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DonViejo

(60,536 posts)
Mon Jun 16, 2014, 12:51 PM Jun 2014

SCOTUS Rules For Anti-Abortion Group In Case About Campaign Lies

Source: TPM

SAHIL KAPUR – JUNE 16, 2014, 10:41 AM EDT

On Monday, the Supreme Court ruled that the anti-abortion group Susan B. Anthony List has standing to challenge a state law in Ohio that prohibits false statements about political candidates.

The unanimous ruling, written by Justice Clarence Thomas, says the group demonstrated a "sufficiently imminent injury" and therefore its First Amendment case against the law may move forward. Conservatives including Justice Antonin Scalia have sardonically dubbed it the "Ministry of Truth" statute.

"The question in this case is whether their preenforcement challenge to that law is justiciable—and in particular, whether they have alleged a sufficiently imminent injury for the purposes of Article III. We conclude that they have," Thomas wrote for the Court.

In 2010, SBA List sought to put up a billboard accusing then-Rep. Steve Driehaus, a Democrat, of supporting taxpayer-funded abortion by voting for Obamacare. Driehaus complained to state officials, saying it ran afoul of the campaign lies law. Although the state didn't take action, the billboard company refused to put up the ad, which caused SBA List to sue, alleging the law had a chilling effect on its free speech rights.

-snip-

Read more: http://talkingpointsmemo.com/dc/supreme-court-susan-b-anthony-campaign-lies

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SCOTUS Rules For Anti-Abortion Group In Case About Campaign Lies (Original Post) DonViejo Jun 2014 OP
Scalia, Thomas, Alito, Roberts lark Jun 2014 #1
It was an unanimous decision. former9thward Jun 2014 #11
If they get to lie for money, why can't everyone? n/t Orsino Jun 2014 #16
You can lark Jun 2014 #20
Nice To See people Fight For Liberty To Lie, Sir The Magistrate Jun 2014 #2
William O. Douglas onenote Jun 2014 #24
Oh, Well, Sir The Magistrate Jun 2014 #25
TYRANNY!... onehandle Jun 2014 #3
Did Nader appoint Sotomayor and Kagan? former9thward Jun 2014 #12
No, but Ralph enabled the man who put Alito and Roberts on the court Arkana Jun 2014 #18
This decision was unanimous. former9thward Jun 2014 #19
What they do behind closed doors is none of your business. But back to the law, this ruling was 24601 Jun 2014 #21
you're going to blame Nader for Bush stealing Florida AGAIN? yurbud Jun 2014 #26
SBA will join the ranks of Faux News VanillaRhapsody Jun 2014 #4
This is a terrible law that certainly violates the First Amendment and should be overturned. Nye Bevan Jun 2014 #5
We would just have to be more concise in our wording, for instance... DesertDiamond Jun 2014 #7
So some election panel would have to decide whether or not Bush knew Powell was lying, Nye Bevan Jun 2014 #8
I wonder though if a tweaking of the law is what is needed such as adding the clause cstanleytech Jun 2014 #9
An anti-abortion group named after Susan B. Anthony?? Suing for the right to lie?? And winning??? We DesertDiamond Jun 2014 #6
The law was unconstitutional on its face. former9thward Jun 2014 #13
Actually, Anthony could be contestibly-argued, not-certainly, to be both pro-life and pro-choice. Chan790 Jun 2014 #23
, blkmusclmachine Jun 2014 #10
Here is the Case if you want to read it happyslug Jun 2014 #14
Yeah, the fucking SupremeCOUS. Cha Jun 2014 #15
Good. It's a terrible law that SHOULD be struck down. I don't care who challenges the law NYC Liberal Jun 2014 #17
Called it. joshcryer Jun 2014 #22

The Magistrate

(95,244 posts)
25. Oh, Well, Sir
Tue Jun 17, 2014, 09:29 PM
Jun 2014

I repeat; it is nice to see people rear up on their hind legs to fight for the right to lie. It should be thrown in their faces whenever they open mouths that the only honest thing they ever said was telling a judge, "Your Honor, I'm a liar, and please let go on telling lies and deceiving people for personal and political profit." Because the people who filed this are liars, and know they are liars, and know telling the truth would be their doom.

"In searching for truth, a liar has no more part than a counterfeit bill in a bank deposit."

Arkana

(24,347 posts)
18. No, but Ralph enabled the man who put Alito and Roberts on the court
Tue Jun 17, 2014, 12:19 PM
Jun 2014

by telling everyone who would listen that there was no difference between the parties.

former9thward

(31,949 posts)
19. This decision was unanimous.
Tue Jun 17, 2014, 12:26 PM
Jun 2014

With respect to this decision who cares who put who on the court? Of course your premise is wrong. Nader did not enable anyone. It was Gore who could not get FL Democrats to vote for him.

24601

(3,955 posts)
21. What they do behind closed doors is none of your business. But back to the law, this ruling was
Tue Jun 17, 2014, 06:46 PM
Jun 2014

100% correct.

Nye Bevan

(25,406 posts)
5. This is a terrible law that certainly violates the First Amendment and should be overturned.
Mon Jun 16, 2014, 01:25 PM
Jun 2014

Most campaign claims are not 100% true or false. There are half-truths, statements that are true but misleading, statements that are open to differing interpretations, and so on. The Washington Post fact checker, for example, does not adjudge statements "true" or "false" but awards between one and four "pinnochios" depending on the degree to which they see the statement as misleading.

With such a law in place, whoever gets to decide on whether a political claim is "true" or "false" has an extraordinary amount of power to censor political speech. Imagine a billboard that claimed "Bush Lied Us Into War" being ordered removed because the claimant could not prove the literal truth of this statement.

DesertDiamond

(1,616 posts)
7. We would just have to be more concise in our wording, for instance...
Mon Jun 16, 2014, 01:50 PM
Jun 2014

"The Bush Administration Lied Us Into War" I think would be defensible. However, in this particular case, I think since the POTUS is responsible for everything done, at least publicly, in his or her name, I think it would stand in court that Bush knew Colin Powell was lying to the public. Colin Powell knew it, so Bush knew it. Or has to answer for being clueless about what was said by a person representing him.

Nye Bevan

(25,406 posts)
8. So some election panel would have to decide whether or not Bush knew Powell was lying,
Mon Jun 16, 2014, 01:55 PM
Jun 2014

and ban the ad if they decided that he did not.

OTOH they would have to allow an ad that claimed "We Found WMDs in Iraq" because we actually did. Yes, they were antiquated sarin shells left over from the first Gulf War that posed no threat, but that statement is technically true.

Granting the power to censor disputed political speech in this manner is a clear violation of the First Amendment.

cstanleytech

(26,251 posts)
9. I wonder though if a tweaking of the law is what is needed such as adding the clause
Mon Jun 16, 2014, 03:58 PM
Jun 2014

that you cannot knowingly lie in such campaign ads.
That way if its an honest mistake it protects the person making the claim yet it reduces the chance of someone with say the Koch brothers level of cash coming in to post lies in order to smear someone with lies.

DesertDiamond

(1,616 posts)
6. An anti-abortion group named after Susan B. Anthony?? Suing for the right to lie?? And winning??? We
Mon Jun 16, 2014, 01:40 PM
Jun 2014

are definitely in the Age of Mappo, where everything is upside down and backwards. We are plunging deeper and deeper into The Rabbit Hole.

former9thward

(31,949 posts)
13. The law was unconstitutional on its face.
Mon Jun 16, 2014, 04:40 PM
Jun 2014

That is why it was not even a close decision. It was unanimous.

 

Chan790

(20,176 posts)
23. Actually, Anthony could be contestibly-argued, not-certainly, to be both pro-life and pro-choice.
Tue Jun 17, 2014, 07:55 PM
Jun 2014

It's clear that she opposed it as a personal decision, as she told her sister-in-law she would come to rue her abortion. That exchange is so straightforward that only the most pretzel logic position could assert it means anything other than what it says.

There's a substantial basis to argue on both sides of the issue...articles that could be interpreted as pro-life but are not explicitly so, her refusal as editor of the The Revolution to run ads for abortifacients, her publication of articles that both argue against having abortions but also against laws prohibiting abortion. Her statements to others including Elizabeth Cady Stanton and Frances Willard seem to infer that she opposed abortion as an oppression of women. Her famous speech, Social Purity. probably provides the best insight into Anthony's position on abortion:

"The prosecutions on our courts for breach of promise, divorce, adultery, bigamy, seduction, rape; the newspaper reports every day of every year of scandals and outrages, of wife murders and paramour shooting, of abortions and infanticides, are perpetual reminders of men's incapacity to cope successfully with this monster evil of society."


That would suggest she opposes abortion as a social evil...she however later in the same speech criticizes legal prohibitions on abortion as a laws written by men to favor men:

"The true relation of the sexes never can be attained until woman is free and equal with man. Neither in the making nor executing of the laws regulating these relations has woman ever had the slightest voice. The statutes for marriage and divorce, for adultery, breach of promise, seduction, rape, bigamy, abortion, infanticide—all were made by men."

_________________________________________________________________________________


Splitting hairs and reading between lines, it's likely that SBA opposed women having abortions (as a moral position, viewing abortion as being a consequence of the oppression of women)...but more strongly opposed laws that restricted autonomy of women. (As a sociopolitical position)

NYC Liberal

(20,135 posts)
17. Good. It's a terrible law that SHOULD be struck down. I don't care who challenges the law
Tue Jun 17, 2014, 12:10 PM
Jun 2014

as long as it's gone.

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