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eridani

(51,907 posts)
Sat Oct 17, 2015, 01:05 AM Oct 2015

Unless You’re a Corporation, Nothing Good Will Come of the Trans-Pacific Partnership

http://inthesetimes.com/working/entry/18514/corporations_not_workers_will_benefit_from_TPP

For workers, the TPP’s dead rats are supersized versions of the ones in the North American Free Trade Agreement (NAFTA), the Korean free trade agreement (KORUS) and the agreement to allow China into the World Trade Organization. NAFTA covered only the United States, Mexico and Canada. The TPP would encompass four times that many countries – the United States, Mexico, Canada and nine other nations, which together account for roughly 40 percent of global GDP and one-third of world trade.

Errors in such a deal would produce dangerously massive effects. And NAFTA, on which the TPP is based, is deeply flawed.

NAFTA provisions prompted corporations to move auto, auto parts, electronics, appliance and other factories from the United States to low-wage, low-environmental-protection Mexico. Twenty years later, an analysis by Public Citizen’s Global Trade Watch showed that NAFTA cost Americans at least 845,000 jobs. And the study’s authors said they believe that number is low by hundreds of thousands because it includes only workers who qualified for Trade Adjustment Assistance, the federal aid for workers who can prove globalization cost them their jobs.

The TPP would encourage a new round of offshoring to countries with even more deplorable pay and environmental protections. And it would drive down U.S. wages by pitting American workers against those in Vietnam making less than 65 cents an hour and against forced and child laborers in Malaysia and Brunei.

Every time one of these deals is signed, its cheerleaders contend enforcement of new and improved labor and environmental standards will prevent U.S. job losses and wage reductions. That’s what TPP backers are swearing now. But, based on experience, that’s nothing but a big fat rat.

Another rodent in the TPP stew is currency manipulation. Like China, TPP signatories Japan, Malaysia and Singapore exploit this tactic to lower the price of their exports. In August, China deliberately and sharply devalued its currency as its economy cooled and its stock market sank. That artificially lowered the price of the steel, tires, paper and other products that Chinese factories had overproduced for export. And it artificially increased the price of American products exported to China. That costs Americans their jobs.
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Unless You’re a Corporation, Nothing Good Will Come of the Trans-Pacific Partnership (Original Post) eridani Oct 2015 OP
How many here work for a big corporarion? How many here have worked for a small, local corporation? Hoyt Oct 2015 #1
No. TPP has fuckall to do with China eridani Oct 2015 #2
Yes it does longterm. Hoyt Oct 2015 #3
In the long term, as Keynes once said, we are all dead eridani Oct 2015 #4
Lots of 99%ers will suffer from denying we live in a global economy. Hoyt Oct 2015 #5
WTF does living in a global economy have to do with the 1% fucking over the 99%? eridani Oct 2015 #7
Yeah, but France, Sweden, Holland and every other country, including Denmark, are fine signing Hoyt Oct 2015 #9
So, since NAFTA, we have lost jobs and not increased tax revenue eridani Oct 2015 #10
It's debatable whether NAFTA caused those things, or as Krugman said, Hoyt Oct 2015 #13
Where is the increased tax revenue given off-shore banking? It was either Google UK snagglepuss Oct 2015 #12
Again, why do all these countries want to be party to these agreements? Hoyt Oct 2015 #14
Do you think that America is the only country that has corporations snagglepuss Oct 2015 #17
Countries like Denmark, Canada, Finland sign then too. I guess they are all corrupt. Hoyt Oct 2015 #18
They don't. Only their 1 percenters do. n/t eridani Oct 2015 #19
So, if Corporations are People... GReedDiamond Oct 2015 #6
This is exactly what I have been thinking Samantha Oct 2015 #8
But Obama said it's the only way to make China play nice... WhaTHellsgoingonhere Oct 2015 #11
K&R smirkymonkey Oct 2015 #15
And the only way we can change it is to stop it. Congress jwirr Oct 2015 #16
Or an owner of said corporation(s). nt raouldukelives Oct 2015 #20
And the Bigger the Corporation, the Better... Octafish Oct 2015 #21
 

Hoyt

(54,770 posts)
1. How many here work for a big corporarion? How many here have worked for a small, local corporation?
Sat Oct 17, 2015, 01:34 AM
Oct 2015

How many got paid better working for a small local corporation, considering benefits? Corporations sux to high heaven, small ones are even worse.

So how do you propose to deal with China? Do you think the TPP might improve things, realizing that our glory days are over?

eridani

(51,907 posts)
7. WTF does living in a global economy have to do with the 1% fucking over the 99%?
Sat Oct 17, 2015, 01:53 AM
Oct 2015

ISDS has fuckall to do with tariffs.

Thanks to an ISDS provision in a past trade agreement, a mining company didn’t have to go to a Canadian court to challenge the permit decision – they went right to a special ISDS panel of corporate lawyers. Last month, the international panel ruled in favor of the mining company, and the decision cannot be challenged in Canadian courts.

Now the Canadian taxpayers may be on the hook for up to $300 million in “damages” to the mining company – all because their government had the gall to stand up for its environment and the economic livelihood of its local fishermen.

ISDS isn’t a one-time, hypothetical problem – we’ve seen it in past trade agreements. Just in the past few years:

• A French company sued Egypt after Egypt raised its minimum wage.
• A Swedish company sued Germany because Germany wanted to phase out nuclear power for safety reasons.
• A Dutch company sued the Czech Republic because the Czech Republic didn't bail out a bank that the Dutch company partially owned.
• Philip Morris is using ISDS right now to try to stop countries like Australia and Uruguay from implementing new rules that are intended to cut smoking rates – because the new laws might eat into the tobacco giant’s profits.

Now what in bleeding hell does any of this have to do with selling wheat, apples or planes? If any of your Republican opposition were smart, they’d run against you on this issue and win. Lucky for you they probably aren’t.

 

Hoyt

(54,770 posts)
9. Yeah, but France, Sweden, Holland and every other country, including Denmark, are fine signing
Sat Oct 17, 2015, 01:57 AM
Oct 2015

agreements with the ISDS in it, as they have from 1959. Why? Because all those countries want to attract foreign investment, create jobs, and increase tax revenue.

eridani

(51,907 posts)
10. So, since NAFTA, we have lost jobs and not increased tax revenue
Sat Oct 17, 2015, 02:45 AM
Oct 2015

The particulars are particularly shitty for TPP. The only people who favor it are whoring for corporations.

 

Hoyt

(54,770 posts)
13. It's debatable whether NAFTA caused those things, or as Krugman said,
Sat Oct 17, 2015, 10:18 AM
Oct 2015

"people blame NAFTA for things caused by other factors."

snagglepuss

(12,704 posts)
12. Where is the increased tax revenue given off-shore banking? It was either Google UK
Sat Oct 17, 2015, 08:41 AM
Oct 2015

or Facebook UK that only paid $4000 in taxes last year in the UK. You probably paid more tax.

And exactly how many jobs have been created that haven't been outsourced overseas. No provision to keep any created jobs from being outsourced.

snagglepuss

(12,704 posts)
17. Do you think that America is the only country that has corporations
Sat Oct 17, 2015, 03:16 PM
Oct 2015

wielding enormous political power? The grave problem of inordinate wealth and power in the hands of the few is a world wide phenomena. This tiny economic elite not only want to solidify their power but they want to dramatically lower the standard of living (ie destroy social safety nets) as well as dismantle environmental, health and work safety regulations in North America and Europe.

GReedDiamond

(5,310 posts)
6. So, if Corporations are People...
Sat Oct 17, 2015, 01:51 AM
Oct 2015

...does that mean, People are Corporations, too?

So therefore, individual citizens should qualify for all of the benefits of membership of this elite class of corporate 'mercans.

Right?!

Samantha

(9,314 posts)
8. This is exactly what I have been thinking
Sat Oct 17, 2015, 01:55 AM
Oct 2015

Each of us should incorporate. I have some things I do to earn money. It is not that difficult to incorporate through the State of Delaware. I just do not know because I have not looked what the requirements are.

But wouldn't that be a hoot if people did just start to incorporate and then our rights could not be trampled by this piece of trash. We then would not be considered an individual doormat.

Sam

 

WhaTHellsgoingonhere

(5,252 posts)
11. But Obama said it's the only way to make China play nice...
Sat Oct 17, 2015, 07:26 AM
Oct 2015

and stop outsourcing.

FAIL

The only way to level the playing field is through tariffs. That is the only thing we control.

jwirr

(39,215 posts)
16. And the only way we can change it is to stop it. Congress
Sat Oct 17, 2015, 03:00 PM
Oct 2015

gave away the right to change it in the TPA.

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