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applegrove

(118,430 posts)
Sun Aug 21, 2016, 08:45 PM Aug 2016

Free money is not so funny anymore: Confessions of a (former) skeptic of basic income

Free money is not so funny anymore: Confessions of a (former) skeptic of basic income

by Gleb Tsipursky at Salon

http://www.salon.com/2016/08/21/free-money-is-not-so-funny-anymore-confessions-of-a-former-skeptic-of-basic-income/

"SNIP............


Getting a tire replaced seems easy to me. I’d just go to the nearest tire place and get it fixed. But Jayleene was living from paycheck to paycheck and didn’t have $110 to spare. She couldn’t get to work, and her boss fired her. She couldn’t make her rent and was soon out on the street — all because she needed $110 at the right time.

Jayleene told me her story during my volunteer shift at a soup kitchen. Her experience was the final straw that convinced me to support the idea of providing a basic income, the notion of giving people an unconditional living wage, which has been backed by conservatives and liberals alike. The concept of basic income is becoming increasingly popular around the world, with Finland, the Netherlands, Switzerland and Canada experimenting with it.

So is the United States. A study is planned for Oakland, California, that will be funded by the well-known Y Combinator. “In our pilot, the income will be unconditional,” Sam Altman, president of Y Combinator, said. “We’re going to give it to participants for the duration of the study, no matter what. People will be able to volunteer, work, not work, move to another country — anything.”

Added Altman: “We hope basic income promotes freedom, and we want to see how people experience that freedom.”


...............SNIP"

6 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Free money is not so funny anymore: Confessions of a (former) skeptic of basic income (Original Post) applegrove Aug 2016 OP
It's a study. Igel Aug 2016 #1
Are you talking about the Chicago HCV plan generated by the Gautreaux lawsuit in the 60's? JanMichael Aug 2016 #2
Why move people? Just give them the basic income and let them decide what will work best AllyCat Aug 2016 #3
^^^ THIS. Buckeye_Democrat Aug 2016 #4
When white collar jobs are replaced by automation this idea will be much more popular nt. killbotfactory Aug 2016 #5
exactly ProfessorPlum Aug 2016 #6

Igel

(35,268 posts)
1. It's a study.
Sun Aug 21, 2016, 09:38 PM
Aug 2016

Wait for the results. Then the results of the study might result in policy changes, which will then be evaluated to show how the wonderful practice plays out in the real world.

In the '90s I was all gung-ho for a policy rooted in sound research. You take families living in "persistent poverty" and relocate them. In their new digs, they receive subsidies for their living quarters. Kids attend "good" schools. The neighborhoods were middle or upper-middle class. They'd have access to good jobs. It's all the things that more recent research saying that life opportunities depend on geography, i.e., on neighborhood, would predict should work, with the added bonus that it helped break up pockets of persistent poverty. This was the prediction.

And the research said that those things did work. Kids did better in school, families stuck together better, family income rose. So the Clinton administration made it a policy to help very low SES/intergenerational-poverty families move into nice neighborhoods. This is still often the basis of mixed-neighborhoo policies in, say, Harris County (Houston, in other words).

Thing is, by the early 2000s the policy was evaluated and found to fail. Kids often returned to their original neighborhoods to be with friends. Families moved back. Even if the kids did better in schools, they were still below the "indigenous" populations. If you're #50 out of 50, it doesn't matter if your test scores are 69 or 73, you're still #50.

Except by the time the policy was shown to be pretty much a failure that did little but piss off established residents of a neighborhood and create resentment it had a constituency in the population, in academia, and in the bureaucracy. So it's still policy. Anecdotes say it's a wonderful thing; too bad there's no data to back it up--in fact, the data say it's a rather expensive wash--but in a post-Enlightenment anti-intellectual world, who needs crummy data when you have impressions and belief?

So do the study. The results will come out great. We'll try it in reality. And the results will be an expensive 0 that we're stuck with for decades, the pointless being the enemy of the good. But we'll have nice pats on the back, even if we have to dislocate our shoulders to receive them from ourselves.

JanMichael

(24,869 posts)
2. Are you talking about the Chicago HCV plan generated by the Gautreaux lawsuit in the 60's?
Sun Aug 21, 2016, 10:02 PM
Aug 2016

Where they tried to get very low income inner city households to live in the burbs after it was agreed that the concentration of poverty was not ideal for children involved?

I've seen studies that show that it was not a failure but more of a mixed bag.

https://www.google.com/webhp?sourceid=chrome-instant&ion=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8#q=hud+hcv+Gautreaux+results

Buckeye_Democrat

(14,852 posts)
4. ^^^ THIS.
Sun Aug 21, 2016, 11:41 PM
Aug 2016

Forced busing didn't work well either.

http://www.slate.com/articles/life/history/features/2014/the_liberal_failure_on_race/how_the_left_s_embrace_of_busing_hurt_the_cause_of_integration.html

Schools could be forced to desegregate—that is, to accept black students—but genuine integration, as King said, was an “unenforceable” demand. The government can put us in the same room, but they can’t make us get along.
To this day, the language of racial balance, as used by the left, keeps us talking about “integrated schools.” But institutions don’t integrate. People do. If a school is 3 percent black, but all of those students are actively engaged in making friends and participating in student activities, then those children are well and fully integrated. If a school is 20 percent black but all the black students stay on their own side of the cafeteria and then get bused home at 3 p.m. every day, then there is no integration taking place at that school. Trying to measure integration with percentages is like trying to measure your weight in inches.


Black America wasn’t fighting for integration, per se. They were fighting for agency, the right to exercise control over their lives and, hopefully, to enjoy the full protection of the government while doing so. In education, that’s not what they got. They got a policy that demanded white schools produce statistical proof of significant progress, and one where whites were in charge of executing the burdens imposed on them by the courts. Black schools were unilaterally closed down, their students divvied up and distributed to whatever white school needed to adjust its numbers in order to avoid being sued, often over the very loud protests of black parents; at angry town hall meetings, integration was denounced as a white supremacist plot to destroy the black community. Some black students, fearing the prospect of a hostile white environment, dropped out of school rather than ride the bus.


A 1972 Gallup poll showed that 77 percent of whites were against busing. The same poll showed 47 percent of blacks were against it as well. Many black Americans did believe in the school bus and the access it provided, and busing might have been a viable tool for those families had it been smartly and surgically applied. It wasn’t. It was presented in a sweeping fashion that denied many blacks the agency they sought.

ProfessorPlum

(11,253 posts)
6. exactly
Tue Aug 23, 2016, 08:33 AM
Aug 2016

What will we do when we've all been replaced and there are no jobs?

I'm only half kidding with this question. Mincome will happen, it has to.

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