eom

Maybe some people are not used to that?

nothing compared to any or all Rebubs

Save the negative for the Rebubs and feel free to tout the merits of your favorite Democratic candidate.


This crap is getting old.

Bernie runs on his record, HRC runs from hers.

Gay Rights is so awful if I were a supporter I wouldn't mention it at all. But hey it gives us a chance to talk about Bernie's record and to compare the two.

And we can always start another fundraiser for Bernie again each time they come up with a new distortion, like we did re Brock.

Kerry enlisted in the Vietnam War and got medals. Dimson's daddy got him into the Texas Air National Guard (which was NOT the National Guard, btw). When time came to take a drug test, Dimson went AWOL, never to be heard from the Texas Air National Guard again. So, what does Rove do? Attack Kerry on his military service.

Very similar to Hillary's supporters attacking Sanders on equal marriage, war votes, and almost anything else.

Attending the Republican National Convention in 2004, where purple heart bandaids were among the souvenirs.


?1437258185

on doing just what Bernie is doing. Skip the dumb shit and just stick to the issues and plans to solve them. Not going to jump in the mud and start slinging it. That is not the Bernie way.

more decades ahead of Hillary on this? How is it not an issue?

Thing is, when we do praise Bernie, they respond by attacking him.

Poster says, "...stop telling the truth about Hillary."

Both Bernie and Hillary would be great in the White House. Both are strong supporters of LGBT rights, despite the fact that both of them, like most of the country, evolved on the issue of gay marriage.

The big thing is that Bernie can't get there, being a self-described socialist an all, and Hillary can.

I know you wish she was, but that doesn't make it true.

Sorry about that, have a great day.

Hillary creates almost no enthusiasm, is distrusted by all buy 80% of Democrats, and is tanking in the polls.

No thanks. I'll vote for the populist socialist.

You do the same.

I didn't say not to vote for a Democrat.

i vote my conscience.

My conscience won't let me hand the presidency to the GOP.

he is doing better against gop

but you have the right to use your vote as you see fit

Of course, the important thing is putting a Dem in the White House. After the primaries are done, we're all on the same team. Go Dems!

no more buying politicians!

have a lot in common in terms of goals. it just comes down to who each of us thinks is best to carry that out in the wh.

The left of the Democratic Party doesn't like her. Republicans hate her. Few indies like her. Her self avowed supporters are unenthusiastic.

Just make sure you vote for the Democratic candidate in the general, however the primary turns out.

Also no doubt that you are in no position whatever to issue orders about how people vote.

PS. I don't post anything unless I "really believe" it.

Which is that any sane progressive should do everything in their power to make sure Dems keep the White House.

Surely, despite our differences, we can agree on this basic principle.

Just make sure you vote for the Democratic candidate in the general, however the primary turns out.

obvious fact that we need to keep a Democrat in the white house. I mean, if you actually believe that Bernie is going to win the primary, then all this amounts to is a reminder to also vote for him in the GE. And yet people freak out at the suggestion.

Strange.

supporting the Dem nominee whoever it may be. There's no point in commanding people to do what they already intend to do. Just a friendly reminder is all.

she wins the primarily.

I think Bernie would have a better chance against any of the gop clowns

Not exactly as inspiring a slogan as "hope and change".

It was said that a black man with the middle name of Hussein couldn't be elected in 2008.

but the story rings true. They said Obama couldn't be elected, and now you are saying we should vote for Hillary cause Bernie can't be elected. LMAO.

supported him and donated back in 2007. Bernie's not Obama, though. By a long shot.

HELL fucking NO! I don't care if Bernie just came out for gay marriage yesterday seriously.

side of that issue always.

I have yet to hear an explanation of how his proposal would not have ended ALL de jure discrimination against gays. including as to marriage.

I suspect that is because no such explanation exists. In any event, Hillary fully supported discriminating against equal marriage until 2013, well after Obama came out for it, and see my sig line.

it didn't single out gays. Removing laws singling out gays would have either removed all laws about marriage period or left that defintion in place, neither would have let gays marry and yes I said this before when this was posted the first dozen times.

to a man and a woman discriminated against gays.

BTW, which gay advocacy groups were advocating for equal marriage in the 1970s?

but you can't have it both ways. You can say, well of course that means opening up marriage to gays but on the other hand, no one was saying open marriage up to gays. The fact is it didn't mean that then nor would it mean that now. And we now know that every word I wrote about this in the thread I was taken apart for is the truth thanks to Slate. The simple fact is he voted against DOMA for the same reason every other straight Congress person and Senator did.

That is not trying to have it both ways.

The simple fact is he voted against DOMA for the same reason every other straight Congress person and Senator did.

said why he voted against it. Unless the bloggers is an out and out liar the jig is up.

And, going to the point of the OP, how was Hillary's support of DOMA until 2013 preferable?

uncorrected by Sanders was the same as the reason the rest had. Oh, and we now know that he found marriage a divisive issue and opposed it (those were his words according to the blogger). I have asked the blogger for his sources, if and when he gives them to me you can rest assured I will post them here.

In a plural relationship with a few other Bs that lean to L havnt been able to suss this argument out.
As the Bf says 'shouldn't we feel the Bern if we want to flame?'
Love that boy.

It’s a dumb thread (of which there are many) and I’m dumb to respond.

As far as the person who is gay that will never ever support Hillary (like that’s a badge of honor if repeated over and over again?), no prob. I’ll cancel your vote out. As a man who happens to be gay, I’m raising Hill in 2016!

I’ve been ‘out’ since my early 20s (I’m 60 now) and there aren’t many folks who supported same-sex marriage back in the day. Maybe no one. At least our party has evolved.

What if Bernie supported same-sex marriage in, let’s say, 1985 and Hillary didn’t until 1992 (hypothetically). So your argument is that Hillary is “late to the game.” But what if someone else supported same-sex marriage in 1983, do you dump Bernie and go support that person because they were two years ahead of Bernie?

Stick with why you like your guy and quit the Hillary bashing. This crap is getting old. And I’ll also say those of us that support Hillary but also like Bernie are starting to not like Bernie because of his supporters on DU. Or maybe that’s just me. Sounds silly, but true. When there is constant bashing of someone I like and support (Hillary), I tend to rebel against those that are doing the bashing. Some Bernie supporters say they will never support Hillary if she is our nominee; the reverse is also true. Might want to tone it down and keep it civil.

And there are many angry threads about Hillary ‘surrogates’ and super pacs criticizing Bernie making it sound as if Hillary has initiated that herself. Just look at all the surrogates on DU that trash Hillary day in and day out. Kettle, meet pot!

Some of the vile things said about her should be saved for the Republicans. Who cares how these people evolved or when. Just as long as they did.

Sanders said we should eliminate all discriminatory laws in 1985. That would include laws banning "gay marriage". If you want a more explicit support for "gay marriage" as opposed to other discrimination, there's votes in the 1990s, most notably DOMA.

Clinton supported DOMA until a 60% majority opposed it in 2013. Making it appear that her position changed only when it was no longer politically tenable.

Why are you trying to create hypotheticals when we have their actual records? What about their records is not good enough to judge their beliefs?

If you don't understand politics by now, I'd question where you've been hiding.
[hr][font color="blue"][center]All things in moderation, including moderation.[/center][/font][hr]

But it's not how the vast majority of politicians work. I wish it was otherwise, too, and I'll vote for Sanders in the primary. But Clinton is still favored to win and LGBT rights will continue moving forward.
[hr][font color="blue"][center]All things in moderation, including moderation.[/center][/font][hr]

We can wish for one but it should be understandable why our flawed leaders are not perfect.
[hr][font color="blue"][center]All things in moderation, including moderation.[/center][/font][hr]

because its her turn!!!




policy agreement is not necessary. all serve the one percent and the MIC

and we have full marriage equality, why is it even an issue. Why have a contest about who agreed first? If they agree now, there's no problem - they are not opposing it now. Republicans are, so we need the one of our candidates most likely to win. If this is your only issue, that should be your only concern. Though, even the Republicans are not going to succeed in making us go backwards.

Please be real.

Roe v. Wade is law for over 40 years. The Republicans ranting on about it does not mean they have not lost. This is why I'm not going to bother researching whether it was Hillary or Bernie who became pro-choice first.

if they were, stone tablets can be broken.

If she wouldn't stick out her neck for us when it mattered, why do I think she'll be any different in the White House?

Marriage equality is one issue on the road to full equality. We have yet more work ahead of us.

It is also a sign about how she'll behave on social justice issues generally. She has proven herself to not be a risk-taker. In this day and age, with all the social justice issues facing us, I just don't find her disposition acceptable in a Democrat.

Last edited Tue Oct 6, 2015, 10:11 AM - Edit history (1)

It's a mysterious profit based logic system where fact and reason are arbitrary according to circumstance.

You may want to review what happened during the Clinton White House when "don't ask, don't tell" was being considered. She was an advocate for LBGT way back then.

I know you actually know the truth, and this is just another clinton-attack post. But, you may want to dig into the facts before you post something.

And...I don't think you are "supposed" to vote for anyone.

Dig deeper and you will see that they were not that far apart in their actions.

I don't claim that Hillary's record on GLBT is not superior to Bernie's. You do. Digging to try to prove your unprovable claim is not my job.

under the bus for political expediency. Was that what you meant?

She opposed same sex marriage until 2013.

She also said this:

We did not.
Now we do.
Bernie.
And, as has been flung at us so many times, we are not all single issue voters, either.

Good.

Second, there is no difference between Bernie and Hillary regarding this. So, you are presenting yourself with a false choice.

War (guns, bombs, dead people), TPP, fracking, cluster bombs, H-1B visas, facile lie about sniper fire, and then shrugging it off. I really am unable to compromise THAT much.

was sure Obama could not win, blamed everything on that woman card.
Voted for her in Florida, which was a clusterfuck indeed. never bought into the PUMA thing, though. I am a woman, but do not identify with women as a vengeful tribe.

Now, thanks to due diligence, I cannot support her, and my opinion of Bill is pretty low, too. If there had not been a Bernie or a Warren, I likely would have just ignored all of the primary stuff; lack of enthusiasm and interest, can't be helped.

despite his fucked up pandering at saddleback. WS defends Bernie's superior LGBT record aganst a smear in another post and you use Obama's sad anti-LGBT statement to show the OP is disingenuous? This place is nuts

Probably like most Bernie supporters on DU. So, I think it's fair to mention how those principles were tossed out the window then in favor of a male running for President against the same woman who is doing so now.

Does seem a bit disingenuous.

that since Clinton had to make a huge 180 shift in position on gay marriage, she deserves more credit than Sanders.

But not in the primaries.
I'm sure you had some sort of point.

Barack Obama's position was the same through the GE.

I do assume that you are not a homophobe or agreed with him yet still voted for him. So why the double standard. Hillarys position on gay marriage is the same as bernies this election cycle. So why would you use this issue as a reason to criticize others and question others primary choice and democrats bonafides.

Hillary supports full marriage equality today. This isn't 1969 or even 2008 when Bernie said same sex marriage should be left up to the states. This is 2015 and Hillary supports full equality and she is going to be the Democratic nominee.

back in 2004 i voted against issue here in Missouri to ban gay marriage.meanwhile Clinton gave speech calling marriage bond between one man and one woman.reportly Bill Clinton advised John Kerry to come out in favor of ballet initivaties Bush was pushing
to ban gay marriage in states.

have courage to stand with us when they did not before.

I appreciate Sanders support of my community but I am voting for Hillary. You need to do what feels right for you.

which is kinda rightwing in terms of the value they place on foresight and sense of justice the nominee will be expected to have, promote, and use.

In other words, to those who are and would be adversely affected or effected by the many and varied cruelties in this world -- like those in the LGBT community -- they say -- "FU people, we wanna elect someone who's always catching up instead of someone who's largely always been ahead..."

It's almost like this isn't applicable across most issues, whether primarily foreign or domestic in application.

SOmebody needs to ask -- "in what way is HC superior?"

oh that's right, she's the ONLY ELECTABLE one...lol

When it comes to civil rights Bernie's record is superior, anyone who tries to say differently has been drinking the koolaid.

Neither Bernie nor HRC is going to roll back the progress made on marriage equality.

Vote for the nominee in the general.
Forgiveness means you have stopped hoping for a better past.