Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

DanTex

(20,709 posts)
Tue Oct 27, 2015, 09:20 AM Oct 2015

There is one big reason why I'd like to see Bernie Sanders as president.

It would be a huge reality check to everyone currently bashing Obama for not magically getting the Republicans to come on board with his agenda (and who will no doubt bash Hillary for the same reason). In the unlikely event that Bernie becomes president, it will quickly become apparent that, in practical terms, nothing much will have changed from Obama.

There will be no single payer. There will be no free college. There will be no $15 minimum wage. What there will be is more gridlock and legislative battles, some executive actions. There will be some incremental progress, but, regardless of who is president (from the Dem side), we will be lucky if they approach Obama's historical presidency in terms of progressive accomplishments.

At some point during a Bernie presidency (maybe once he gives up on single payer after six months of failing to persuade a single Republican and many centrist Dems to support it), the Obama/Hillary bashers will have two alternatives. One, they can turn into Bernie bashers. Or two, they can finally wake up to the political reality that the president is not a dictator.

I'm guessing that a lot of them will choose door number two. And that would be good.

32 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
There is one big reason why I'd like to see Bernie Sanders as president. (Original Post) DanTex Oct 2015 OP
I recall a similar sentiment during Obama -- Clinton race Evergreen Emerald Oct 2015 #1
Bernie's goal is to get the masses involved no politician can JRLeft Oct 2015 #2
Exactly kenfrequed Oct 2015 #7
What makes you believe he thought Rahm Emanuel was a mistake? JRLeft Oct 2015 #8
Faith in human nature kenfrequed Oct 2015 #11
He was always a corporate democrat. JRLeft Oct 2015 #14
Right on! tecelote Oct 2015 #3
Of course voting matters. I'm voting Clinton in the primary, but what matters much more than DanTex Oct 2015 #4
Absolutely agree. tecelote Oct 2015 #6
his plan is to exert public pressure through the activism of his 'revolution' bigtree Oct 2015 #5
Every Other Pol That's Running For President Is Thinking They Are God's Gift And .... global1 Oct 2015 #25
actually bigtree Oct 2015 #26
How many of those revolutionary Bernie voters are in safe R districts? brooklynite Oct 2015 #28
For me, that would be a consolation prize. NurseJackie Oct 2015 #9
Point well made. NCTraveler Oct 2015 #10
The radical leftist extremists will treat Sanders the way the've treaated Obama... MohRokTah Oct 2015 #12
"Radical leftist extremists"? You mean people who favor Social Security and Medicare? Scuba Oct 2015 #16
The term speaks for itself. eom MohRokTah Oct 2015 #17
Thank you, MiddleMan. Scuba Oct 2015 #18
That is not my screen name. MohRokTah Oct 2015 #19
Sorry, I obviously confused you with someone else. Scuba Oct 2015 #29
The term you are looking for is "Democrats." PowerToThePeople Oct 2015 #20
No, Democrats have supported Obama. MohRokTah Oct 2015 #22
I think exactly as you do PowerToThePeople Oct 2015 #24
His ardents stood aside and refused to advocate to him policies we all supported and instead they Bluenorthwest Oct 2015 #31
Radical leftist extremists? pinebox Oct 2015 #23
Great, support Sanders! kenfrequed Oct 2015 #13
this assumes the presence restorefreedom Oct 2015 #15
I disagree PowerToThePeople Oct 2015 #21
Everybody needs to find their own path to supporting Sanders phantom power Oct 2015 #27
Dan, we're not expecting miracles. Chan790 Oct 2015 #30
This makes me nostalgic for 08 when Republicans said Obama was seen as some miracle working Bluenorthwest Oct 2015 #32

Evergreen Emerald

(13,069 posts)
1. I recall a similar sentiment during Obama -- Clinton race
Tue Oct 27, 2015, 09:25 AM
Oct 2015

One of the big complaints about Clinton at that time was that she was so hated by the republicans, she could get nothing done as President because they would not cooperate with her. Many here on DU blamed Clinton for the vast-RW-conspiracy. Well, as many of us knew, and everyone else discovered--it was not Clinton, but rather it was the republicans that were the problem.

I also believe that many grew up in the era of constant Clinton bashing by the republicans using the complicit media. Hate was generated by people who should know better.

 

JRLeft

(7,010 posts)
2. Bernie's goal is to get the masses involved no politician can
Tue Oct 27, 2015, 09:28 AM
Oct 2015

make a change alone, but people pressure can.

kenfrequed

(7,865 posts)
7. Exactly
Tue Oct 27, 2015, 09:45 AM
Oct 2015

President Obama tried but he made the mistake of putting Rahm Emmanuel in as Chief of staff. I think he would have done a lot better if he had put more progressives into positions of importance.


When Democratic activists were going to hold the the blue dogs feet to the fire to try to get single payer, or at least a public option he insulted them and dismissed them. They seemed more worried about getting the support of Olympia Snowe than to enforce a bit of party discipline. The republicans meanwhile circled their wagons and were the most obstructionist political minority in modern American history.


I like President Obama and voted for him, but he did make a lot of mistakes that were enabled by the third-way sorts.

kenfrequed

(7,865 posts)
11. Faith in human nature
Tue Oct 27, 2015, 09:56 AM
Oct 2015

I think President Obama sincerely wanted to do well. Maybe he sold himself as being a bit more progressive than he was, but he definitely wanted to do a lot more than he did. I think he made a few mistakes politically in thinking that he could sit down and negotiate in good faith with the republicans. He had faith in the good of human nature and I had faith in him. It might have been mistaken but I don't think he had bad intentions.

I believe that he was pressured to put in a few of the conservative democrats and third way sorts as a move towards party unity. There probably were people in that faction that might have worked, but Rahm was too interested in hippie-punching to be much use. Add to this Geithner and Summer and you have a recipe for problems and a heavy influence towards status quo thinking built into his own administration.

DanTex

(20,709 posts)
4. Of course voting matters. I'm voting Clinton in the primary, but what matters much more than
Tue Oct 27, 2015, 09:34 AM
Oct 2015

that is that I'll be voting for the Dem nominee in the general. If the GOP takes over all branches if government, we have a big problem.

tecelote

(5,122 posts)
6. Absolutely agree.
Tue Oct 27, 2015, 09:37 AM
Oct 2015

I'll vote for Bernie first but if Hillary wins, she's miles ahead of any Republican and has my vote for sure.

But, my hope is that Bernie creates a revolution and America experiences real change.

bigtree

(85,917 posts)
5. his plan is to exert public pressure through the activism of his 'revolution'
Tue Oct 27, 2015, 09:35 AM
Oct 2015

...the activism of his 'revolution' of voters and the pressure they would exert on D.C. pols..

It's not an unheard-of strategy and would be interesting to participate in if it actually materialized as he envisions. I daresay, it's really what every pol who runs for president should aspire to.

global1

(25,167 posts)
25. Every Other Pol That's Running For President Is Thinking They Are God's Gift And ....
Tue Oct 27, 2015, 10:40 AM
Oct 2015

they can do it on their own. Bernie is the only one realistic enough to know he needs a People Powered Revolution behind him to make the big changes. I think The People are beginning to realize that now as well.

bigtree

(85,917 posts)
26. actually
Tue Oct 27, 2015, 10:43 AM
Oct 2015

...all three Dems have made similar statements about the importance of the people to their campaigns.

 

NCTraveler

(30,481 posts)
10. Point well made.
Tue Oct 27, 2015, 09:56 AM
Oct 2015

But in the end we are fighting to build off the great work of Obama. Might I even say expand the scope of his good work. That is why you and I are supporting someone who we know will do just that. Happy Tuesday DanTex. Sanders would be better than a republican. His positions are excellent, his leadership is virtually non-existent, which matches his network.

 

MohRokTah

(15,429 posts)
12. The radical leftist extremists will treat Sanders the way the've treaated Obama...
Tue Oct 27, 2015, 09:56 AM
Oct 2015

probably starting on January 21, 2017.

They don't know how to do anything else.

 

MohRokTah

(15,429 posts)
22. No, Democrats have supported Obama.
Tue Oct 27, 2015, 10:23 AM
Oct 2015

The radical leftist extremists derided him before he ever took office.

And eventually, they will see their Saint Sanders be the same disappointment because they are wholly naive and ignorant as to how politics function.

 

PowerToThePeople

(9,610 posts)
24. I think exactly as you do
Tue Oct 27, 2015, 10:24 AM
Oct 2015
they are wholly naive and ignorant


Just the group of people I think that way about does not overlap those you are talking about.
 

Bluenorthwest

(45,319 posts)
31. His ardents stood aside and refused to advocate to him policies we all supported and instead they
Tue Oct 27, 2015, 11:37 AM
Oct 2015

spent time harping at say, LGBT people for pushing him on marriage equality and DADT. Obama had come to LGBT groups and asked us to be forceful about pushing our objectives and we did. He responded with political acumen and much victory was had by Obama and LGBT activists victory his ardent and self proclaimed 'supporters' nattered against at every possible moment. When they could have joined in with us, they instead joined with those criticizing us which was the Republicans and not Obama. Obama was being our partner. His ardents were being background noise. DU archives will show you that to be true 'you want a pony' and 'it's all poutrage, Rick Warren is a good man!'

Yeah.

 

pinebox

(5,761 posts)
23. Radical leftist extremists?
Tue Oct 27, 2015, 10:24 AM
Oct 2015

Bwahahahaahahahahahah!
That is hilarious! By that commentary, Ike, FDR and Teddy were "radical leftist extremists". lol

Seems pretty extremist to me.

Hey, the cold war is over, the red army isn't marching through the streets and the best places in the world to live are social democracies.
Times change, people change, causes change.







kenfrequed

(7,865 posts)
13. Great, support Sanders!
Tue Oct 27, 2015, 09:58 AM
Oct 2015

I mean, you can't get that good 'ole schadenfreude if he doesn't get elected and I am eager to have you tell us all "I told you so."

restorefreedom

(12,655 posts)
15. this assumes the presence
Tue Oct 27, 2015, 10:00 AM
Oct 2015

of the same obstructionist GOP Congress that existed for President Obama. If Bernie wins the nomination and the presidency, it's going to be because he brought hordes of young people and people who have typically not been involved in voting to the polls to vote him in. Those people are also very likely to vote for progressives in the down ticket races. If Bernie wins the presidency, The Dems will have the Senate and a good chunk of the house, and a lot of the wackos will be gone. I expect he would be able to get a lot more than some fear.

and just to clarify, are you suggesting in your post that you only want to see Bernie win the presidency to see him fail? So that you can say I told you so? How does that attitude advance any progressive causes at all?

 

PowerToThePeople

(9,610 posts)
21. I disagree
Tue Oct 27, 2015, 10:22 AM
Oct 2015

Obama did not even put up a fight. I do not think that will occur with a Sander's Presidency.

phantom power

(25,966 posts)
27. Everybody needs to find their own path to supporting Sanders
Tue Oct 27, 2015, 11:17 AM
Oct 2015

If yours is hoping to prove that the Presidency is irrelevant, there is no wrong answer!

 

Chan790

(20,176 posts)
30. Dan, we're not expecting miracles.
Tue Oct 27, 2015, 11:27 AM
Oct 2015

We just know that unlike Obama who starts from a concession position of what he actually wants and Hillary who is bought-and-paid-for by Wall St. and will be starting from what they want...Sanders is going to stake out a negotiating position on the left and make them actually negotiate and horse-trade the things they want for the things we want.

We don't think we're going to get everything we want.

We just know we're going to get a lot closer than we will with Hillary starting right-of-center and compromising towards the loonie-right fringe or Obama who concedes half his "wants" from the outset as a gesture of good faith with fascists that view those concessions as weakness.

 

Bluenorthwest

(45,319 posts)
32. This makes me nostalgic for 08 when Republicans said Obama was seen as some miracle working
Tue Oct 27, 2015, 11:39 AM
Oct 2015

messiah and claimed he'd never get anything done. 'He's just a celebrity candidate, his fans think he is their savior!'

Latest Discussions»Retired Forums»2016 Postmortem»There is one big reason w...