In Reid, Dean sees vestiges of himself

In Reid, Dean sees vestiges of himself

Despite differences, vocal leaders' alliance shapes party's future
By Nina J. Easton, Globe Staff | March 25, 2005

WASHINGTON -- Howard Dean, whose occasional blunt talk has landed him in political hot water, has met his match and made a new friend.

In Washington, Senate Democratic leader Harry Reid of Nevada has emerged as the fire-breathing face of the party, describing the Federal Reserve Board chairman, Alan Greenspan, as a ''political hack" and charging that President Bush and his allies are ''drunk with power." Aides to Dean say Reid's recent aggressive style has earned admiration from the former Vermont governor, and is producing a budding friendship between the two men.

''He's honest and direct, which is what Governor Dean likes," said Laura Gross, a spokeswoman for Dean.

Reid and Dean have strategized by phone at least a dozen times over the past few weeks with the Democratic National Committee, which Dean chairs, producing television ads to bolster Reid's efforts to crush White House plans to create private Social Security accounts for younger workers. Together with House Democratic leader Nancy Pelosi of California, Dean, the doctor from the Green Mountains, and Reid, the lawyer from the Nevada desert, are shaping a Democratic Party that is rigorously oppositional, a strategy that GOP opponents call ''obstructionist," and one that some Democrats find invigorating while others criticize as shortsighted.

alot more at...http://www.boston.com/news/nation/articles/2005/03/25/in_reid_dean_sees_vestiges_of_himself/

Oh, DO take a look at the WH and BOTH houses of Congress, Mr Schoen.

snip?
''For the Democrats, to be a bold opposition party might help in the short term with the 2006 congressional elections, but if we're even going to win the White House, there is no evidence this will work," said former Clinton pollster Doug Schoen. In a recent memo, Democratic strategists James Carville and Stanley Greenberg worried that, among voters surveyed, their party has not ''emerged as a serious alternative" on critical issues, including Social Security, where the public ''does not think the Democrats have any particular ideas."

A "bold opposition" is somehow a bad thing, to this guy? :shrug:

Uh, Mr. Schoen, please don't think us rude if we completely ignore everything that comes out of your mouth. :eyes:

2008 can wait.

... and focus on what unites us. Got to get on message together.

I'm still kinda wary of Reid, but anyone willing to call a hack a hack is winning points in my book.

As for being "obstructionist"... you bet your ass we're being obstructionist, when the GOP is out to destroy America!


(edit typo)

WELCOME TO THE NEW DEMOCRATIC PARTY

:puke:

that Dems would accept if Bush would negotiate on new Supreme Court judges. Such a bad idea? Chief Justice only gets 1 vote, just like any other justice. And Scalia is so divisive and polarizing that he would frequently find himself in the minority on the court and in the minority, the Chief Justice does not have any additional power, cannot even decide who writes the opinion.

For example, here is a survey sent out by a Democratic congressman to his constituents last week:

1. What are the 3 most important issues you would like to see Congress and the federal govt do something about?

a. Protect Moral Values.(I swear to God, that's first)

b. Keep American jobs at home.

c. Better protect our borders and stop illegal immigration.

d. Protect the environment.

e. Strengthen national defense and Homeland security

f. Lower health care costs.

g. Lower the deficit

h. Improve education.

(Oh, boy! I get to pick three!)

2. Do you agree with setting up private investment accounts under social security for people who are 55 and under?

Yes/no

This is the party as it exists today. It is gradually losing my support.

Like Dean says, "run for office." Perhaps you should run against your congressmen? Just join a DFA meetup. Participate and if you're a socially progressive and fiscally responsible the local DFA will endorse you. Then you can get the national DFA to endorse you. Now you have your foundation. This is one route you can take. There are many other ways. Maybe you can work on someones campaign that's running against him. Or perhaps you can run for office on another different position and try to make changes.

Party and find out what is *really* going on or do any work to benefit it.

...and so your snap judgments are completely out of place.

...would know more about how it works. Have you signed your loyalty oath yet, where you pledge to work for and support any Democratic candidate regardless of whether you agree or not with their positions? I have. It must be signed if you are to be a voting member of the party or hold a party office, you know.

The Republicans aren't the only ones with such documents.

And so I will complain all I want outside the confines of my party duties and the pledge I signed. Have a pleasant day.

Though I support DFA's efforts.

Not exactly the same thing.

But I am not exactly excited by Reid as Senate Minority Leader.

The only thing a minority leader really has is to hold a caucus together in order to oppose or negotiate deals. Clearly, Reid cannot do that. He only had one vote where the caucus held together (budget), and it is not even clear if he could hold it for a filibuster vote on judges (given the absence of Nelson and Lieberman at the photoop).

Sure, he is a vocal opposition, but is he an effective opposition?

Howard Dean's was selling out to own such a reputable position in the Democratic Party. P

With sentiments as inane as this, perhaps it's "a good thing" Howard Dean did not go on to win the primaries?

Another of these reporters married to a GOP operative. I would take what she says with a grain of salt.

Don't make BLATANT ACCUSATIONS without proof, or else it's a bunch of imflammatory comment that you're trying to use as Flamebait. First of all your premise is invalid. You're assuming that working with other Democrats is "selling out." Errr last time I heard cooperation was a GOOD thing...Unless you don't believe in cooperation.

My proof is everywhere ... in Dean's NOTABLE absence.

But hey, believe in him if you wish. I think we are going to have to start from the ground up with the democratic party. Ridding ourselves of the DLC will be IMO, a good start. :-)

:shrug:

You're assuming that Dean is a DLC member. You have no proof. Your only proof is that, "time will tell." That's just like saying, "Bush is a Democrats deep inside," and then someone ask, "do you have proof," then that person responds by saying, "only time will tell."

You're assuming that Dean is not doing anything because he's not appearing on Major Networks. First of all if you were truly following Dean you would know that he is avoiding Major Media and is only doing local news. If you didn't know Dean Just got done addressing people in tennesse, before that Mississippi, and before that Kansas. He's following through that he's going to compete in all 50 states. Also if YOU DIDN'T know he's working to have 4 DNC Staff members in every state.

On Edit: Please note - unlike the Republican Party, you can't bully people into liking the Democratic representatives, especially when they sell-out their constituents. IMO Dean should be on the major networks every damn weekend.

Follow your own philosphy of, "I'm willing to take a step back." Put your words where your mouth is. Your philosphy is moot and BS if you yourself don't follow it. There's only on word that describes that kind of action...HYPOCRITICAL.

in NO matter how you bully me. Does this make you feel powerful?

second of all you're assumung that beause I'm rebuttaling your false accusations that equals bullying. Umm if that is true then everytime someone catches some in a lie then they are bullyimg. Which is BS.

go along to get along. No, I want a fighter. Since we are going to lose no matter what and the Republicans refuse to compromise on ANY issue, we might as well lose with dignity?

You're assuming that we are going to lose no matter what. That's stretching it. Under that premise anything would go and Democrats would still lose. It's like saying if "Bush gets impeached, Democrats still lose no matter what." If Delay is indicted, Democrats still lose no matter what."

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Look at what you said. You basically admitted that you're working against the Democratic Party.

sell out to corporate interests in the democratic party.

KNOW that clarification. The democratic leadership left it's base. You think you say a few flowery sentiments and we snap in line. No way. I voted for Kerry but I will not support any more representatives who sell out to corporate interests before serving The People.

Saying that we the ordinary people are corporate interest. Also you the claim that you are going to work against ordinary democrats like us.

she would work against DLC types like yourself. She wants the party to regain its progressive message. There's nothing wrong with that.

it's through intimidation and character assaination. People need to stand up for progressives ... even within our party. What a shame.

ProudToBeLiberal. LOOK AT MY AVATAR. DFA=Democracy for America. If you knew about Democracy for America, you would know that they stand up for socially progressive and fiscally responsible candidates.

What do you mean by "gang up on us".? Are you working against the Democrats?

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You're assuming that i'm working against the Democratic Party. Wrong.

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shills and thugs for the Republicans. You "bad mouth" everyone who disagrees with Reid and Pelosi. You stand up for them in ALL situations. You are their boys. No, you are not IMO true democrats that I joined in the 70s.

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I am not sure what you are getting at here.

You're assuming that we "bad mouth" everyone who disagrees with Reid and Pelosi. I do NOT STAND UP FOR THEM IN ALL SITUATIONS. First of all I AM STANDING UP FOR HOWARD DEAN. So your assumption is off based. Second of all you're asumming all the supportes of the democratic party are boys, your assumption is way off based. First of all you're assuming that with age comes wisdom, WRONG. The attitudes and assumptions you make about young people is totally of base, it's these kind of attitudes that make the young generation polically apathy. You think we're all dumb. BS

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is that suppose to be a compliment, or an indirect attack? Please clarify. thanks

that specific information (my age) is uhhh "classified." LOL

Truce? We all are a little strained today, IMO, Fundy wackos are wearing on our tolerance. :-)

anywayz I'm tired of my post being deleted.

It was a misunderstanding. I'm not too proud to admit that I've been a little too feisty today. The Fundies are bringing out the worst in me.

I hope that you are right and Howard Dean is doing the best that he knows how. Honestly, and for the people.

Truce :-)

DFA is the group Dean formed when he dropped out. We support local candidates, even school board and city commissioners who are socially liberal but believe in handling money well.

I think you got confused about us. We also work with the DNC as well.

:)

organizations, I will not specifically support them as I'm a base type of democrat - for the people first and foremost.

Thanks for the interesting exchange, Men :-).

I thought we were at truce? DFA is a bottum up organization. GRASSROOTS. A lot of these DFA has their own projects going that concern the grassroots. the DLC is totally different from the DFA.

first of all DLC is a centralized organization. In DFA are many many small organizations. For emample there's Democracy of Texas, Democracy of Austin, Democracy of Finger-lake, and etc. There are many many small groups many up of the grassroots people.

Since DFA is building from the ground up, with very little top down control....that seems pretty much for the people to me.

We don't ask for your support for DFA unless you wish to give it. However, we do ask not to be confused with the DLC.

;) ;-) ;)

for a break in the action. <g>

:P

continuing to sharp shoot me as such. This is not humorous any longer, just drawn out and tiresome. I request we all give it a rest?

We are not fond of being confused with the DLC. ;)

... and all other Democrats. I agree, there are things about Reid that I find troubling. It's on Dean that I'm pinning my hopes.

BTW, I like this write-up. The party chair should be working with the leadership of the house and senate. Despite the Counterpunch like calls for Dean to say get out of Iraq, which is what they are doing to MoveOn right now....Dean is doing what he needs to do.

Reid's childhood, amazing.

SNIP.."The Reid-Dean friendship brings together men of vastly different backgrounds. Reid, 65, is an antiabortion-rights Mormon who voted in favor of the 2003 authorization to invade Iraq. His youth in a desert shack built out of railroad ties was spent with an alcoholic gold-miner father and a mother who washed clothes for local prostitutes.

Dean, 56, is a Congregationalist and an abortion-rights proponent, who built a presidential race around opposition to the war in Iraq. He grew up in a Park Avenue apartment, spent weekends in East Hampton, and bypassed his wealthy family's preferred Yale-to-Wall-Street path in favor of medical school.

But the pair share traits. Neither was a high-profile figure on the national political scene as recently as three years ago."

"Where is Howard Dean," I hope this answers the
freaking question.