But I still have seven minutes to go!

from the duel. That's what made it so memorable in the books.

[font color=white]
Ellaria: "You're going to fight that?"
Oberyn: "I'm going to kill that!"

[/font]

Hello Ygritte.

and the slaughter there.

What a despicable creature.

this time with Missendei

HBO is putting them in there.

Last edited Mon Jun 2, 2014, 01:58 AM - Edit history (1)

When she has clothes on it's hard to recognize who she is anymore. I also think it's a big mistake with the character because it makes it seem like everything she's accomplished is because she used sex.

I really get annoyed by all the gratuitous sex scenes. There's never any reason for them, and they're nothing but a waste of time better served in the story.

On Edit: Woops! I thought you had said Melissandre, the Red Woman. Their names are so similar.

in the books Missendei is what, 11? And, I think she & Grey Worm are brother & sister.

That's who I thought you meant before - the Red Woman that never seems to have clothes on.

Missendei and Podrick and several other people from what I remember were supposed to be really young in the books.

Grey Worm wasn't one of her brothers though. She had two that were Unsullied but had no contact with them, and you didn't even know if they were still in Astapor and not yet sold or what, but I think you got the impression that they were sold to Dany because it made her so upset when she told Dany that once she didn't need them anymore rather than sell them on again to someone else (that might use them against her) she could have them fall on their swords because that would have meant her two brothers would have to kill themselves as well.

I think it's what also made Dany definitely decide to make them all free men and come with her or not of their own accord since after she didn't need them anymore they'd be free men to do what they wanted and not be sold again but whatever they did after (like if they became sellswords) that because she freed them and they then could live as the liked they'd never lift a hand against her no matter who they worked for. In the books I felt that her freeing them was more two-fold... the obvious one that she hated the idea of slavery but also that freeing them took care of the worry that they could be used against her later. But in the books it was also that Missandei was given to Dany before she made the decision to buy the Unsullied. She also figured at that freeing Missandei was what really bound her to her much more so than if she was just Dany's slave. So, she did know because of that that freeing the Unsullied would also actually bind them to her more as well because of gratitude being stronger than their obedience training.

Tania Raymonde - formerly of Lost - was auditioning for the role of one of the Sand Snakes...

I'm not even sure what they plan on doing with the Sand Snakes since in the books all three of them only had one or two brief scenes. I guess the show will be changing a lot of that. Good, that whole Dorne part was boring as hell. Hopefully what ever changes the show does will make it more interesting. I'm also hoping they just skip all that stuff with the Ironborn. I could barely stand to plow through all of that in the books, and to date they still haven't actually done anything.

of Martin needing a strong editor. The last two books - A Feast for Crows and A Dance with Dragons - probably could have been condensed down into one book with a few characters having several chapters condensed down to only a few. Did we really need a whole chapter of Arianne locked in the tower? Same with Brienne and also Jon Snow. Did we really need all those chapters for each of them? (not to mention Sam's story overlapping to Jon's for a few chapters)

He forgets about the plots and characters already revealed and goes off i other directions making up more that also don't go anywhere. Splitting books 4 and 5 into two by geography and not by time was torture to read, and I still can't believe his publisher allowed it.

In book 4 (A Feast for Crows) which I've been reading over again for like the fourth time and almost done with right now I still breezed through all the chapters about both Dorne and the Ironborn. The first time I read that book I was soooo pissed off that nothing was said about the other characters and plots that he cliffhanged in the previous book. It was almost like reading an entirely different story I didn't give a rat's ass about. If it wasn't for the chapters about Cercei, Jaime, Arya and somewhat with Brianne and John Snow I probably would have just skipped reading it all together.

It also really bothers me that the very first book opens with these mysterious and creepy White Walkers and here we are after book five and we still don't really know much of anything about them, they really haven't been doing much of anything nor do we know what their purpose is or why they've come back after a thousand years or whatever. He needed to move that story along several books ago rather than just mention them casually here and there so you don't forget about them entirely.

With all the characters and plots he keeps adding most of them don't go anywhere, and it's nearly impossible to keep track of them all. And he stretches out a lot of these stories like with Bran and Brienne just traveling while nothing of importance is happening is nearly excruciating to slog through waiting for something to finally happen.

I'm wondering if the show is going to have all the Sand Snakes and leave out Arianne all together having them try bringing Myrcella to the Water Gardens to be crowned. Though I never understood the whole point to crowning her in the first place since it was always apparent that it was a stupid idea. I'm also hoping that the show just skips all the stuff with the Ironborn since none of it meant anything... you already know that Euron's idea of going east after Dany's dragons isn't going to work anyway, so what's the point to going on and on about them.

now

not good

it happened in the book in a similar fashion, if I recall

You are officially removed from the "Friendzone"!

actions have consequences.

I imagine she is going to make mincemeat out of little Robert.

Serious chemistry issue there.

To have gotten all the way to the Gate and with everything she's been through only to find out Lysa's dead. In the books they didn't get anywhere near the Vale.

because the hound lost his payday.

since Ned lost his head to finally arrive at a place of safety only to find out that because of Lysa's death she's really back where she started with no one and nowhere to go. With her and the Hound getting along and actually starting to feel compassion for each other I really doubt that she'd be thrilled with his loss of a payday and a possible place for him to land a job and wouldn't be thinking about it anyway with Lysa's death being such a blow to her own self and her future.

For the first time since she had to run from King's Landing she was finally able to say and be who she was instead of always having to hide and use false names because being discovered as who she was was such a danger to her. You can hear in her voice when she announces who she is both pride and relief to be able to finally say so knowing she was no longer in danger because of it. I think her hysteria laughing was that this was such a full blown body blow as to normally cause someone hysterical tears but it's the irony of it I believe that this realization that all was for naught and only by a mere three days that has her react with hysteria by laughing.

So there is a revenge desire there.

And she suddenly became aware of that while they traveled together yet left him to die of his wounds without giving him the gift of mercy anyway. In the tv show her compassion for him comes during all their traveling after her still naming him in her nightly list... she tries to help him by burning infection from his neck wound, and feels badly for him when he tells her the story of his being burned by his brother in his youth which she had already known and threw in his face before. During this traveling he tries to teach her things and she learns from him. Even when questioned when they reach the Gate that leads to the Erie he names her as his companion acknowledging the change in their relationship.

This didn't happen in the books though. He died from a wound he got back at the inn when she got Needle back a few days after that fight, so they never got anywhere near the Vale. She only realizes that she's not been listing him in her nightly recitations that he was never even aware of anyway. It's only been in tv show that they continue to travel to the Vale together becoming closer to each other. Since it's the show that has their relationship changing to one of sort of grudging friendship I imagine having her laughing when they reach the Gate and find out that Lysa had died just days before has nothing to do with the Hound at all since it was the show that had them continue traveling all through this season all the way to the Gate learning compassion of each other that didn't happen in the books.

I had expected him to die in the first or second episode not realizing the the show would change this part of the story... and probably so that when he does die we'll feel upset by it. I actually prefer the show's version to what happens to them rather than the book version. I also expect that the show changing their relationship and what happens to them will also change her reaction to his dying and give him the gift of mercy that she didn't in the books.

He's sort of a big brother/father figure in Arya's life. Probably more big brother because she does criticize him when he tells her that poison is a woman's way. And his look of disappointment to hear that Lysa was dead, was priceless.

I'm glad the show has opted to take this direction. Though I don't see how Arya and Sansa will fail to meet because I can't see how the Hound would turn around at this juncture. It would make more sense that they proceed up the mountain where he could get medical attention.

it means that Martin must have told the writers that the gravedigger that Brianne notices in A Feast of Crows isn't the Hound (as it's been rumored for some time).

In the books Brienne finds out that the current "Hound" isn't the real one and just some imposter wearing the Hound's helm when they go over the quicksand to that island of religious men, and the leader tells her that he knows the Hound died because he came across him dying in the woods, stayed with him until he died doing what little he could for him and buried him putting his helm on top of the grave as a marker. So he knows the real Hound is dead because he was with him when he died and buried him himself and that someone just picked up his helm from the grave and was wearing it as an imposter. I think the imposter Hound turned out to be Biter though when he bites off half her cheek and breaks her arm when they fought she knew it wasn't the real Hound because that happened after they left that island.

There was a gravedigger in the religious order of men on that island that dug the graves for all of the corpses that washed up on their shore, but he never spoke since they weren't allowed to speak except for one day a week.

I don't know why anyone believes that the silent gravedigger is the real Hound. He died. And Brienne would have noticed his scared face if it was somehow supposed to be him. Sounds like wishful thinkers just wanting to believe the Hound isn't dead.

He is huge (taller than Brienne), is friendly to dogs. and has a limp that corresponds to the injuries he sustained in the fight where Arya left him. Additionally, he is a novice (has only been there a short time), is cowled (so his burns don't show), and his savage unmanageable horse is in the stables, having somehow navigated the treacherous tidal flats.

As for the leader of the abbey, he's pretty clearly dissembling a bit. He repeatedly tells Brienne that "The Hound" and "the man you seek" are dead, but when asked point-blank if Sandor is dead, he replies with "He is at rest." He also knows way more about Sandor's personality and drives than is likely if their only interaction was the death scene he describes, and points out that by the time they met at the Trident, all Cleglane had left to live for was slaying his brother, and even that had been taken from him by Oberyn. Then, he tells her the story of his own circumstances as an angry violent warrior left for dead, starting with "When I died on the Trident", and talking about entering his second life naked. Sandor the Hound is dead, but Sandor the humble penitent is alive.

Plus, on a narrative level, it fits perfectly with the theme of hidden and assumed identities that run throughout both A Feast for Crows and A Dance with Dragons.

do you think they have time to get through all the huge events at the end of A Storm of Swords in just two episodes?

But they already have brought some stories of some characters to that point like with Sansa. I think it's been apparent all season that they've had to stray from the books a lot to keep some stories progressing that didn't in the books.

They already did "Only Cat" and the Mountain/Viper duel, and half of the cast is already onto books 4+5 material. Next week looks like it will cover everything that goes down at the Wall. Seems like there will be plenty of time to tie things up for the season, and leave enough space for the big break-the-internet scene.

Last edited Tue Jun 3, 2014, 09:29 PM - Edit history (2)

to have the ebb & flow of the battle, and the big events that take place afterwards - namely (spoilers) [font color=white]Stannis offering Winterfell to Jon Stark, and then Jon being named Lord Commander. Jon will have to do something to merit being named L-C - on the show, he's sometimes been good sometimes, but kind of incompetent others (losing his sword to Craster, letting Ygritte escape, etc) Can they really do justice to all of that in an hour? Not to mention what happens with Mance Rayder, Ygritte, Tormund, etc. They'll have to have time for Ygritte to utter one last "you know nothing Jon Snow" and for Jon to moon over her. [/font]

Beyond that, you still have:[font color=white]
Jamie's reveal to Tyrion about Tysha
Tyrion escaping
Tyrion killing Shae and Tywin
Lady Stoneheart
Arya boarding the boat to Braavos
[/font]

The band of brothers were aiming to ransom her as well. Nobody was aiming to deliver Arya back to her family out of altruism. I think she just finally snapped from fate continuing to fuck her over.

As already mentioned the Hound and Arya never had this particular scene in the books.

was priceless!

That will define him. He can talk about nothing, and still, we're engrossed with his acting.

He was so concerned yet frustrated by the beetle squishing.

The Mountain stayed on his back, but it was bloody enough where the blood seemed to smoke when Clegane hit him.

one of my favorite scenes in the books.

N/t

Sansa looks totally different with darker hair and in that black dress...

The dark hair, however, is questionable.

but, also that she wants to keep her famous red hair hidden as well.

We've both read the books.

Can't wait for Episode 9. It's going to be fun reading the internets.

is going to focus on The Battle at the Wall.

About time, too. They already spent all last season and then almost all of this one gearing up for it.

Do that highlight thing if you have to.

Littlefinger mentions that people sometimes die while situated on the chamber pot.

I wonder if they'll be able to work in Martin's infamous line, though?

I don't get it.

Sadly, for the Lannisters that source turned out to be bogus. Too bad for them considering they're not only broke but heavily in debt.

"situated on the chamber pot". It sounds almost divinely meadow fresh.

Sigh.

People die in droves this season. I didn't really care so much in the books, but I really liked his character in the tv series.

Actually, for never having acted before I thought the guy playing the Mountain did a good job.

...because otherwise this show would just be depressing!

Littlefinger better be careful he isn't training a Vader to his Obi Wan

Was Tyrion drawing a parallel between the boy squishing bugs and gods? Seems like something a man says to put his own death in perspective. He's a damned good actor. Hope he gets another Emmy for this.

Goodnight, sweet viper. You were pretty cool.

Aria's laugh + the Hound's face when they got punked I was waiting for Ashton Kutcher to jump out of the bushes

are for the Mockingbird, symbols of Petyr Baelish.

The plot thickens.

So I didn't really care when he was killed except for what that meant for Tyrion. I just loved his character in the show though. Even though I knew what was coming I was still sort of hoping things would end differently for him though it would have made a mess of the story.

Up to the very last second i thought there would be a change, but no. I screamed like a banshee and completely lost it. I didn't even do that for the red wedding. Pedro Pascal stole my heart and the Mountain crushed his face. I may never love again.

But I just loved how he played Oberyn. I couldn't even watch his bitter end it was so upsetting. As soon as the Mountain grabbed him I squeezed my eyes shut and didn't open them again until Ellaria screamed.

It was definitely the best fight scene ever though. Now every time I see the regular sword fighting they're going to look really clumsy to me. I want to watch that part again, but I don't think I can stand to see him actually die though.

I'd love it if they could use Pascal again as another character and just make him look different, like maybe Quentyn Martell.

and put on a bit of weight and you have Pascal as Doran Martell.

Of course, I jokingly say that this guy should be Doran:

that look interesting and give you a bit of insight on what the show will be doing with next season...

Possible spoilers in that link...
http://winteriscoming.net/2014/05/23/characters-confirmed-game-thrones-season-5-new-details/

I'm surprised they're giving us three Sand Snakes and Arianne. I figured Ellaria Sand (Indira Varma) would be a stand-in for all the Sand Snakes.

Also, interesting that they have The Waif. But, what about the Kindly Man?

It kind of makes more sense having them combined into one character.

With the addition of the Septa it looks like someone's "walk of shame" will be at the end of season 5, and that came at the end of the last book.

I'm not really sure of the purpose for all the Dorne characters since even in the books there wasn't very much that happened with them particularly the Sand Snakes.

I'm most surprised with the addition of Maggy the Frog since at this point in the show she's really not needed. Then again I expect there would have to be a lot of changes from the books in order to have all the known characters still moving along.

That's something to look forward to.

had 7 or 8 daughters with several different women, so they could literally be just about any ethnicity.

I'm pretty blase about fictional gore, but that was some hideous brutality. Says something for the props and prosthetics team that a flayed corpse was only the second most disgusting special effect of the episode, and by a wide margin too.

But I agree, Pascal was amazing. In the book, you care about the duel for it's role in Tyrion's story, and to see some justice meted out on the Mountain and Tywin, but Oberyn himself isn't that compelling. Pascal made him into a character you care about for his own sake.

I heard about how gorey Oberyn's death was, and I'm glad I didn't see it. I did see the flayed man and wish I hadn't. Ugh.

what happened in the show to what happened in the books. As someone who has read the books but forgets a lot of the detail, I really appreciate this. Sharing:

http://www.wired.com/2014/06/game-of-thrones-recap-8/

good information there.

I expected there would be more of them for this scene though.

12 minutes long... Dotrice makes Oberyn sound Scottish, though.

I liked Oberyn. One thing about this series I do like is that I never know what to expect. I didn't think Joffrey would die so soon. The red wedding, of course, was very unexpected. Most stories have the good guys win and the bad guys get what they deserve. Martin doesn't appear to be following the typical structure. A lot more good are dying than bad. While I don't like seeing characters I sympathize with die, I do like the departure from the norm. In real life a lot of bad things happen to good people, and sometimes the bad guys do win. Reality is no fairy tale and Game of Thrones certainly isn't either.

Ned Stark was the honest & noble hero who should have triumphed in the end. But, he got his head chopped off.

Then, his son should have risen up to avenge his father's death, but then Robb Stark died, too.

And, people that should have had valiant, noble deaths like Robert Baratheon, Khal Drogo, and a few others, end up going out in decidedly unheroic ways.

there really are no winners.