Chertoff: Katrina scenario did not exist (Does he live under a rock?)

http://edition.cnn.com/2005/US/09/03/katrina.chertoff/index.html

Defending the U.S. government's response to Hurricane Katrina, Homeland Security Secretary Michael Chertoff argued Saturday that government planners did not predict such a disaster ever could occur.

But in fact, government officials, scientists and journalists have warned of such a scenario for years.

Chertoff, fielding questions from reporters, said government officials did not expect both a powerful hurricane and a breach of levees that would flood the city of New Orleans. (See the video on a local paper's prophetic warning -- 3:30 )

"That 'perfect storm' of a combination of catastrophes exceeded the foresight of the planners, and maybe anybody's foresight," Chertoff said.

<snip>

But engineers say the levees preventing this below-sea-level city from being turned into a swamp were built to withstand only Category 3 hurricanes. And officials have warned for years that a Category 4 could cause the levees to fail. (See video of why the levee's breech was devastating -- 1:53)

...more...

On what planet do these people live?

It's been fairly on the ball lately...

Just wondering.

they link to a video(s) and also link to stories debunking what he said
like this:
http://edition.cnn.com/2005/WEATHER/09/02/levee.criticism.reut/index.html

Our press is regenerating its spine...

Now if our Dem "leadership" would just do the same.

www.nationalgeographic.com/ngm/0410/feature5

The flooding of New Orleans was anticipated in considerable detail-
Check out this great article from '04.

back in line with the bush gang, NOW THAT the military is in charge.

Msongs
www.msongs.com

Articles subtitle is "However, experts for years had warned of threat to New Orleans"

... his potential nominees?

"What's better: lying or not lying?"

"Lying, of course."

"You're in."

only those that have perfected the art of lying for any reason, large or small, is allowed to continue their relationship with the mob.

:toast: You are So right !

:argh:

... connected to D.C.

n/t

Is Bush to Blame for New Orleans Flooding?
He did slash funding for levee projects. But the Army Corps of Engineers says Katrina was just too strong.
Factcheck.org --September 2, 2005

Summary
Some critics are suggesting President Bush was as least partly responsible for the flooding in New Orleans. In a widely quoted opinion piece, former Clinton aide Sidney Blumenthal says that "the damage wrought by the hurricane may not entirely be the result of an act of nature," and cites years of reduced funding for federal flood-control projects around New Orleans.

Our fact-checking confirms that Bush indeed cut funding for projects specifically designed to strengthen levees. Indeed, local officials had been complaining about that for years.

It is not so clear whether the money Bush cut from levee projects would have made any difference, however, and we're not in a position to judge that. The Army Corps of Engineers – which is under the President's command and has its own reputation to defend – insists that Katrina was just too strong, and that even if the levee project had been completed it was only designed to withstand a category 3 hurricane.

else. They're completely fucked, spewing garf.

hit going over the scenario on MSNBC (I think, it could have been CNN). I forgot his name, but he was REALLY worried about what was about to happen.

He's been warning about this and begging for help for it for a long time.

Is it because you're stupid, or just willfully and criminally ignorant?

Either way, your work is the work of evil.

after repeating the lie often enough, it becomes the truth. You have to admit, it's been working like a charm for them, until now. There's just too much damning information to the contrary to pull off the "big lie" ploy this time. They're not going to be able to wiggle off the hook this time. They've been hooked, landed and are flopping around on the bottom of the boat as we speak. Their mighty wurlitzer of propaganda has been silenced, in fact, turned against them, and there's no lie big enough to cover the magnitude of their ineptness this time.
They're digging themselves deeper into a hole with each lie they speak at this point but there's no possibility of lying their way out of it. They keep trying though, because it's all they know how to do.
They're going to be forced to shoulder the blame for this one and in turn the past layers of lies are going to come unraveled as a result. When that finally happens, the true magnitude of their incompetence is going to be subject to the light of day for the first time. It is NOT going to be pretty. This is either going to force their hand and make them attempt their final strategy to control the country WAY too early, or they're going to have to take the hits and wait for another day to attempt their fascist takeover.
IMO, they're going to have to go into full retreat mode. The Republican party is going to have to shrink back under their rock and wait another 25 years or so before they'll attempt another coup. In the meantime, we have to do everything we can to make sure that the same chinks in the country's armor are closed so they can't exploit them again. These rogue madmen can never be given another foothold in American politics.

Blame and denial are hallmarks of an addict, especially alcoholics. I wonder if Bush chooses other alcoholics like himself for cabinet positions.

he is just a spokesman for the White House, he knows nothing of disaster management...just like his underling Mike Brown

These people are just too stupid. It seems the press won't let them get away with it any more, but they haven't caught on yet.

CATASTROPHE FACING THE COUNTRY!!!!!!


In 2001, a FEMA report ranked hurricane damage to New Orleans as one of the three most likely catastrophes facing the country (the other two were a terrorist attack on New York City and an earthquake in San Francisco).

The New Orleans Times-Picayune published a five-part series in 2002 that began with the words: "It's only a matter of time before south Louisiana takes a direct hit from a major hurricane. Billions have been spent to protect us, but we grow more vulnerable every day. ...'' The stories quoted flood experts warning specifically of the potential damage from rising water levels and broken levees.

Despite the warnings, money was cut from flood control as the federal government's focus shifted to terrorism. The Bush administration routinely provided less than half the money the Army Corps of Engineers requested for New Orleans flood prevention. Officials routinely blamed budget restrictions and the war in Iraq in Times-Picayune articles.

A 2001 FEMA REPORT????????? What do you think his job is anyway? Sheesh.

:sarcasm:

They want to get caught in these lies. What kinds of idiots do they take us for?

glad to have you here

everyone else looks like an idiot too!

:evilgrin:

Welcome to DU crimnos.

Many people saw this coming for years.

I was flabergasted when I found out the levees were only built to withstand Category 3 hurricanes, and the upgrades were stopped
because of Bush's tax cuts for his rich buddies and his warmongering.

Let him try to float this crap past Landreau et al.

incompetent. Stupid with a capital S. Dumbasses.

They are clearly unfit to hold office. They must be impeached and removed from office for the safety of the American people.

BATON ROUGE, La. -- Hurricane Pam brought sustained winds of 120 mph, up to 20 inches of rain in parts of southeast Louisiana and storm surge that topped levees in the New Orleans area. More than one million residents evacuated and Hurricane Pam destroyed 500,000-600,000 buildings. Emergency officials from 50 parish, state, federal and volunteer organizations faced this scenario during a five-day exercise held this week at the State Emergency Operations Center in Baton Rouge.

http://www.fema.gov/news/newsrelease.fema?id=13051


and even more at
http://www.ohsep.louisiana.gov/newsrelated/incaseofemrgencyexercise.htm

BATON ROUGE -- It's a recipe for appalling destruction, and it could happen here:

A hurricane packing winds of 120 mph and a storm surge that tops 17-foot levees slams into New Orleans, killing an untold number of people and trapping half the area's residents in attics, on rooftops and in makeshift refuges in a variety of public and office buildings.

Parts of the city are flooded with up to 20 feet of water, and 80 percent of the buildings in the area are severely damaged from water and winds.

FEMA Director Michael Brown told CNN's Larry King on Wednesday, "When I became the director of FEMA a couple of years ago, I decided it was time we did some really serious catastrophic disaster planning. So the president gave me money through our budget to do that. And we went around the country to figure out what's the best model we can do for a catastrophic disaster in this country? And we picked New Orleans, Louisiana."

Organizers said "Hurricane Pam" was based on weather and damage information developed by the National Weather Service and other agencies.

"Hurricane Katrina caused the same kind of damage that we anticipated," Brown said Wednesday. "So we planned for it two years ago. Last year, we exercised it. And unfortunately, this year, we're implementing it."

http://www.cnn.com/2005/POLITICS/09/02/hurricane.drill/index.html

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

Israelis eliminated terror...

/sarcasam off


BTW... welcome to DU

The relevance of that is....?

And slamming it into the Gulf Coast."

Lying fuckers.

and levees for seciurity and you get the same answers...

being used as a missile!

They say what ever they want KNOWING they are lying out of their teeth

TWISTING THE FACTS AND BALD FACED LYING.

The only thing that will "curb" their zealotry in lying is to WRITE to them; get everyone to write or call.

Write to your local newspapers to tell these stories to YOUR citizens in your locale.

Just sitting on DU (which I love) and ranting between ourselves, we should be BARRAGING the communications systems with THE TRUTH.

Not everyone, perhaps not even most, Americas are as Hip as DU..many may not even turn on the news AT ALL. Somehow, the truth has to pop out to the masses......which ever way possible.

So many regular folk are more interested in the "Godfather" movies and how slick that org operates but HAVE NO CLUE about our OWN GOVERNMENT and how we are being screwed each and every day, in every way, in every locale. These same folk don't realize we are being led by a Mafia style, neo-fascist, Plutocracy... This type of Government DOES NOT BENEFIT everyday citizens. They need to know it.

... their lips are moving.

He failed miserably, and should be in jail.

my hotel in April 1993 knew that the city might one day be destroyed by a flood.

Why didn't Chertoff?

The perfect storm my ass!

http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?articleID=00060286-CB58-1315-8B5883414B7F0000
------------

Magazine Content
October 2001 issue

CIVIL ENGINEERING

Drowning New Orleans
By Mark Fischetti

A major hurricane could swamp New Orleans under 20 feet of water, killing thousands. Human activities along the Mississippi River have dramatically increased the risk, and now only massive reengineering of southeastern Louisiana can save the city.

snip

New Orleans is a disaster waiting to happen. The city lies below sea level, in a bowl bordered by levees that fend off Lake Pontchartrain to the north and the Mississippi River to the south and west. And because of a damning confluence of factors, the city is sinking further, putting it at increasing flood risk after even minor storms. The low-lying Mississippi Delta, which buffers the city from the gulf, is also rapidly disappearing. A year from now another 25 to 30 square miles of delta marsh--an area the size of Manhattan--will have vanished. An acre disappears every 24 minutes. Each loss gives a storm surge a clearer path to wash over the delta and pour into the bowl, trapping one million people inside and another million in surrounding communities. Extensive evacuation would be impossible because the surging water would cut off the few escape routes. Scientists at Louisiana State University (L.S.U.), who have modeled hundreds of possible storm tracks on advanced computers, predict that more than 100,000 people could die. The body bags wouldn't go very far.

A direct hit is inevitable. Large hurricanes come close every year. In 1965 Hurricane Betsy put parts of the city under eight feet of water. In 1992 monstrous Hurricane Andrew missed the city by only 100 miles. In 1998 Hurricane Georges veered east at the last moment but still caused billions of dollars of damage. At fault are natural processes that have been artificially accelerated by human tinkering--levying rivers, draining wetlands, dredging channels and cutting canals through marshes. Ironically, scientists and engineers say the only hope is more manipulation, although they don't necessarily agree on which proposed projects to pursue. Without intervention, experts at L.S.U. warn, the protective delta will be gone by 2090. The sunken city would sit directly on the sea--at best a troubled Venice, at worst a modern-day Atlantis.

As if the risk to human lives weren't enough, the potential drowning of New Orleans has serious economic and environmental consequences as well. Louisiana's coast produces one third of the country's seafood, one fifth of its oil and one quarter of its natural gas. It harbors 40 percent of the nation's coastal wetlands and provides wintering grounds for 70 percent of its migratory waterfowl. Facilities on the Mississippi River from New Orleans to Baton Rouge constitute the nation's largest port. And the delta fuels a unique element of America's psyche; it is the wellspring of jazz and blues, the source of everything Cajun and Creole, and the home of Mardi Gras. Thus far, however, Washington has turned down appeals for substantial aid.

/snip
--------------------

Despite what the LIARS in our Executive Branch claim as well as the putrid spin that their hired guns in the American Enterprise Institute (AEI) try to put on it, THIS DISASTER WAS PREDICTED AND NUMEROUS APPEALS WERE MADE TO CORRECT THE SITUATION.

However, it was never made a priority - thus this PREDICTABLE tragedy has been made all too real.

Ask almost anyone who has lived for more than a decade in New Orleans? ---> They will tell you that THEY (the citizens of New Orleans) KNEW of the possibility of this disaster.

Any talking head or government official who claims that this disaster was the result of a "perfect storm" or was completely unpredictable is LYING! :puke:

from the October 2004 issue of NatGeo, comes this incredibly prophetic vision, entitled "Gone with the Water"

-snip-

It was a broiling August afternoon in New Orleans, Louisiana, the Big Easy, the City That Care Forgot. Those who ventured outside moved as if they were swimming in tupelo honey. Those inside paid silent homage to the man who invented air-conditioning as they watched TV "storm teams" warn of a hurricane in the Gulf of Mexico. Nothing surprising there: Hurricanes in August are as much a part of life in this town as hangovers on Ash Wednesday.

But the next day the storm gathered steam and drew a bead on the city. As the whirling maelstrom approached the coast, more than a million people evacuated to higher ground. Some 200,000 remained, however—the car-less, the homeless, the aged and infirm, and those die-hard New Orleanians who look for any excuse to throw a party.

The storm hit Breton Sound with the fury of a nuclear warhead, pushing a deadly storm surge into Lake Pontchartrain. The water crept to the top of the massive berm that holds back the lake and then spilled over. Nearly 80 percent of New Orleans lies below sea level—more than eight feet below in places—so the water poured in. A liquid brown wall washed over the brick ranch homes of Gentilly, over the clapboard houses of the Ninth Ward, over the white-columned porches of the Garden District, until it raced through the bars and strip joints on Bourbon Street like the pale rider of the Apocalypse. As it reached 25 feet (eight meters) over parts of the city, people climbed onto roofs to escape it.

Thousands drowned in the murky brew that was soon contaminated by sewage and industrial waste. Thousands more who survived the flood later perished from dehydration and disease as they waited to be rescued. It took two months to pump the city dry, and by then the Big Easy was buried under a blanket of putrid sediment, a million people were homeless, and 50,000 were dead. It was the worst natural disaster in the history of the United States.

-snip-

This amazing "playbook" of what would become Katrina was published a year ago in National Geographic.
http://www3.nationalgeographic.com/ngm/0410/feature5/?fs=www7.nationalgeographic.com

It couldn't be imagined? My ass!

"No one could imagine Hussein not having WMDs."

"No one could imagine Iraqis not welcoming us with flowers."

"No one could imagine a huge tax cut for the rich causing these huge deficts."

...

...

...

...is an idiot. We spend so much money on security, but not nearly as much on actual preparedness. Case in point: New Orleans.

This is a link to a report that DHS made last year predicting what would happen if a "major" hurricane hit a "major metropolitan area".

It may not be exactly what happened in NO, but it's awfully damn close.

"Secondary Hazards/Events – In addition to the massive destruction caused by the hurricane itself, there are also areas within the MMA and scattered inland areas that have sustained severe damage from tornadoes that were generated by the storm. Storm surges and heavy rains cause catastrophic flooding to low lying areas. Rainfall from the hurricane, in combination with earlier storms, causes significant flooding in multiple states along the coast.

Flooded and damaged petrochemical facilities, chemical plants, sewage treatment plants, and other facilities threaten the health of citizens, create a hazardous operating environment, and require cleanup and remediation. An oil tanker is blown off course during the storm and sustains serious damage and leaks oil into the waters adjacent to the MMA"

and that's just for starters!

what a bunch of idiotic people Bush has chosen in these positions of responsibility!

If "Chertoff says planners didn't predict such a disaster could occur", he is lying and/or just stupid, and has incompetent planners!

WAKE UP and smell the coffee, you Bush supporters! More people in positions just like Georgie the F up. Bush's history of failures is a good predictor of his present and future abilities (more failures, more lies, more scapegoating).

Like most Bush appointees are.

.

"That 'perfect storm' of a combination of catastrophes exceeded the foresight of the planners, and maybe anybody's foresight," Chertoff said.

lies, lies, more lies... so sick of the lies...

was one of three disaster scenarios being "war-gamed" by federal officials for, at least, a couple years now.

Chertoff, you're a fucking hack liar. You're ignorant to the point of being stupid and dangerous.

:banghead:

If they let them lie believing well "we knew but maybe the feds didn't", they should have to wonder why the Feds did not know. If the Feds didn't know then they are obviously not doing their jobs. This scenerio has been predicted since the 70's. If "red voters" spend their time defending these lies after witnessing them first hand they are just as guilty.

time has come to throw his stinking thieving ass out of office. Where's butt head cheney?

Brown pushed from last job: Horse group: FEMA chief had to be `asked to resign'


The federal official in charge of the bungled New Orleans rescue was fired from his last private-sector job overseeing horse shows.

And before joining the Federal Emergency Management Agency as a deputy director in 2001, GOP activist Mike Brown had no significant experience that would have qualified him for the position.

The Oklahoman got the job through an old college friend who at the time was heading up FEMA. http://business.bostonherald.com/businessNews/view.bg?articleid=100857&format=text

Enough is enough. I've emailed my Senators Durbin and Obama and my congressperson to begin impeachment hearing immediately.

We the People should demand that this president be the CEO that he claims to be and resign from his position of honor and trust. Any other CEO whose horrible job performance caused hundreds, perhaps thousands, to die would be fired by the corporations board of directors.

WE (the People) ARE THE BOARD OF DIRECTORS of this beleaguered country, and it’s time we demanded our hired CEO leave his job. If he doesn’t, we throw him out via
impeachment and a trial in the Senate.

"We couldn't have known", "It's unknowable". They are using these lies when there is a ton of documentation that they did know.
They were too busy counting their money (Chertof from Tasers and other security stuff) and too busy following their 'GOP Guide To Taking Over The World', to prepare for anything not in the book.

Friday night - they replayed some of a TWO THOUSAND TWO story detailing this very thing.


Pack of f*cking liars. Do these people audition for their appointments? - best liar is appointed

years and NO had begged for money to fix the levees since the current administration started ripping their budget for the last 3 years.

Excuse me, I am no engineer, but don't hurricanes,rising water and levees go hand in hand?

That is common sense and reality 101 of which this fucking administration hasn't an ounce of either.

Times-Picayune 2004 article on LA site: http://www.ohsep.louisiana.gov/newsrelated/incaseofemrgencyexercise.htm

Is that even a word? Because it should be.

these people aren't qualified to run a fucking McDonald's.

I'm serious.