LAT: Eligible to Vote in Arizona? Prove It

PHOENIX — A stringent new voter identification law being put into effect in Arizona — designed to keep illegal immigrants from voting — will also prevent thousands of legitimate voters from casting ballots Tuesday, election officials say.
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The law put this border state at the edge of a nationwide push to tighten screening at the polls: fifteen states now require ID at polling places, but no other state requires documentation of citizenship in order to register.

It's a movement that advocates say is long overdue to prevent election fraud, but which critics say will decrease voter turnout and has already disenfranchised thousands of Arizona voters.

In Maricopa County, home to Phoenix, more than 10,000 people trying to register have been rejected for being unable to prove their citizenship. Yvonne Reed, a spokeswoman for the recorder's office, said Friday that most probably are U.S. citizens whose married names differ from their birth certificates or who have lost documentation.
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In Pima County, home to Tucson, 60% of those who tried to register initially could not. Chris Roads, chief deputy recorder and registrar, said all appeared to be U.S. citizens but many had moved to Arizona recently and couldn't access birth certificates or passports.

http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-arizona5nov05,0,1430736.story?coll=la-home-nation

I worked at the polls in Miami and citizenship was on the "honor system". Anyone could get a voter registration card and they couldn't be asked if they were citizens.

When people exercise the privilege of voting, they should be willing to prove they are US citizens before getting on the voting rolls and bring ID with a picture when they come to the polls.

We Dems are losing almost every election, then complaining the elections might be rigged. We can't afford to let the voting system get away from us!

They have to show birth certs *and* marriage docs.

I agree that in theory, proving citizenship is a worthy goal. In practice, lots of constituencies upon which the Democratic party depends will be challenged.

You make it sound like having a drivers' license....

To call it a 'privilege,'and worse to deny it to citizens who don't have the means to obtain the documentation in time to register for an election, is a crime.

And it does that. Current forms of ID used in other states are adequate.

Is everybody put through the wringer, or just those with names like Mendoza? If John McCain is not asked to show ID and a birth certificate then this law is BS. Everybody must prove their citizenship status, no exceptions. Nobody is allowed to say that they know the guy, and they would swear under oath with the penalty of perjury that McCain is a citizen. I ask this not because I have a thing against John McCain voting, but because of the Wilson's. How many people thought they knew Valerie Plame-Wilson? Everyone of those people got it wrong didn't they? So who is to say they know what the Mayor or state senator really is? Everybody needs to be checked, or the law should go in the trash IMO.

McCain probably has his papers in a safe or a bank and he'd have staff to get them in order.

And I know just where mine are. They've been in the same drawer for 20 years. I haven't lost them to fire, flood or theft -never had to leave them due to violence in the home or eviction.

For those not so fortunate, will minimum wage workers have the time or wherewithal to replace them?

Contact with official bureaucracies don't freak me out, but there are various reasons why others avoid such contact.

Compliance to the law is a headache I'd be defiantly willing to endure. I'm doubtful that will be the universal reaction of every voter the dems need.

That is only one part of my problem with the law, will everybody be checked to the same degree? You bring up another question I have with the law and that is the ability to replace such documents or having the money to do so.

I was mugged, and had my wallet stolen. Which, of course, contained my driver's license. The credit cards are a piece of cake, pay 5 bucks for a new Metro card, 5 bucks for a new student ID, an inconvenience, sure, but not a big deal.

So I call the DMV to find out what I need for my license (digital photo, mind you, identical address and everything) I need a valid passport. Mine is expired. Or a Social Security card. Destroyed in a fire as a kid (you never need an actual card, I've always had tax returns and a passport to identify my Social and an expired passport is still valid for I-9s)) Or a birth Certificate. a real one, not a miniture copy. All I have is the copy. And my birthplace, Hartford, is 600 miles away from DC. It takes 8-10 weeks to get a copy by mail, and I can't get there, right? I can't drive, I can't fly, I can't take a train. And, in DC, you can't get into bery many buildings without valid ID.

Long story short, I got lucky. The mugger obviously dumped my wallet after taking the cash, and some good soul mailed it back to me, otherwise, I would have had to not work for a week while I paid several hundred dollars to expedite a new passport.

and I'm a caucasian, with my entire immediate family in the country, a good command of the English language, no fear dealing with government beaurocracy and fairly decent financial resources. I can't even think of the chaos that would have ensued if I hadn't had that cushion.

Not in any given year, mind you.

But I've never been asked to prove citizenship. In only one case was I told I had to prove residency either when registering (by mail) or the first time I voted, but nobody enforced the requirement.

that the law in Georgia has (currently on hold, thankfully). It's easy to say "what's the big deal" with getting photo id -- but it is a big deal for some citizens. A birth certificate generally costs around $12-15 dollars, plus postage. A US passport will run you $97 (without the cost of the photos)-- $67 for a renewal/replacement. If you have the money, the time, the ability to get to the places you need to go to accomplish the task, it's no problem. If you don't, you are, de facto, disenfranchised.

I understand AZ's desire to maintain a level of control on the voting process, but this does more than prevent (maybe) illegal immigrants from voting; it places an undue burden on citizens who are least able to meet the new "qualifications."

If you're not familiar with the Georgia issue, there is a fairly informative article here:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/10/27/AR2005102702171.html

Janet Napolitano (D) If we can't trust our own people to be fair, who can we trust.

zalinda

"designed to keep illegal immigrants from voting"

But it tosses the baby with the bathwater, imo.

That comes with the responsibility of verifying that you are a citizen and eligible to vote. Unfortunately, with the moral decay of our country, "honor systems" don't work.

Mexico or Jamaica, I can tell you it is an unfair burden. My husband was adopted by his stepfather and his stepfather won't let my husband keep his own birth certificate. Pops couldn't find the BC at the last hour and because of the adoption change of surname issue it was a miracle hubby was able to get on that plane. And yes it cost us lot of money to get that documentaion from the state capital at the last minute.

Remember the GOP wants decreased voter participation. Supression is a big part of their tool kit. The people who won't have picture IDs, passports or know where their birth certificates are, is the poor.

I don't want to come off a callous, but shouldn't you keep your stuff in a safe place? Those little fire safes cost about 25 bucks. I just think it is important to know who is voting, and if they're here legally or not.

voting machine systems. I am also a lot more concerned that the poor people that I worked so hard to register and motivate will actually be able to cast a ballot. So I'm not into supressing turnout. But hey, that's just me, I guess I'm not a republican.

being able to vote. I am 51 years old. At 18 yrs old I was able to go to health Department in the KY county I was born in. I got a verification of my birth. This was free of charge. With this verification of my birth, I was able to get my driver's license, get married and become a registered voter. Do you think anyone could do these things now free of charge? (HELL NO) So it's the poor that is not being allowed to vote, not the wealthy people. When I was 49 yrs old I sent off for my birth certificate and it cost me $20.00. Some people don't have $20.00 because they live pay check to pay check. They don't have an extra penny for anything (not even 25 bucks for a little fire safe). I'm more concerned about legal united state citizens being allowed to vote than illegal aliens voting in our elections. Perhaps we would not have to worry as much about illegal aliens voting or taking our jobs IF some of the money that is going for an illegal war would go into sealing our borders so that illegal aliens can not come into our country and vote or take our jobs.

As long as illegals can be exploited for profit, profit hungry businesses will employ them. Crack down on the businesses who employ illegals and not only will those businesses have to pay what the job is worth, but Americans will do those jobs.

wants, big businesses gets.

Most undocumented workers are too busy trying to feed their families (on the shit they get paid to do jobs we don't want to do) to take part in some vast conspiracy to vote in someone else's name in an election being held in a language they can't even read anyway.

and the citizenship paper in order and kept in fire proof safty box! Just in case this kinda shit happens here!

The organizations who work so hard to register people, and the democratic party should start spending the money necessary to GET these people the ID cards that will pass muster when they actually try to vote. They are very likely to be voting in precincts that will have overly zealous "challengers". Where once a utility bill and an expired drivers' license with a photo "might" have been enough, the opposition is more aggressive than ever, and they try every trick in the book to intimidate people..

What is truly needed, since some people have an issue with the idea of passports for all, is a PICTURE ID (with a decent sized photo) that is a VOTER ID CARD..issued when you register.. Hell Costco can manage to do it, right there on the spot...The card should not be "address specific" because we all know that people MOVE.. With a good photo ID voter's card that would only need to be updated as one ages..(like every 12 years), a current bill in that person's name should verify address..That's all we should ever need..

If I got the card in Indiana,it should not matter that I now live in Kansas.. If I am registered in Kansas, they could just put a KS sticker on the back of the card when I registered there, to prove that I have lived there long enough to vote.. An electric bill or rent receipt would verify my home address..

They are making something so EASY..into something so difficult..

I suspect many on both sides see this as the first step to a 'national identity card'. The technology is available to put all sorts of things on cards and use them to track things too. Not to be paranoid, but did you ever wonder what Costco, et al might be tracking?

:)..maybe they'll send me a coupon :)

seriously though, a Voter ID card is not the same as a national ID card. Lots of folks do not vote, and other than the very poor, I would guess that every other voters carries at least ONE photo ID card on their person at all times, and a multitude of other electronically linked cards:)

Visa knew when we were in tahiti, so did out bank when we used the ATM..They knew where we stayed, what we ate, what we bought.. Unless you are trafficking in something illegal, hiding from the IRS, or ducking the law, it's possible for "someone" to know exactly what you do every time you use a card for gas, or phone, or to buy a trinket at KMart..

I don;t buy into the paranoia, because as inept as our government is, I am not afraid of them "tracking" me. They knew that Katrina, Rita and Wilma were coming, tracked them for days, and still couldn't get their shit together :)

Voter ID should NEVER associate you with a party.. It should just prove that you are a voter. If you choose to align with a party, that should be entirely separate.

to get poor people IDed. These are the people who "stay with" rather than live at. They are often evicted. They live in neighborhoods where they are victims of crime including purse snatching and robbery.

Just going door to door in low income neighborhoods to try to get the poor people set up with everything they need to get IDs is a daunting task.

And then once they get the ID, we'll have to hope they don't lose it. I use my vehicle registration papers only once a year and I always have to look for them.

IDs are all about republican suppression. Voter fraud is risky and inefficient and is not swinging anything other than a razor thin election.

ACORN employees who registered Mary Poppins were only trying to get paid. Mary Poppins was never going to show up to vote.

over the USA and get the whole damned thing straightened out already. There are a lot of people dead for years in a county near me and several federal investigations showed they were always voting ...but, you know, dead. Look at Ohio going for Bush in 2004, Florida in 2000. I'd love to see a stringent overhaul of the whole damned voting system. You know when you read things that more people voted in a county than are in the county there's a bit of a problem. I think the last two presidential elections may have been stolen. Also I see nothing at all wrong with keeping illegal immigrants from voting. Can I vote in their countries? No. They can still vote in their own countries where they are citizens. Do other countries allow illegal immigrants to vote? I bet they don't. That's my two cents

didn't have easy access to a birth certificate. Therefore they are illegal aliens and shouldn't be voting?? I know you don't mean that, but it's what this amounts to.

This sort of legislation is the right wing's wet dream. Disenfranchise as many as you can. It's a solution to a problem that doesn't really exist; the fraud, by and large, does not come from voters, it comes from those who control the counting. Check the origins of legislation like this, and you will almost always find that it came from a Republican.

Right now, I can't prove I'm a U.S. citizen, because I have never possessed an official copy of my birth certificate. I recently had reason to get a passport for the first time in my 39 years, so I tried to get a copy of my b.c., but because I (legally!) changed my name some years ago, the state I was born in won't give it to me. I have to spend $300 to get a court order, in addition to $75 for posting my name in a local paper for four weeks. Then I have to wait until December for my hearing to get the court order. Once I have that, if they word the court order exactly correctly, I can then pay $20 to get the birth certificate. It will probably be January before I have it in my hand; I began this process in August.

I don't think my circumstances are all that unusual.

ballots--the old, vote now, prove it later deal.