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brush

(53,475 posts)
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 02:01 PM Mar 2016

I'm watching the Cuba v the Tampa Bay Rays baseball game in Havana. They are awaiting Pres. Obama

It's quite a spectacle. As the cameras scan the stands you can see that the complexions of the people range from black to brown to lighter brown to white, all Cubans. Both presidents have arrived now and a huge choir of Cuban ladies in white are singing both the Cuban anthem in Spanish and US anthem in English — beautiful.

Many other baseball notables are there — Rachel Robinson, Jackie Robinson's widow (she's 90 and still beautifu- — black don't crack); Derrick Jeter; Dave Winfield; Louie Tiant, a Cuban and great former pitcher for the Indians and Red Sox threw out the first ball, man, this is historic.

Eduardo Perez, a Cuban American and former player here is one of the announcers. He has relatives in Cuba that he hadn't seen before. He was asked about the trip and he expressed joy and sadness in seeing his family, sharing a meal with them, and then at the diplomatic situation between Cuba and the US. Then he expressed the anger at the Castro regime that many Cubans and Cuban Americans hold.

It made me wonder if there is ever any appreciation towards the Castros and Guevara and their overthrow of the Batista regime?

I know Castro kept his grip on power much too long, unlike revolutionary Daniel Ortega of Nicaragua who eventually held elections.

44 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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I'm watching the Cuba v the Tampa Bay Rays baseball game in Havana. They are awaiting Pres. Obama (Original Post) brush Mar 2016 OP
Thanks! Tuned in on ESPN. Land of Enchantment Mar 2016 #1
Appreciation towards the Castros? oberliner Mar 2016 #2
Most Cubans in Cuba do. Mika Mar 2016 #3
That is total BS oberliner Mar 2016 #5
You have this one wrong malaise Mar 2016 #7
You have no way of knowing that oberliner Mar 2016 #13
Then maybe you don't know the relationship between Cuba and Jamaica n/t malaise Mar 2016 #15
You have no way of knowing what you say. I lived in Cuba. Many of my family live there, I go often Mika Mar 2016 #33
I would guess that most *claim* to. trotsky Mar 2016 #17
What a bigoted and uninformed comment. Mika Mar 2016 #34
LMAO! trotsky Mar 2016 #36
HRW has no observers there. HRW's Cuba reports are based on stories fabricated by Cubanet employees. Mika Mar 2016 #38
Oh I get it. trotsky Mar 2016 #40
A lie goes around the world before truth can get its boots on. Mika Mar 2016 #41
Why don't they have human rights observers in Cuba? trotsky Mar 2016 #42
We go over this on the LatAm forum almost every time a Cuba related event comes up. Mika Mar 2016 #43
Yup, there's the forum. trotsky Mar 2016 #44
For overthrowing the dictator Batista brush Mar 2016 #4
If they don't appreciate it, they get arrested oberliner Mar 2016 #6
I'm talking intellectually, privately, historically do they wonder where Cuba would be . . . brush Mar 2016 #9
Maybe oberliner Mar 2016 #10
There's a lot of free speech in Cuba but one cannot speak badly of Fidel flamingdem Mar 2016 #31
WHAT? This is where we part ways. Mika Mar 2016 #35
Well maybe that's just folklore but I don't think so flamingdem Mar 2016 #39
Much as had happened during the Batista presidency LanternWaste Mar 2016 #20
Do you see Castro in the same light as those two right wing dictators that came before? brush Mar 2016 #25
It seems like that to you, maybe because you don't know. Mika Mar 2016 #37
Do you know why there is no baseball in the Olympics?? malaise Mar 2016 #8
No. Why do I get the feeling you're going to tell me? brush Mar 2016 #11
Is it because Cuba always wins? oberliner Mar 2016 #12
Correct n/t malaise Mar 2016 #16
There is a simple reason for that. Elwood P Dowd Mar 2016 #32
If they bring it back guess the World Baseball Congress event will dissolve brush Mar 2016 #26
Do you have a link? Are you watching on ESPN? flamingdem Mar 2016 #14
Sorry, no link. I'm watching it on ESPN brush Mar 2016 #18
They're about to interview Obama malaise Mar 2016 #19
In the middle of the game? flamingdem Mar 2016 #21
Yep - we're not seeing the game right now malaise Mar 2016 #22
Split screen every now and then malaise Mar 2016 #23
What I love most about Obama malaise Mar 2016 #24
I was thinking the same about his speech, he admitted to the faults of the USA flamingdem Mar 2016 #27
Said that on another thread malaise Mar 2016 #28
I see on twitter that the Cuban pitcher is/was chewing a toothpick flamingdem Mar 2016 #29
Very old school malaise Mar 2016 #30
 

Mika

(17,751 posts)
3. Most Cubans in Cuba do.
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 02:36 PM
Mar 2016

Yes. You are reading it right .... Most Cubans in Cuba do appreciate the Castros.






 

oberliner

(58,724 posts)
5. That is total BS
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 02:41 PM
Mar 2016
304 Dissidents Arrested Ahead of Obama Visit, Cuba Human Rights Group Says

HAVANA, Cuba -- The head of Cuba’s leading human rights organization tells ABC News that 304 people were arrested for criticizing the Cuban government just days before President Obama’s historic visit to the island.

The Cuban Commission on Human Rights provided a list of names and the locations where the arrests took place -- 104 of them in Havana and others at locations throughout Cuba.

“Since last year, we’re talking about thousands” of arrests, Elizardo Sanchez told ABC. “The worst thing is that the Cuban government has unleashed a huge wave of political oppression, and during Obama’s visit this morning they were arresting people and this will go on for the rest of the day and probably tomorrow.”

http://abcnews.go.com/International/304-dissidents-arrested-ahead-obama-visit-cuba-human/story?id=37823936

 

oberliner

(58,724 posts)
13. You have no way of knowing that
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 02:51 PM
Mar 2016

Cubans are not permitted to speak critically about the Castro regime.

 

Mika

(17,751 posts)
33. You have no way of knowing what you say. I lived in Cuba. Many of my family live there, I go often
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 04:17 PM
Mar 2016

You post here what you know not of.
Do yourself a favor... go there and see for yourself. Like most who go, your opinion might change.
Don't accept what the corporate media and US State Dept/USAID paid minions spew for profit.




trotsky

(49,533 posts)
36. LMAO!
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 04:22 PM
Mar 2016

"Bigoted"? Please do explain how on earth what I said could be considered bigoted.

And then answer this question - TRUE or FALSE: People are imprisoned in Cuba for criticizing the government.

To help you with that question, feel free to consult this 2014 report from Human Rights Watch: https://www.hrw.org/world-report/2014/country-chapters/cuba

 

Mika

(17,751 posts)
38. HRW has no observers there. HRW's Cuba reports are based on stories fabricated by Cubanet employees.
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 04:31 PM
Mar 2016

Cubanet (based in Miami, funded by US gov't entities to the tune of $180,000 per month, as well as from Miami Cuban RW exiles connected to terrorism in Cuba) pays their propagandists in Cuba $2000 a month to produce anti Cuba propaganda.
You want to go with that as your truth? ... have at it.
Otherwise, it might be good to do some research on this.


It is kinda bigoted to be broad brushing an entire populace with your dystopian, and untrue, aspersion.


BTW, I've lived in Cuba. Have family there. I visit regularly, fyi.



trotsky

(49,533 posts)
40. Oh I get it.
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 04:43 PM
Mar 2016

You have all the facts, and everyone else has propaganda.

All the Cubans who escaped and reported facts other than what you are claiming must be part of the propaganda conspiracy. Of course! I guess the UN is being paid off too, somehow? https://www1.umn.edu/humanrts/commission/country51/52.htm They control the government of the UK even! https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/cuba-country-of-concern/cuba-country-of-concern And the Red Cross to boot! Amnesty International! All must be fake orgs propped up by Cubanet no doubt!

 

Mika

(17,751 posts)
41. A lie goes around the world before truth can get its boots on.
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 05:08 PM
Mar 2016

None have human right observers in Cuba. The sources are, for the most part, from one resource (funded by anti Cuba entities).
Do your own homework. Not asking you to believe my words.

I have no idea what your " fake orgs propped up by Cubanet" comment means. I never said nor inferred they were. Just referring to their sourcing of information that they base their reports on - they do not have their own sources ... they've outsourced reporting to anti Cuba exile organizations based in Miami.

I might not know "all the facts" on every topic in Cuba, but, I certainly know more than posters on the internets who have never set foot on the island.

Do yourself a favor ... and go there.



trotsky

(49,533 posts)
42. Why don't they have human rights observers in Cuba?
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 05:17 PM
Mar 2016

Have they not tried to put them there?

Has someone stopped them?

Help me do this homework. Educate me.

 

Mika

(17,751 posts)
43. We go over this on the LatAm forum almost every time a Cuba related event comes up.
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 05:27 PM
Mar 2016

You can choose to look, or not.



brush

(53,475 posts)
4. For overthrowing the dictator Batista
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 02:39 PM
Mar 2016

I did say that they've kept their grip on power much too long.

You do understand that right?

Before Batista was overthrown, Cuba was a society exploited by rich Americans and their corporations, and by the mafia.

 

oberliner

(58,724 posts)
6. If they don't appreciate it, they get arrested
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 02:41 PM
Mar 2016

So there really isn't a whole lot of free choice involved in this matter.

brush

(53,475 posts)
9. I'm talking intellectually, privately, historically do they wonder where Cuba would be . . .
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 02:46 PM
Mar 2016

if Batista and his family had held onto power all these years.

 

oberliner

(58,724 posts)
10. Maybe
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 02:48 PM
Mar 2016

But we can't really get a good read on that since they are not allowed to speak freely on the subject.

flamingdem

(39,304 posts)
31. There's a lot of free speech in Cuba but one cannot speak badly of Fidel
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 03:56 PM
Mar 2016

That's a big no no.

Otherwise it's not as locked down as the media would have you believe.

Don't forget they are, in their minds, fighting against the USA and the embargo, very real to them.

 

Mika

(17,751 posts)
35. WHAT? This is where we part ways.
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 04:22 PM
Mar 2016

It is a no no to be an unregistered foreign agent on US payrolls spewing anti Castro propaganda. That is it. Otherwise Cubans openly speak out freely about their feelings about the Castros, both pro and con.
I have NO idea why you would post such doggerel.



flamingdem

(39,304 posts)
39. Well maybe that's just folklore but I don't think so
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 04:40 PM
Mar 2016

Consider the artist who wrote Fidel and Raul on two pigs. He did time for that.

 

LanternWaste

(37,748 posts)
20. Much as had happened during the Batista presidency
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 03:00 PM
Mar 2016

Much as had happened during the Batista presidency using his his Bureau for the Repression of Communist Activities to carry out wide-scale violence, torture and public executions; ultimately killing anywhere from 1,000 to 20,000 people.

And the Machado regime prior to that.

Seems Castro was simply one more in a line of naked emperors rather than The Naked Emperor.

brush

(53,475 posts)
25. Do you see Castro in the same light as those two right wing dictators that came before?
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 03:18 PM
Mar 2016

Seems in rightist dictatorships the connected elite do very well but the rest of the people don't.

 

Mika

(17,751 posts)
37. It seems like that to you, maybe because you don't know.
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 04:24 PM
Mar 2016

Go to Cuba. See for yourself that this dystopian Cuba many American fantasize over doesn't exist.


Elwood P Dowd

(11,443 posts)
32. There is a simple reason for that.
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 04:03 PM
Mar 2016

The best players in the US, Dominican Republic, Japan, etc. are in the middle of their Major League and Minor League seasons. The owners, executives, and coaches are simply not going to allow their best players to take a month off to play in the Olympics. There are millions of dollars at stake. Cuba doesn't have that problem, even though some of their best players have defected to Major League Baseball. That stupid early March world baseball tournament that is played every 4 years attracts very few of the best American players and some of the best foreign Major League players skip it.

For years we sent 18-22 year-old college kids to play baseball in the Olympics. Those are kids not good enough to be selected high in the Major League draft and were not even the best 18-22 year-olds available. Most of the best in that age group were playing in the Majors, Minors, under contract, and not available for the Olympics.

The NBA allows it because the Olympics are played weeks before the NBA season starts. The NHL works with the Olympics also.

brush

(53,475 posts)
26. If they bring it back guess the World Baseball Congress event will dissolve
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 03:19 PM
Mar 2016

It's also every four years.

brush

(53,475 posts)
18. Sorry, no link. I'm watching it on ESPN
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 02:55 PM
Mar 2016

Now they're interviewing Rachel Robinson about Jackie Robinson's play in Havana before the Dodgers bought him up to the major leagues.

She says they were treated excellently by the Cuban people.

malaise

(267,823 posts)
24. What I love most about Obama
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 03:08 PM
Mar 2016

is his honesty about himself and his own weaknesses - as in not being a great baseball player.

flamingdem

(39,304 posts)
27. I was thinking the same about his speech, he admitted to the faults of the USA
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 03:22 PM
Mar 2016

and that's something new. The USA doesn't do much self inventory, especially when empire is involved!

malaise

(267,823 posts)
28. Said that on another thread
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 03:26 PM
Mar 2016

but we knew that was Obama. I remember how shocked the hacks at M$Greedia were when he talked about the shellacking after the 2010 elections. ReTHUGs never admit they are wrong.

I'm going to watch the speech again and read the transcript - it was deep and honest.

flamingdem

(39,304 posts)
29. I see on twitter that the Cuban pitcher is/was chewing a toothpick
Tue Mar 22, 2016, 03:37 PM
Mar 2016

That was the cause of about 100 tweets! I guess it's old school or something.

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