House Votes to Name Official Pennsylvania ‘State Firearm’
Source: Philadelphia Magazine
The Pennsylvania House of Representatives overwhelmingly voted to name the long rifle the state firearm of Pennsylvania on Monday. Thats right: Soon youll be able to take a state gun (the long rifle) and shoot the state bird (the ruffed grouse) before celebrating with the state drink (milk).
The vote prompted an impassioned response from a State Rep. Mark B. Cohen, one of many Philadelphia-area representatives to vote against the bill.
Having a state gun is deeply offensive to many people in Pennsylvania, Cohen said on the floor. We ought not to pass this amendment. We ought to show some sensitivity to the loss of human life.
State Sen. Pat Browne first introduced a bill naming the Pennsylvania long rifle the state gun in 2010. Gun-rights activists have pushed for official state firearm designations for the last five years, with four states adopting official guns.
Read more: http://www.phillymag.com/news/2014/06/03/house-votes-name-official-pennsylvania-state-firearm
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tclambert
(11,085 posts)Mnemosyne
(21,363 posts)BumRushDaShow
(128,833 posts)They should have done this instead -
Bryce Butler
(338 posts)The PA state legislature is one of the reasons I left.
bluedigger
(17,086 posts)That's the birthplace of Daniel Boone, who leaned to shoot as a youth there. That's American History. Shouldn't even be politicized with the modern gun debate, and I'm sorry it has/will be.
rpannier
(24,329 posts)So what exactly does he have to do with the conversation?
It was the weapon carried by Pennsylvanians in the 18th and 19th century and that was the reason given.
So it was also used to kill a lot of native Americans
Should that little tidbit also be included?
bluedigger
(17,086 posts)The fact that we took this country from the native Americans early on in armed conflict is indisputable, and in many cases dishonorable acts were carried out. Our record was bad, but history is what it is, and I am glad we succeeded. I rather like our "sea to shining sea".
When colonists like Daniel were pushing the frontier forward it was a real life and death, personal struggle, in which he lost several of his own children. The first colonist to settle west of the Appalachians, and reputed to have reached the Yellowstone River in his senior years. An amazing, and fittingly complicated founder of our country.
The Pennsylvania long rifle was symbolic of Daniel Boone, whose real life exploits inspired several generations of Americans to head West. As one of the first truly American innovations to gain global notice it inspired inventors and tinkerers to make us a modern and adaptive nation.
He, and the rifle he carried, have been on our currency and postage and are iconic symbols of our founding. If Pennsylvania wishes to officially acknowledge the distinctiveness of it by official act, I don't have a problem with that. My dog is a Catahoula, the State Dog of Louisiana. Catahoulas are distinctive to the state of Louisiana historically. A lot of states have named State Things for a lot more obscure reasons. If this has to be some sort of modern day victory for guns rights activists then I am willing to concede the ground in this case. I prefer to view it as official recordation of American History, and I would love to have a real Pennsylvania long rifle hanging over my mantle. If I had a mantle.
OffWithTheirHeads
(10,337 posts)were instrumental in winning the Revolutionary war. Both were some of the first guns to use rifled barrels. The British, as I understand it, were basically using smooth bore equivalents of shotguns. In the right hands, an American long gun could hit a target at 1,000 yards. A British smooth bore would have been good for about 25 yards. Both of the American long guns were magnificent pieces of American craftsmanship. I built a re-creation of a Tennessee long gun a few years ago. It took me three years WITH power tools and electric light. The craftsmanship required is just unimaginable back in the day. If any guns need to be honored in our culture, these two should be.
I know that many people here hate guns, period. But without these guns you might still b singing "Hail to the Queen".
happyslug
(14,779 posts)Last edited Wed Jun 4, 2014, 02:08 PM - Edit history (3)
The "American Rifle" as it was called in the 1700s (the name Kentucky and Pennsylvania Rifles is a late 1800 or early 1900s name adopted name for that type of rifle) had two bad characteristics when compared to smooth bore muskets.
The first was speed of reloading. A smooth bore musket could reload as fast as six rounds a minute. The American Rifle was restricted to two rounds per minute (which was better the the Jäger or hunting Rifle used by the Hessians which could fire only one round per minute). Worse, misfires occurred every six shots (this would continue till the percussion cap was adopted starting in 1830, with percussion caps misfires dropped to one in a thousand shots).
The real effect of this high rate of misfires is in a muzzle loading rifle, you had to pull out the bullet. This could take cover five minutes. Thus after about a minute of combat any rifle unit had seen its fire power drop by 90 %. Smooth bore muskets fired undersized bullets, that could be removed, by just just turning the musket with the barrel to the ground and watch the bullet roll out. Total time out of action less then 10 seconds.
The second problem was no bayonet. Given the high rate of misfires a serious defect (fixed with the adoption of the 1803 Harper's Ferry Rifle).
These two restriction forced Washington to issue an order that no Rifle regiment could go into combat without being supported by TWO musket equipped infantry regiments.
By the time of the US Civil war, the percussion cap had been in use in the UK since 1830 and the US Army since 1842. In 1854 the US adopted the Minie ball, which permitted undersized bullets to be used in rifle barrels with loading time equal to smooth bore muskets. The percussion cap eliminated most misfires, so misfires were not a big a factor as in the Revolution. Thus during the US Civil War Rifles were used by both sides, unlike the Revolution when rifles were important for they much longer range, but the problems of misfires and loading times restricted they use, as can be seen in Washington's order that any rifle regiment by supported by two musket equipped regiments.
As to the American/Kentucky/Pennsylvania Rifle, it stayed in production till the 1950s in Appalachian Mountains for it was cheap to operate (Small bore meant you only needed small amounts of lead and powder, things imported into the Colonies till the Revolution, Powder being imported till DuPont build his first powder mill when Jefferson was President). Thus in the 1800s the price of lead and powder declined and as people ran into larger game that existed in the West, other weapons became preferred on the Frontier. On the other hand Annie Oakly's first weapon was her father's American Rifle and she started to use it in the late 1860s (In her days with the Wild West Show, she opt for 22 caliber rimfire rifles, a little bit more expensive to operate but a lot easier to use).
Thus the American Rifle was popular east of the Mississippi till about 1880 when the 22 came into its own (yes the 22 was invented in the 1860s, but it took a while for people to switch). By 1900 the American Rifle had been restricted to Appalachian Mountains (Sargent York, the most decorated American Soldier of WWI, grew up using such a rifle, through he was known also as an excellent pistol shot). If you had money you opt for a more modern rifle, but in the poorest parts of America the American Rifle was King till the Great Depression finally forced many of its last users out of the Mountains and into Northern Cities.
OffWithTheirHeads
(10,337 posts)thanks for taking the time to educate me further.
happyslug
(14,779 posts)But the most telling fact is that George Washington ordered ALL Rifle Regiments NOT to go into Combat unless supported by two Musket Equipped Infantry regiments.
On the Frontier, most combat involved less then 20 men on both sides. In such situations the American Rifle came into its own (Most combat involving such small units tend to be over in about a minute, one side or the other is captured, shot or retreating). Thus the down sides of the American Rifle rarely came into play. On the other hand, even on the Frontier, when actual volume of fire was called for, it was the Musket that was supreme during the Revolutionary period.
Thus General, late President, Jackson went against Native Americans, the frontiersmen supplied the rifle units, but they had ordered to retreat to the infantry lines if things went bad and leave the line infantry take care of any Native Americans who followed the frontier men back to camp. When attacking a Native American Village the Frontiersmen went in first, but these tend to be over in under a minute. When the Native American took a stand, the Frontiersmen would engage them, and then leave the regular infantry push through with their muskets and bayonets.
This was the tactics of the time period, these started to change with the adoption of the Percussion Cap in 1842 and then the Minnie ball in 1854 (and with the adoption of the first breech-loading rifle for use by regular infantry the Model 1866 in 50-70).
Side note: The US Army did permit Cavalry units to use the Spencer during the Civil War, and also permitted any unit to use any weapon provided it purchased the replacement rounds (This some units did use Henry Rifles, the predecessors to the model 1866 Winchester). After the Civil War the US Army restricted itself to the Model 1866 in 50-70 for its infantry units and Spencers and Sharps for the Cavarly (The Sharps was a single shot weapon that had long range capacity, the Spencer was a magazine weapon that could fire a lot of rounds in 30 seconds but at much shorter range, the two complimented each other nicely). All three were replaced in 1873 by the 1873 Springfield in 45-70 (With the Cavalry getting a 20 inch carbine and reduce loading of the 45-70 rounds).
Thus from the 1840s till the 1870s you saw a massive change in weapons technologies. You went from an era where the bayonet could still claim to be the King of the Battlefield, to one where it was often thrown away as useless. You went from a period when Rifles were at best a secondary support weapon to the Musket and Bayonet, to one where Rifles are the main battle field weapon (Over 60% of all causalities were done by Rifle Bullets in the Civil War, In combat today, if you are fighting in Woods, Mountains or Cities, similar percentage occur, it is only in open fields where you seen injuries done by rifles reduced to less then 50%. Please note most combat occurred in such forested terrain during the Civil War, for the US was still in the process of deforesting itself at the period in time).
name not needed
(11,660 posts)Divernan
(15,480 posts)Half-Century Man
(5,279 posts)The Red Ryder BB gun.
packman
(16,296 posts)Half-Century Man
(5,279 posts)Evidently ricochets off of signs is the greatest danger.
packman
(16,296 posts)For those not grasping your reference - watch the end
Kelvin Mace
(17,469 posts)I suggest a four year old who blew his brains out playing with daddy's gun.
valerief
(53,235 posts)JohnnyRingo
(18,624 posts)I threw myself into the line of fire once at an Eagles concert at Star Lake Amphitheater Near Pittsburgh.
Still, Cleveland Rocks!
Wait... are they talking about a real gun?
Never mind, fuck em'. That's stupid.
blkmusclmachine
(16,149 posts)sweetapogee
(1,168 posts)that you don't shoot birds with a long rifle.
malthaussen
(17,186 posts)... there'd be a lot fewer mass shootings. Somebody at DU has already floated that idea, though.
Silly legislature. I never got the point of having 50 different "official state" whatevers. Why do they waste their time on this crap?
-- Mal
Tommy_Carcetti
(43,173 posts)Although with the iron grip that Marion Hammer and the NRA have on the Florida legislature, one might assume that it would.
But it didn't!
So I repeat....not a Florida story.
packman
(16,296 posts)When we do adopt a rifle, it will be an assault rifle that can spew out at least 2,000 rounds per minute - not that pansy long rifle that the settlers of Pennsylvania used.