Religion
Related: About this forumAtheist shares ‘great news’ at Westminster symposium
By Janese Silvey
Wednesday, September 19, 2012
FULTON With armed police guards stationed at each exit, a pastor-turned-atheist made a case against God yesterday at Westminster College's annual fall symposium.
"The truly good news is not that Jesus died for our sins," said Dan Barker, co-president of the Freedom from Religion Foundation. "The truly good news is that there is no purpose of life. That's great news. If we had purpose, it would mean we are subservient to something. If we have purpose, we are secondary."
Although Barker was challenged by some during a question-and-answer session, his hourlong speech was without incident. Westminster administrators upped security at the two-day symposium on religion in light of recent events, said spokesman Rob Crouse.
"We're taking some security precautions because of the climate," he said, citing riots over an anti-Muslim film and recent bomb scares on college campuses.
http://www.columbiatribune.com/news/2012/sep/19/atheist-shares-great-news-at-westminster-symposium/
"The truly good news is that there is no purpose of life."
If that was true we'd all be posting in the Lounge.
immoderate
(20,885 posts)To avoid the Lounge?
--imm
monmouth
(21,078 posts)""The truly good news is that there is no purpose of life."
If that was true we'd all be posting in the Lounge."
Not sure what tone that was supposed to have but I'm going on the assumption you were objecting to the idea there is no purpose. In which case, he was talking about a universal absolute purpose. As in, the kind people say exists because some magic super-being imposes it.
You can still assign your own purpose to your life. "Post in the Lounge" seems like a fairly trivial one but if that does it for you...
rug
(82,333 posts)He said: "If we had purpose, it would mean we are subservient to something. If we have purpose, we are secondary."
Yay! We're purposeless!
gcomeau
(5,764 posts)It's mind numbingly obvious from the context of the *entire address*.
cleanhippie
(19,705 posts)cbayer
(146,218 posts)face. If clarified it or explained it further, this story doesn't cover that. Since this is the only article I can find on this lecture, I am going to go with what he said.
cleanhippie
(19,705 posts)I agree, cbayer, the authors of the bible SHOULD have clarified or explained it further. Imagine all of the heartache and drama that could have been avoided!
rug
(82,333 posts)cleanhippie
(19,705 posts)gcomeau
(5,764 posts)He made a perfectly ordinary and rather obvious observation. There is no "purpose" to our lives imposed upon us by an all powerful magical being that's in charge of everything.
To take from that that therefore you, personally, can't have any kind of purpose to your own life? That you can't just decide for yourself to adopt any purpose you like?
THAT is ludicrous on it's face.
cbayer
(146,218 posts)The reported may have taken this completely out of context or not.
But god does not equal purpose and purpose does not equal god in most people's lives, believers or not.
gcomeau
(5,764 posts)...are capable of reading the subject of the lecture... which was about taking God out of the picture. It was not about removing all sense of personal volition.
What more were you needing exactly?
rug
(82,333 posts)Becketta at least, could say things without sounding like an idiot.
ESTRAGON:
Well? Shall we go?
VLADIMIR:
Pull on your trousers.
ESTRAGON:
What?
VLADIMIR:
Pull on your trousers.
ESTRAGON:
You want me to pull off my trousers?
VLADIMIR:
Pull ON your trousers.
ESTRAGON:
(realizing his trousers are down). True.
He pulls up his trousers.
VLADIMIR:
Well? Shall we go?
ESTRAGON:
Yes, let's go.
They do not move.
Curtain.
Goblinmonger
(22,340 posts)*confused*
rug
(82,333 posts)I mock his glee.
mr blur
(7,753 posts)Who can tell?
And you're not Beckett, by a long way.
rug
(82,333 posts)You're embarassing yourself.
Angry Dragon
(36,693 posts)rug
(82,333 posts)If we are aware of others as well, we aware aware of our community. Preserving that community, and those in it, is then an obvious natural choice. We are not simply coral.
If you are a believer, then an additional purpose is to know God.
Whatever purpose you discern, the reality is not Dan's.
DonCoquixote
(13,615 posts)No one has yet stated:
Forty-Two!
10 geek points if you get the reference
cbayer
(146,218 posts)cbayer
(146,218 posts)That's absurd.
cleanhippie
(19,705 posts)Come on cbayer, you can do better.
longship
(40,416 posts)It is one of the iconic ones non-believers commonly hear from believers. I know it's weird, but it goes like this.
A. God created the universe.
B. God's creation provides purpose for the universe.
C. Believing in God gives Humans purpose.
D. Therefore, non-believers have no purpose.
I know the progression is illogical, but that's the gist of it.
I really like Dan Barker. He is one of the most gentle and meek of the atheist activists. He is apparently a very nice guy.
I think he was merely speaking of this believer argument that professed atheists hear all the time. It's similar to the atheists cannot be moral argument, which we also hear all the time.
I would like to read the whole thing to see what he's about here.
I really like him.
cbayer
(146,218 posts)Your take on him means something to me, as I am really not familiar with him.
I am sure there was much more substance to this than the article reflects, and, in fact, the writer might have made it over-simplistic on purpose.
longship
(40,416 posts)Dan Barker is one of the founders of the Clergy Project which supports clergy who no longer believe that God exists. These people are often stuck in hopeless situations. It is all they know, so they stay in the pulpit which puts them in a knotty ethical dilemma.
Barker knows about this because he was in the pulpit himself for years and understands the pain. He is a very ethical person. The portrayal is totally out of character for the Dan Barker I have heard speak on his weekly podcast and various speeches and interviews.
I think this article probably rips Barker's words out of context. It was an hour talk and they pick out this one thing. It also makes a very big deal out of the police protection. The reportage is horrible here.
(Always nice to see ya, cbayer.)
cbayer
(146,218 posts)legitimate program.
Agree about the police protection aspect of this and how it reveals even more about the biases of this writer.
I am going to take your perspective over theirs.
Always nice to see you as well, longship.
longship
(40,416 posts)Understand that many of the Clergy Project members are closet atheists still in the pulpit. The project protects these people's identities while supporting them with general support. They even help find resources for retraining.
Who would ever have thought that such a thing would be a problem? Well, Dan Barker did as he went through it himself.
cbayer
(146,218 posts)Looks like he tried on several different flavors of christianity before leaving it completely. He definitely has a view from the inside as well as the outside
cleanhippie
(19,705 posts)"The truly good news is that there is no purpose of life."
And I think he means there is no inherent purpose...
rug
(82,333 posts)cleanhippie
(19,705 posts)And if you believe that humans do in fact, have an inherent purpose, I'd love to see the evidence for that claim.
humblebum
(5,881 posts)nothing more than an electro-chemical reaction in the brain, as are all emotions, therefore what you think you love, like, hate, or don't like has no purpose. As a matter of fact nothing you do really has any purpose. Love and hate are really no different than flushing a toilet.
cleanhippie
(19,705 posts)You have a really nice day.
Fortinbras Armstrong
(4,473 posts)I bring you news of great joy, futilitarianism reigns! Rejoice, and be exceeding glad. Again, I say, rejoice.