Religion
Related: About this forum800 dead babies are probably just the beginning
Sadly, the mass grave at Tuam is probably not unique. I visited the site the home was demolished in the 1970s and spoke with locals who remember babies skulls emerging from the soil around their houses. When boys broke open the cover of the sewage pit, they found it full to the brim of skeletons. Tuam was only one of a dozen mother and baby homes in Ireland in the years after the Second World War, all of which treated their inmates in a similar fashion.
--snip--
The warped code of honour behind the decades of silence had been inculcated by an all-powerful Catholic Church. For much of the late 20th century, the Irish civil authorities were in thrall to the hierarchy; Archbishop John Charles McQuaid threatened pulpit denunciations if the government contradicted his policies. So the state connived in the mother and baby homes, paying the nuns at Tuam and all the other homes a per capita rate for every inmate.
With hindsight, the church argues that it was performing a socially necessary task, helping to solve the problem of illegitimate children. It is true that pregnant girls would have been shunned by their families and left with no one to turn to. But the fact is that the church itself had created the problem by the stigma it attached to unmarried sex and by its refusal to allow contraception or sex education in any form. Philomena was typical of the thousands who became pregnant through ignorance. She says she didnt even know which end the baby would come out.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2014/06/06/800-dead-babies-are-probably-just-the-beginning/
Faux pas
(14,657 posts)could have prevented this hideous tragedy. Same goes for the present and the future.
I'm a recovering Catholic. I ditched out when they tried to sell me on kissing being a 'mortal sin'. That was the late 50's. Can't even imagine what it was like before that. It's an accidental pregnancy, not murder for hell's sake!
rug
(82,333 posts)I was starting to wonder.
cleanhippie
(19,705 posts)While at the same time proclaiming a "pro-life" stance.
Glad you like the story.
rug
(82,333 posts)Confirms your intentions.
Lordquinton
(7,886 posts)the rolling on the floor smiley was not about ~800 babies killed by the Catholic Church, but rather that the same church claims to be pro life.
rug
(82,333 posts)AtheistCrusader
(33,982 posts)Lordquinton
(7,886 posts)struggle4progress
(118,273 posts)for whom Catherine Corless found death certificates showing they died at the Tuam home?
Despite some low-quality reporting to the contrary, the home was neither physically nor legally part the Bons Secours religious community, which was actually located about a kilometer away
The home itself had been the county workhouse, and when it later became the local home for unwed mothers, the county continued to own the property and fund operations there, even though it was administered by Bons Secours
There seems to be evidence the facility was poorly maintained and quite overcrowded, that disease spread rapidly in the nursery, that necessities such as food and medical attention were inadequate, and that the death rate was extraordinarily high, especially in the WWII era. There's also evidence that the county was aware of the problems but was not inclined to provide funding to improve conditions there
Lordquinton
(7,886 posts)"Extraordinarily high even for the time" and"Run by nuns and priests" and "Not the only place this happened" and "Don't try and defend mass murder of actual babies"
struggle4progress
(118,273 posts)about $6.50 per resident per day (in current US dollars) to support operations there
Current cost estimates for warehousing the homeless in the US don't seem to fall below $25 per person per day and (depending on location) are sometimes much high, so it seems possible that county funding was completely inadequate
Current cost estimates for feeding the homeless don't seem to fall as low as $1.50 per person per meal so one might guess that the 1927 County Galway support for Home residents left (in current US dollars) less than $2 per resident per day for all operations other than feeding
okasha
(11,573 posts)of a mass grave, still less "mass murder."
But you're really enjoying your fantasy, aren't you?
Lordquinton
(7,886 posts)on the other hand, it never happened, which is it? It's sick enough that it happened, now the apologists can't even get their stories straight! And this is along side the Magdalene laundries, which I suppose you have another source that has proof never existed.
okasha
(11,573 posts)All we know is that the home had an extremely high mortality rate and that the dead children were presumably buried on or near the grounds.
So far, the burials excavated appear to be from the time of the great famine, something that is consistent with mass burials. Since investigators have yet to find the remains of the children, we don't know whether they were buried individually or if their graves were marked.
"Mass murder" appears to be your personal invention. There is no evidence to support it.
skepticscott
(13,029 posts)aren't defending mass murder. But I wouldn't count on it.
Response to skepticscott (Reply #7)
Post removed
struggle4progress
(118,273 posts)The speculation that there is a mass grave comes from the fact that Catherine Corless obtained official death records for 796 persons who died at the home between 1925 and 1961 and was unable to locate burial records; and two individuals report that they saw found about 20 skeletons under a concrete slab when playing there as children forty years ago. But the site was a county institution since 1840 or earlier, at one time being the county workhouse before Bon Secours administered it as a home for unwed mothers and their children for the county 1925-1961.
... A preliminary examination of the site is likely to involve testing .. for traces of human remains. They have to be forensically examined to determine whether they are remains of babies who died in the last century or famine victims from the nineteenth century. Gardai told RTE that some bones discovered at the site related to famine deaths ... TST, an engineering firm, was this weekend carrying out a subsurface radar examination of the site at the former mother-and-baby home. But sources admitted the team will not .. determine if skeletons are at the location ... but .. will only be searching for 'anomalies' in the soil ...
http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/news/baby-deaths-now-gardai-probe-the-tuam-mass-grave-30337463.html
LostOne4Ever
(9,288 posts)Warren Stupidity
(48,181 posts)beam me up scottie
(57,349 posts)Catholic bishops apologised for the "hurt caused by the Church" as Taoiseach Enda Kenny ordered a wide-ranging investigation into what he branded the "abominable" way mothers and babies were treated in religious-run homes.
The probe will look at death rates and burial practices at the homes, as well as illegal adoptions and vaccine trials.
The bishops conference said in a statement: The investigation should inquire into how these homes were funded and, crucially, how adoptions were organised and followed up.
We also support the Irish Governments intention to publish legislation on tracing rights for adopted children and their mothers with due regard to the rights of all involved.
The bishops statement added that the scandal reminds us of a time when unmarried mothers were often judged, stigmatised and rejected by society, including the Church.
http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/bishops-apologise-as-kenny-orders-religious-homes-probe-271650.html
I wonder why Catholic bishops are apologizing for something that obviously had nothing at all to do with their religion.