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amborin

(16,631 posts)
Sat Mar 19, 2016, 09:15 PM Mar 2016

Robert Scheer talks w/ Thomas Franks ("What's Matter w/ KS"): Clintons: "A different kind of evil"

http://www.truthdig.com/avbooth/item/audio_robert_scheer_talks_with_thomas_frank_20160318

Frank tells Robert Scheer how the party has become class-based, now representing primarily the “professional” or upper socioeconomic class. Frank also talks about the Clintons’ role in this shift and why he believes people who might have earlier voted for Democrats are now flocking to Donald Trump.

When Scheer suggests that Bill and Hillary Clinton may not represent a lesser evil—when compared to Republicans—but merely a “different kind of evil,Frank responds: “You could make the argument that Bill Clinton did things in the 1990s that no Republican would have been capable of doing. ... Reagan couldn’t push bank deregulation as far as Clinton did. Clinton did things that Reagan would never have dared to do: welfare reform ... [and] NAFTA.

George Bush couldn’t get NAFTA passed. ... So you start to think that the game that the Clintons play with us, where we vote for them because we have nowhere else to go. ... There’s a sort of political economics of how we the voters are manipulated in this situation, and they’re very, very good at playing that game. And so people like you and me who are on the left are captured, basically. We don’t have anywhere else to go. And they play us in a certain way.

He continues: “I have a lot of friends who say you can’t criticize the Democrats because you’ll just weaken them and then the Republicans will get in. But I say that we can’t give up our critical faculties just because of the ugly historical situation that we’re in.”

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Robert Scheer talks w/ Thomas Franks ("What's Matter w/ KS"): Clintons: "A different kind of evil" (Original Post) amborin Mar 2016 OP
The other term is party realignment nadinbrzezinski Mar 2016 #1
another key term is "counter scheduling" nashville_brook Mar 2016 #5
Well yes, that is part of the problem nadinbrzezinski Mar 2016 #16
Some flameouts are going to be beautiful to see.... LexVegas Mar 2016 #2
yeah it's all about Bernie......I'm glad you like to live in a non-democracy Armstead Mar 2016 #13
as TF writes, it's all about the "professional class" grabbing more for themselves nashville_brook Mar 2016 #26
"but Trump's scaring all his voters into choosing him! not like us! we're Democrats!" MisterP Mar 2016 #3
Listen, Liberal! (best seller, Amazon) nashville_brook Mar 2016 #4
Our county chair yesterday blamed Republicans for bank deregulation. vintx Mar 2016 #6
The Dem Party takeover by the Third Wayers and their unthinking lapdogs is almost complete. Broward Mar 2016 #7
It makes me feel nauseated. Literally. nt vintx Mar 2016 #8
Some of us have woken up. Hell Hath No Fury Mar 2016 #9
It is a difficult mental adjustment FlatBaroque Mar 2016 #10
+100000 Armstead Mar 2016 #11
Don't give up your critical faculties! Octafish Mar 2016 #12
i remember when Thomas Frank took his leave of absence to write this... nashville_brook Mar 2016 #23
couldn't agree more Vote2016 Mar 2016 #14
I listened to this podcast last night BernieforPres2016 Mar 2016 #15
if you're like me, and like to have stuff to listen to...get the Audiobook! nashville_brook Mar 2016 #21
Excellent post. Nice antidote to the fiction Hillary backers have been tossing around. Karmadillo Mar 2016 #17
K & R AzDar Mar 2016 #18
The politics of fear is past it's shelf life and isn't selling as well as it has previously. Tierra_y_Libertad Mar 2016 #19
Thomas Frank - one of my heroes. Brilliant political analyst and historian. And he's funny too! Nanjeanne Mar 2016 #20
if you don't read The Baffler, it's totally Spy Mag for our decade. nashville_brook Mar 2016 #22
Thanks for the link! Nanjeanne Mar 2016 #28
I like that! a “different kind of evil” Nedsdag Mar 2016 #24
K&R CharlotteVale Mar 2016 #25
K & R mountain grammy Mar 2016 #27
Kick bobthedrummer Mar 2016 #29
A not so kinder, gentler kind of evil.... SammyWinstonJack Mar 2016 #30
Isn't there a better link. . . this one takes forever to load and it still isn't finished. pdsimdars Mar 2016 #31

LexVegas

(6,031 posts)
2. Some flameouts are going to be beautiful to see....
Sat Mar 19, 2016, 09:35 PM
Mar 2016

As HRC puts Bernies failing campaign out of its misery.

nashville_brook

(20,958 posts)
26. as TF writes, it's all about the "professional class" grabbing more for themselves
Sun Mar 20, 2016, 05:03 PM
Mar 2016

the rest of the country really doesn't matter, as that post sadly illustrates. and you can't really blame them, as they've been told for decades that they are indeed the anointed ones: The creative class, the wired workers, the well-graduated.

Thomas Frank points out that the narrative constructed from the 90s and beyond is that people who have been left behind in this economy have done it to themselves. they should have graduated from Ivy League schools, and gone into financial services.

It's a myth that's laughable on its face. has there ever been a country of nothing but high-degreed professionals doing well-paid work, without the muss and fuss of real workers? what's really being putting forth in that script, i wonder? where do we expect those people to go -- you know, the ones who (gasp!) didn't go to college, or have no interest in derivatives, and would like to simply live working on a living wage? are we to believe that they don't deserve a living wage b/c they don't do work on keyboards wired to the internet?

 

vintx

(1,748 posts)
6. Our county chair yesterday blamed Republicans for bank deregulation.
Sun Mar 20, 2016, 09:58 AM
Mar 2016

I commented that Democrats had a hand in that. The Hillary supporter in front of me laughed and said don't hate on my buddy Bill (or something to that effect).

I do not know how these people sleep at night.

Broward

(1,976 posts)
7. The Dem Party takeover by the Third Wayers and their unthinking lapdogs is almost complete.
Sun Mar 20, 2016, 10:06 AM
Mar 2016

Bernie is/was our last chance.

 

Hell Hath No Fury

(16,327 posts)
9. Some of us have woken up.
Sun Mar 20, 2016, 10:29 AM
Mar 2016

Yes, believe it or not, I was a Clinton True Believer back in the day.

My believe in The Clintons and the Democratic Party under them was a transformation that began right here on DU -- it's amazing what information the age of the Internet can reveal. It was like the peeling back of an onion. Layer after layer, exposed, discarded, until I came to the point I am now: fully awake and unwilling to continue being held captive.

I now look back at what I defended, I excused, I overlooked, I justified and cringe.

Now that I have been let lose from the Clinton Closet, there isn't anyone who is going to stuff me back in. Ever.

Octafish

(55,745 posts)
12. Don't give up your critical faculties!
Sun Mar 20, 2016, 10:35 AM
Mar 2016

Thomas Frank puts things into words that people can remember.

Thank you for an outstanding OP and article, amborin!

nashville_brook

(20,958 posts)
23. i remember when Thomas Frank took his leave of absence to write this...
Sun Mar 20, 2016, 04:57 PM
Mar 2016

been waiting for his return. this is quite an impressive product of his sabbatical.

BernieforPres2016

(3,017 posts)
15. I listened to this podcast last night
Sun Mar 20, 2016, 10:58 AM
Mar 2016

And also listened to Thom Hartmann's discussion with Thomas Franks. There is simply no defense of the Clintons and the rest of the Third Way Progressives unless you are a conservative.

nashville_brook

(20,958 posts)
21. if you're like me, and like to have stuff to listen to...get the Audiobook!
Sun Mar 20, 2016, 04:51 PM
Mar 2016

it's especially good b/c Thomas Frank does his own reading.

http://www.audible.com/search/ref=a_hp_tseft?advsearchKeywords=listen+liberal&filterby=field-keywords&x=0&y=0&sprefixRefmarker=nb_sb_ss_i_0_12&sprefix=listen+liber

if you're not already a subscriber, they offer a free book with trial subscriptions.

 

Tierra_y_Libertad

(50,414 posts)
19. The politics of fear is past it's shelf life and isn't selling as well as it has previously.
Sun Mar 20, 2016, 02:12 PM
Mar 2016

People are beginning that voting for the "lesser of two evils" or a "different evil" just perpetuates the corruption of our government and democracy.

Nanjeanne

(4,915 posts)
20. Thomas Frank - one of my heroes. Brilliant political analyst and historian. And he's funny too!
Sun Mar 20, 2016, 03:15 PM
Mar 2016

Speaks the truth. When he wrote "What's the Matter With Kansas" it opened my eyes to how people can vote against their own best interest. I used to see and hear him all the time on TV and talk radio. Guess now that so much of the media has it's own corporatist agenda is why I rarely see him anymore, although he was on Thom Hartmann's program on Friday Tis a pity more people don't hear him.

 

pdsimdars

(6,007 posts)
31. Isn't there a better link. . . this one takes forever to load and it still isn't finished.
Mon Mar 28, 2016, 04:27 PM
Mar 2016

All I get is an ad at the top and it never actually gets to anything else.

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