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NCTraveler

(30,481 posts)
Sun Mar 20, 2016, 09:57 AM Mar 2016

Bernie Sanders is pointing out the flaws in our system every day.

His overall point on income inequality and governments role is based in capitalism run amuck and the piecemeal regulations that don't control what I believe to be the greatest flaw of capitalism; survival of the fittest.

Sanders, and his form of democratic socialism, is something just about all of us here agree on. It is a combination of heavily regulated capitalism combined with a much broader view of governments role in providing a social safety net.

I believe that is what really attracted Sanders to MLK early on as that was a cornerstone of MLK's message. Sanders involvement at that time was significant as I believe he was educated by one of the best minds and speakers on the issue in history, MLK himself.

I believe Sanders original plan was to work his way into power and fight the system from within. His entrance into politics was difficult and it took a lot of effort just to get his foot in the door. He did so in a region that really doesn't provide one with much clout on a national level. Overall, he still fought the good fight, with many small victories, and kept working his way up the political ladder.

Once he got to congress, he was met with reality. Our government, by brilliant design, moves slow as hell outside of major crisis. It is not a friendly place for an activist or for quick and massive change.

"moves slow as hell outside of major crisis." That right there is the kicker and is the failing of Sanders, our government, and we the people. Sanders has known for decades that income inequality and the governments lack of response, sometimes flat out support, is a major crisis. Many of us recognize it.

Sanders has been fighting it for decades with no better results than anyone else. While he learned from one of the best, he completely missed the greatness of MLK. Coalition building. At seventy some years old, a lifetime as a politician, Sanders is building a coalition for the first time. It is impressive, politicians are taking notice, and the people are taking notice.

I am not making the equation to Sanders being MLK, as that would be laughable at best, but this movement sure is MLKesque in concept, though it is missing the scope. It is a movement that we must keep alive after the election. It is not political movement, it is a social movement, being led by a career politician.

The attachment of the movement to a career politician, in a presidential primary, is one of its greatest negatives and positives.

Negative. So much has become about the man, not the movement. He himself is being critiqued, and there is a lot to critique. Some of which I touched on above.

Positive. There's no greater time to build the coalition and tap into the anger than during an election. It is a time when resources not normally available become readily available. The difficult part will be holding its scale after the primary. It somehow needs to transfer over to the occupy movement or something similar.

This movement is real. It will not be diminished and it isn't going anywhere. The promotion of income inequality as a crisis is accurate and people are waking up to it. With the groundswell we are seeing, we are on a path to more robust regulation and more swift action to deal with the crisis.

To those who don't think I support Sanders because I'm voting for Clinton, you could be no more wrong. This is a primary on DU and a part of the fun is the competition itself. I believe Clinton is our best shot at the most rapid change under current conditions. Have I taken shots at Sanders? Hell yes. He is a politician and some of his positions deserve it. Just as some of Clintons do. It doesn't mean I'm attacking you. That also doesn't mean I don't support the movement promoting income inequality as a crisis, and that is Sanders main goal.


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12 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Bernie Sanders is pointing out the flaws in our system every day. (Original Post) NCTraveler Mar 2016 OP
"Sanders is building a coalition for the first time" vintx Mar 2016 #1
I don't know what that has to do... NCTraveler Mar 2016 #2
That explains a lot. nt vintx Mar 2016 #3
Agree. A 91-3 vote.. NCTraveler Mar 2016 #4
Where I disagree -- Clinton is the epitome of the problem. Democrat complacency and corruption Armstead Mar 2016 #5
I believe you hit on some valid points. NCTraveler Mar 2016 #7
I'm not either, but I appreciate your OP Armstead Mar 2016 #8
Recommended (#1) H2O Man Mar 2016 #6
I don't know what to do. NCTraveler Mar 2016 #9
It's been tough here, too. H2O Man Mar 2016 #10
the 'coalition' he's attracted is as politically nebulous as his career has been bigtree Mar 2016 #11
You really just hit big points as to why I'm supporting Clinton. NCTraveler Mar 2016 #12
 

vintx

(1,748 posts)
1. "Sanders is building a coalition for the first time"
Sun Mar 20, 2016, 10:03 AM
Mar 2016

This is simply not true.

Bernie Sanders Is a Loud, Stubborn Socialist. Republicans Like Him Anyway.
His achievements include the bipartisan VA reform bill: "Frankly, without him, I don't think we would have gotten it done."


Lawmakers on both sides of the aisle, including Sanders himself, point to last year's deal to improve the disastrous, scandal-ridden Veterans Affairs Department as a highlight. After weeks of negotiating with a cadre of Republican colleagues, Sanders helped pass the deal on a 91-3 vote in the Senate. "In a pretty dysfunctional Congress I helped pass, in a bipartisan way, the significant veterans bill, which increases health care to veterans and lowers waiting times, and I'm proud of that," Sanders said. "That was a significant step forward."

"He knew when to hold and knew when to fold and, I think, maximized what we could get for veterans," said Sen. Chuck Schumer, who also participated in the VA talks.

Sanders has also passed an amendment to the Dodd-Frank bill that led to the first audit of the Federal Reserve. He and Sen. Robert Menendez secured funding in the 2008 stimulus bill for clean-energy initiatives. And he inserted language into the Affordable Care Act to increase funding for community health centers.

Those legislative wins are roughly on par with those of his fellow classmates of 2006, including more moderate members whose ideological leanings more easily lend them to compromise with the other side, such as Sens. Jon Tester and Bob Corker.

http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2015/07/bernie-sanders-is-a-loud-stubborn-socialist-republicans-like-him-anyway/450597/
 

NCTraveler

(30,481 posts)
2. I don't know what that has to do...
Sun Mar 20, 2016, 10:06 AM
Mar 2016

With building a lasting coalition. I believe it solidifies my point.

 

NCTraveler

(30,481 posts)
4. Agree. A 91-3 vote..
Sun Mar 20, 2016, 10:12 AM
Mar 2016

That senators were tripping over themselves to vote for is the go-to to prove he is a lasting coalition builder.

 

Armstead

(47,803 posts)
5. Where I disagree -- Clinton is the epitome of the problem. Democrat complacency and corruption
Sun Mar 20, 2016, 10:24 AM
Mar 2016

Sanders should have merely been another Congressman and Senator whose positions aligned with a Democratic Party that had the same concerns for the problems he has been pointing out, and the same determination and policies to fix them.

Instead the Democrats have been part of the problem -- either by complicity with the Corrupt nexus of Corporate immorality and Wall St. criminality and the GOP...or by cowardice.

That is not a part of the "checks and balances" built into out government. It was a whole series of bad conscious choices and bad actions over the years by the leadership of the Democratic Party.

Sanders is not Superman or Jesus. But he is one of a minority of politicians -- along with Paul Wellstone, and several others -- who tried for decades to steer the Democratic Party in a better redirection, but were ignored and marginalized.

The Clintons were leaders of the reactionary Corporate Democrat Conservative elites that suppressed that, and opened the gates to a new Gilded Age.

That, ultimately is what the primary has been about.

 

NCTraveler

(30,481 posts)
7. I believe you hit on some valid points.
Sun Mar 20, 2016, 10:35 AM
Mar 2016

No all but I'm not really in the debating mood this morning.

I do agree with a good portion of what you stated.

H2O Man

(73,528 posts)
6. Recommended (#1)
Sun Mar 20, 2016, 10:33 AM
Mar 2016

I would point out that the #1 reason Bernie hasn't been "more effective" in the House and Senate has been the Democrats, who are at very best slightly more likely than republicans to support MLK's economic message.

 

NCTraveler

(30,481 posts)
9. I don't know what to do.
Sun Mar 20, 2016, 10:43 AM
Mar 2016

I believe we are currently in an enormous hole at the local level and that has severely damaged us nationally. I will get you some links soon but the redistricting in my area was deplorable and a huge win for conservatives locally and nationally.

Many of our deficits nationally, and the increase in moderate dems nationally while losing numbers overall as well, are a direct results losing fights locally.

Before I started my business I was more involved at the local level. I'm starting to get back into it. I have become more and more progressive over my life. I hope that continues because my retirement years are going to be spent raising hell in my area politically.

Here's to good health and the possibility I will retire one day.

H2O Man

(73,528 posts)
10. It's been tough here, too.
Sun Mar 20, 2016, 10:55 AM
Mar 2016

A few years back, in my hometown, the Town Supervisor made the national news, by attempting to force a tiny Sufi settlement to destroy their legal cemetery. He and two associates were of a fringe "tea party" group, that worked within the republican party. Old friends there asked me to help organize, and by finding common ground with the Democratic Party, the Democratic Left, and some sane republicans, we elected the first Democratic majority the Town Board ever had.

We then began expanding that model to other communities, with success. The opposition remained consistent, while our side began experiencing the to-be-expected in-fighting, fatigue, etc.

It's not that differing opinions and even different values are "bad," in and of themselves. It's how we deal with them. DU:GDP provides a wonderful illustration of the worst possible way to deal with difference, between good people that should be able to work together.

bigtree

(85,986 posts)
11. the 'coalition' he's attracted is as politically nebulous as his career has been
Sun Mar 20, 2016, 11:06 AM
Mar 2016

...it reminds me of one of the countless benefit concerts I attended where you can find dozens of booths set up advocating a wide range of progressive issues, all but obscuring whatever the concert was originally for.

Moreover, without a clear path to accomplishing the ideals expressed by his campaign and supporters, the effort becomes self-serving to his own election, rather than what most of us involved in politics understand as 'coalition building' within the system to effect change. Where is his support and encouragement of new legislators who would usher in his brand of change?

Further, his broad-brush attacks against the political 'establishment' he's been part and parcel of for decades, and has relied on to help buttress his own agenda as a legislator when it suited him, have stirred up more resentment than hope that we can come together as Democrats in the end to move forward together.

 

NCTraveler

(30,481 posts)
12. You really just hit big points as to why I'm supporting Clinton.
Sun Mar 20, 2016, 11:15 AM
Mar 2016

I will still support the movement overall, even though I find some elements of it to be disturbing. I agree with the overall concept. It just so happens I believe the crisis is larger that they are promoting.

H2O seems to have put it better than I can in his post above. Not in support of my position, but highlighting the difficulty in growth of a movement.

I disagree with Clinton on numerous issues. I still feel she is the best choice by far. I disagree with many elements of Sanders movement, I still support many of its main points.

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