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Tobin S.

(10,418 posts)
Sat Dec 27, 2014, 04:46 PM Dec 2014

I don't know what the hell is wrong with DU right now.

Last edited Sun Dec 28, 2014, 09:46 AM - Edit history (1)

*****ATTENTION: THIS IS POSTED IN THE AFRICAN-AMERICAN GROUP*****

It doesn't look like it is possible to talk about black issues right now without spawning a barrage of threads bemoaning racism against white folks. I have been a member of DU for a long time and I don't remember a time before now when there was basically a virtual race war going on in GD. I'd like to think that it was mostly due to trolls, but I know that's not the case.

*White people here do not seem to understand that without the black community the Democratic party is powerless*

That fact alone should make white liberals very open to and understanding of black issues. However, ignorance abounds basically because people can't open their minds long enough to listen and consider ideas that are probably foreign to them. Yes, that takes effort.

I do not have the solutions to solve all of the problems regarding race in America. I do know one thing, though. As a white person it is very important for me to have an open mind on the issue. What that basically means for me is shutting up about it and really listening to black people. I wish more white people would do the same, but apparently it's too much to ask.
331 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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I don't know what the hell is wrong with DU right now. (Original Post) Tobin S. Dec 2014 OP
Black folks here have been the long dead canaries in the DU coal mine ... 1StrongBlackMan Dec 2014 #1
I think that many of us white folks are shutting up about and really reading the posts of JDPriestly Dec 2014 #7
+1 nt steve2470 Dec 2014 #9
+ another Scuba Dec 2014 #49
+100. Thanks for listening with an open-mind! Nt Anansi1171 Dec 2014 #103
No, I'm on board with you BOTH! cilla4progress Dec 2014 #2
Message auto-removed Name removed Dec 2014 #75
Message auto-removed Name removed Dec 2014 #196
Because someone is Black that doesn't upaloopa Dec 2014 #3
Holy shit! Tobin S. Dec 2014 #4
You don't know shit about me. upaloopa Dec 2014 #11
I haven't claimed to know anything about you! Tobin S. Dec 2014 #15
His opinion. Your reaction makes it truth. nt TeamPooka Dec 2014 #22
DingDingding We have a winner! Upaloopa - you just proved the OP's point. Tommymac Dec 2014 #48
No jumping on the couch! marym625 Dec 2014 #119
Sorry Mom. Got a bit carried away. Tommymac Dec 2014 #128
OK then marym625 Dec 2014 #129
Actually, you start to get to know someone with 5,500+ posts. We're getting to know each other. marble falls Dec 2014 #79
Thank you for your OP JustAnotherGen Dec 2014 #52
Right.. who knew.. a perfect example would pop up on this thread? Cha Dec 2014 #63
Like this one? JustAnotherGen Dec 2014 #66
Precisely, Gen.. it never fails. They cannot help themselves, even in the AA Group. It's all about Cha Dec 2014 #67
You hit it on the nose there, racism is a white and white ONLY problem in america and most white randys1 Dec 2014 #106
+ ellenrr Dec 2014 #84
As you see/will see ... 1StrongBlackMan Dec 2014 #151
You saw it too eh? JustAnotherGen Dec 2014 #170
They may know more about black issues than you do though. bravenak Dec 2014 #6
I warned him brave - no more "shut up" or he will be blocked JustAnotherGen Dec 2014 #53
Good. bravenak Dec 2014 #57
You are posting in a group, brer cat Dec 2014 #8
I didn't piss on anyone's thread. upaloopa Dec 2014 #13
Your responses in this thread BainsBane Dec 2014 #16
Your words are right there for everyone to see, you certainly did pee in this thread, & this GROUP. Raine1967 Dec 2014 #39
Let me make this clear: You don't speak for me. and as far as a 'blanket description': Raine1967 Dec 2014 #45
You most certainly did JustAnotherGen Dec 2014 #54
Yes you did, for everyone to see. sheshe2 Dec 2014 #71
As opposed to your blanket references to black people, ie: "them"? Your problem is the correct .... marble falls Dec 2014 #81
You just go on and on heaven05 Dec 2014 #121
What does that even mean? notadmblnd Dec 2014 #14
Wow how disrspectful to OP! This is exactly what he was talking about. ncjustice80 Dec 2014 #23
Group Host weighing in JustAnotherGen Dec 2014 #50
Just one point this is a specific forum for sanctuary from the general still_one Dec 2014 #158
two kinds of trolls: paid and unpaid steve2470 Dec 2014 #5
Wish I could rec your posting yuiyoshida Dec 2014 #12
the same goes for Asian-American related threads steve2470 Dec 2014 #35
Plus 1000 JustAnotherGen Dec 2014 #55
The listening and learning part BainsBane Dec 2014 #17
yep I agree nt steve2470 Dec 2014 #28
seriously BlancheSplanchnik Dec 2014 #36
Many paid trolls all over the internet, and their main job is to get Democrats NOT to vote in 2016 randys1 Dec 2014 #108
I don't believe it for a minute. Agschmid Dec 2014 #163
they call into liberal radio shows ALL the time, they are here too randys1 Dec 2014 #167
Yup and they are called assholes, they aren't paid trolls. Agschmid Dec 2014 #189
Thom Hartmann is the one who asserted it, and I agree. Maybe he would know more randys1 Dec 2014 #202
I'm saying they don't need to pay to do it... Agschmid Dec 2014 #203
I agree but I listen to tons and tons of liberal talk radio and hear the same 7 or 8 voices randys1 Dec 2014 #205
+1000 heaven05 Dec 2014 #124
That's kinda true for many topics jeff47 Dec 2014 #10
WTF!?!? It's raining! marble falls Dec 2014 #82
It's almost as if people going on a political chat want to chat about politics... kioa Dec 2014 #105
I just did a test post on class warfare and got some denials. Spitfire of ATJ Dec 2014 #18
Don't worry..... DeSwiss Dec 2014 #19
Shut up and just listen War Horse Dec 2014 #20
Where is the barrage of threads bemoaning black-on-white racism? Doctor_J Dec 2014 #21
What's this about? bravenak Dec 2014 #25
I saw the thread on the Greatest page, clicked on it, and would like to be pointed to some of the Doctor_J Dec 2014 #29
Ok. bravenak Dec 2014 #32
Since you're here BainsBane Dec 2014 #41
No racism here at DU, just white privileged people pretending racism doesnt exist... randys1 Dec 2014 #110
Exactly and they are using pretzel logic to rationalize their position. Debating it, is futile. Tuesday Afternoon Dec 2014 #125
Go back to February 2014 JustAnotherGen Dec 2014 #60
Well, the OP seemed to indicate a very recent torrent of busy, blatantly racist threads Doctor_J Dec 2014 #156
What the hell are you talking about? Where is the black on white RACISM that you whining about? Number23 Dec 2014 #174
take a look DonCoquixote Dec 2014 #272
How do you know the Color of a person on DU? Cryptoad Dec 2014 #24
Self identification. bravenak Dec 2014 #27
Self proclamation still has not meaning......you can say you are anything.... Cryptoad Dec 2014 #33
Who pretends to be black for fun and continues while getting trolled everyday by name removed? bravenak Dec 2014 #38
name removed lol rbrnmw Dec 2014 #152
I always imagine this guy. bravenak Dec 2014 #154
LOL rbrnmw Dec 2014 #161
hahahahahaha Cali_Democrat Dec 2014 #268
Don't feed the trolls. They're not worth it. They're like talk radio or shit on a dinner plate. valerief Dec 2014 #232
I agree steve2470 Dec 2014 #236
She's black JustAnotherGen Dec 2014 #58
Well, I chose my screen-name for pure sh!ts and giggles ... 1StrongBlackMan Dec 2014 #155
Me? JustAnotherGen Dec 2014 #159
Crypto's not talking about posts in the AA group. And neither was the OP Doctor_J Dec 2014 #34
Because I'm mean? bravenak Dec 2014 #37
A Trusting Soul......... Cryptoad Dec 2014 #40
Are you talking about me? bravenak Dec 2014 #42
You are marym625 Dec 2014 #51
Thank you. bravenak Dec 2014 #56
+ 1,000,000,000... What You Said !!! WillyT Dec 2014 #26
a lot of that stuff would have been shut down by mods. mopinko Dec 2014 #30
You bring up a huge problem Fred Friendlier Dec 2014 #31
Wow, way to throw a jab in at atheists, there. F4lconF16 Dec 2014 #78
White ATHEISTS are the problem? WTF randys1 Dec 2014 #111
I don't know about "atheists"; but, they are certainly ... 1StrongBlackMan Dec 2014 #162
As a white atheist I see no truth in your proclamation that we are the problem justiceischeap Dec 2014 #285
Yea, damned atheists. LiberalAndProud Dec 2014 #311
Ridiculous deflection. Feral Child Dec 2014 #319
Well said. The Velveteen Ocelot Dec 2014 #43
I am not easily discouraged. :) bravenak Dec 2014 #44
Good. "Don't let the bastards grind you down," as the old saying goes. The Velveteen Ocelot Dec 2014 #46
I have learned the most by making false assumptions over and over and having randys1 Dec 2014 #113
Melissa Harris Perry offered the following ... 1StrongBlackMan Dec 2014 #164
We can confront it gwheezie Dec 2014 #47
Can you edit OP? JustAnotherGen Dec 2014 #59
Will do. n/t Tobin S. Dec 2014 #86
That will go a long way to stopping nonsense JustAnotherGen Dec 2014 #87
seriously do DonCoquixote Dec 2014 #253
"What that basically means for me is shutting up about it and really listening to black people." Cha Dec 2014 #61
I think suggesting that anyone needs to 'shut up' because of race to be condescending at best. kioa Dec 2014 #91
When the one person is trying to have his/her opinion ... 1StrongBlackMan Dec 2014 #165
Thank you. Cha Dec 2014 #169
The DU LGBT community has gone through this animus on DU and sometimes people justiceischeap Dec 2014 #286
I agree Tobin S. that listening and learning is essential. lovemydog Dec 2014 #62
is this about the d_b Dec 2014 #64
Nope - a pattern of behavior that is rotten to the core JustAnotherGen Dec 2014 #65
Mahalo for the links, Gen. Cha Dec 2014 #68
Its the polite racist that are the dangerous ones. I learned about racism at the feet of my..... marble falls Dec 2014 #85
LOL ... 1StrongBlackMan Dec 2014 #166
I lived at W45th and Lorain and 140th and Puritas. In the 1950's and early 60's. Kids have to be.... marble falls Dec 2014 #168
Jesus...i am so sorry you had to experience that. randys1 Dec 2014 #325
That's just it ... 1StrongBlackMan Dec 2014 #327
since a certain person asked where to find examples DonCoquixote Dec 2014 #271
He trashed the thread JustAnotherGen Dec 2014 #273
of course DonCoquixote Dec 2014 #274
I have just read through your links and.... Spazito Dec 2014 #290
I took the time to read thru your links, JAG. Thanks for putting the post together Hekate Dec 2014 #313
I have been staying away from the threads marym625 Dec 2014 #69
I came back to DU to have a look around and I'm just sickened. myrna minx Dec 2014 #70
"shutting up...and really listening to black people". It's really that simple. Mister Ed Dec 2014 #72
they won;t say it DonCoquixote Dec 2014 #73
No, I think more accurately ... 1StrongBlackMan Dec 2014 #171
Message auto-removed Name removed Dec 2014 #74
Message auto-removed Name removed Dec 2014 #76
Well Tobin there is a real problem here Kalidurga Dec 2014 #77
swearing isn't allowed here? marym625 Dec 2014 #122
In real life I have been told that I cus bad enough to make a sailor blush Kalidurga Dec 2014 #142
This message was self-deleted by its author Corruption Inc Dec 2014 #80
Even if there were a lot of posts like that here (which I have not seen) Tobin S. Dec 2014 #89
Words only carry what power we give them. kioa Dec 2014 #95
That's not exactly what I said. Tobin S. Dec 2014 #97
You wrote the OP. If you don't want people to listen to you, you're going about it in an odd manner. kioa Dec 2014 #98
Welcome to being black in America JustAnotherGen Dec 2014 #100
Did I do something wrong? If so, say what it is. kioa Dec 2014 #102
You might want to read through the the first pae of posts in this group JustAnotherGen Dec 2014 #107
You made an issue specifically with MY comment & by extension with me. kioa Dec 2014 #109
I never told you to shut up JustAnotherGen Dec 2014 #112
You engaged me. If you have a problem with anything I have said, please, say so. kioa Dec 2014 #118
This is enough JustAnotherGen Dec 2014 #120
Very well. Lets take a step back. kioa Dec 2014 #126
You are not understanding the op. bravenak Dec 2014 #127
At no time have I ever kioa Dec 2014 #130
That's because the op is not about you. bravenak Dec 2014 #132
Because statements addressed to the public.... kioa Dec 2014 #136
Hey, guess what? bravenak Dec 2014 #137
Strange. The OP telling others to "shut up" doesn't address me. kioa Dec 2014 #141
Hey! bravenak Dec 2014 #144
"shutting up" is NOT the point of OP. heaven05 Dec 2014 #143
You are demonstrating your views on race BainsBane Dec 2014 #267
I have zero problem with you JustAnotherGen Dec 2014 #131
Your first sentence of your post and the first sentence of your final paragraph directly contradict kioa Dec 2014 #135
Your participation is up for review JustAnotherGen Dec 2014 #140
Do you realize gollygee Dec 2014 #180
you are so obviously not listening to what other posters are telling you fishwax Dec 2014 #270
The point is to listen BainsBane Dec 2014 #265
you were never told, specifically, to shut up heaven05 Dec 2014 #139
There is a collection of letters though heaven05 Dec 2014 #138
Those are absolutely descriptions of 300 years of abuse. kioa Dec 2014 #146
well good heaven05 Dec 2014 #147
I think my original statement was fairly bland & self apparent. kioa Dec 2014 #148
your original statement heaven05 Dec 2014 #149
You're right. He didn't tell one person to "shut up". He told many people to "shut up" kioa Dec 2014 #150
"shut up" = white people need to listen and learn steve2470 Dec 2014 #153
I simply made the very simple statement that kioa Dec 2014 #157
what you were doing with this dead-horse beating Kali Dec 2014 #186
I did JustAnotherGen Dec 2014 #201
Yeah, you were way to kind to that one... giftedgirl77 Dec 2014 #257
what are you talking about? rbrnmw Dec 2014 #185
I don't agree with your assessment of DU. yes there are racists, ellenrr Dec 2014 #83
It's not just about the recent conflicts with the police Tobin S. Dec 2014 #90
Someone alerted on this thread? JustAnotherGen Dec 2014 #93
Yes. I got a PM about it. Tobin S. Dec 2014 #94
well, I'll defer to you, bec. I haven't been a regular poster for very long. I think ellenrr Dec 2014 #96
They haven't been though JustAnotherGen Dec 2014 #99
I think it's bad enough to have racist posts anywhere on DU, but there are special ellenrr Dec 2014 #104
I've been a host here for awhile JustAnotherGen Dec 2014 #114
Appreciate that. I'm glad to be here. I'll probably read more than write, ellenrr Dec 2014 #115
I agree with his assessment JustAnotherGen Dec 2014 #92
The simple truth about this place is there is a large group of rightwingers, who post in certain randys1 Dec 2014 #116
I think if you complain in Ask the Admin JustAnotherGen Dec 2014 #117
Funny ... 1StrongBlackMan Dec 2014 #173
I bet HE was! JustAnotherGen Dec 2014 #176
Perhaps ... 1StrongBlackMan Dec 2014 #177
Well it's not childish if it's true! JustAnotherGen Dec 2014 #179
lol rbrnmw Dec 2014 #182
& now that his posting priveleges have been revoked... giftedgirl77 Dec 2014 #318
LOL ... 1StrongBlackMan Dec 2014 #324
that is so not true about you rbrnmw Dec 2014 #181
Thanks ... 1StrongBlackMan Dec 2014 #184
You have no such history gollygee Dec 2014 #187
Perhaps, but the fabricated B.S. got the hide. n/t 1StrongBlackMan Dec 2014 #188
Yes ... 1StrongBlackMan Dec 2014 #172
It's out there, ellen. Feral Child Dec 2014 #320
WOW!!! bravenak Dec 2014 #323
It was your posts that made me look Feral Child Dec 2014 #326
Message auto-removed Name removed Dec 2014 #88
There are members of the white community who have taken their privilege for granted. Baitball Blogger Dec 2014 #101
The problem abelenkpe Dec 2014 #123
+1 bravenak Dec 2014 #133
Message auto-removed Name removed Dec 2014 #134
Great discussion heaven05 Dec 2014 #145
And made it all about those two words JustAnotherGen Dec 2014 #160
Thanks, Tobin. Though this will fall on deaf ears like so many other OPs imploring people to get out Number23 Dec 2014 #175
I use to trash the threads and was not going to comment rbrnmw Dec 2014 #183
"White people here do not seem to understand that without the black community the Democratic party Number23 Dec 2014 #178
Agreed ferverently with all you said. And they are shameless and refuse to listen. freshwest Dec 2014 #194
Message auto-removed Name removed Dec 2014 #198
Well said, Number23! Spazito Dec 2014 #291
Yes yes yes Hekate Dec 2014 #314
Message auto-removed Name removed Dec 2014 #190
Hopefully you'll be out of here before you get a chance to even see my post Number23 Dec 2014 #191
lol, thanks to that (deleted) poster, who in the last paragraph, ellenrr Dec 2014 #192
Damn. I feel neglected! n/t 1StrongBlackMan Dec 2014 #266
oh you didn't make the list? ellenrr Dec 2014 #278
Where have I seen this before? JustAnotherGen Dec 2014 #199
You've read that here at least twice before from other one post wonders. marble falls Dec 2014 #200
I think I know who that is rbrnmw Dec 2014 #204
Thanks for preserving this post. I always want to see the Name Removed posts. kwassa Dec 2014 #208
" I wonder if this is our old friend .... now on vacation." Number23 Dec 2014 #218
There is no jury mechanism to reveal a pattern of abuse .... kwassa Dec 2014 #221
DU will be "saved" by "making it open to more conservative views"?! Hekate Dec 2014 #315
the Carlton Banks thing was such a joke JI7 Dec 2014 #193
Message auto-removed Name removed Dec 2014 #195
Message auto-removed Name removed Dec 2014 #197
It is getting worse by the hour...Why is this alleged liberal message board dominated randys1 Dec 2014 #206
Did you happen to see this Op posted in AA just a few minutes ago? bravenak Dec 2014 #207
that guy came from Stormfront-lite (Discussionist) or the real Stormfront steve2470 Dec 2014 #209
I think so too. bravenak Dec 2014 #210
You are being attacked by long time members of DU, why shouldnt rightwing racists from randys1 Dec 2014 #212
Name removed is the most prolific poster right now. bravenak Dec 2014 #216
OK, now "name removed" is not one poster, right? "name removed" is racist after randys1 Dec 2014 #223
Yeah Randy, you so funny! bravenak Dec 2014 #224
yes they post junk about DU steve2470 Dec 2014 #217
Oh, god... bravenak Dec 2014 #219
Dear god no, where is this? Is it hidden already? randys1 Dec 2014 #211
Why would you assume that was sarcasm? Do you think someone posted that ironically Number23 Dec 2014 #213
I meant when I started to read it I thought it was, it was so outlandish, so racist randys1 Dec 2014 #214
They believe it, Randy. They do Number23 Dec 2014 #220
Blaming racial divide in American on Black people is like randys1 Dec 2014 #226
It is hidden. bravenak Dec 2014 #215
Holy crap! gollygee Dec 2014 #222
Umm hmm, proof baby!!! bravenak Dec 2014 #225
OMG bravenek rbrnmw Dec 2014 #227
I was actually mildly surprised at the boldness. bravenak Dec 2014 #228
I am just so sick of the shit rbrnmw Dec 2014 #229
I am just so USED to this shit. bravenak Dec 2014 #230
being use to it doesn't make it any less sickening though rbrnmw Dec 2014 #231
So true. bravenak Dec 2014 #233
I don't think it's nerve. I think it's deperation and fear, knowing their time has passed. arcane1 Dec 2014 #238
Post removed Post removed Dec 2014 #235
Because you care about DU so much after one day? bravenak Dec 2014 #237
Message auto-removed Name removed Dec 2014 #239
I'm glad I'm not forced to read DU posts. arcane1 Dec 2014 #240
That goes both ways now don't it? bravenak Dec 2014 #241
Message auto-removed Name removed Dec 2014 #243
You're oppressing me right now. bravenak Dec 2014 #244
Message auto-removed Name removed Dec 2014 #251
Did you just call me a nigger? bravenak Dec 2014 #252
I need to step away for an hour or 2 rbrnmw Dec 2014 #259
I know. bravenak Dec 2014 #261
Journal - did you just call me a nigger JustAnotherGen Dec 2014 #275
These people are a trip!! bravenak Dec 2014 #276
No - but I will look later JustAnotherGen Dec 2014 #279
I noticed that too this summer. bravenak Dec 2014 #280
They don't seem to be too fond of anyone marym625 Dec 2014 #289
Never!! bravenak Dec 2014 #292
totally get that! marym625 Dec 2014 #293
.... bravenak Dec 2014 #294
Well you know I have to marym625 Dec 2014 #295
bravenak, sorry to break in here, off topic Feral Child Dec 2014 #322
Awesome. I never use those words even in private circles. I hate hate and hate words. Elmer S. E. Dump Apr 2015 #328
Me too!! I hate them so much. bravenak Apr 2015 #329
Seems there will always be 2 types of people in this world Elmer S. E. Dump Apr 2015 #330
Yes we do. bravenak Apr 2015 #331
For the first time in history, white men are expected to treat non-whites and women with civility arcane1 Dec 2014 #246
I do not understand the anger at not being special anymore. bravenak Dec 2014 #249
I think it's hard for them to accept being equal to people they thought were inferior to them arcane1 Dec 2014 #254
A great deal of self-loathing is required too. Comfortable people don't act this way. arcane1 Dec 2014 #296
I'm thinking our friend ain't much to look at. bravenak Dec 2014 #298
Message auto-removed Name removed Dec 2014 #303
Message auto-removed Name removed Dec 2014 #256
Message auto-removed Name removed Dec 2014 #283
Another one!!! bravenak Dec 2014 #284
And they continue to prove my point. arcane1 Dec 2014 #297
Stupidest people in the world. bravenak Dec 2014 #299
There is definitely an undercurrent of sexual insecurity/envy in many of those posts. arcane1 Dec 2014 #300
For suuure. bravenak Dec 2014 #301
It's weird how obsessed they are with the inherent awesomeness of black men. bravenak Dec 2014 #304
Message auto-removed Name removed Dec 2014 #305
I feel like I have my own TMZ. bravenak Dec 2014 #306
Message auto-removed Name removed Dec 2014 #307
Lol! bravenak Dec 2014 #308
Message auto-removed Name removed Dec 2014 #309
I'm taking a nap, so, see you at 3, lol!! bravenak Dec 2014 #310
Message auto-removed Name removed Dec 2014 #302
who says only whites can be racist? Have you a good what privilege means? "for the sake of du"???? uppityperson Dec 2014 #242
Message auto-removed Name removed Dec 2014 #245
You poor thang!! bravenak Dec 2014 #247
And to save DU!!!1 arcane1 Dec 2014 #248
Hahahahahaha!!!! bravenak Dec 2014 #250
Another one preserved for posterity. It's acting on me like a purgative... Hekate Dec 2014 #316
So many people actually refuse to believe things could be so bad for other human beings. Dont call me Shirley Dec 2014 #234
side note DonCoquixote Dec 2014 #255
wow, it seems like Stormfront emptied their sewers to troll this thread steve2470 Dec 2014 #258
Indeed, and MIRT is ON FIRE! They're PPR'ed before I even realize they've replied to me arcane1 Dec 2014 #260
yes MIRT rocks!!!! steve2470 Dec 2014 #263
The MIR team did a fantastic job this weekend too! JustAnotherGen Dec 2014 #277
maybe more people than you realize are doing that. Jackpine Radical Dec 2014 #262
Unfortunately, the ones that aren't marym625 Dec 2014 #264
That's no doubt true. Jackpine Radical Dec 2014 #287
For me as well marym625 Dec 2014 #288
KICK & REC! Feral Child Dec 2014 #269
Fantastic OP. Thanks for writing it. riqster Dec 2014 #281
Rec before, kicking now... MrScorpio Dec 2014 #282
I do think that the ignorant asses (i.e. trolls of the internet) Bill USA Dec 2014 #312
++ ellenrr Dec 2014 #321
KnR for a better New Year here Hekate Dec 2014 #317
 

1StrongBlackMan

(31,849 posts)
1. Black folks here have been the long dead canaries in the DU coal mine ...
Sat Dec 27, 2014, 04:58 PM
Dec 2014

what you are observing is what Black folks on DU have long been lamenting.

I do not have the solutions to solve all of the problems regarding race in America. I do know one thing, though. As a white person it is very important for me to have an open mind on the issue. What that basically means for me is shutting up about it and really listening to black people. I wish more white people would do the same, but apparently it's too much to ask.


That would go a long way to resolving the race problems in America.

ETA: Now ... Brace yourself ... you guilt ridden race traitor!

JDPriestly

(57,936 posts)
7. I think that many of us white folks are shutting up about and really reading the posts of
Sat Dec 27, 2014, 05:29 PM
Dec 2014

our black contributors.

That said.

The posts that are offending our black brothers and sisters on DU are, since the rest of us are just reading and "listening" posted by people who have not yet worked through or recognized their own inner conflicts about racism.

As I have said many times, we are increasingly a society that is not just white and black but rather a society of people of mixed race.

And when people start checking out their DNA, they are likely to discover to what extent they, as Americans are already of mixed race. So many Americans think they are just one race but actually have ancestors of other races.

Please understand that most white people just don't know what to do about racism. It's like a cultural wave, a tsunami that reaches us and touches us all but that is beyond the control of the individual. It's an aching problem for many of us. It is an opportunity to be cruel for a great many. It is an issue to ignore for most.

But the offensive posts on DU do not reflect the majority view of whites on DU who just feel powerless at the hate and lack of understanding.

cilla4progress

(24,588 posts)
2. No, I'm on board with you BOTH!
Sat Dec 27, 2014, 05:04 PM
Dec 2014

I haven't read the threads you are discussing, but it pisses me off to think of white people not recognizing white privilege. It sounds like this is what you are referring to.

I think we need to have in this country, as they did in S. Africa, a "Truth and Reconciliation Commission" for African-Americans, Native Americans, and other ethnic groups that have sustained foul oppression on coming here.

Reparations? Yes, should be seriously weighed.

I think until we face our demons and own up to our treatment of ethnic minorities in this country, there will always be rot at the center of our democracy.

Response to cilla4progress (Reply #2)

Response to cilla4progress (Reply #2)

upaloopa

(11,417 posts)
3. Because someone is Black that doesn't
Sat Dec 27, 2014, 05:07 PM
Dec 2014

mean they are infallible. Shut up if you want to but don't run other's lives for them.

Tobin S.

(10,418 posts)
4. Holy shit!
Sat Dec 27, 2014, 05:17 PM
Dec 2014

Well, I'm a trucker from Indiana. I have enough of a problem running my own life to be concerned about yours.

Nobody said anything about anyone being perfect. The main problem is that a lot of white people aren't open enough to consider black issues without getting defensive, as you have perfectly illustrated.

upaloopa

(11,417 posts)
11. You don't know shit about me.
Sat Dec 27, 2014, 05:58 PM
Dec 2014

Your blanket statements and definition of me after only a few words shows your inability to deal with reality.
You feel good saying what you want fine but realize it is your opinion not truth.

Tobin S.

(10,418 posts)
15. I haven't claimed to know anything about you!
Sat Dec 27, 2014, 06:05 PM
Dec 2014

You seem to be the one have a hard time dealing with reality. I have definitely struck a nerve here. I know that's true.

You have a problem with me asking white people to open their minds to what black people have to say. That's definitely true. That's real.

Tommymac

(7,263 posts)
48. DingDingding We have a winner! Upaloopa - you just proved the OP's point.
Sat Dec 27, 2014, 07:47 PM
Dec 2014

Have an Exciting and Interesting New Year!

JustAnotherGen

(31,683 posts)
66. Like this one?
Sat Dec 27, 2014, 09:46 PM
Dec 2014
upaloopa (5,572 posts)
3. Because someone is Black that doesn't

mean they are infallible. Shut up if you want to but don't run other's lives for them.


And this one?


In the discussion thread: I don't know what the hell is wrong with DU right now. [View all]
Response to Tobin S. (Reply #4)Sat Dec 27, 2014, 04:58 PM
upaloopa (5,572 posts)
11. You don't know shit about me.

Your blanket statements and definition of me after only a few words shows your inability to deal with reality.
You feel good saying what you want fine but realize it is your opinion not truth.

Cha

(295,917 posts)
67. Precisely, Gen.. it never fails. They cannot help themselves, even in the AA Group. It's all about
Sat Dec 27, 2014, 09:57 PM
Dec 2014

them and how infallible they are.

randys1

(16,286 posts)
106. You hit it on the nose there, racism is a white and white ONLY problem in america and most white
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 11:59 AM
Dec 2014

folks in america, including liberals, are so selfish when it comes to guarding white privilege, and to some extent this even applies to liberal whites like myself and others here.

We were born with a privilege that is so encompassing that we cant see it ourselves and yet it is glaringly obvious to the non white Americans.

 

1StrongBlackMan

(31,849 posts)
151. As you see/will see ...
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 03:35 PM
Dec 2014

every mention of any Black injustice will be met with a chorus of white DUers that take it as an accusation directed at them personally.

 

bravenak

(34,648 posts)
6. They may know more about black issues than you do though.
Sat Dec 27, 2014, 05:26 PM
Dec 2014

So, infallible or not, we know about our issues than you so rather than be nasty in the African American group, you can politely not accuse posters in this group of trying to run YOUR life. This is a group, not a forum.

brer cat

(24,401 posts)
8. You are posting in a group,
Sat Dec 27, 2014, 05:31 PM
Dec 2014

not GD. If you can't be civil and respectful, you don't need to be here. There was absolutely no need to piss on Tobin S's thread.





upaloopa

(11,417 posts)
13. I didn't piss on anyone's thread.
Sat Dec 27, 2014, 06:01 PM
Dec 2014

This blanket description of White people is what is wrong with so much here at DU.
Unless you get in line behind all the condemnations you are pissing on someone.

Raine1967

(11,589 posts)
39. Your words are right there for everyone to see, you certainly did pee in this thread, & this GROUP.
Sat Dec 27, 2014, 07:18 PM
Dec 2014


Let me quote you:

This blanket description of White people is what is wrong with so much here at DU.
Unless you get in line behind all the condemnations you are pissing on someone.



You just made the point that the OP was making.

and you clearly aren't aware that he wasn't talking about all white people on DU. You sure don't speak for me, so stop acting like you do, please.

Raine1967

(11,589 posts)
45. Let me make this clear: You don't speak for me. and as far as a 'blanket description':
Sat Dec 27, 2014, 07:37 PM
Dec 2014

Who appointed you the spokesperson for white people??

sheshe2

(83,341 posts)
71. Yes you did, for everyone to see.
Sat Dec 27, 2014, 10:30 PM
Dec 2014

This is a group not a forum, take a deep breath control your emotions and post here nicely. If not don't post in AA go to GD.

As for the blanket description of White people being wrong?

I didn't piss on anyone's thread.


This blanket description of White people is what is wrong with so much here at DU.
Unless you get in line behind all the condemnations you are pissing on someone.


I am white, never thought for a minute someone tossed a blanket over me. Analyze this 101. Why is it you feel this way?



marble falls

(56,358 posts)
81. As opposed to your blanket references to black people, ie: "them"? Your problem is the correct ....
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 09:17 AM
Dec 2014

pronoun is "us". That we aren't "us" yet isn't that they've stayed out, but they've been kept out, and because we haven't had much history of listening and hearing, and too much history reacting and shouting back.

I've always known that there were enough racists out there that if a job or apartment were open to me and any black person in the world, it was almost always going to fall my way. Someone with white privilege was going to make the choice and me by virtue of being white was benefiting by my own white privilege.

Didn't want it, didn't ask for it, didn't even realize what it was until too, too recently. Look at my posting now, I get it and I am working hard to be 'us'.

 

heaven05

(18,124 posts)
121. You just go on and on
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 12:47 PM
Dec 2014

being transparently WRONG. DU is fine, the AA group is fine, you're not.

notadmblnd

(23,720 posts)
14. What does that even mean?
Sat Dec 27, 2014, 06:02 PM
Dec 2014

Just remember, if you choose to not be part of the solution, then you are a part of the problem and your participating in this conversation IMO, will benefit no one.

JustAnotherGen

(31,683 posts)
50. Group Host weighing in
Sat Dec 27, 2014, 07:50 PM
Dec 2014

Dont tell anyone else to "shut up" or I'm blocking you.

Play nice.

This is the AA Group - take what you need and leave the rest.

still_one

(91,963 posts)
158. Just one point this is a specific forum for sanctuary from the general
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 04:08 PM
Dec 2014

Discussion board to allow like minded folks to discuss issues. The Hillary group should not have anti Hillary folks in discussions in that group as an example

steve2470

(37,457 posts)
5. two kinds of trolls: paid and unpaid
Sat Dec 27, 2014, 05:23 PM
Dec 2014

I'm very confident there's at least one paid troll on DU, because it just makes sense from the RNC perspective. Probably more than that. From a conservative and Republican point of view, why not disrupt the largest Democratic Party-oriented (not endorsed or affiliated, of course) on the internet ?

Unpaid trolls, plenty of them. They love to argue (not discuss), be snarky, be disrespectful, get people hidden, and in extreme cases get people PPR'ed. From what I've seen, they are 100% white (or that's what they claim). It was interesting who did not rec my giant thread about welcoming black people back to DU and who did not comment. It's interesting who NEVER recs or positively comments in racism-related threads. It's interesting who never starts a positive racism-related thread. One can judge for oneself from all pieces of evidence.

I'm a white guy also. I also believe in listening and learning. I'm still learning about cultural appropriation versus cultural assimilation, so I'm not commenting on those threads. What I do know is, we white people need to be respectful and listen. We always need to be respectful. You're a good guy, Tobin, and I'm glad you're here. Some of the other white people, imho, need to leave DU. If one cannot respect black people, one needs to leave DU and leave the Democratic Party. It's just that simple.

yuiyoshida

(41,762 posts)
12. Wish I could rec your posting
Sat Dec 27, 2014, 05:59 PM
Dec 2014

and agree with what was being said by Tobin-san as well kanzen ni doi suru!!(I totally agree!!)

steve2470

(37,457 posts)
35. the same goes for Asian-American related threads
Sat Dec 27, 2014, 07:09 PM
Dec 2014

We of European ancestry need to listen and learn, and be respectful above all.

BainsBane

(53,003 posts)
17. The listening and learning part
Sat Dec 27, 2014, 06:14 PM
Dec 2014

Is what they refuse to do. We have had many threads telling feminists they don't do feminism right. Now we have one telling black people they don't do blackness right. The hubris is incredible.

randys1

(16,286 posts)
108. Many paid trolls all over the internet, and their main job is to get Democrats NOT to vote in 2016
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 12:04 PM
Dec 2014

but they also like to fan the flames of racism, they are employed by vicious and disgusting racist pig fucks, teaparty, etc.

Agschmid

(28,749 posts)
163. I don't believe it for a minute.
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 04:26 PM
Dec 2014

Just because someone disagrees with you does not mean they are paid to do so.

You need to remember than some people are just assholes.

And to a jury that asshole comment is not directed at anyone but the people who troll websites for fun.

randys1

(16,286 posts)
202. Thom Hartmann is the one who asserted it, and I agree. Maybe he would know more
Mon Dec 29, 2014, 12:11 PM
Dec 2014

than you, maybe?

You dont think the Rove's and Koch's of the world arent trying to influence social media?

Of course they are.

Agschmid

(28,749 posts)
203. I'm saying they don't need to pay to do it...
Mon Dec 29, 2014, 01:01 PM
Dec 2014

Why would they pay for a service they can get for free?

They are republicans after all.

randys1

(16,286 posts)
205. I agree but I listen to tons and tons of liberal talk radio and hear the same 7 or 8 voices
Mon Dec 29, 2014, 01:06 PM
Dec 2014

calling in on any topic that ALEC or the Koch's or Rove would find important, and they all say similar things.

It is a script they are reading form, no doubt about it.

ACA is a perfect example, documented dozens of callers, calling over and over to all the shows constantly.

jeff47

(26,549 posts)
10. That's kinda true for many topics
Sat Dec 27, 2014, 05:57 PM
Dec 2014

Post a "Here's why people didn't turn out" thread, and you get a river of people screaming at you.
Post a "non-voters should STFU" thread, and you get a river of people screaming at you.

Post a "I'm not really a fan of Clinton" thread, and you get a river of people screaming at you.
Post a "I'm really a fan of Clinton" thread, and you get a river of people screaming at you.

Post a "Racist cops are a huge problem" thread, and you get a river of people screaming at you.
Post a "Not all cops are bad" thread, and you get a river of people screaming at you.

And so on.

We're in the middle of a shift in our party. The old guard is failing to accomplish it's goals. That's causing some people to attack the old guard. The people who make up that group and their allies lash back.

As a result, you'll find someone to be overly defensive and abusive on pretty much any topic. I suspect I could get someone to chew me out if I posted a thread that only said "It was sunny today".

(Disclaimer: White dude. Things may be soaring over my head)

 

kioa

(295 posts)
105. It's almost as if people going on a political chat want to chat about politics...
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 11:56 AM
Dec 2014

and it's far easier to chat about disagreements than things agreed upon (after all there's only so many ways to say, "Yeah, what you said&quot

Some people seem to find any sort of disagreement as a negative, when in actuality without disagreement, nobody would really have anything to say.

Completely agree with you.
In other words, "Yeah, what you said".

 

DeSwiss

(27,137 posts)
19. Don't worry.....
Sat Dec 27, 2014, 06:36 PM
Dec 2014

...as long as we're talking.

- Then it can get better.

When the blacks in the crowd that are protesting against racism only make-up 12% -- then we won't have to protest much longer. And that's the thing that has been more impressive to me than anything. Seeing white crowds, absent of any blacks, proclaiming that black lives matter to them. Never thought I'd see that.

White people must be the ones protesting against racism. That's where it began and it is the only way it'll ever end.

K&R

[center][/center]

 

Doctor_J

(36,392 posts)
21. Where is the barrage of threads bemoaning black-on-white racism?
Sat Dec 27, 2014, 06:45 PM
Dec 2014

I peruse the Greatest page and don't see such threads (at least OPs). In fact I mostly see the opposite - lots of threads bashing the NYPD for their disrespect of the mayor and so forth. Where do you see the barrage of which you speak?

 

bravenak

(34,648 posts)
25. What's this about?
Sat Dec 27, 2014, 06:57 PM
Dec 2014

Do you have to come here to the AA group to be nasty? We deal with enough nastiness, it will not be tolerated here.

 

Doctor_J

(36,392 posts)
29. I saw the thread on the Greatest page, clicked on it, and would like to be pointed to some of the
Sat Dec 27, 2014, 07:04 PM
Dec 2014

barrage of threads about which the OP speaks. If that is being nasty, then I will bow out. But I thought people usually rec threads because they want others to see them.

BainsBane

(53,003 posts)
41. Since you're here
Sat Dec 27, 2014, 07:27 PM
Dec 2014

Take some time to read through recent threads in the group. You may have not noticed such threads, but I can assure you that many African American members here have.

JustAnotherGen

(31,683 posts)
60. Go back to February 2014
Sat Dec 27, 2014, 08:06 PM
Dec 2014

Start with a du search of Fried Chicken. It actually got really shitty during the trial of Trayvon's murderer. But that was the tipping point.

Good luck!

 

Doctor_J

(36,392 posts)
156. Well, the OP seemed to indicate a very recent torrent of busy, blatantly racist threads
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 03:59 PM
Dec 2014

which I don't detect in the Greatest page. If there was one a year ago I will pass on tracking that down.

Now trashing this thread. Best of luck sorting it out.

 

bravenak

(34,648 posts)
27. Self identification.
Sat Dec 27, 2014, 06:59 PM
Dec 2014

See... This is the A-f-r-i-c-a-n A-m-e-r- i-c-a-n group. We are such a small group of folks that most of us know who each other are because we say who we are. Most of us post here on occasion.

 

bravenak

(34,648 posts)
38. Who pretends to be black for fun and continues while getting trolled everyday by name removed?
Sat Dec 27, 2014, 07:14 PM
Dec 2014

Plus a lot of us meet up on Facebook too. Self identification occurs all throughout DU. I, for one, have posted a photo of myself before and my posts link to a page where you can see my face.

valerief

(53,235 posts)
232. Don't feed the trolls. They're not worth it. They're like talk radio or shit on a dinner plate.
Mon Dec 29, 2014, 08:03 PM
Dec 2014

You can't make it better, so alert the shit out of them and walk away for your own sanity. Some of us who vote can easily see the trolling and vote to hide.

steve2470

(37,457 posts)
236. I agree
Mon Dec 29, 2014, 09:22 PM
Dec 2014

There's some people here who will not get it, no matter how it's explained or how many links or books or articles you give them. It's the #NOTALLWHITEPEOPLE mindset, which is not necessary at all.

JustAnotherGen

(31,683 posts)
58. She's black
Sat Dec 27, 2014, 08:01 PM
Dec 2014

We are on Facebook. Now knock it off.

She's one of the nice group hosts - I'm the zero tolerance one.

Another thread derailment.

 

Doctor_J

(36,392 posts)
34. Crypto's not talking about posts in the AA group. And neither was the OP
Sat Dec 27, 2014, 07:07 PM
Dec 2014

Until I read through this thread I had no idea you're an AA. Heaven05's been here forever. I just recently discovered that he's AA. Crypto's question was an honest one - why the scolding?

mopinko

(69,806 posts)
30. a lot of that stuff would have been shut down by mods.
Sat Dec 27, 2014, 07:04 PM
Dec 2014

sigh.
i think you are right tobin. it is a damn shame.

 

Fred Friendlier

(81 posts)
31. You bring up a huge problem
Sat Dec 27, 2014, 07:05 PM
Dec 2014

There is a smug little gang of white atheists who have declared themselves "The Base" and have zero respect for the concerns of anyone else - even when those they spit on are in fact major contributors to the Democratic coalition. Like you, I do not know what to do about the problem except to stand up and draw attention to its existence.

Solidarity!

F4lconF16

(3,747 posts)
78. Wow, way to throw a jab in at atheists, there.
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 08:03 AM
Dec 2014

There's a lot of white assholes out there. The lack of a belief in a deity has shit-all to do with that. If you'd like to point towards some evidence suggesting that the atheist movement has a problem with racism (as it does with sexism), then I'll listen. But that was unnecesary.

That, and my guess is that, since atheists tend to be humanists, they'll be less racist than, for instance, the Christian right, which hates all minorities with a passion.

 

1StrongBlackMan

(31,849 posts)
162. I don't know about "atheists"; but, they are certainly ...
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 04:15 PM
Dec 2014

"civil libertarians" and "class warriors" ... the rest of your description is accurate, though.

I cannot tell you know many times I, and other PoC, have been told that race issues will magically disappear once there are no more poor white people. {paraphrasing, of course}

justiceischeap

(14,040 posts)
285. As a white atheist I see no truth in your proclamation that we are the problem
Tue Dec 30, 2014, 08:38 AM
Dec 2014

The problem as I see it are individuals.

People who proclaim boldly it is a certain group of all people within that group are also the problem. There are atheist racists, I'm sure just as there are white racists, Asian racists, even African-American racists but that doesn't mean that all people in each of these groups are the entire problem. It s the racist individual that is the problem. And trying to derail a serious conversation by placing blame on an entire group doesn't further the conversation at all.

It would be like me saying all religious people are the problem because I'm an atheist and don't follow their theism. In fact, I have friends of many different religions and we are all strong advocates for racial equality so that would make my statement patently false as is yours.

As an openly LGBT person, I get bias, I've felt it and been subjected to it so please don't use your bias against non-theists to further your agenda in a thread about racial inequality on DU.

LiberalAndProud

(12,799 posts)
311. Yea, damned atheists.
Tue Dec 30, 2014, 07:33 PM
Dec 2014


I don't think ^this guy^ is an atheist. I'm just sayin' that your post smells of red herring.

Feral Child

(2,086 posts)
319. Ridiculous deflection.
Wed Dec 31, 2014, 09:09 AM
Dec 2014

I'm a white atheist. My sig line reveals my stance, my posts support it.

Instead of bringing religious bigotry in here, try to add to the discussion. We don't need thread-jacking.

The Velveteen Ocelot

(115,280 posts)
43. Well said.
Sat Dec 27, 2014, 07:30 PM
Dec 2014

I read in this group but I don't post because, as a white person, I figure I can learn more if I were to just shut up and listen. I don't know what it's like to be black in this country - except that it's a long way from where it ought to be - and the people who do know deserve to be listened to and their opinions respected. Tobin, your point is a good one, and I hope the black members of DU aren't discouraged by some of the insensitivity and occasional outright racism that sometimes turns up here.

randys1

(16,286 posts)
113. I have learned the most by making false assumptions over and over and having
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 12:16 PM
Dec 2014

a close AA friend on another board educate me.

Used to joke about paying her, and she would not jokingly insist I take a course at my local community college on African American history, which I have not done.

The one thing I have learned to do in relation to minorities of all kinds, Women, Gays, African Americans and all, is I defer to them, always, on everything related to them.

Not to say I will listen to Phyllis Schlafly ever on anything to do with Women, for instance, but maybe I would even her...

 

1StrongBlackMan

(31,849 posts)
164. Melissa Harris Perry offered the following ...
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 04:32 PM
Dec 2014

regarding her role in various issue discussions:

On matters of race, her role is to speak of her life's experience, as a Black person ... On matters of gender, her role is to speak of her life's experience, as a woman ... On matters of LGBT, a community of which she is not member of, her role is to listen to those of that community, asking clarifying questions to better understand the life's experience of those in that community, so that she can communicate to, and talk with, other Black people and women about their issues.

{and she jokingly added, she tries really hard not to say, "Well, my Gay friend told me ..." }

gwheezie

(3,580 posts)
47. We can confront it
Sat Dec 27, 2014, 07:42 PM
Dec 2014

But I don't know if it changes any minds. I do know being silent is often interpreted as agreement.
my basic rule is if a person of color says something they read here is racist then it is.

JustAnotherGen

(31,683 posts)
59. Can you edit OP?
Sat Dec 27, 2014, 08:04 PM
Dec 2014

Put at the top of the body -

****** Posted in the African American Group*******


Learned that from HOF. It will keep a lot of the more abrasive folks just trying to prove 'they is smart' away from it.

Kick and rec!

DonCoquixote

(13,615 posts)
253. seriously do
Mon Dec 29, 2014, 09:49 PM
Dec 2014

because one problem is that some people, and yes, a lot of them are Euro-Americans, love to pick fights with people because they act like anyone who is trying to tell them to have some manners is some fascist tyring to harsh their mellow. I may agree with Doctor J on other issues, but if you go on a board dedicated to a group and pick fights, do you expect people to kpowtpow to you? That is like going on a labor board, saying "unions suck" and then wondering why people are pissed? But of course, Union people do not take crap, neither should this board.

Cha

(295,917 posts)
61. "What that basically means for me is shutting up about it and really listening to black people."
Sat Dec 27, 2014, 08:17 PM
Dec 2014

Excellent advice, Tobin. Thank you.

 

kioa

(295 posts)
91. I think suggesting that anyone needs to 'shut up' because of race to be condescending at best.
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 10:10 AM
Dec 2014

Discussion is a two-way street and there is no reason for anyone to 'shut up', particularly on a discussion board.
(assuming dialog is honest, of course)

 

1StrongBlackMan

(31,849 posts)
165. When the one person is trying to have his/her opinion ...
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 04:47 PM
Dec 2014

on a matter, informed by vicarious observation, hold the same weight on a matter as someone else's lived experience ... well, yes, the former just needs to shut up and listen.

But I guess, you covered that here:

(assuming dialog is honest, of course)

justiceischeap

(14,040 posts)
286. The DU LGBT community has gone through this animus on DU and sometimes people
Tue Dec 30, 2014, 08:45 AM
Dec 2014

do need to just shut up and listen to the group that is pointing out the problem. All too often we got a lot of the same reactions--for a while some DU'ers even blamed us for losing entire elections because we wanted equality to be a part of the democratic platform. So if a DU'er of color is telling you to shut up maybe you should and listen, really listen to what they are trying to tell you because more often than not the reason you are being told to shut up is because you are actively denying the issue with your comments.

lovemydog

(11,833 posts)
62. I agree Tobin S. that listening and learning is essential.
Sat Dec 27, 2014, 08:21 PM
Dec 2014

It's not too much to ask, for people to listen and learn.

marble falls

(56,358 posts)
85. Its the polite racist that are the dangerous ones. I learned about racism at the feet of my.....
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 09:44 AM
Dec 2014

politely racist grandfather I adored. His descriptions colored my image of black people (he did use the other term), that I didn't know for several years that one of my favorite TV show hosts, Nat King Cole was was black. I didn't know there were black members on the Cleveland Indians who I watched religiously on TV. I went downtown on public transportation fairly often to Public Square in Cleveland and never realized I was among black folk. In my mind, I guess, there were black people who were basically part of 'us' and the 'n' word people that I heard about from Pop and never actually knowingly met.

I want to get back to the kid who honestly did not realize there was any difference between the races. I had to learn how to discriminate. I've had to learn how to drop it, a much longer, more painful and necessary process. And it is ongoing now.

 

1StrongBlackMan

(31,849 posts)
166. LOL ...
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 05:10 PM
Dec 2014

My mother tells a story of a white kid that lived on our block ... he played with my sister and I, just about every day ... he ate at our house ... my mom baby sat him many an evening ...

One day he came over and with great distress in his voice, warned my mom that she had better start planning to move because "the ni@@ers are coming!"

My mom, handled it perfectly, saying, "Oh my, Timmy! ... But what is a Ni@@er?"

Timmy responded, "I don't know but Dad says they're coming and we're going have to move."

If memory serves me, Timmy and his family moved somewhere west of the Cuyahoga, shortly after that.

marble falls

(56,358 posts)
168. I lived at W45th and Lorain and 140th and Puritas. In the 1950's and early 60's. Kids have to be....
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 05:15 PM
Dec 2014

taught to hate by someone they love. Sad, sad, sad truth.

randys1

(16,286 posts)
325. Jesus...i am so sorry you had to experience that.
Wed Dec 31, 2014, 02:58 PM
Dec 2014

I am so god damn sorry that everyday of your life you have to experience ignorant, hate filled racist assholes.

I wonder if in the mirror planet where there is an exact copy of all of us but in reverse, if the white people in that USA are the ones with a history of being slaves and being hung and being discriminated against in every conceivable way.

I would like to see that, even though it would be really uncomfortable for me.

 

1StrongBlackMan

(31,849 posts)
327. That's just it ...
Wed Dec 31, 2014, 03:28 PM
Dec 2014

Timmy wasn't a racist (though he said racist stuff) ... his parents may have been. And I, at that age, knew little of racism.

I wonder if in the mirror planet where there is an exact copy of all of us but in reverse, if the white people in that USA are the ones with a history of being slaves and being hung and being discriminated against in every conceivable way.


And more, that is nothing that PoC would like to see.

DonCoquixote

(13,615 posts)
274. of course
Tue Dec 30, 2014, 02:53 AM
Dec 2014

he had to run back to his secret base where you could be a liberal, yet still attack black people as much as you want. It's the big rock candy mountain

Spazito

(49,764 posts)
290. I have just read through your links and....
Tue Dec 30, 2014, 01:04 PM
Dec 2014

was horrified, nauseated, disgusted and also uplifted by some of the responses. I have seen some of the racist posts in GD but had no idea of the breadth of them.

Thanks for posting these links, they have been very enlightening. I am still completely aghast at Skinner's 'contribution' in that one thread.

Hekate

(90,195 posts)
313. I took the time to read thru your links, JAG. Thanks for putting the post together
Wed Dec 31, 2014, 04:22 AM
Dec 2014

All I can say is it is even worse than I thought. For more people than I thought.

marym625

(17,997 posts)
69. I have been staying away from the threads
Sat Dec 27, 2014, 10:12 PM
Dec 2014

But not the posts. I will rec, sometimes leave a comment, but I know that almost all threads that even raise the question of racism will contain hate. Even if those commenting honestly don't understand it's hate. And they seem to be the hardest to make understand.

So, lately, I just stay away from the threads

myrna minx

(22,772 posts)
70. I came back to DU to have a look around and I'm just sickened.
Sat Dec 27, 2014, 10:13 PM
Dec 2014

I don't really post much any more but I wanted to K&r this thread. To our DUers of Color, I'm just sick about the horrible racist stuff that's allowd to thrive here. This place should be a safe place for us to all learn and talk and commiserate, but the amount of racism and sexism that flourshes here is disturbing.

Mister Ed

(5,896 posts)
72. "shutting up...and really listening to black people". It's really that simple.
Sat Dec 27, 2014, 10:53 PM
Dec 2014

Or at least the start is that simple.

DonCoquixote

(13,615 posts)
73. they won;t say it
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 04:26 AM
Dec 2014

but I will give you a hint, they are the same people that thought Hillary should have been crowned instead of the "inexperienced" obama.

 

1StrongBlackMan

(31,849 posts)
171. No, I think more accurately ...
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 05:45 PM
Dec 2014

they are the same ones that yell, at every opportunity, "It's classism, stupid." And, it's divisive to suggest that it's not.

Response to Tobin S. (Original post)

Response to Tobin S. (Original post)

Kalidurga

(14,177 posts)
77. Well Tobin there is a real problem here
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 07:23 AM
Dec 2014

I can tell there is a real problem because every thread that talks about race and issues that affect black people more profoundly have get a lot more attention by name removed.

I was in the middle of chewing out a name removed just before I was going to hit the reply button I noticed that MIRT saw the post before I could reply.

What I was saying probably would have earned me a hide, but I didn't put in any cus words I promise.

I don't have any solutions to the race issues either. I do know one thing though that would go a long way to making things better. It's not an easy thing some might think it's all but impossible. What is vitally important is getting rid of laws that are used against POC. For example legalizing drugs. Now I am not saying black people use drugs more than white people in fact I think it's the other way around, can't prove it, but that is my hunch. But, drug laws are used against Black people every day. Stop and frisk has to go away completely. I think we need to make it harder for the police to just stop people because they think they might be breaking a law. Because when we allow that well it's become obvious that they will stop Black people a whole lot more than White people and without looking I am going to hazard a guess that when they do stop White people they are poor to very poor and probably a high proportion are homeless.

So in a nutshell fixing the problem of institutionalized racism will go a long way to making things better.

Oh and one more thing. We absolutely need to see income inequality as a civil rights issue.

marym625

(17,997 posts)
122. swearing isn't allowed here?
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 12:49 PM
Dec 2014

Boy am I lucky I have been good. I swear like a sailor. Not that I know any sailors or how they speak. Just a saying

Kalidurga

(14,177 posts)
142. In real life I have been told that I cus bad enough to make a sailor blush
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 02:20 PM
Dec 2014

probably true the things that come out of my mouth sometimes they have me thinking OMG I can't believe I just said that. I usually keep going anyway cuz when I am mad I am usually good and mad. But, online I have time to keep myself in check somewhat. So I can play around with saying things to bother other people without actually using cus words. Those are my favorites but some people are offended go figure.

Response to Tobin S. (Original post)

Tobin S.

(10,418 posts)
89. Even if there were a lot of posts like that here (which I have not seen)
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 09:54 AM
Dec 2014

None of what you said is going on here really hurts me. Does it really hurt you if someone calls you a cracker? Is the weight of over 300 years of abuse and oppression contained in that word?

 

kioa

(295 posts)
95. Words only carry what power we give them.
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 10:21 AM
Dec 2014

There is no collection of sounds that "carry with it 300 years of abuse".
Words aren't magic. There are no wizards here.
I have no idea what kind of race discussions you or the person you are talking to are referring to, but let's keep things in perspective here.

Calling for respectful dialog is a perfectly reasonable thing to call for. Asking that people cease discussion for 'shutting up' because of their ancestry is condescending at best.

Tobin S.

(10,418 posts)
97. That's not exactly what I said.
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 10:30 AM
Dec 2014

Are we going to get into an argument about semantics here? Words don't really mean anything? Our laws are made of words. Don't tell me they don't have any power.

Besides, you are missing the point of this thread. I'm not really the person you need to be listening to here.

 

kioa

(295 posts)
98. You wrote the OP. If you don't want people to listen to you, you're going about it in an odd manner.
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 10:56 AM
Dec 2014

The post you referred to spoke of encountering rude, racially-based & disrespectful phrases.
You automatically dismissed such obviously counterproductive speech because they didn't "carry the weight of 300 years of abuse". If you don't like being called on melodramatics, don't use such melodramatic nonsense.

I think respectful dialogs on race are informative & appropriate.
You are openly saying that blatantly and unnecessarily disrespectful dialog is perfectly fine and the best way to have a discussion on race is "shutting up".

Your suggestion is, at best, counterproductive & condescending.


JustAnotherGen

(31,683 posts)
100. Welcome to being black in America
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 11:11 AM
Dec 2014

Where being told to shut up and eat your peas is standard operating procedure by the dominant culture.

You might want to read through the first page of posts in this group before posting anything else.

It's pretty clear who gets alert stalked, stalked by intruders, and told to shut up at DU the moment the truth makes people uncomfortable.

 

kioa

(295 posts)
102. Did I do something wrong? If so, say what it is.
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 11:24 AM
Dec 2014

That is how discussion works.

I certainly have never told you to "shut up" (nor eat anything), so I am at a loss at what you are trying to tell me.

I'm responding merely to the OP's suggestion of "shutting up", something you also seem to disagree with.
I am unaware of what you want me to read or with its relevance.
Tell me.
Spell it out.

It's pretty clear who gets alert stalked, stalked by intruders, and told to shut up at DU the moment the truth makes people uncomfortable.

Who? What truth? Who is uncomfortable?
What is an 'alert stalk'?
Who else, other than this OP, has told anyone to "shut up"? Who was it that was told to "shut up". Why?

JustAnotherGen

(31,683 posts)
107. You might want to read through the the first pae of posts in this group
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 12:00 PM
Dec 2014

All of the answers to your questions are there.

 

kioa

(295 posts)
109. You made an issue specifically with MY comment & by extension with me.
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 12:05 PM
Dec 2014

Those posts have nothing to do with either myself nor my comments.

If you have an issue with what I said, by all means, say so.
But don't suggest that I should "shut up" because of an issue you have with what somebody else said

JustAnotherGen

(31,683 posts)
112. I never told you to shut up
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 12:12 PM
Dec 2014

I have no issue with what Tobin posted.

All I did was suggest you read through the first page of posts in the group.

All of the answers to your questions are there.

I will also tell you I have never received as many "blocked from group" private messages or seen as many "name removed" posts with comments removed as I have in the past few days.

I'm also getting messages from Hosts of other Groups and roles at DU in support of us.

You can continue to be indignant - or you can read JUST the first page of threads in the AA Group and learn the dynamics in play.

It's your choice.

Be indignant? Or understand? Your choice.

 

kioa

(295 posts)
118. You engaged me. If you have a problem with anything I have said, please, say so.
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 12:31 PM
Dec 2014

I will be happy to address them.

The OP said people should be "shutting up". Something I completely disagree with for the reasons specifically outlined.

I am extremely uninterested in petty in-blog issues. I'm not the one you need to be addressing over such trivialities as "the dynamics at play".
If you have an issue with what somebody else said respond to them. Not me.

Again, if you have an issue with anything I said, please feel free to say so. I will happily engage you & explain/defend/revise my statement.

But don't drag me into whatever issues you are having with someone else.

JustAnotherGen

(31,683 posts)
120. This is enough
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 12:41 PM
Dec 2014

Note - Group Host here.

Note -Protected Group.

You appear to be looking for a fight. This weekend? Enough.

You are being deliberately disrespectful.

This is a protected group. Learn something - and you will catch up with the wide range of issues at play.

As a Group Host - I damn well WILL direct anyone who has NEVER posted in this group before to understand the dynamics at play not only in the OP on this thread - but in the first page of posts in the group.

Now let's engage - What did you think about Coates article in The Atlantic regarding Reparations as it relates to Slavery by Any Other Name and Post World War II economic oppression of black Americans?

 

kioa

(295 posts)
126. Very well. Lets take a step back.
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 01:09 PM
Dec 2014

The main issue I have with the OP is the "shutting up" part.
I think honest, open & respectful dialog is useful.

"shutting up" is not part of "open discussion" & trying to espouse that position, especially in a discussion section of a political blog is counterproductive & pointless.

I don't think it is unreasonable to ask that you hold me to only my statements.

As you have just made clear, you can ban anyone you want, so why are you asking me to read comments from commenters you can ban? I do not factor into that discussion one iota.

What would you like me to do?
Do you want me to "shut up" as the OP suggests? If so, I disagree. I haven't said anything rude, disrespectful nor off the subject of the OP or to the specific comments I specifically responded to.
Frankly, I have no clue what your problem is with me nor my statements.
If your problem is with others or with other comments, then
(a) address that person.
(b)you can apparently ban them.

Perhaps we are talking past each other. If so, lets try & figure it out.

 

bravenak

(34,648 posts)
127. You are not understanding the op.
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 01:13 PM
Dec 2014

Shut up and listen to us when we tell you about the racism we face and the issues that stem from it, instead of downplaying what we face or telling us that racism is over and Al Sharpton is the only real racist left. Don't pretend to know more about the racism black people face than the black people themselves and try to do all the talking.

 

kioa

(295 posts)
130. At no time have I ever
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 01:20 PM
Dec 2014
"downplaying what we face or telling us that racism is over and Al Sharpton is the only real racist left. Don't pretend to know more about the racism black people face than the black people themselves and try to do all the talking."
Such a statement is demonstratively wrong & disrespectful and should be treated as such.

But nor do I think anybody speaking respectfully should "just shut up".

A discussion is a two way street & is a useful tool for learning.
Telling people to "shut up" is neither.
 

bravenak

(34,648 posts)
132. That's because the op is not about you.
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 01:23 PM
Dec 2014

Dude. Should I tell you in spanish?
It's about people who need to shut up and listen. Why you think you were included, I'll never know.

 

kioa

(295 posts)
136. Because statements addressed to the public....
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 01:49 PM
Dec 2014

addresses the public.

I really don't think that disagreeing with "shutting up" instead of respectful dialog is an unreasonable position.

 

bravenak

(34,648 posts)
137. Hey, guess what?
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 01:52 PM
Dec 2014

Some people need to learn to shut up. The op is about them. The people who make everything about them.
I am about to block you soon. I'm trying not to. Maybe the op IS about you?

 

kioa

(295 posts)
141. Strange. The OP telling others to "shut up" doesn't address me.
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 02:14 PM
Dec 2014

But I need to "shut up" about people telling others to "shut up", because you're not telling people to "shut up", so "shut up" or else.

Interesting tact.
If telling others to "shut up" doesn't work out for you, feel free to try encouraging respectful dialog.
Who knows? It just might work.

 

bravenak

(34,648 posts)
144. Hey!
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 02:22 PM
Dec 2014

Pipe down in here!! This is a group, not a forum.
Shhhh!! Quiet!! Hush!!! Callate la voca!! No habla! Kein sprechen!


But, yeah, basically, you got it.
You can't say whatever you want in here. Go to GD and say whatever you want. You are in the African American Group. In here , in this here group, you need to follow the rulez.
Rule 1. If it ain't about you it ain't about you.
Rule 2. Do not be disruptive.
Rule 3. Group hosts ban the disruptive.
Plus some other rules you don't need to know since you probably just realized that you are being a jerk to the hosts of the African American group, in the African American group. I suppose now, you will see the error of your ways and politely stop being a jerk.

 

heaven05

(18,124 posts)
143. "shutting up" is NOT the point of OP.
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 02:20 PM
Dec 2014

how many times does that have to be mentioned? Like someone else said, the OP is "NOT ABOUT YOU". You're fun... NOT.

BainsBane

(53,003 posts)
267. You are demonstrating your views on race
Mon Dec 29, 2014, 11:40 PM
Dec 2014

in the way you have engaged in this thread. You insist you do not need to listen or read. It is all about you. What the members here feel and experience is inconsequential compared to your ego. We know a great deal about you from this interaction. You have chosen to reveal yourself. You have insisted you don't need to read other threads in this group. What African American members experience in regard to racism seems to be inconsequential compared to what you want. The discussion must be about you because nothing else matters. You've communicated your views quite effectively through the way you have interacted in this thread.

JustAnotherGen

(31,683 posts)
131. I have zero problem with you
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 01:21 PM
Dec 2014

You are some person at the other end of the Internet being abrasive.

You've been disrespectful to me by continuing this path.

1. This group has been directly under attack for 72 hours.
2. We don't get paid - we volunteer.
3. A little respect for our time would be nice.

Your Original Post - that's a BIG ISSUE we have not only at DU but in general in AmeriKKKa as heaven05 calls it.

The op of this thread - showed a huge amount of empathy. All you did - if you had read the FIRST PAGE OF POSTS in the Group -

Is do what America always does.

Chastise someone for how they shared their message. How they protest.

It didn't meet your standard or give you warm fuzzies so ALL you could post was a dismissal of everything else.

Now I won't ban you. But if you keep it up - another host might.

My problem is with you. When I see you pst something that addressed the issue within the OP - my issue with perceiving you as disruptive to the Group will go away.

 

kioa

(295 posts)
135. Your first sentence of your post and the first sentence of your final paragraph directly contradict
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 01:45 PM
Dec 2014

each other.

I never "chastised" anybody. I disagreed with a suggestion that people "shut up" instead of using respectful dialog.

I certainly don't demand "warm fuzzies" from other people's opinions.
I find the idea of dismissing respectful dialog in preference for "shutting up" to be ludicrous.

Let us simplify our disagreement.
Do you think a discussion forum is better with or without respectful dialog?
Do you think that enforcing that everyone "shut up" to be a good idea?

If you think our thread has gotten off the rails, I would agree.
However, you have specifically engaged my statements & I have specifically engaged yours.
This is how "discussion" works. "Warm fuzzies" are not required.

fishwax

(29,146 posts)
270. you are so obviously not listening to what other posters are telling you
Tue Dec 30, 2014, 02:02 AM
Dec 2014

I think most people would be happy with just the "listen" part of "shut up a bit and listen," but you're not doing that.

Also, you're completely wrong if you think just shutting up and listening every now and then isn't essential to discussion. It's hard to listen to other people when one is never quiet oneself.

BainsBane

(53,003 posts)
265. The point is to listen
Mon Dec 29, 2014, 11:28 PM
Dec 2014

To learn about the experiences of people of color. I'm sorry you find that so objectionable. It is not a petty blog issue. It's about racism and how people of color experience that racism. Either one cares about that because they want to help lessen racism, or they do not. JAG has politely suggested you read the other posts in this group to get a sense of that several times, and you have repeatedly refused in a rather rude fashion.

 

heaven05

(18,124 posts)
138. There is a collection of letters though
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 02:08 PM
Dec 2014

KKK. Have a ........problem with that collection of sounds around a group a letters that forms sound?...can you say Racism, Ku Klux Klan, lynching, castrating, burning, murdering, killing, shooting unarmed black men, women and children...now that, to me, is a collection of words with their associated sounds that "carry with them 300 years of abuse", wouldn't you say? "Shut up" pales to insignificance, I'd say, given the sounding out of my above words.

 

kioa

(295 posts)
146. Those are absolutely descriptions of 300 years of abuse.
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 02:54 PM
Dec 2014

Your statement, unlike what the statements of the two comments above mine were discussing are not examples of disrespectful dialog.

Isn't amazing what can be accomplished with factual & respectful dialog?

 

heaven05

(18,124 posts)
147. well good
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 03:00 PM
Dec 2014

now reread the OP and see if you can get past those two words you're hung up on and maybe you'll see that the others you are engaging here are trying to dialog also. At least that's how I'm reading WHOLE thread and original OP which is very important in it's sage advice to all actually.....

 

kioa

(295 posts)
148. I think my original statement was fairly bland & self apparent.
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 03:05 PM
Dec 2014

It exploded into far more than it needed to be, which is something apt to happen on the Internet.

After all, this is not only a discussion forum but a political website & people that like discussing politics are also disposed to argue politics.

 

heaven05

(18,124 posts)
149. your original statement
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 03:23 PM
Dec 2014

took issue with two words that never had the implicit intention of blatantly telling any one individual to "shut up" as you so surmised. Those two words were in context with the whole of the OP giving advice that is/was needed by many. If you can't take it.....

 

kioa

(295 posts)
150. You're right. He didn't tell one person to "shut up". He told many people to "shut up"
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 03:29 PM
Dec 2014

I prefer reasonable & respectful dialog, but to each his own.

steve2470

(37,457 posts)
153. "shut up" = white people need to listen and learn
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 03:46 PM
Dec 2014
THAT'S what Tobin meant. He didn't mean to "shut up" forever and not discuss.

My philosophy is to have a good understanding of a subject matter before opening my mouth. I prefer not to spew ignorance, either in real life or here on DU. By "shutting up", I learn about racism FROM THE VERY PEOPLE WHO ARE EXPERTS AT EXPERIENCING IT.

Ok, you hate the phrase shut up. Substitute listen first and learn about the topic thoroughly. Is that better ? I prefer NOT to be ignorant and learn FIRST.

I, as a white person, do not dare to tell black people what to say or think about racism. If we don't agree, then there is nothing further to discuss. Our approach is fundamentally different.
 

kioa

(295 posts)
157. I simply made the very simple statement that
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 04:06 PM
Dec 2014

respectful discussion is preferable to "shutting up" & telling others to "shut up" is counterproductive. Especially on matters of discord.


I hope this clears it up.
Really didn't think such a basic statement would cause such a ruckus.

"I, as a white person, do not dare to tell black people what to say or think about racism."

I would certainly hope not.
In fact, I would hope that there is nothing that as a white person you would presume to tell someone what they should think. That would be very arrogant and disrespectful.
I would hope that any person could simply manage to use respectful dialog, especially if it is something he/she is ignorant of.
So long as a person does so, I don't think anybody should be admonished to simply "shutting up".

Are we here to learn, discuss and carry a dialog or are we not?

Kali

(54,990 posts)
186. what you were doing with this dead-horse beating
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 10:29 PM
Dec 2014

is rude and disruptive. I can not believe the patience you were accorded here. I would have banned you after your second or third "who me? I am just trying to be reasonable" bullshit post.


(had to change the tenses there as I see they finally and rightfully did block your oh so innocent disingenuous ass)

JustAnotherGen

(31,683 posts)
201. I did
Mon Dec 29, 2014, 11:10 AM
Dec 2014

And I don't like having to do that.

When I looked at the length of time at DU, the complete disregard for the OP and the actual point of their message, and let's face it -

I tried to get her on track and I couldn't do it. So I blocked her.


Then I went and looked at the overall posts in the past 2 months - After the Block- and realized that she was just here at DU to talk about owning guns - and I said - eh . . .

I'm not going to feel bad about the boot. It's not like there was a genuine interest in having a discussion or care/consideration for the experiences of blacks in America.

rbrnmw

(7,160 posts)
185. what are you talking about?
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 09:28 PM
Dec 2014

OMFG
you can't possibly be serious I have never seen anyone say that here or on GD. in fact many many times people try to explain over and over and over. Do folks get mad sometimes with all the foolishness thrown in their face? sure Do they make bigotted statements about white people? No I have never seen anyone from this group EVER call someone a stupid cracker or anything like what you describe.

ellenrr

(3,864 posts)
83. I don't agree with your assessment of DU. yes there are racists,
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 09:38 AM
Dec 2014

but they are out-numbered - at least to my observation - by the people who tell them to fuck off.

Compared to many other forums, DU is really a bastion of anti-racism.

I've only been posting regularly recently - I was drawn by the news and discussion of Black Lives Matter and of police violence.
What I see is that the majority of posters are outraged at police killings of Black people.

yes, there are people who post in support of the police, but a small number.

Tobin S.

(10,418 posts)
90. It's not just about the recent conflicts with the police
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 09:59 AM
Dec 2014

Actually, I didn't have that in mind at all when I posted the OP.

But I agree to a certain extent. There are a lot of good people here. My OP was alerted on and the jury voted 7-0 to leave it. However, I was on a jury yesterday to judge a blatantly racist post and it was voted 4-3 to leave it.

JustAnotherGen

(31,683 posts)
93. Someone alerted on this thread?
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 10:18 AM
Dec 2014

They ought to be ashamed of themselves.

And I agree it's far more than police violence and civil rights abuse by law enforcement. And it's far more than Iggy.

It's been the bigots unleashed since Obama took office.

When black folks older than 60 tell me it's true - I believe them.

Tobin S.

(10,418 posts)
94. Yes. I got a PM about it.
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 10:20 AM
Dec 2014

The 7-0 vote to leave it was encouraging. The alert itself was discouraging.

ellenrr

(3,864 posts)
96. well, I'll defer to you, bec. I haven't been a regular poster for very long. I think
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 10:25 AM
Dec 2014

racists posts should be immediately removed, and the poster should be banned.

JustAnotherGen

(31,683 posts)
99. They haven't been though
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 11:07 AM
Dec 2014

As a matter of fact a member of Admin came back here and basically chastised a member for pointing out racial prejudice - and the arrogant bigoted thread stands. This was earlier this year.

ellenrr

(3,864 posts)
104. I think it's bad enough to have racist posts anywhere on DU, but there are special
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 11:42 AM
Dec 2014

considerations for groups:
"This is a group, not a forum. Groups often serve as safe havens for members who share similar interests and viewpoints. Individuals who post messages contrary to a particular group's stated purpose can be excluded from posting in that group."

JustAnotherGen

(31,683 posts)
114. I've been a host here for awhile
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 12:17 PM
Dec 2014

Its very rare to get blocked here. I would rather err on the side of a productive dialogue - and I think the other group hosts would agree.

You really have to be disruptive or have us see a pattern of thoughts/beliefs outside of the group - to get blocked from here.

And I think this OP is an awesome one! This is why I really encourage people of all walks of life to contribute and participate.

ellenrr

(3,864 posts)
115. Appreciate that. I'm glad to be here. I'll probably read more than write,
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 12:22 PM
Dec 2014

which is often a good thing!

JustAnotherGen

(31,683 posts)
92. I agree with his assessment
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 10:15 AM
Dec 2014

I think DU has tons of polite bigots - but recently we've seen people come out of the woodwork in support.

There is a post(two) by Steve asking AA du-ers to "come back".

I think it woke people up to the hostility.

There are more named removed back here in the past few days than in the past year.


They no likey this "awakening"

randys1

(16,286 posts)
116. The simple truth about this place is there is a large group of rightwingers, who post in certain
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 12:24 PM
Dec 2014

places only it seems, who wait for a liberal to get overly emotional or upset about something then they alert them and hope their buddies are on the jury.

It is ridiculous and quite frankly an AA at DU is in jeopardy of being silenced if they are unlucky enough to get the wrong jurors. Any liberal here is in jeopardy of this.

That seems insane to me, on a LIBERAL message board?

Are there several polite racists here, yes, getting less and less polite recently.

You can see them SEETHING when they try and politely respond to a thread where an AA is mentioning how sick they are of all the racists.

kind of entertaining actually

I HAVE A QUESTION, is it against the rules to complain about the jury system?

JustAnotherGen

(31,683 posts)
117. I think if you complain in Ask the Admin
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 12:29 PM
Dec 2014

It's okay - but posting agaist jury results is taboo.

Now in the AA group - we don't lock threads posting about jury alerts or the system. I've never received a pm or message on FB from another group host suggesting we do that.

And you are so filled with truthiness in this post!

 

1StrongBlackMan

(31,849 posts)
173. Funny ...
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 06:25 PM
Dec 2014

I just found I received a Christmas day hide for what was (IMV) clearly a joking comment ... the hide was very informative in that the Alerter referred to my "history of vulgar sexual comments that are really sick" and that my "discourse is corrosive."

I wonder if the Alerter was thinking of someone that looks like me?

JustAnotherGen

(31,683 posts)
176. I bet HE was!
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 07:26 PM
Dec 2014

You've been an ally in HOF? I don't think any of those members would ever saythat about you.

 

1StrongBlackMan

(31,849 posts)
177. Perhaps ...
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 07:54 PM
Dec 2014

While I'll admit ... betting that a Named Removed was "typing with one hand (because) the other is occupied ... down his pants", was childish ... I can't think of a single other crude comment I have made on DU ... and a single comment, wouldn't make my discourse corrosive, would it? .

 

1StrongBlackMan

(31,849 posts)
324. LOL ...
Wed Dec 31, 2014, 10:39 AM
Dec 2014

Note to self:

"When commenting in condemnation of racist stuff ... do so, in the most vanilla language possible, so as not to inflame the sensibilities of those pretending to not know racist stuff gets said."

 

1StrongBlackMan

(31,849 posts)
184. Thanks ...
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 09:15 PM
Dec 2014

I didn't think people saw me that way ... especially since I rarely use ANY vulgarity, on line or IRL.

 

1StrongBlackMan

(31,849 posts)
172. Yes ...
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 06:08 PM
Dec 2014

there are a bunch of DUers that tell some of the more obvious folks to Fuck off, and are very vocal about Black Lives Matter and police violence ...

But that's just it ... Black Lives Matter and police violence are important to PoC; but, not more important than the daily (less extreme) indignities that we face ... like telling non-PoC what we believe to be racist, and having non-PoC tell us what should REALLY be of concern ... you know, like what just happened here.

That's where the listening part comes in.

But in all fairness ... with you being relatively new (and presumably, non-Black), you may not have picked up on what Black DUers have been saying.

Feral Child

(2,086 posts)
320. It's out there, ellen.
Wed Dec 31, 2014, 09:34 AM
Dec 2014

It's somewhat masked, but it's certainly there.

Take a look at this thread:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=6020590

All the "yes, but" posts excusing the white privilege this crazy woman received. It's heartbreaking.

It isn't just the intruders, the cop-apologists with 10 or 15 posts, there's an ugly, covert, slyly under-spoken atmosphere of racism rampant here.

I didn't notice it at 1st, till I started reading bravenak's posts on the subject, then it all became very clear. I have to credit her for making me look for it. Once I looked it was obvious.

 

bravenak

(34,648 posts)
323. WOW!!!
Wed Dec 31, 2014, 10:29 AM
Dec 2014

It is very hard for 'some' scientists (like 3 of them, anyway) to accept the truth about climate change, so maybe he's one of those 'type' of scientists.

I'm glad you noticed all the 'yeah, buts'. I try to explain it to people but some don't even bother to look. They just tell me I don't see what I see and act like I'm imagining things. The trolls are one thing, but it upsets me when people here agree with the trolls, just using nicer language. Sad.

Feral Child

(2,086 posts)
326. It was your posts that made me look
Wed Dec 31, 2014, 03:23 PM
Dec 2014

for this kind of behavior, and I was shocked by the sheer prevalence of it.

I think a lot of them are in complete denial. Then they look for reasons, little nit-picks, to attack any message that exposes racism. "You see, this isn't really about racism, because....".

What's really sad is I can jack them on it and they'll mutter some excuses and say I'm launching personal attacks, but if you or another AA call them on it, they get ugly, aggressive, and claim that you're a racist.


It's a very real problem for DU, and I don't see Admin paying attention to it.

I've said it, and I'll say it again. Thanks, bravenak. You challenged us to look, I did, and your posts are vindicated by the truth. It's made a real difference.

Response to Tobin S. (Original post)

Baitball Blogger

(46,576 posts)
101. There are members of the white community who have taken their privilege for granted.
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 11:22 AM
Dec 2014

As long as they are in agreement with each other there is no limit to the illicit course of actions they will take when they are in positions of leadership. It is for this reason that we need to continue to hammer away when we observe their hypocrisies, because their overreaches are usually the result of racism. As long as they can convince people that minorities are inferior, it allows them to think that they are entitled to perks they really have no legal right to.

Racism is at the core of inequality.

Response to Tobin S. (Original post)

 

heaven05

(18,124 posts)
145. Great discussion
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 02:29 PM
Dec 2014

stemming from your OP. Enjoyed the back and forth with ONE who couldn't handle just two words of your whole OP? Amazing. One never has the solution, but, engaged and discussing, rationally, reasonably, we all can find one. I think. I hope.

Number23

(24,544 posts)
175. Thanks, Tobin. Though this will fall on deaf ears like so many other OPs imploring people to get out
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 06:36 PM
Dec 2014

of their own way, step outside of themselves and try to see/hear/understand the perspectives of others.

I've been taking more and more DU breaks lately and the level of stupidity I've been seeing means I will be taking a lot more.

rbrnmw

(7,160 posts)
183. I use to trash the threads and was not going to comment
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 09:12 PM
Dec 2014

Last edited Sun Dec 28, 2014, 09:52 PM - Edit history (1)

but we have to know about these people because they need to be confronted on their racism

sorry about those typos mr.rbrnmw was talking to me as I was typing

Number23

(24,544 posts)
178. "White people here do not seem to understand that without the black community the Democratic party
Sun Dec 28, 2014, 07:59 PM
Dec 2014

is powerless"

I have LONG since suspected that with a lot of these people, this explains the animosity towards black posters and black issues better than anything else. This same crowd picks apart everything the President does and only supports black posters that frame issues of racism as a "class" issue. And needless to say, this same band of fuckwits will barge into to ANY thread about racism and try to turn it into a discussion about how "Obama hasn't done this" or how the real issue is class, not race.

We are to be assisted/supported as long as it somehow benefits THEM. Which is why so many in this tribe have leached onto the problems involving the drug war. I laugh my ass off at these folks, they are so stupid. So transparent and pitiful. They are as closed mouthed as they can be about discrepancies in prison sentencing, racial profiling in hiring and policing, police brutality against minorities but the MILISECOND they can pipe up about how the drug war disproportionately affects minorities - there they are! And I'm sure it's just coincidence that getting rid of the drug war would make it infinitely easier for them and their 9 remaining functioning brain cells to go out and find some... whatever. But if they can crouch their self serving need for weed as a "social issue" because OMG! Look at how it affects the NEgroes!1 then they are all too happy to do it. And they are mad as hell that SO many of us see right through them (though there are a few of us that seem to go along to get along).

A lot of these folks seemed to almost SEETHE that black people, including many black posters on DU, have been and remain stalwart supporters of this president. I guess in their heads, because they are SOOO much smarter/better/in possession of knowledge of the REAL issues that affect the world, that if we don't turn on the man as they demand we do every minute of every day, if we can't be their lackeys, I mean allies, then we're in the same boat as the right wing. And they wonder why so many here would consider being their allies as quickly as we would the Tea Party.

Response to freshwest (Reply #194)

Spazito

(49,764 posts)
291. Well said, Number23!
Tue Dec 30, 2014, 01:23 PM
Dec 2014

I could not agree more with your post, I see it the same as you. I have been reading the links provided in this OP and 1StrongBlackMan's "DU ... Just So You Know, It's NOT Our Imagination ..." thread in GD and am sickened, angry yet want to applaud those in this group for fighting back and not letting the horrid racist crap go unchallenged.

Hekate

(90,195 posts)
314. Yes yes yes
Wed Dec 31, 2014, 04:51 AM
Dec 2014

Too tired to really say more -- been following this and associated links for the past several hours, and am so disheartened about DU.

Response to Tobin S. (Original post)

Number23

(24,544 posts)
191. Hopefully you'll be out of here before you get a chance to even see my post
Mon Dec 29, 2014, 01:21 AM
Dec 2014

But just in case someone wants to see your idiocy:



From "DUer" Komocere:

There are three main things contributing to the death of DU.

The first was the creation of the African American and feminist groups. The more prescient DUers commented at the time that this would only divide people, create a clique-like environment and create safe havens for extremists. Over time, the bullying and alert-stalking of the rest of DU by these two groups created a very hostile atmosphere and it killed open debate.

The second thing was the daily threads pushing the "white male privilege" meme, and more recently the "cultural appropriation" meme. Having people constantly abuse and shit all over you while telling you you're actually a member of the privileged class is too absurd to take seriously. DU obviously doesn't do irony. Telling people their opinion doesn't matter because they're a white male is no better than telling someone their opinion doesn't matter because they're a black female. Both are wrong. Equally wrong were the black people telling white people to shut up because they couldn't possibly understand what it's like to be black, while these same people think they know everything how about white people think and feel. At some point, the sane DUers were going to stand up and fight back.

The third thing was the automatic support given to certain criminals, just because they were black, and the demonization of the people who killed them. It started with Trayvon Martin, continued with Michael Brown and Vonderritt Myers, and it's still continuing with Antonio Martin. Even after it was proven that George Zimmerman and Darren Wilson acted in self-defense, certain DUers continued to lie about what happened, and supported the criminals. We now had the "police brutality" meme. This has divided not just DU, but the whole country. It seems like some kind conflict is unavoidable at this point, unless the blacks back down and apologize.

The only thing that can save DU at this point is making it more open, especially to more conservative views. MIRT is one of the biggest obstacles to free discussion at DU right now, and should really be retired.

One final point. Several of the people responsible for creating the toxic atmosphere at DU are posting right in this thead - BainsBane, bravenak, Cha and JustAnotherGen, among others. Banning these people would improve the morale of DU immensely.

ellenrr

(3,864 posts)
192. lol, thanks to that (deleted) poster, who in the last paragraph,
Mon Dec 29, 2014, 02:34 AM
Dec 2014

gave me the names of some posters that I should for sure pay attention to.

JustAnotherGen

(31,683 posts)
199. Where have I seen this before?
Mon Dec 29, 2014, 06:32 AM
Dec 2014

What an ass wipe!

And before anyone goes alerting - she is not a member so she is fair game.

It's perfectly reasonable to call someone an ass wipe who is not a member of DU.


I did not use sexist, mysoginstic, or racially based language.

Any single person can be an ass wipe!


There are a few people watching this from a site I used to belong to that I directed to DU in 2008. We are friends IRL.

It was an email that drew me to this post.

Years ago I posted my user name here so they could connect with me. The more I think about it - the more I believe this is an ass wipe I booted from there years ago. What a BB from hell! < ---- those women from my old site will get that.

Thanks 2nd2 for the heads up!

kwassa

(23,340 posts)
208. Thanks for preserving this post. I always want to see the Name Removed posts.
Mon Dec 29, 2014, 06:26 PM
Dec 2014

I've had more of these posts in response to mine, in the past week, than I have had in my entire DU career, and I haven't seen any of them!

I wish they would let us see all of them.

This is a psuedo-rational classic. I wonder if this is our old friend .... now on vacation.

Number23

(24,544 posts)
218. " I wonder if this is our old friend .... now on vacation."
Mon Dec 29, 2014, 07:12 PM
Dec 2014

Can you believe that his account is no longer flagged for review and is now active, leaving us to all wait breathlessly until his "vacation" is over? And this is at LEAST his second, maybe even third vacation.

In the meantime, he is rec'ing every single race baiting OP he can get his hands on. I'm just trying to figure out... exactly WHAT does this person have to do before the admins kick his ass off of this web site?

kwassa

(23,340 posts)
221. There is no jury mechanism to reveal a pattern of abuse ....
Mon Dec 29, 2014, 07:19 PM
Dec 2014

if there are no individual posts that are over the top and hide-able. A big flaw in the DU system, in my opinion.

Hekate

(90,195 posts)
315. DU will be "saved" by "making it open to more conservative views"?!
Wed Dec 31, 2014, 05:02 AM
Dec 2014

My. Gods.

You did a public service by copy/pasting this piece of garbage in the open air.

JI7

(89,180 posts)
193. the Carlton Banks thing was such a joke
Mon Dec 29, 2014, 03:08 AM
Dec 2014

isn't that a common stereotype of certain types of kids. usually nerdy, geeky,from well to do type families and who attend certain schools . that look has crossed racial lines. there are many asians who have that look also. do people look at those nerdy asians and think they are trying to be white ? it has nothing to do with race.

you have to wonder about someone who sees carlton banks and sees it as him being more white.

there have always been nerdy/geeky black guys . there is a reason why media usually only portrays certain images of certain races.

there is so much ignorance in many of these threads i don't even know where to start with many of them. just trying to deal with how much ignorance, denial , stupidity is in them.



Response to Tobin S. (Original post)

Response to Tobin S. (Original post)

randys1

(16,286 posts)
206. It is getting worse by the hour...Why is this alleged liberal message board dominated
Mon Dec 29, 2014, 02:02 PM
Dec 2014

by right leaning white people hurling nonsense all day?

Sure seems to be that way to me...

 

bravenak

(34,648 posts)
207. Did you happen to see this Op posted in AA just a few minutes ago?
Mon Dec 29, 2014, 06:24 PM
Dec 2014
Message to the blacks on DU (how to be a good ally)

Dear black people,

1) Just because white people don't agree with you, it doesn't mean they haven't listened to you. Do not demand that white people shut up and listen to you when you're not willing to do the same.

2) The world does not revolve around you. You are not special, so don't expect to be treated as if you are. If you're offended or outraged, that's just too bad. There's no law that protects you against hurt feelings.

3) You do not get to tell white people what they need to be doing or saying. Learn some respect and humility.

4) You are not an "oppressed group". You live in a First World country, the wealthiest in the world. We have a generous welfare state that provides for your every need. You have a home, access to clean, running water, central heating, and so much food that many of your people are morbidly obese, while there are people in the world who are starving. You have access to some of the best education in the world, and some of the best healthcare. There are genuinely oppressed people in the Third World who could only dream of having the opportunities and privileges that you have.

5) No black person alive today was ever a slave, and no white person alive today ever owed slaves, so get over it. Nobody owes you anything. Spare us the "300 years of oppression and suffering". There are no 300 year old black Americans, and you have suffered no more than the average white American.

6) Do not accuse whites of being racist. You are far more racist, so check your own racism first and ask yourself, did I do anything to provoke this?


You have created a huge divide in American society. This will be difficult to overcome, but not impossible. All it requires is that black America takes a good, honest look at itself, and stops blaming whites for their own failures.


Regards,

White America



Dear Juror,

I merely reposted an op that was posted in this group. We are being harassed this week and need to discuss some of these posts and ops in a protected space. Please understand and do not hide.

steve2470

(37,457 posts)
209. that guy came from Stormfront-lite (Discussionist) or the real Stormfront
Mon Dec 29, 2014, 06:33 PM
Dec 2014

Horrible how this group is getting trolled and attacked now.

 

bravenak

(34,648 posts)
210. I think so too.
Mon Dec 29, 2014, 06:35 PM
Dec 2014

Do they post stuff about DU over there? I should check it out again, but it's too hard.
From now on, I'm going to be available all day to ban people like that from the group immediately. I was so shocked, I forgot.

randys1

(16,286 posts)
212. You are being attacked by long time members of DU, why shouldnt rightwing racists from
Mon Dec 29, 2014, 06:45 PM
Dec 2014

other boards come here and also attack you.

You folks seem to be open season, again.

randys1

(16,286 posts)
223. OK, now "name removed" is not one poster, right? "name removed" is racist after
Mon Dec 29, 2014, 07:24 PM
Dec 2014

racist punk who gets instantly banned?

this confuses me a little

randys1

(16,286 posts)
211. Dear god no, where is this? Is it hidden already?
Mon Dec 29, 2014, 06:40 PM
Dec 2014

I assume it was sarcasm, but a person actually wrote this?

Number23

(24,544 posts)
213. Why would you assume that was sarcasm? Do you think someone posted that ironically
Mon Dec 29, 2014, 06:45 PM
Dec 2014

or because they are deliberately trying to piss off the handful of black people that still post here?

It's obvious that was not meant as sarcasm.

randys1

(16,286 posts)
214. I meant when I started to read it I thought it was, it was so outlandish, so racist
Mon Dec 29, 2014, 06:47 PM
Dec 2014

so hateful, so ignorant, I couldnt believe anyone who posts on this board could say that.

But i believe it...now


I didnt see it in AA I saw it here when Bravenak posted it and I was confused, I guess I dont want to believe that level of hate exists here on DU

but we know it does

oops, I am in AA now...I thought Bravenak reposted it in GD, but my reaction has nothing to do with that, i am a little confused, so it was hidden and that is why I dont see it on AA?



I mean the part where a white person accuses Black people of creating the huge divide in America, it could have been written by "The Onion" as it is ass backwards in every detail..

I have always wondered if white people, teaparty, actually believe it when THEY Say that OBAMA is the one creating racial unrest in America, i mean it is so fucking INSANE, so completely backwards that I assume they say it just to be assholes, surely they dont believe it?

randys1

(16,286 posts)
226. Blaming racial divide in American on Black people is like
Mon Dec 29, 2014, 07:29 PM
Dec 2014

blaming our economic problems on Obama for not realizing the entire Republican party would work day and night to block everything he tried to do to help Americans.

It is his fault for not anticipating this and figuring out a way around it.

It is Black people's problem for not anticipating rampant racism against them, and for not appeasing white assholes quickly enough to dissuade them of their idiotic beliefs and bigotry.

rbrnmw

(7,160 posts)
227. OMG bravenek
Mon Dec 29, 2014, 07:39 PM
Dec 2014

This shit is getting bad I can't believe the racist assholes have the nerve to come to a protected group and post that.

 

bravenak

(34,648 posts)
228. I was actually mildly surprised at the boldness.
Mon Dec 29, 2014, 07:41 PM
Dec 2014

I'll send you and gen a link to the rest of what's left of that thread that PERSON started.

rbrnmw

(7,160 posts)
231. being use to it doesn't make it any less sickening though
Mon Dec 29, 2014, 08:03 PM
Dec 2014

this place has become a racist cesspool

 

arcane1

(38,613 posts)
238. I don't think it's nerve. I think it's deperation and fear, knowing their time has passed.
Mon Dec 29, 2014, 09:23 PM
Dec 2014

I like to think that, anyway

Response to bravenak (Reply #207)

Response to bravenak (Reply #237)

 

bravenak

(34,648 posts)
241. That goes both ways now don't it?
Mon Dec 29, 2014, 09:27 PM
Dec 2014

When have blacks oppressed whites in America? Or is just discussing racism oppression to you? How... Weak.

Response to bravenak (Reply #241)

 

bravenak

(34,648 posts)
244. You're oppressing me right now.
Mon Dec 29, 2014, 09:32 PM
Dec 2014

And also when I got assaulted and called ni$$er everyday for three years while living as the only black family in a white town. Such dirty ugly people.

Response to bravenak (Reply #244)

 

bravenak

(34,648 posts)
252. Did you just call me a nigger?
Mon Dec 29, 2014, 09:41 PM
Dec 2014
Such dirty ugly people, and they all smell of wet dog and mayonnaise, am I right? Nigger.

When you call white people crackers, they have a right to call you nigger.



Funny, I never called anybody any names. Not even you. I will post your response to me for posterity.


Dear Jury... Once again I am copying this post to prove I am not lying about the things people say to me on DU. Please do not hide my post.

rbrnmw

(7,160 posts)
259. I need to step away for an hour or 2
Mon Dec 29, 2014, 10:07 PM
Dec 2014

I will end up banned and by the way name removed fuck off you racist pos

 

bravenak

(34,648 posts)
261. I know.
Mon Dec 29, 2014, 10:11 PM
Dec 2014

When this happens I sometimes take a break and read something good or watch something funny. Last time I was watching the Episode of South Park called 'Fishsticks'?(Kanye west is in it) I laughed and laughed.
There's a couple more from this season that killed me like '#rehash.

T

 

bravenak

(34,648 posts)
276. These people are a trip!!
Tue Dec 30, 2014, 06:13 AM
Dec 2014

Did you see 1strong's op? He op'd the dirty business in GD. I'm glad. People need to see. And BtA has been getting some humdingerz too. I swear it's the same people. All antisemites hate black people and vice versa. Yuck!!!

JustAnotherGen

(31,683 posts)
279. No - but I will look later
Tue Dec 30, 2014, 06:32 AM
Dec 2014

And that's very true on the anti Semite thing. I don't want to derail the thread - but I noticed not at DU per SE - but in general folks who got on the "Black Lives Matter" bandwagon only after the Palestinians denounced the US justice system.

Not realizing Jews in America were lynched too. And well - a lot of Jewish young people were out marching with black folks.

Whose convert to Christianity to marry a prett girl grandfather took his wife and teenage daughter to the march on Washington?

My Grampa. . But growing up in Western PA he got it. His father had converted to Judaism - to marry a pretty girl - so my Grampa got things that some people never would. And his RAGE at the end of WW 2 as a young soldier guarding Eisenhower - there are some things he could never forgive or forget.

I wrote about his twin brother during the 2008 election. He was GOVing in his 80's as much for his parents and neice and her husband, and her children - as he was his brother.

 

bravenak

(34,648 posts)
280. I noticed that too this summer.
Tue Dec 30, 2014, 06:40 AM
Dec 2014

People were showing up in IP threads who were here for a long time and never posted on that subject, just to be nasty as possible. One guy just went on and on with his hate, post after post... It was bizarre.
It's one thing to be anti war and have empathy. But the hate level towards Jews, rather than the right wing that controls the politics in Israel disturbs me. It's the right wing, not the people. Hell, both sides are run by right wingers, with all the people stuck in the middle. Bibi reminds me of Cheney and I wish people would remember how we felt when Cheney was running this nation.

I thought it had calmed down. But I think I have just been focused elsewhere. I'm now positive it's gotten worse .

 

bravenak

(34,648 posts)
292. Never!!
Tue Dec 30, 2014, 02:20 PM
Dec 2014

I do about five to seven hours a night.
But my timezone is Alaska so it's an hour behind California. I like to stay up late and jus take a nap during the day. I'm doing online courses in HTML5 between posts on DU. I wanted to watch the AA group to make sure I didn't need to block anybody.

Feral Child

(2,086 posts)
322. bravenak, sorry to break in here, off topic
Wed Dec 31, 2014, 10:14 AM
Dec 2014

but if you get a chance, please read my post #320 in this thread.

Have to give you credit. It was your posts on the "hidden" racism at DU that woke me up and made me look for it. I know you caught flack for your posts on the subject, but please know you weren't ineffectual; you got my attention.

Thanks, G/F.

 

Elmer S. E. Dump

(5,751 posts)
330. Seems there will always be 2 types of people in this world
Sat Apr 4, 2015, 06:12 PM
Apr 2015

Racist, bigoted assholes, and everyone else. Thankfully, I still believe we outnumber them, but we definitely need to stick together!

 

arcane1

(38,613 posts)
246. For the first time in history, white men are expected to treat non-whites and women with civility
Mon Dec 29, 2014, 09:35 PM
Dec 2014

And some of them just cannot adapt to that change. It's the same infantilization that allows men to be regarded as not-quite-responsible for their sexual and/or violent actions. It's a need to remain in a state of perpetual spoiled boyhood, where they are the Only Thing That Matters, their asses need continuous kissing, and nothing is ever their fault.

I still like to think their numbers are dwindling.

 

bravenak

(34,648 posts)
249. I do not understand the anger at not being special anymore.
Mon Dec 29, 2014, 09:37 PM
Dec 2014

And they seem to want sympathy from black people for their loss...
I don't get it.

 

arcane1

(38,613 posts)
254. I think it's hard for them to accept being equal to people they thought were inferior to them
Mon Dec 29, 2014, 09:49 PM
Dec 2014

The implication being that they are just as inferior. Similar to how creationists have such a hard time putting themselves on any kind of equal footing with other mammals.

I never experienced either of those, since I never had a very high opinion of myself in the first place But I've seen people go through that kind of thought process (technically more like an emotional process). Of course that likely doesn't account for every one of them, but it's there.

Being an ignorant dumb-ass doesn't help matters either

 

arcane1

(38,613 posts)
296. A great deal of self-loathing is required too. Comfortable people don't act this way.
Tue Dec 30, 2014, 03:12 PM
Dec 2014

Our friend Name Removed surely doesn't like what he sees in the mirror every morning.

Response to bravenak (Reply #298)

Response to arcane1 (Reply #246)

Response to arcane1 (Reply #246)

 

bravenak

(34,648 posts)
284. Another one!!!
Tue Dec 30, 2014, 07:32 AM
Dec 2014
283. Because non-white men have always treated women with so much respect, right?




White men have always treated women with the most respect, and we pretty much INVENTED women's rights. This "right wingers don't like non-whites and women" dog won't hunt. We love women, we just don't like non-whites and FEMINISTS. Non-whites don't like them either. If all white men disappeared off the face of earth tomorrow, there'd be no one left to protect women from the rampant misogyny that exists in non-white communities.

Be careful what you wish for.


You do this all day? Good grief!!
 

bravenak

(34,648 posts)
299. Stupidest people in the world.
Tue Dec 30, 2014, 03:32 PM
Dec 2014

And obsessed with what white women do all the time. I get name removed that say the craziest things.

 

arcane1

(38,613 posts)
300. There is definitely an undercurrent of sexual insecurity/envy in many of those posts.
Tue Dec 30, 2014, 03:37 PM
Dec 2014

Two sides of the same coin.

AKA two cheeks of the same ass.

 

bravenak

(34,648 posts)
301. For suuure.
Tue Dec 30, 2014, 03:44 PM
Dec 2014

It trips me out everytime. Like, damn dudes, I know Idris Elba is fiiiine, but he can't steal aaaallll the white women.

 

bravenak

(34,648 posts)
304. It's weird how obsessed they are with the inherent awesomeness of black men.
Tue Dec 30, 2014, 05:07 PM
Dec 2014

I understand it, but, they are just OBSESSED with black men in a sexual way.

Response to bravenak (Reply #304)

 

bravenak

(34,648 posts)
306. I feel like I have my own TMZ.
Tue Dec 30, 2014, 05:27 PM
Dec 2014

Yes, that is a fact.
It's jealousy of the, er, shall I say physical attributes they posses to please the ladies, or gentlemen.
An envy of sorts.

Response to bravenak (Reply #306)

Response to bravenak (Reply #308)

Response to arcane1 (Reply #297)

uppityperson

(115,674 posts)
242. who says only whites can be racist? Have you a good what privilege means? "for the sake of du"????
Mon Dec 29, 2014, 09:29 PM
Dec 2014

Welcome to du.

Response to uppityperson (Reply #242)

Dont call me Shirley

(10,998 posts)
234. So many people actually refuse to believe things could be so bad for other human beings.
Mon Dec 29, 2014, 09:06 PM
Dec 2014

They believe the victims are not telling the truth, that they are exaggerating or trying to get pity or "faking it". I find this a bizarre phenomenon, but this is an underlying thought structure which causes people to fear and hate others.

This is a mentally manufactured lack of trust, which separates us. That we are separate is a lie. We are all one. We must all move our mental state into this awareness. We truly are our brothers' keeper.

Be kind to each other no matter gender, race, religion, sexual orientation.











DonCoquixote

(13,615 posts)
255. side note
Mon Dec 29, 2014, 09:51 PM
Dec 2014

It is funny how many racists have to post here. Come on folks, Skinner gave you a nice clean sandbox called Discussionist, hoping you would play there. Of course, Priviledge does not have to have courtesy, so they will take discussionist, DU, and whatever and whoever else they can point to and say "mine mine mine! Feed me more!"

steve2470

(37,457 posts)
258. wow, it seems like Stormfront emptied their sewers to troll this thread
Mon Dec 29, 2014, 10:06 PM
Dec 2014

I don't remember ever seeing a DU thread with as many PPR'ed people.

Jackpine Radical

(45,274 posts)
262. maybe more people than you realize are doing that.
Mon Dec 29, 2014, 10:28 PM
Dec 2014

"shutting up about it and really listening to black people"

Jackpine Radical

(45,274 posts)
287. That's no doubt true.
Tue Dec 30, 2014, 10:55 AM
Dec 2014

For me, though, the notion of assimilation is quite familiar, but the topic cultural appropriation is new to me & I haven't been exposed to minority thinking about it. I know it is a time to be quiet & read & think from the heart.

marym625

(17,997 posts)
288. For me as well
Tue Dec 30, 2014, 11:02 AM
Dec 2014

Though I am not great at the being quiet part, I am good at the learning, reading, following the lead, reflecting part.

I believe the only time I have been aware of the appropriation is in music and dance.

riqster

(13,986 posts)
281. Fantastic OP. Thanks for writing it.
Tue Dec 30, 2014, 07:04 AM
Dec 2014

Shutting up and listening isn't controversial: it's common sense. After all, how can we hear anything if we aren't listening?

This applies to almost any topic where one is ignorant. And as a white guy, I am sure my knowledge of what it's like to live as a POC in America is pretty scant.

Bill USA

(6,436 posts)
312. I do think that the ignorant asses (i.e. trolls of the internet)
Tue Dec 30, 2014, 08:07 PM
Dec 2014

make a lot more noise than their numbers would lead you to expect. I think the many sensible, reasonable people are not nearly as prone to posting comments as the simpletons are. I don't think this can be quantified in any way, but I do believe that the internet, with the anonymity it provides, offers an ideal place for idiots - who most people would not stand around to listen to - to sound off ad infinitum.

Also, I have a personal theory that the creation of the Disgustingest (aka: the Discussionist) web site has encouraged the intellectually challenged and the emotionally immature to venture forth on DU to proudly proclaim and parade their ignorance before the grownups (they are at the psychological core, children who feel most people around them have more power than they do - thus they perceive them as 'grown-ups').

The one thing they live for is ATTENTION! and they don't care at all if it comes in the form of disgust or condemnation. This gives the timorous ones a feeling of being impactful. It's an imitation of strength. It's really the same thing the nut-job ISIS guys are doing. For those who feel powerless and unable to cope with real competition and pull off real achievement (which requires hard work and sacrifice) it's a way to get ersatz achievement and importance. Commit crimes and you get quick attention.

....... "Wow, look how powerful I am. All the legitimate people are paying attention TO ME!"








Hekate

(90,195 posts)
317. KnR for a better New Year here
Wed Dec 31, 2014, 05:22 AM
Dec 2014

Though after the reading I've done for the past several hours, I don't really expect it any more. >smh<

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