2016 Postmortem
Related: About this forumFine. I'll say it. If it comes down to Clinton vs Biden, I'm for Joe.
Yes I know we haven't even had the 2014 midterms yet. And I urge all Democrats to work for and contribute to Democrats running in that election and vote for them. It's extremely important.
But since the 2016 election is already being discussed in a multitude of threads, let me put in my two cents. Joe Biden would make a better president than Hillary Clinton and he is just as qualified to be president if not more so. He has been on the front lines fighting for liberal causes and social and class justice for his entire adult life.
We could do far worse than him for president. Remember he was the one who pushed President Obama to change his position on gay marriage. And he has been a sensible and calming influence on the administration's foreign policy. And he is a well respected statesman.
He has also been very strong on campaign finance reform and on reining in Wall Street.
Of course he is not prefect as no politician is. He voted in favor of authorizing the illegal invasion of Iraq in 2003 as Clinton did. Of course since Warren wasn't in the Senate at the time we don't know how she would have voted.
Yes I could enthusiastically support Senator Warren. But what if she keeps to her word and doesn't run? And yes it's high time that we broke the glass ceiling and elected a woman president. But I don't think that Clinton is that woman. If it comes down to Hillary vs Joe I'm for Joe.
yeoman6987
(14,449 posts)Joe is too gaff prone. Hillary really has worked hard for the job. She has been a success at everything she has done in her life. We must come together and at least try and respect her enough to make her President of the United States of America....our country deserves and needs Hillary Clinton for President!
Whisp
(24,096 posts)Hillary is the gaffer, she has such enormous, stupid gaffs another word has to be invented for them.
karynnj
(59,498 posts)to say. Both, in campaigns and in high position are taped for an incredible number of hours. It is hard to imagine that anyone could speak that much and say nothing that - even when isolated from context - can not be spun.
In 2008, when Kerry was a top advocate for Obama, he avoided any temptation to take a cheap shot when he was asked by media at an event (in Texas) for Obama if he thought that Hillary's Bosnia's comments should cause people to be concerned. His answer was that campaigns are incredibly tough - that for him the campaign in 2003/2004 was more physically exhausting than anything in his life and that he had always been athletic. Just thinking of what he said, it is clear has to be mentally, physically and emotionally extremely tough - and they have to be "on" for as many as 16 hours a day - while moving from hotel to hotel.
It is rather offensive - and demeaning - to these people who have risen to the top of the Democratic party that Democrats then take up the very attacks that the Republicans CREATE after parsing eveything and placing it in the very worst light.
I will admit that I see this most clearly for the politicians that I like most. In particular, I have often watched CSPAN or other links to see an entire John Kerry speech. He is an incredibly thoughtful, principled man and I almost always come away impressed --which will surprise no one here. Then, one of two things happen. There is no coverage - after all its "just" the Secretary of State -- OR - there is coverage of one or two sentences taken out of paragraphs that clearly explain what he is saying. This then is used by some Democrats, usually to his right, and the Republicans suggesting he is a loose cannon.
What I have seen, when I look for a fuller account of comments from Biden or, until recently, Hillary Clinton -- I often see the same thing. You might say that this is just the media looking for something more sensational --- except they actually buried genuinely dumb things George Bush said. Watching the NH race, it is interesting that the Boston Globe in the last week or so wrote the story of Scott Brown's selling his name to a sham company and since then going after that story with many followups - but the BG alone can not be an echo chamber.
lunatica
(53,410 posts)and I'm a political junkie. It's a lie invented to make people think that when he tells the truth it's just a gaffe. He's a straight shooter when it comes to telling the truth - an almost impossible feat for politicians so it's easy to create a lie.
I'll vote for whoever gets the nomination. But I think Hillary is as much a lighting rod as Obama is. She always has been. It would be another 4 to 8 years of stagnation and obstruction accompanied with insults and derision and threats of impeachment.
Frankly I'm sick to death of it.
Thinkingabout
(30,058 posts)I like Biden but he is famous for his gaffes.
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2012/04/26/the-never-ending-list-of-vice-president-joe-biden-s-verbal-gaffes.html
Leme
(1,092 posts)LoisB
(7,188 posts)comment during the 2008 campaign in West Virginia. I will do a write-in.
FiveGoodMen
(20,018 posts)She said a lot of terrible things during that campaign, but that was the worst.
Whisp
(24,096 posts)gack!
Beacool
(30,247 posts)She was just quoting a poll. She was also correct, she was ahead of Obama and won WV by a large margin.
All these constant self righteous statements of people who refuse to vote for her if she's the nominee are a bore.
Vote, don't vote, who gives a damn?
LoisB
(7,188 posts)vote for the person of my choosing. It is also my right to voice my opinion; if you don't like it, don't read it.
Beacool
(30,247 posts)One thing I know is Hillary's 2008 campaign. I was there for the duration.
As for your vote, do whatever you want with it. Waste it on a third party candidate, sit home and mope, whatever........
InAbLuEsTaTe
(24,122 posts)Xipe Totec
(43,888 posts)Whisp
(24,096 posts)Beacool
(30,247 posts)I saw it in Paris on a rainy afternoon.
Whisp
(24,096 posts)We use a word from the movie that cracks us up: Obb Stackles.
I can't get into the back room on account of them Obb Stackles in the way. lol.
Beacool
(30,247 posts)Not only did I see it in Paris, it was released there before it was released in the US.
Response to totodeinhere (Original post)
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TheCowsCameHome
(40,167 posts)on the way out.
Response to TheCowsCameHome (Reply #6)
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VanillaRhapsody
(21,115 posts)totodeinhere
(13,057 posts)VanillaRhapsody
(21,115 posts)My choice didn't win in the Primary....but you don't hear me complaining about it....I bucked up and respected the choice my fellow Democrats made.
I am not going to go around denigrating ANY Democratic candidate. Because I AM a Democrat.
totodeinhere
(13,057 posts)we are going to have to take sides. And there's nothing wrong with saying whose side I would be on.
Peacetrain
(22,872 posts)I can't tell you why, but for the life of me, I just do not see her running again. My guess is that we are going to have someone running that no one is even talking about right now.. Just a guess
davidpdx
(22,000 posts)There are going to be some crushed souls on DU the day it happens. I'll go one step further and say you are going to hear some rather nasty accusations revolving around the decision that have nothing to do with the Republicans.
blkmusclmachine
(16,149 posts)demosincebirth
(12,530 posts)totodeinhere
(13,057 posts)would win. The Republican Party is toast on the national level until it moves away from its right wing extremism, and I see no sign that it will do that anytime soon.
demosincebirth
(12,530 posts)wish-washy as a scrub board. These are the ones who elect Presidents, sad to say.
Liberal_Stalwart71
(20,450 posts)JayhawkSD
(3,163 posts)...which is one of the most anti-populist peices of legislation to pass Congress in several generations.
The being said, Biden is more liberal on his worst day that Clinton is on her best day, and is so much better for the working class that Clinton is not even on the same planet with him.
totodeinhere
(13,057 posts)mwrguy
(3,245 posts)He has my vote.
snot
(10,504 posts)davidpdx
(22,000 posts)The inevitability drum will keep on beating.
mgcgulfcoast
(1,127 posts)but Joe Biden looks ancient. Dont we someone a bit more vigorous to support?