to BO or HRC. The Democratic Party that Will Rogers was referring to is now the Warren Wing of the Party. The Conservatives that fled the R Party as it went over the cliff are now strongly influencing the Democratic Party.
I think it's very interesting when the demands of the left for rolling back the un-Constitutional Patriot Act, establishing single payer Health Insurance, being free from the disastrous trade agreements, and controls on Wall Street, are viewed as radical.
If you dont want "uncompromising rigidity" you best vote for the Warren Wing of the Party. The left has never stood for "rigidity."
Doctor_J
(36,392 posts)Heh. The BOG thinks these ideas, as well as public schools, an end to fracking, and toll-free interstate highways, are racist and treasonous.
Really stupid article.
Andy823
(11,495 posts)I know you hate the BOG, and it's pretty obvious in your posts, but can you actually prove that the members of the BOG actually have stated that all the things you just posted are "racist and treasonous"?
Just the facts please.
djean111
(14,255 posts)individual policies. By the end of the year, I expect to be condescendingly and angrily told that to hate the TPP, for example, is to hate Obama and Hillary and undermine the Democratic Party. This is what we used to laugh at Freepers for doing - lockstep, no matter what.
I am a proud member of the Warren Wing; I don't think the rigid lockstep people understand, as yet, that it is what Warren stands for that is important, thus the ad hominem attacks and the failed attempts to dismiss Warren out of hand by asking, for example, if we are calling her a liar. Was Obama a liar when he said he was not going to run? Pfft. Nothing said about Warren will convert me into a Hillary fan.
winter is coming
(11,785 posts)that is important..."
I'm not sure that's true. I suspect that at least some of the people who scoff at a Warren candidacy understand only too well that it's what Warren stands for that's important. But if you could successfully chain those ideas solely to Warren, and then eliminate Warren from the picture, those awkward ideas would go *poof*.
"The game is rigged" is a simple expression of a potent truth that many Americans recognize. It's an idea that a lot of well-heeled backers don't like. The first line of defense will be repeated attempts to discredit that concern. The second line of defense will be to pretend to address the concern, with no intention of doing anything more than rearranging deck chairs.
Enthusiast
(50,983 posts)DFW
(54,302 posts)I'd thrilled just to get Wendy Davis in as governor so we can start to undo DeLay's gerrymandering and get our state represented in Congress to a degree that somewhat reflects the purpling in progress. Of course, unfortunately, the same could be said of Pennsylvania. When you can compare the ground situation in PA to that in TX, it is a sorry thing to have to say to begin with.
Iliyah
(25,111 posts)When an organization subjects its member to purity ideals where they "must" comply to be one of them than you got a problem. That's exactly what the GOP Party have become.
I just hope we don't make the same mistake as the Republicans. Long term progressive goals can't be realized if we never get the votes to implement them, and 2016 will determine if the Supreme Court remains a rightist tool for the next 20 years or not. It's a step by step slog, which Howard Dean as DNC chair realized and manipulated deftly. His predecessors did not, and look where we are now--fearing a loss of seats in the Senate whereas the country as a whole wants us to hold on to it.
Maedhros
(10,007 posts)have no desire to implement progressive legislation.
To quote my crazy but insightful Uncle G: : "You can't get to Minneapolis from Detroit by rowing towards Buffalo." (He was being literal...there was a canoe involved.)
If we want to implement progressive legislation...we need to stop supporting conservative agendas. Well, we don't...we never did...Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama need to stop supporting conservative agendas calling it moderate.
DFW
(54,302 posts)However, if we don't nominate candidates skillful enough to be palatable to a majority of the people voting in their district/state, then it won't matter what their good intentions are. It's easier if you are a Republican putting up some maniac in a district/state that will vote for the manic every time. We don't have it that easy. There aren't a lot of States that would give a Bernie Sanders a shot at a Senate seat, and the People's Republic of Vermont has yet to be declared.
Maedhros
(10,007 posts)that then proceed to screw us. When time comes to elect them again, we do.
They quickly learn that there is no consequence for screwing us and great reward from their corporate benefactors for doing so. So the cycle continues.
We've been at this "Lesser of Two Evils" strategy for quite some time, and it has definitely not delivered results.
winter is coming
(11,785 posts)Maedhros
(10,007 posts)and not just buckets of Hope(tm), in return for our votes.
Well said.
Doctor_J
(36,392 posts)You don't like rigidity, OK. But when you start believing that the ACA is health care, that fracking is OK, and approve of drone murder, TPP, KXL, for-profit schools, off-shore drilling, teacher purges, union-busting, and so on, what is left? And why did you vote Dem in the 70's if these things are OK with you?
tabasco
(22,974 posts)Thanks to the ACA, more than 140,000 citizens of my state, West Virginia, have health insurance for the FIRST TIME under expanded Medicaid.
Sorry it's not overnight utopia, but we're working on that.
MannyGoldstein
(34,589 posts)Hatched from the Heritage Foundation.
How many more in your state would have reliably have shelter and food on their table if Democrats had fought for the 99% as mightily as they fought for banker bonuses to be saved in 2009?
DonCoquixote
(13,616 posts)the answer could have easily been ZERO, because if the aca was not signed, then the GOP, with full Kockj banking, would have held ground and simpky giuven the millions of diabetics and others served under the aca jack diddly.
Everybody wants to slam Barack O for battele he should have fought, includign myself at times, but if he did not win them, thanks to those same blue dogs that are defended loudly on here, we would have pilloried him and dealt the lowest cards in our decks at him, especially the age and race ones, as Hillary did her "see, I coulda gotten ya all that if ya voted fir me" dance that we are beginning to see the first steps of now, deep in the heart of the 2016 presidential campaign (and yes, it started a while ago.)
Doctor_J
(36,392 posts)Your post is nonsense, because there weren't going to be any republican votes anyway. What he should have done was held his ground for once, and said, "two more Dem senators in 2010, and will have Medicare For All like we should have". Instead he actually said, "your friends and neighbors need those insurance jobs". The jig was up at that point. He'd lost all of the HOPEful voters from 2008, and signaled to the Repukes that he could be had.
DonCoquixote
(13,616 posts)in stead, he woudl have been blamned for the GOP rise as the Koch brothers shoveled in the cash to buy TV ads. Then he would have had NOTHING to show for it except for feel good stuff.
pampango
(24,692 posts)the legislature passed it over his veto. I dare say the Heritage Foundation would have been even less happy with the actual Massachusetts law that liberal Democratic legislators passed than Mr. Romney was.
MannyGoldstein
(34,589 posts)Of course the bill isnt 100 percent of what anyone in this room wanted... But the differences between us are relatively small.
The Heritage Foundation attended the signing ceremony and gave a speech praising the bill.
Some good coverage at http://thinkprogress.org/health/2012/04/12/463097/romneycare-6/
Romulox
(25,960 posts)This is what the centrist "misunderstand" consitently.
DFW
(54,302 posts)If the insurance is nothing more than a national guarantee of health care for every citizen, that is still insurance--the best kind, i.e. not for-profit insurance. France has it. Germany, by the way, does not, although their patchwork system covers most of their citizens. My wife and I would have been ruined if she had to pay for her cancer treatment 13 years ago, and her employer tried like hell to get rid of her because of it (he failed, but he's a sick asshole for trying).
Dragonfli
(10,622 posts)simply because an insurance company refused to pay for something that would have saved that life while simultaneously thanking God for the ACA that enabled said insurance company to do so.
I was more than a bit empathetic as my wife was similarly killed by Blue Cross in '06 for the same reason, they delayed a procedure for eight months (surgery) that every single member of her health care team deemed necessary to be done and at a precise time after chemo was stopped (just long enough for her system to strengthen) but no longer. during that delay, the tumor shrunken by chemo prior to surgery to remove it began to grow again after three months and by 8 months had doubled in size and metastasized. The time it took for the insurance to lose the battle to fight an expenditure of a very needed second surgeon, changed it from operable to only operable in the sense that some could be removed but not all the brand new mets that caused her death.
Insurance is not health care, it is a way to avoid paying for health care unless it is something inexpensive and designed solely for the profits of vultures.
Doctor_J
(36,392 posts)I got involved in it but had to pull out because the entire discussion was so discouraging. As you said, the poster who'd lost his son was thanking God and the President for mandating for-profit insurance that refused to provide the care that was needed. It is impossible to win an argument when the frame of reference is so distorted.
Sorry your wife succumbed to Big Insurance. It is nothing less than a travesty that the richest nation in history lets that happen, every day. And also that there is nothing that working people can do to get it fixed.
Dragonfli
(10,622 posts)The doc. after all exposed the damage done to the insured regarding actual care, fast forward to a neoliberal with the correct letter on his voter registration card, and now insurance vultures=good.
I find it truly amazing and concerning.
I will never forgive these vultures for killing my wife nor will I applaud that they have many more victims to abuse because a Democratic corporate servant managed to push to fruition the Heritage foundation law that the Republicans couldn't in the early nineties.
A true servant of the people would have tried to push a health Care law rather than an insurance company welfare law, but few in my party appear to agree, I thought perhaps that after the ones they loved were murdered they would figure it out, but even that does not appear to matter to those that will swallow any corporate law spoon fed to them by a politician because of nothing more than party affiliation.
No, I will never forget and I will never forgive and it is very true that even if working people awaken from their mesmerization there is nothing they (we) can do about it..
Romulox
(25,960 posts)Maedhros
(10,007 posts)Something that Democrats passed and Republicans opposed. It's primary purpose now is propaganda.
Republicans focus on the "big government" aspects of mandated insurance and how it hurts providers in an attempt to bludgeon Democratic opponents in elections.
Democratic operatives focus solely on the enrollment numbers for the previously uninsured, using the enrollment as an ad hoc approval poll for Democrats. What the ACA actually does is not important - only it's popularity is.
Doctor_J
(36,392 posts)Sorry it's not overnight utopia, but we're working on that.
9 million nation-wide now have health insurance for the first time. Leaving 40 million without. What about them? Meanwhile health insurance stocks, which reflect profits (you know, money paid in that's not going to health care) are through the roof. Guess who's paying for that non-care. It's not the rich.
As for "working on that", that is simply false. Most of us who don't have a crush on the president knew when it was enacted that Heritage Care would never "turn into Single Payer". That's because it is a huge step away from Single Payer. And now it is clear to see from the DU posts and former liberals like Krugman, Heritage Care is now declared to be just great the way it is. We are now locked permanently into abomination of a system that was once peddled by Newt Gingrinch.
Like I said in the post that so offended you, how many Republican policies can you go ga-ga over and still call yourself a Dem?
Maedhros
(10,007 posts)Will those 140,000 be able to pay for the treatment they need when they have a serious medical condition? The ACA allows the insurance companies to play the same old tricks with respect to "out of network" providers, deductibles and out-of-pocket maximums that they have always used to make us pay through the nose for care.
The ACA can only be considered a success if it allows people to receive the care they need without bankrupting them. One useful indicator will be the medical bankruptcy rate - a decline will support the notion that the ACA is working, a flat rate or increase will indicate otherwise. Coverage means little if one can't pay for the care.
treestar
(82,383 posts)Geez!
This is why I can't get with this left. So unreasonable. Let's just demand things. That'll work.
Jeff In Milwaukee
(13,992 posts)If you're looking for clear answers, there aren't any. And you damned sure won't find them on DU. Give you one example (and there are many others).
Tenure reform for K-12 teachers. Now some people have used the slogan "tenure reform" as a guise to assault teachers unions, but some people believe that tenure as a system needs to be revised. In one poll nearly a third of teachers felt reform was needed. So if we have that conversation, are we "union busting" or trying to reconfigure schools for the 21st century? If you've been on this site long, you know that mentioning the topic makes you "evil incarnate" and a corporate shill, etc., etc.,.
America is polarized, and DU is way more polarized than America.
Maedhros
(10,007 posts)Liberal vs. Conservative.
Jeff In Milwaukee
(13,992 posts)Not so much liberal vs. conservative on DU, but Far Left vs. Center Left.
I'm ignoring the obvious (and not so obvious) trollery that goes on around here.
But polarization, to be sure.
Maedhros
(10,007 posts)Nobody is calling for nationalization of industry, redistribution of wealth or violent revolution.
It's "Center Left" vs. "Center Right".
Phlem
(6,323 posts)It's "Center Left" vs. "Crazy Right".
Maedhros
(10,007 posts)Of course, nation-wide, the Republicans are no longer Conservative, but full-on Reactionary. The nominally-reasonable Conservatives have switched parties, and now constitute the Moderate Conservatives setting the Democratic Party agenda. The corresponding elements on DU are opposed by the traditional Liberal Democratic base and the Progressives.
Jeff In Milwaukee
(13,992 posts)You're right (or I should probably say "correct" in this context) that there is no credible "Far Left" in this country. There is both a Socialist and Communist Party, but neither is much more than a website. Even Bernie Sanders, a self-described Democratic Socialist, is not a member of the Socialist Party. There is, however, a noticeable Socialist presence on DU.
Maedhros
(10,007 posts)Most of the Liberals are traditional FDR-style Democrats.
alarimer
(16,245 posts)If those things (even the ACA, the form of which originated at that bastion of liberalism, the Heritage Foundation) were proposed or enacted under a Republican administration, everyone here would be opposed to it.
We have some version of "It's okay if you're a Democrat" when it comes to policy.
DFW
(54,302 posts)For the record, the first time I was allowed to vote, it was in 1971, it was for a Republican, and I doubt there is ONE member of DU who would have voted differently. I was in college in Philadelphia, and the Democrats ran their oafish, corrupt police commissioner, Frank Rizzo, against a modest, unassuming administrative type named Thatcher Longstreth. Rizzo won, Phildelphia went farther downhill than it already was, and Rizzo quickly switched to the Republicans, where he belonged in the first place.
Also, voting for fracking was OK with me in the 1970s? I have ALWAYS been against fracking--anywhere, any time--since I first heard of it, which was less than 10 years ago. My views of fracking in the 1970s were about as developed as my views at the time on the merits of Google Chrome.
And as to my posts expounding on the merits of drone murder, teacher purges, union-busting and offshore drilling--would you mind refreshing me on just where and when I posted anything of the sort? Maybe I'm in the initial stages of Alzheimer's, but I just can't for the life of me recall ever having taken such positions.
Doctor_J
(36,392 posts)And as to my posts expounding on the merits of drone murder, teacher purges, union-busting and offshore drilling--would you mind refreshing me on just where and when I posted anything of the sort?
The president is for all of these as well as death panels and the eradication of public schools. Yet the Fan Club says we must support him. The question is pretty simple - when we support a politician who is in favor of all of these destructive policies, are we really helping the country and its people?
mcar
(42,278 posts)This is absurd, right wing tripe not worthy of this board. But, of course, it's not ODS because that doesn't exist on DU. At least, so I've read.
Doctor_J
(36,392 posts)for-profit health insurance companies, which are now built into the system, decline life-saving treatment every day due to cost considerations. What would you call them?
mcar
(42,278 posts)Health insurance, both for- and non-profit, have denied care since their inception. The ACA makes it harder to do that.
To extrapolate from that that the president is pro death panel is absurd.
Oh, and I am a fan of the president (which doesn't mean I agree with everything he's done BTW), so sneer away.
Warren Stupidity
(48,181 posts)The institution of the Democratic Party is a corrupt collaborator in the oligarchic kleptocratic duopoly that has run this country for the last 30+ years. The electoral system we have makes it nearly impossible for a third party to displace either of the two parts of the duopoly. There hasn't been a displacement since the Republican Party triumph of 1860. The only viable strategy is revolution from within.
rhett o rick
(55,981 posts)I think I know what you mean but the word brings up different ideas for different people. Those that think pitchforks in the street will bring freedom havent learned from history. Elites (those with knowledge and/or power) run this country and every other country. Elites run everything at all levels. Form a group and the elites of the group will end up running the group. This is Elite Theory. It was elites that saved us from the last Great Republican Depression. Elites that recognized that their lives would be better if they didnt allow millions to starve. Some of their reasons were altruistic and some were selfish. We need to find elitists that will help us take back our party and our country.
Warren Stupidity
(48,181 posts)And one is required if one accepts that the existing order is a corrupt oligarchic kleptocratic duopoly. A revolution does not have to be violent, it can be non-violent, but it has to go way past mere reform.
rhett o rick
(55,981 posts)djean111
(14,255 posts)some places......I think the usefulness of that is completely gone, though. Sticks and stones, etc.
Doctor_J
(36,392 posts)by the Fan Club that likes for-profit health care, for-profit schools, TPP, XL, and so forth.
djean111
(14,255 posts)Wonder just who it is who wants to drive the Left out of the Dem party so the Dem party is more like GOP-lite? Who benefits?
msanthrope
(37,549 posts)rightwing.
Doctor_J
(36,392 posts)(right wing), and first enacted by Willard Romney (right wing). It corporatizes and profitizes life and death decisions, and places the profits ahead of lifesaving treatments.
If that does not make it right wing, what would?
msanthrope
(37,549 posts)percent less than my old plan, with better coverage. From the same carrier.
Doctor_J
(36,392 posts)I am happy that this is working well for you. Like the rest of the BOG and those who have benefited from it, you have talked yourself into believing that your experience is all that is needed to call the ACA the greatest legislative achievement in history - Medicare, the Civil Rights Act and Social Security all rolled into one. Also, like the rest of the BOG, you have gone from claiming "this will lead to Single Payer" to "I like it just like it is!". You've now convinced yourself that giving Big Insurance a half trillion dollars per year in profits is the best way to provide health care to the people of the US. Those of us without crushes on the president think this borders on the insane.
BTW, your happy story does nothing to address the post to which you responded.
msanthrope
(37,549 posts)antigop
(12,778 posts)Romulox
(25,960 posts)her critics "racist", if she's allowed.
DFW
(54,302 posts)No matter if you agree with them or not (and I often don't), the goals of most of them are justice and equality, whereas the Teabaggers are control freaks, and are out to feel superior in some way to others less fortunate than they are.
Not that so-called socialists can't be control freaks. I was in the former East Germany often enough to see 1.) a country run by control freaks labeling themselves "socialists," and 2.) that calling yourself "socialist" doesn't make you one, and more than our pseudo-Christians behave as if they honor the teachings of their "savior."
At the end of the day, labels don't mean much, unless you watch Fox Noise, and are afraid of "libbruls."
Turbineguy
(37,296 posts)vi5
(13,305 posts)Is for a punching bag for those actually in charge of the Democratic minority to use to show just how "centrist" and "bipartisan" they are.
While the Republicans listen to and are beholden to their right flank, Democrats would continue to do as they do now and ignore theirs except when they put their hands out for money, votes, and work needing to be done.
CrispyQ
(36,424 posts)We're the ones dem leadership blames when they don't win.
As the baggers slip over the edge of reality, true conservative repubs will jump ship to the democratic party, or flail with the baggers, & the dems will drift even further to the right, leaving the left with no voice at all, which is close to where we are right now.
vi5
(13,305 posts)This is what this admin and many in the Dem leadership are hoping for. Enough Republicans moving over to our side to justify their rightward shift. They've been doing it anyway, even in situations where there's no fucking way any of these people would vote for Dems. Now, if it becomes even a faint possibility they'll kick their "centrism" into overdrive.
DFW
(54,302 posts)I think that disillusioned Republicans will do what disillusioned Democrats did in 2010--not participate at all. The trouble is--the right wing lunatic fringe will show up to vote. Our solid left did not. The radical right has been conditioned by their hate media to despise all "libbruls," and that is, to them, a synonym for "Democrats." We may have the anger, but the frothing hate on their side is the more powerful motivator to GOTV. Disillusionment is still a greater danger to us on election day than it is to them.
TheKentuckian
(25,021 posts)Must be the youth, the temporary TeaPubliKlan crossovers, too many minorities, and the ever chased "Independents" because as far as I can tell liberals did well, the blue dogs took it on the chin, and we got slaughtered in the indie count.
Stop telling the lie. The Turd Way policies have no purchase. You disillusioned the new voters and ran off the segment that it is claimed the failed policies attract.
The fingers are pointed, the hollering of nonsensical aspersions, the whining about the TeaPubliKlans being mean, the "looking forward", the rationalizations, spin, and excuses are just phony baloney cover for doing exactly what you want in a mad dash to completely screw the American people over and sell us into perdition before enough figure out the scam to put some gremlins in the gears.
ALWAYS WITH THE SAME BOGUS LIE!
neverforget
(9,436 posts)Why did we lose? Independents voted for Republicans and they even won women!
GOP candidates scored better than they have in decades among some key demographic groups. Consider:
Women voted 49-48 percent for Democratic vs. Republican House candidate -- the best for Republicans among women in national House vote in exit polls since 1982. Obama won women by 13 points in 2008.
Democrats and Republicans were at parity in self-identification nationally, 36-36 percent, a return to the close division seen in years before 2008, when it broke dramatically in the Democrats' favor, 40-33 percent.
Swing-voting independents who, as usual, made the difference, favored Republicans for House by a thumping 16 points, 55-39 percent. Compare that to Obama's 8-point win among independents in 2008. It was the Republicans' biggest win among independents in exit polls dating to 1982 (by two points. The GOP won independents by 14 points in 1994, the last time they took control of the House.)
That's the reason why we lost. Independents went with the Republicans. This BS that the base didn't show up is a meme that has taken hold here. It's just another way to blame the Left for the failings of the Democratic Party.
Shankapotomus
(4,840 posts)was the Left-Wing Tea Party.
http://www.coffeepartyusa.com/
CrispyQ
(36,424 posts)It helps when the main stream media amplify's a voice greater than it actually is, like they did with the teabaggers.
rhett o rick
(55,981 posts)nolabels
(13,133 posts)blackspade
(10,056 posts)This is just another meme to link the left wing of the Democratic Party to the teahadists by the DLC/Third Way. These corporate assholes want to solidify their hold on the party by painting the likes of Warren and Sanders as 'unelectable.'
I'm not falling for it.
Doctor_J
(36,392 posts)There would be no "Tea Party" is they didn't have the entire mar right media apparatus behind them. that's 1200 radio stations, and every newspaper and cable "news" outlet. There is no such thing for the left. so this whole premise is preposterous.
randys1
(16,286 posts)Here is how simple it is...
You work tirelessly to get Warren to win the nomination, if you fail, if we fail, (maybe she doesnt even run, then who?), but when that fails IF it fails, you say OK, hopefully the issues brought out by a tough primary campaign will bring attention to what is important, and oh, by the way, i vote on election day and of course I vote for whoever the dem candidate is.
The vote is something you do regardless of anything else, you do that only so you can preserve what little sanity there is in our system, so you can later get Warren elected or whoever.
real simple
Doctor_J
(36,392 posts)Yeah, those are almost the same
djean111
(14,255 posts)Romulox
(25,960 posts)ReRe
(10,597 posts)... the "Tea-Party" of the Democratic Party is not the far left/liberal wing of the Democratic Party, it's the traitorous highjacking DLCer/Grand Bargainer/Third Wayer Pete Peterson branch of the party. Period.
tabasco
(22,974 posts)just like the right wing version.
gulliver
(13,168 posts)The right is more vulnerable to being taken over by stupid ideas, because the right has a general respect for stupidity. Not so on the left. We are lucky that our strong respect for wisdom and intelligence suppresses our fringe. Their hearts are in the right place, but they don't think, so they would just drag the left down if they had significant numbers.
I kind of wish the left fringe would shut up about Elizabeth Warren and let her get somewhere politically. The "Elizabeth Warren Wing" is a major burden to her, imo. She's a powerful voice for logic and liberalism, but the weirdos on our fringe keep trying to claim her. They are like stalkers.
DFW
(54,302 posts)Remember how Ellen James hated the Ellen Jamesians?
I hope Elizabeth Warren's eloquent voice is not drowned out by those who most want it heard.
That's a very good call, imo. Good book too.
Maedhros
(10,007 posts)Half-Century Man
(5,279 posts)That would damn near have to be Stalinist level communists. The whole one true path thing.
I don't think we as a party would be susceptible to stalinist influence. I do think we could put a more positive spin on socialism for the USA. Arguably, the whole "we the people" and "government by consent of the governed" is the very seed of what would become socialism some 70 years later. We might be one of the founding countries/governments of socialism (USA and the Republic of France, both rejected monarchy at near the same time).
TPTB of that time reacted to our (the 2 countries) adopting of democracy as well as the 20th century's reacted to the communist revolution in the Russian empire.
Gman
(24,780 posts)As I've been saying for a couple of years , if the teabagges and the left ever realized how much they have in common and could iron out differences without anyone getting killed , it would be both party's worst nightmare and new day for America.
Comrade Grumpy
(13,184 posts)To pressure the national party in the proper direction.
If they want our votes, they can earn them.
Maedhros
(10,007 posts)You mean, we should expect our elected officials to produce results and hold them accountable for not doing so?
It's crazy, but it just might work!
starroute
(12,977 posts)Brat was able to defeat Canton only because of support from powerful outside interests. There is absolutely nothing like that on the left. With rare exceptions, the Democratic Party chooses its own candidates -- and if someone not to its liking happens to win a primary, they make sure that person receives no support in November.
Expecting a grassroots movement to take over the Democratic Party from inside is folly -- or else a deliberate diversion. The only way the left has ever had any influence on the Democrats has been as scary outsiders who threaten the party's ability to conduct business as usual.
The Democratic Party leadership at this point appears to be as divorced from the needs and wishes of actual Democrats as most union leaders are from the needs of workers, or as the United States Chamber of Commerce is from the needs of small business. In every case, decisions are made at the top to enhance the power and wealth of the people at the top, and any threat to that cozy arrangement will be ruthlessly put down.
intheflow
(28,443 posts)Can't believe I had to scroll this far down to get to the heart of the matter. There will never be a left-wing Tea Party because the left will never have that kind of bankroll. This article advocates true grassroots change while the Tea Party is pure astroturf made out of cash.
Utopian Leftist
(534 posts)For too long the left has been willing to settle. We needed another hero. But we settled for slick Bill Clinton. We needed another Roosevelt but we settled for Barack Obama, because that was who we could get elected in this toxic political environment. Both of those Presidents ran as centrists and then betrayed the interests of the 99 percent.
We can't afford to settle again.
Why settle for single payer healthcare, for example? Let's find someone who wants to champion Roosevelt's Second Bill of Rights! It's time in this country for liberals and progressives and liberators of all sorts, whatever we are calling ourselves these days, it is time for us to stand up and be proud of our heritage, and be proud that we are on the side of science, the side of peace and the side of prosperity; proud that we hold the answers and solutions for the future.
riderinthestorm
(23,272 posts)Designed to drum up clicks on a website, devoid of rationality.
No thanks. This lefty leftist can stand on her own thankyouverymuch. Without bullshit labels like
"Tea Party"
Phlem
(6,323 posts)Jamaal510
(10,893 posts)I always think of a force that is not only ideologically-pure, but also is unwilling to work within the system to get things done, is hostile to moderates, disregards social issues of women and minorities, and is unable to grasp the concepts of basic civics. In fact, the Tea Party views the establishment as not "conservative" enough, despite a bunch of evidence to the contrary. I'm fine with populism (and actually prefer going back to some of the old school economics of the Democratic party prior to Reagan), but it would be a huge mistake for the Left to completely emulate what the Tea Party has done. The GOP is on the verge of fully self-destructing.
The author is correct that people are going to have to support candidates who are willing to change the party from within. I would also add that people who want to see change should write to their Congresspersons (if they haven't already), telling them what they want, and continue working in every election to get rid of the nuts so that the President can get more progressive goals accomplished. We still have a House and a whole bunch of governorships to flip.