and IMHO Jeb Bush will immediately take the "I am not a crazy nut job like the republicanteapartylibertarians are and I will save the party."

and quickly secure the advantage for 2016 with the others fighting for VP
(Marco Rubio at that point will like mitt become irrelevant as you can't have two people from the same state run together...I look for Rubio to disappear from the political world after his term is up.

Chris Christie will run for VP
and the republicanlibertarianteaparty as a whole will become a minority party forever more, as they kicked out all factions but older white males, and don't have enough people to vote for them.

good riddance to rubbish. out with the trash they are. ta ta see you. (and to quote John Kerry "Don't let the door hit you on the way out".

Put him on the big national stage, and his Jersey Shore mentality ...

I am pretty sure that won't play well, and he won't react well under the pressure, he will be the big bully he is ...

Hard to run Jeb, a third Bush, as a pitch to the entire country.

But, if it is Hill, the second Clinton will legitimize it.

get under his skin and he'll blow it big time!

He may have some advantages in Jersey, but on the national stage he'll come across as a rude East Coast wise ass. No love for that in the heartland...

just his general nature, I agree, would not play well.

I think beyond that, he has the capacity to get really mean when pushed even a little. I would suspect that under the scrutiny of a national campaign, that he would blow a gasket and really lose it a manner that would just blow his campaign up.

Go for it, Chris!

and will not go back a generation, IMHO. Besides, I believe her when she says she isn't interested.

That does raise a question about who will come to the forefront in the next 4 years. There is no obvious heir apparent. Biden is of the same generation as Hillary and will not be the candidate.

It has been in Obam's advantage to not have anybody emerging while he is running. But I didn't see any speakers at the DNC that were obvious candidates. Julian Castro will need more experience. Deval Patrick looked the most like a real candidate to me. I have my doubts about two African Americans being able to win back-to-back. I know it shouldn't be an issue, and I'd personally have no trouble supporting Patrick, but there could be an element of "What, white people aren't good enough any more?" from some quarters.

I wonder about Ted Strickland. He might be well positioned.

What about Jennifer Granholm?

She could run for Congress.

And, she would be a very strong prohibitive favorite.

At this point, a huge medical intervention seems clearly necessary. Perhaps gastric bypass. The damage to his heart alone would be enough to warrant it.

Oh no. . . He has a snotty stuck I live in Mendham NJ in a mansion and waaaaah waaaah waaaah - pay 13K in property taxes so I'm going to be a big cry baby mentality.

He's nothing like the fine people of Asbury Park - nothing like them.

OK ...

Wrong generalization.

Either way, a self entitled bully.

but Christie? I think he would wear people down pretty quick-like. He's a novelty. He gets your attention, but his bully ways turn people away.


McCain wouldn't dare try again.

She will be 69 years old when the 2016 election takes place. If elected she would be the second oldest President inaugurated. She's retiring from the State Department in the second term and is probably looking forward to a quieter life.

2016 is going to be wide open, and the last hope for the liberals to elect a progressive President.

As I've pointed out, it would make sense for her to start a foundation similar to her husband's except to help women. I'd say a good 50%+ here won't give up on the idea that she will run. They are going to be very disappointed.

why do you think Bill is working so hard for Obama

because Hillary needs Obama's voters if she is going to win (she didn't in 2008 because Obama's voters were voting for Obama).
Had Obama not been in the race, Hillary would be running for reelection

AND I WAS NOT a fan of hers in 2008, so I am not a groupie for her in 2016

but being 45 will make her immortal.
Being retired will just make her a former first lady, former senator, former SOS who will be forgotten by history

She is running.

And no Elizabeth Warren fans should NOT ever think or say Warren should run. In fact, as I keep saying Warren will gain 3-5 or more points right now if she pledged to serve not only her whole first term, but to remain in Senate for 2 decades and become the leading voice fromt he left for democrats in the senate.

(BTW Elizabeth Warren fans, she is no younger than Hillary either. )

and there is NO ONE else stronger than Hillary.
You certainly don't want a fake populist like John the biggest fraud ever Edwards was.

(not to mention it has to be a woman and it better be from the democrat side.)

Anyone who says Hillary is not running is just voicing an opinion that IMHO is 100% wrong, I would bet on it.

and there should not even (IMHO) be any competition, 2012 is proving that dems that stick together win big time.

1968 and 1980 proved otherwise.

I'd like to believe Bill Clinton is working for the good of the party he belongs to. Former presidents do this for their party. It sounds like you are insinuating otherwise.

I believe she's made it clear numerous times she wouldn't run. If she was going to run she'd have to start raising money pretty soon after the 2012 race considering how much money is spent these days on presidential campaigns.

Even if she decides not to, that doesn't necessarily mean we'd lose. There are plenty of people in the party who would be great candidates.

second off, no, there are no other great candidates that could easily win.

as for ex-presidents or other superstar politicians...
Bill Clinton did nothing to help Al Gore in 2000.
And Ted Kennedy did nothing to help Jimmy Carter in 1980.
And the Bush's did nothing to help Mittens this year(but set up the new rules for 2016 in their party to help Jeb).

And you are wrong as she has not made it clear at all. She has been busy the last 4 years being the single greatest SOS of all time, and loyally backing Obama, doing what she was asked for by her President.

And once she retires as SOS there is plenty of time to run for 2016. After all, this is not the republican party.

And of course, any savvy political person knows a major candidate does not announce 5 years ahead of time and denies it. Not one person on the scene that was seriously considered (yes, also rans and nobodies do so but they never stand a chance (ala Eugene McCarthy and other way out there candidates that don't get the nomination. Howard Dean didn't get it).

but then you already know all of that.

And all polls indicate Hillary has like a 70% nationwide favorable rating, and 100% of the people know her, so she cannot be defined by others, she and Bill both are enjoying their highest popularity of all time, and with Obama's blessing they would have the backing of every single demographic group in the nation (and of course the line "it's the economy stupid' could be used again, and by 2014, most people will be enjoying the benefits of the health care changes, and Hillary could advance that making it even better.

And the Clinton's like Obama know how to play politics.

I can't think of one major politician (aside from the great LBJ) who just retired. Trend setters like Hillary just don't give it up. And she would in history surpass the person she idolizes the most, Eleanor Roosevelt by running and winning in 2016. Matter of fact, the only person I could see beating her in the primaries would be Michelle Obama and 2016 is too soon for her. She is young enough that 2024 would be a perfect time after Hillary ends her second term.

A Hillary/Patrick or Hillary/Castro ticket would be nice, but it would be better if Castro became Texas governor and helped make Texas a blue state again, and best if Warren if she wins staying in the Senate and being the top liberal. Patrick should be fasttracked to the US Supreme Court.(or, should John Kerry take a cabinet position, SOS or something else, and Warren wins, Patrick should appoint himself to the Senate).Should Kerry leave, last thing we need is for Scott Brown to win that seat back.
As for Andrew C., well, after the incident when he was running his dad's campaign against Koch and that whisper campaign of "Vote for Cuomo not the homo", well, that has never been forgiven, and would be remembered.

And any other name is just running for VP.

And one thing the democrats cannot do is cede to the republicans the first serious woman candidate nominee. It would be foolish when democrats have a big majority in the polls of woman nationwide. It is time.

That is what I was referring to, after she left office. Also she HAS said multiple times she isn't interested in running. If people want to ignore the fact that it's been stated, so be it.

It's ignorance to assume she is the only woman who is a Democrat who could become the first woman president.

The presidency isn't about a de facto candidate who inherits the thrown. That's how the Republicans play. Look at where it has gotten them in the last two elections.

The race in earnest is going to start pretty much right away. That's unfortunately what the presidential cycle has turned into. Obama announced in Feb 2007 a full 19 months before the 2008 election. There were plenty of people who announced earlier (if you don't believe me go look on Wikipedia).

As to former presidents supporting candidates, most in modern day history have come out to help candidates, but there are exceptions to that. It was Gore in 2000 that pushed back against using Clinton (an obvious a mistake on Gore's part because Clinton could have made the difference with at least one or two states which would have changed history). Mittens would be even more of a complete idiot then he already is if he put W. out there to campaign for him.

As for the rest of the stuff you spouted, it's just pure bs.

Obama announced 19 months beofre 2008 and you are saying Hillary needs to announce 50 months before 2016

checkmate pal.


If Liz Warren would announce today she swore she would keep her senate seat the entire term, and then run for reelection, she would gain 3-10 point immediately. Her fans are harming her close senate race by this talk of presidency, one which she would lose. They think she is a temp.
She needs to stay in the Senate.(should she win, and I am not convinced she will win, despite the couple of polls that have her in the lead.)
And any candidate from Mass that runs for President has a very hard time coming close to winning. Ask Mike Dukakis, John Kerry and now Mittens. Ask Paul Tsongis. Ask Ted Kennedy, who was the best of the best.
But I am not convinced Warren would win more than NY Mass and California. Certainly she don't show she could win Texas which will be near blue by then.

I sure though hope you weren't one of those who wanted John(biggest fraud of all time) Edwards, who spewed this same sort of "she isn't going to do it" "he isn't going to do it" crap.

and Andy Cuomo is out, his wishy washy father couldn't decide(actually there is a major skeleton in the closet), and Andy has that same major skelton.
And also, there is that Vote for Cuomo not the Homo campaign that was done.
I for one, and no one else who remembers it, or would hear about it, would ever vote for him
for President. He is not qualified to be President, especially as a democrat, after those remarks
(and you can look it up).

As for annointed? When Hillary wins the delegates, nationwide, that is winning, not annointing.
Just like Obama did in 2008. Just like Obama did in 2012.

pipedreams like George McGovern and Eugene McCarthy and Howard Dean are just not enough to secure victory.

You need a heavy weight out there, (which is why Obama unlike Gore is a winner and why Nader and thank God any 3rd party is no longer wanted anywhere for President).

A winner does what a loser won't. Matters little as long as we win in 16 and 20, to secure the court for decades and then get the 5% that Obama wasn't able to(including amnesty for all people in US and immediate citizenship, and then improve on the health care.

10% of something is better than 100% of nothing. The only time I was wrong on elections was 2000, going back like 50 years. And that was 100% due to Ralph Nader nothing else.
And that bullshit about dems and repubs being the same.

Now if only Jerry Brown would become President, but alas, that too is a pipedream, and I want to win not toke my pipe.

I clarified that I understood Clinton was stepping down next year and thus she would be free to run if she wanted to. She has repeatedly said she won't. You can continue to lie about it, that's fine. Ignorance is bliss I guess.

I never said anything about Warren (since you are implying I did, please point it out to me). I have confidence there are plenty of capable women in the US of being president. So you are dead wrong about what you are implying.

I supported Kerry/Edwards in 2004. Are you telling me I was wrong? I bet you at least 95% of the people on this board did as well.

As to who I supported in 2008, I supported Obama beginning in April 2007. At first I was torn between him and Edwards, but chose Obama because I felt he was the better candidate.

Not everyone has to fall into line with what you regard as "the truth"

Jesus, get a life!

Edit: I almost forgot, you seem to have a big problem with people on DU given you've had 5 hidden posts in the last 90 days. Maybe you should think about that one.

I don't see him running.

nothing stops them

W's being AWOL didn't stop him either and Iran/Contra and the hostage delay didn't stop 41

It's what they excel at.

If we lose this year, we need to start acting like them.

And his handling of NJ's economy will be a big issue. All of the surrounding states are doing much better and only one of them (PA) has a Republican Gov.

The GOP will be rebuilding and that included Jeb Bush. I wouldn't completely rule out a few others jockeying for positions, but I doubt if it will include Ryan. I am certain that process is well along the way behind the scenes as I really don't believe they wanted to win this year. I consider Romney to be a placeholder and not a candidate. They have always been looking at 2016.

This election-if the Republicans fail to win the WH and Senate could be the biggest deterrent to Citizens United IMHO

unlike when they nominated conservative like they did in 1980, 84, 88,2000 and 2004. Don't those RINOs ever learn?"

.

all ready broken his "read my lips" pledge about not raising taxes and was no longer running as a conservative in 92.

G. H. W. Bush was not a liberal. He was uninspiring, had to run against the best campaigner of the 20th century and had Ross Perot to thank for his loss. Had Perot not split the republican vote, Daddy Bush would have won. Bob Dole was simply too old and too uninspiring to take on Clinton. John McCain lost not because he was too liberal but because he picked a loser for a running mate. I, like many others, had deep misgivings about electing a president who had just 2 years experience in national politics. I was giving McCain a serious look...until he selected Palin...she is just too dumb to be allowed anywhere near the oval office. Romney is not a liberal, he is simply a horrible candidate who has adopted all the right wing absurdities and has demonstrated he is simply spineless and will not stand up to the wing nuts. He also made a poor choice with his running mate. No one believes Ryan is a true conservative, he voted for both wars and Medicare part D...putting all three on the national credit card....there is nothing conservative about that. He also voted against Simpson-Bowles...nothing conservative there either.

Dole and McCain were given "their shot" at the nomination because the party operatives didn't believe there was a snowball's chance in hell of the GOP taking the WH in those elections....They were correct. So those 2 old white guys, who had been party faithfuls, got their gratuitous chance. Romney is exactly what the party operatives deserve. They crammed him down the throats of republican primary voters and it looks like they will all choke on him. Look at who he had to run against in the primaries...do you really think that was by accident? Gingrich, a serial adulterer. Cain, a clueless clown. Perry who couldn't remember his own talking points. Bachmann, too extreme for anybody who is not certifiable themselves. Santorum...didn't win re-election in his own state. Pawlenty who could put a manic to sleep. There was one possible candidate who could have returned the WH to the GOP...Jon Huntsman... smart, articulate, honest and not crazy. Ya'll didn't want him. So when will you learn that the nation is not as stupid or as crazy as you might want. This is not a nation of birthers or Birchers...and if you keep trying to run the heirs of John Birch, you will continue to lose.

Ever wonder why Jeb Bush didn't throw his hat into the ring? Or Chris Christie? They don't believe this election is winnable by anyone who is going to pander to right wing nuts.

You have a strange way of saying it. Sorry I misunderstood.

using sarcasm tags diminishes the point

Money seems to be no object to the likes of Kochs and Adelsons. Like dropping a million or more on a poker bet and lost. They'll dump Romney, maybe not Ryan. They'll pour more $$ to try to lock in the Congress in another 2 years and then place their bets again on another loser in 2016.

I REALLY hope Ryan loses his Congressional seat this election as well. I'd like to see him go back to a real job back home

The Jeb Bush 2016 campaign starts.

Establishment for not choosing the most conservative candidate vs. the side that will blame the Teabaggers for making people cow tow to their wishes.

It'll be interesting, but it ain't over.

When Republicans lose--IF they lose--they tend to double down. Unlike us Democrats and liberals who have this weird inferiority complex, the conservatives/Republicans NEVER act like losers as we've seen for the past several years. They have exploited their minority status to the fullest. And where they lost at the federal or congressional level, they turn their sights to the state legislatures, governorships, and judgeships. We have a lot to learn from the conservatives.

to run the GOP.

He's going to have a ton of money. Watch and see.

And watch Christie have that Gastric bypass surgery and run against him.

Wouldn't that be nice?

At the beginning of the debate, she said she wasn't necessarily going to answer the questions asked of her, because she just wanted to use the debate as an opportunity to speak to the American media without the "lame-stream media" filtering her out.

What she was really doing was repeating her rehearsed talking points because she couldn't actually answer anything that required thought or knowledge.

And nobody in the MSM called her out on it.

Do we not think Willard might do the same?

Will not actually answer questions but will regurgitate his memorized talking points as appropriate.
History has proven he does *not* think well on his feet. Obama will mop the floor with him.

Just put the two candidates on either side of a table, and let them argue with one another for an hour.

The moderator makes sure each one gets a chance to ask questions, and that the other person actually answers the questions that were asked.

Also, they should have to compete against each other on Jeopardy.

She's already got the curtains and china picked.

I hope he pale(ins)

if we are so lucky he could end up on faux news.

they will have to flee to a neutral country to avoid the wrath of their bankers. The rich in the GOP will be pissed. Obamacare will become rooted, and the people will love it. No Rethug will be able to win by running against it. The Koch Bros. will take a major financial hit when the pollution emissions of their industries (old, grandfathered) must come into compliance in about 2015. It will be cheaper to sell them to Bain for foreign export than to add pollution controls to them. The Kochs may be so pissed that they immigrate.

....they'll go on looting and pillaging, but Mitt won't get invited to any more of their parties...

and the same people were with her as with Mittens.

and there are only so many hours in a day people watch tv and see commercials.
With the election coming quickly, and there are 5 ads a day for example, the impact of doubling that is zero. People just get annoyed when there are so many nasty commercials which is all the money in the world from these people can do.

As Obama is fast approaching 50 or more % in the important states, that means every undecided voter can vote for Mittens, but he will still lose those states.(and nobody gets 100% of undecideds anyhow.

Our descent into Mau Mau socialism will then proceed to completion. The 47% will grow to 97%. Obama, as a lame duck president in his 2nd term, will feel free to fill his cabinet full of his relatives from the jungles of Kenya.

At least that's what I read on the comments to news articles at news.yahoo.com

n today's dollars he sold $377K of stock in 1969 so that he could go to college without working or loans:
http://www.uawregion8.net/Region-News/region-news-06.htm

Did he earn that money? Nope. Got it from Daddy.

PLEASE START A THREAD ON THIS--I CANNOT

not sure if he ever, really did. He is a Moderate but is and has been hamstrung by his ignorant base but he doesn't understand them anymore then the working man. The guy is completely lost.

Trust me. They have billionaires on tap. What gives me pause are fraudulent voting machines.