KU Prof Beaten for Remarks on Intelligent Design

Kansas University religious studies professor Paul Mirecki reported he was beaten by two men about 6:40 a.m. today on a roadside in rural Douglas County. In a series of interviews late this afternoon, Mirecki said the men who beat him were making references to the controversy that has propelled him into the headlines in recent weeks.

“I didn’t know them, but I’m sure they knew me,” he said.

Mirecki said he was driving to breakfast when he noticed the men tailgating him in a pickup truck.

“I just pulled over hoping they would pass, and then they pulled up real close behind,” he said. “They got out, and I made the mistake of getting out.”

http://www2.ljworld.com/news/2005/dec/05/mirecki_hospitalized_after_beating/?breaking

Saddens me, really.

Man, they REALLY hate science...:scared:

They do know that they're going straight to Hell for that, don't they?

:puke:

Especially over shit that doesn't matter.

And like God needs puny humans to defend him.

Stupid fucking asshole criminal fucks.

(and no, I don't mean all Christians - just the nutbag violent hatefilled ones)

then they came for the hispanic illegals, then they came for the college professors.....

:scared:

This crap has GOT to STOP

not believe this would happen.

Like I said, I'll click on the link and you can think all the fundie things you want of this area, but he lives in the deepest blue part of the state. This would surprise me to the core if true.

I'd like to see some suspects lined up. If true, throw the book at them. But for some reason, his story is stinking. And I'm a true blue Kansan.

What reason would have have to beat himself up? I know Lawrence is a blue area, but as soon as you get away from Mass street it turns red in a hurry. You'd think the emergency room people would raise some questions if they thought he was making it up.

And even JoCo has huge pockets of blue. I know....I live in one.

Le Compton? Perry?

Really, it seems pretty plausible, and I am from Wyandotte CO, the other blue spot.

OP went for Kerry, didn't it?

And yes, Lawrence is as blue as you can get in red state hell. They had an openly gay mayor - that is a pretty good sign.

Of course, his coming out was quite warmly received here. (Yes, I live in Lawrence and teach at KU.)

Try to call one, identify yourself as a journalist, and ask for some information on anybody. They won't give it, the ambulance staff won't give it and the doctors won't give it. So they won't "raise some questions," at least not publicly unless they're subpoenaed.

I'm not sure what the disclosure laws are in Kansas, but a lot of places have to report certain types of injuries - firearm injuries, anything to do with criminal activity. If they thought the prof was making something up and beating himself, they'd report it to the police because then he'd be filing a false report.

but back when I worked in KUMed ER, only GSW's were required to be reported. Ok, that and child abuse.

that he might make up a story in the stressful situation finds himself, but to say you do "not believe this would happen" is to be overly idealistic or naive. It's perfectly conceivable that it could happen.

the whole thing 100%. A truck is tailgating him at 6:40 AM and he gets out of his car? Nothing more to the story than that?

I know I'd get out of my car in the middle of the morning with nobody else around......

Sorry, something smells fishy about the story. I'm not saying I think he beat himself up, I'm just saying I don't think we know the whole story. And I don't know of any fundies crazy fucking enough to beat up a KU Prof at 6:40AM.

for such extreme behavior as blowing up abortion clinics, shooting doctors, or strapping bombs to themselves and going into shopping malls....

But, guess what? I live right here. Right where said incident happened. And I'm sorry, but this story is not adding up. He's just innocently driving down the road when two big rednecks start tailgating him and intimidating him at 6:40AM, so he stops and gets out?

Sorry. Something doesn't add up.

This isn't hickville. Much of Kansas is....most of Kansas, actually. But not this part. Not at all. Believe me...there is more to this story.

is it so hard to believe that they went on a pilgrimage from hicktown to "open up a can o' whupass" on some pointy headed intellectual? They must get bored with sodomizing their sisters and livestock at some point.

stranger things have happened in KS than the story of this prof's assault.

Yes he is from kansas, and even though most republicans in this state will distance themselves from his rants, there is much to the ole sayin "birds of a feather --" etc

that there have essentially been 3 parties in Kansas for some time (Democratic, RW Republican, and moderate Republican), which is why we have a popular Democratic governor in this otherwise red state. The moderate Republicans have been in conflict with the extreme Right for a long time here, and many moderate Republicans actually supported Sebelius for governor last time. Just today the local rag had a story about a new organization of moderate Kansas Republicans that plans to wrest control of the Republican party in the state from RW extremists.

If you want to read about Mirecki or about this new moderate Republican group, here is the home page for the Lawrence Journal-World:

http://www.ljworld.com

And I'd say "typical", not "some nuts" - because I don't have blinders on.

And although I am very much on Mirecki's side, it bothers me that the truck was described as "large," but that no color was specified. I don't know truck or car brand names, so I wouldn't be able to specify make or model, either, but I sure would mention the color. Maybe he did, though, and the reporter just didn't include it. The stories in the Lawrence Journal-World often leave out essential details, I'm afraid.

On the one hand, I would OBVIOUSLY prefer that there not be such violence ovEr such things, but on the other, I sure DO hope he isn't making it up. By the way, he seems to have resigned his position as chair of the Religious Studies Department as a consequence of all this pressure. And, of course, the conservative Republicans in the state legislature have been calling for hearings to put pressure on Chancellor Hemenway and KU.

weighing the effects. Look at their "shot um up" leader.Remind yourself that we are involved in an illogical war with no plan to repair the scar we made removing an ugly benign tumor and ignoring the creeping terror of misunderstood religious fundamentalists. Yes,where there's a fear and a fundie there is violence.

there are some totally f*cked up Christian whackos around there. I know. Don't defend these a-holes.

Like a coupla self-appointed-and-annointed Hands of Gawd couldn't track him down?

It may be "the Deep Blue" part of the state, but they still have Christian Churches there?

What's it like, living there in the 12th Century? I live in Indiana, where it's still the 19th, but they're trying to fix that...They WANT to go to the 12th...

I remember back when the president of the Gay and Lesbian Coalition's lug nuts were loosened onher car after she spoke out against a frat's "Fag Buster" shirts. The t-shirts were modeled after the "Ghost Buster" logo and were popping up around town. During the 2000 election, Democratic signs were routinely stomped, stolen or defaced.

Earlier this year during the city commission elections there were a series of postcards sent out to targeted voter populations in an attempt influence the election. The target was a Progress Lawrence Campaign candidate. One of the postcards claimed that he beat his former wife and used quotes from a court document in which the candidate was the attorney, not the respondent, in a divorce case. It got pretty nasty as the postcards began arriving the weekend before the election.

I've had signs stolen out of my yard and I live in Lawrence in one of the most liberal precincts (we voted over 80% "NO" on the marriage between man and woman only amendment) but I still have to contend with small minded neighbors who proudly display their Phill Kline signs. What I'm trying to say is that Lawrence is blue but the surrounding county is primarily red. We have three seats on the county commission. The rural districts usually elect Republicans, Lawrence tends to elect the sole Democratic candidate each time.

With all this said, I do believe that Paul was attacked by some fundie wackos. I've been on those roads with my "Don't Blame Me I Voted for Gore" and my Boyda and Moore bumperstickers and have been flipped off by drivers who first acted like they were going to ram my car by coming up fast from behind then slowing down and doing this over and over again. It can get nasty in some areas especially when you're going around some of those curves between Haskell and Vinland. There will always be pockets of idiots.

I was hoping you would jump in on this. :hi:

Remember the sex studies prof the fundies went after last year? What is going on in Lawrence? :scared:

It was Susan Wagle, a state senator from around the Wichita area, that went after Dailey because of his sex education class. She claimed that he was promoting things like pedophilia and homosexuality. One of her little toadies went on O'Lielly's show and was laughed out of town. Senator broadens attack on professor

As for what's going on in Lawrence. I think it is the same thing that has gone on here (and elsewhere) for years and will continue to go on for as long as mankind exists. There are emotionally disturbed people and once in a while they climb out from under their rocks and cause trouble. As wrong as we think their justification, motives or ideas are they feel the same way about us. They think those of us who believe in things like science are threatening them. When they get threatened enough they think they can change things or at least shut the opposition down by attacking them. They believe, as we do, that once the problem they perceive is given the attention they believe it deserves that others will either join them or at least come out and support them.

Hey back to you!

to spy for her?

Or does it?

"The controversy started on the first day of class," said Zahn, a Linwood senior who is serving as an intern for Wagle. http://www2.ljworld.com/news/2003/apr/29/wagle_tells_tvs/

It's just a coincidence. :eyes:

Mirecki's emails, too. Even our states very RW conservative Republican attorney General (Phil Kline, of the abortion records fishing expeditions) was surprised about the attack on academic freedom and said something against the threat of hearings.

major outcry about this. Ignorance. And who is their leader? Who wants to teach "both sides" of the issue in high school science class?

:hi: :toast:

I'm surprised this doesn't happen more often.

it has been going on already, in the form of intimidation and physically (physical abuse esp to gays). It just doesn't make news. I will be surprised if I hear this story in our news in Houston or in the national news.

Violence is rare in Douglas County, rarer before 7 a.m. and not likely against a guy who has been so thoroughly beaten by his own sloppy email. Who would take offense at this guy after seeing him make an ass of himself, get criticized by his boss and have his anti-ID class canceled?

Now, maybe we do have two-man goon squads of jack-booted right-wing thugs roaming the countryside, casing liberal academics' homes and tailgating them on the prairie.

Maybe.

and that's even considering I've lived in Missouri, it's hillbilly neighbor to the east.

Don't live in denial. I have no problem believing some Christian Crusader fuckwits would take it into their heads to go "stone age" on us and whip out the cro-magnon law of the land.

so fitting. so ironic.

wasn't my neighborhood.

and there looks to be evidence of a beating:

"He said the men beat him about the upper body with their fists, and he said he thinks they struck him with a metal object. He was treated and released at Lawrence Memorial Hospital."

<snip>

"Douglas County Sheriff’s Officials are classifying the case as an aggravated battery. They wouldn’t say exactly where the incident happened, citing the ongoing investigation."

Sounds like Kansas may not be as safe as you claim it to be....

You'd think they'd definitely wait until they could grab him far from where he could get help from onlookers, or they could be apprehended.

Undoubtedly they knew exactly who he was.

It doesn't take all that long to recognize the features of primitive, regressive politics in Kansas. There are TONS of truculent right-wingers here. Far more than is tasteful!

Exactly what I said up-thread. Something doesn't add up with this story.

sounds like the Kansas I've seen when I lived there as a teen for 5 years.

Every state has bullies. Sorry you got picked on, but don't blame it on Kansas.

rhe repukes and that AWOL coke snorting asswipe occupying OUR White House - that's still about 40% of "amerikkka".

Sweeping generalizations about this state which attempt to portray it as a super-civilized community are based on flawed information.

People who have lived here a long time are well aware of Kansas cultural problems. There has been an intense right-wing domineering presence in North-East Kansas for ages. The rest of the state has very tiny islands of intelligence.

Weirder things have happened, but this report doesn't sound right at the moment...

Weirder things have happened.

ok, who leaked?

Violence is rare in Douglas County, rarer before 7 a.m.

So I guess any crime story that doesnt come from Detroit should be disbelieved then?

and not likely against a guy who has been so thoroughly beaten by his own sloppy email.

Exactly what logic did you employ to reach this conclusion?

Who would take offense at this guy after seeing him make an ass of himself, get criticized by his boss and have his anti-ID class canceled?

Im sorry that you have such a hard time comprehending the fact that bad things happen, but they do. Some people arent satisfied thinking they won an email exchange. Some people arent satisfied with thinking thier opponants and ass. Some people are satisified when people are critisized or have their classes cancelled. Some people choose less civilized options and if the niavete in your argument is not faked I suggest you discover that most voilence isnt going to make sense to you, that doesnt mean it didnt happen.

Now, maybe we do have two-man goon squads of jack-booted right-wing thugs roaming the countryside, casing liberal academics' homes and tailgating them on the prairie.

A comically lame strawman, how quaint.

Sure we have violence round these parts. Wild Bill Hickock come through and shot up lots of foke. So'd that Quantrill feller, pert near burned down the city of Lawrence, over slavery, no less. So heck yeah, we got some violent folk here. Lock up some of em in a bright shiny jail all lit up like a monument on the edge of town. Yep, yer right buddy we got violence. Senseless violence. Mean-spirited violence. This a hear professor says he got punched and hit with a pipe. He's prolly too smart to make up something this stupid. Prolly happened. Or maybe happened. Road rage maybe. He forgot to to use his blinker, maybe. Yapping on his cell phone. Maybe he has a bumper sticker: Mean people suck. Pissed of some mean people. Hoo knows? Not this hayseed.

This a hear professor says he got punched and hit with a pipe. He's prolly too smart to make up something this stupid.

Huh?

Prolly happened. Or maybe happened.

So your problem is that reality is probably or maybe stupid?

Road rage maybe. He forgot to to use his blinker, maybe. Yapping on his cell phone. Maybe he has a bumper sticker:

So basically any explenation will do except the one the victim gives?

Mean people suck. Pissed of some mean people. Hoo knows? Not this hayseed.

Well yes, he did piss some peole off, and those people responded by assulting him.

no wonder you are hiding, hayseed. LOL.

by five guys, and he was strangled and left for dead (he lived, thank goodness), on 9th street--one of the busiest streets in town--right here in Lawrene 10 years ago. It was just before 10:00 at night, and he was walking his girlfriend home from another friend's house not far away. He was kicked and stomped, too, not just beaten with fists.

There is plenty of violence here in Lawrence.

Plenty of pick up truck goons are up that early... trust me. The red visor and wool gloves, sounds just about right.

It's a violent breed that doesn't resemble anything Christian.

without any actual facts.

some sort of hate crimes legislation that protects intellectuals?

Fucking brainless fundies won't rest until they bring the entire human race down to their level of prideful ignorance.

I'm just saying we should start kicking their asses.

Liberal...doesn't mean pacifist.

I know that everyone wants so much to believe that this is somehow because of the class he wanted to teach, but I smell bullshit a mile away on this story.

He believes in evolution (as ALL people I know in Kansas believe in evlolution) and somehow we are supposed to believe that he was attacked by two sicko fundies at 6:40 AM because of his beliefs? I call bullshit. He lives in an almost entirely blue county in Kansas. Most liberal county in Kansas. And I don't for a minute believe this is the whole story.

We shall see.

In the meantime, how about not fucking recommending until we have the facts?

Geezus, people act like one story Yahoo! story and this is for real. Guess what? They once reported that Iraq had WMD and a tie to Al Qaeda. A media person once told me "don't believe anything you read and only half of what you see." Because either way, they aren't showing you the whole truth.

Let's not jump to conclusions. You have to admit that this story sounds kind of fishy.

Douglas county may be blue, but its really just Lawrence that is. And west lawrence is becoming more purple by the day. He said he was driving to breakfast at 6:40am. Could be to a colleague's house? Or a country cafe? I don't know. But I'm not sure why he would make this up. Especially since he went to the hospital to be checked out. They'd raise a flag if things were inconsistent. They may still. But right now, its not surprising for something like this to happen.

in Topeka?

What does that have to do with it? Nobody here supports him. NOBODY. Do you have some sort of special exemption law that you can pull out of your pocket and make a person move because of their beliefs and hate speech, no matter how hideous? I don't know a single Kansan in my whole life who doesn't hate that mofo to the core. But we have a little thing called free speech in this country and we can't exactly show up at his place with pitchforks and torches.....although he's the one person in the world I would show up with a torch and a pitchfork if I could.

who'd be motivated to plan out and do something like this.

Dunno whether it happened as the prof described or not I don't know- but last I heard, filing a false police report was a criminal offense, so I'm less skeptical than I might be.

Call me cynical, but I believe this story stinks. If they catch some guys and charge them for beating him up because he believes in evolution, I'll be shocked. If they catch two dudes for beating him up because they were headed home from hunting and got in some road rage incident with him, I won't be surprised. I'm just saying I doubt it had anything to do with his Internet comments.

I will mark this thread for future reference when we all know more about the story.

For what it is worth however, I am a low-profile individual who has been threatened on-line for posting my views. I have little doubt that if I had anywhere near the visibility of this fellow I would, by now, have encountered at least one confrontation.

Perhaps even a violent one.

To say that a man like Phelps has no support is definitely incorrect. Otherwise he would have no voice either... and one certainly begets the other.

That I may believe this has happened does not mean that I know the whole story though...

And I'll be keeping my eyes open.

PM me if you get info.

I have a relationship with The University of Kansas and I look forward to speaking with officials whom I feel I can trust and I look forward to hearing all the facts. The most troubling "facts" for me are the time frame and the fact he got out of his car.

If he was jumped by two fundies, looks like we all need to watch our backs and I retract my statement. It's just that my gut says otherwise. I'll keep you posted.

And I'm terribly sorry for your online incident.

Edited to note that Fred Phelps does indeed have some support. Unfortunately, they all share his DNA because they are his children and grandchildren......several of whom are skilled attorneys. See, Fred is a lawyer. And his kids are lawyers. And their kids. It's sort of the the family biz. Crazy, fundie lawyers. They are nuts. They are evil. But, damn it if they don't know the law. That's why they get away with their bit. And that's why we can't make them leave.

I know that everyone wants so much to believe that this is somehow because of the class he wanted to teach, but I smell bullshit a mile away on this story.

I know you have no idea what everyone here does or doesnt want to believe.

He believes in evolution (as ALL people I know in Kansas believe in evlolution)

Alot of people in Kansas don't. Are you denying they exist?

and somehow we are supposed to believe that he was attacked by two sicko fundies at 6:40 AM because of his beliefs?

What exactly are you finding hard to believe? People all over the world resort to violence for what from the outside appear to be stupid reasons ALL THE TIME, very rarely is violence used in a way that appears justified to outsiders. There is nothing the slightest bit unbelievable about people with sharp ideological differences getting into a dispute that escalates into violence. It happens all the time.

I call bullshit.

So you have said, repeatedly.

He lives in an almost entirely blue county in Kansas. Most liberal county in Kansas. And I don't for a minute believe this is the whole story.

So what? Almost entirely blue isnt entirely blue is it?

In the meantime, how about not fucking recommending until we have the facts?

Im sure that will persuade many people.

Geezus, people act like one story Yahoo! story and this is for real. Guess what? They once reported that Iraq had WMD and a tie to Al Qaeda. A media person once told me "don't believe anything you read and only half of what you see." Because either way, they aren't showing you the whole truth.

I assume you post this on every single thread on DU referencing a media source?

Let's not jump to conclusions. You have to admit that this story sounds kind of fishy.

No, we dont have to admit that because your argument consists of claiming that this is an uncommon type of crime (duh) and arguing from a position of general skepticism. Neither of which gives us any reason to doubt this story more than any other stories. How many other stories on DU from the same flawed media, depicting events of equal likelyhood are you urging people to be skeptical about?

Wasn't it at the outbreak of the war that some LA-area prof (female), or maybe SF, claimed to have been attacked by rabid Bush-bots and it turned out she made the whole thing up?

from the article:

Mirecki recently wrote online that he planned to teach intelligent design as mythology in an upcoming course. He wrote it would be a "nice slap" in the "big fat face" of fundamentalists.

I don't know where he wrote this; whether it was intended for public view, or something he wrote in an email. Either way, smart people with a goal do not spread around something that will hamper achieving that goal.

We can also tell Mirecki has motivation - he wants to slap fundies around and make them look bad (like that's hard, but we're preaching to the choir here).

So we know a) he's dumb, b) his previous dumbness made it possible for his target to trip him from his stated goal of publicly spanking said target. The question is: is he stupid enough to attempt to go after the target again by making up a story that can be debunked?

organization. I am not sure, but he might even be their advisor. It was certainly unwise to write that, but he does have a right to free speech, after all, and there is somehting chilling about the fact that his enemies went fishing in his emails like that.

gainsaying what the report says because you don't WANT to think its possible.

At the moment, the report contains all the facts we're aware of, but when people discuss the report, you tells us to ignore the report then lambast for not working with facts.

There's nothing wrong with being skeptical of the report, but to criticize others who are taking the report at face value is a bit unfair to claim they're not working with facts.

hey, I live in a supposedly safe area, too, but even so there is occasional violence.
Because you don't want to think something is possible, does not make it impossible.

Freepers claim Paul Mirecki beat himself up.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x5527034#5527135

Mirecki's account -- at least as reported in this article -- wouldn't be enough to IDENTIFY the assailants, let alone convict them. It doesn't hold water, it's thin and shallow and implausible.

Two white guys between 30 and 40 in a "large" pickup truck wearing jeans. Good luck with that investigation, officer.

Was there a police report?
Is there an investigation?
Truck follows and stops, and he doesn't an LP?
I agree, something don't smell right.

and the sheriff's department (since it occurred outside the city limits) is taking it seriously according to the local news.

According the UDK (University Daily Kansan) Paul "spent between three and four hours at Lawrence Memorial Hospital, where he received X-Rays and a CT scan. He said he suffered a broken tooth but didn’t specify other injuries he may have sustained." http://www.kansan.com/stories/2005/dec/06/mirecki/

It isn't the first time that a prof has come under attack by the RW in Kansas over classes. A recent (and highly publicized case) happened just last couple of years with Dennis Dailey over one of his classes. http://www.ljworld.com/section/kusexclass

and his colleagues say he looked pretty scraped up. He did have injuries.

I live in a senior community. All my neighbors are seniors and most of them are Democrats. There is a background check on everyone who has a share in this community. Does that mean that no crime could ever possibly take place here or even that crime is unlikely? Not hardly.

We have had 5 break-ins in the last year. The thieves were finally caught. Funny thing about that - they weren't people who live here. They came from outside our community. They came in a car.

i don't know what sounds so fishy, no one expects to have their ass kicked that early in the morning, do they? i mighta got out of my car myself. so would you, since you claim it so damned safe, right?

is that this couldn't have happened because it was in Kansas???

Ummmm.....nice try, but I'll go with Occam's razor on this one.

And what's your beef with this guy anyway? It sounds personal . . .

that I believe it too.

Nothing says the perps were from Douglas County, KU or even Kansas itself. They could have driven there for the express purpose of beating this fellow up. Tim McVeigh, after all, didn't actually live in Oklahoma, but he sure managed to get there all right.

I live in Durham, North Carolina, home of Duke University and about 40% African American--along with the neighboring counties, we are a speck of blue in a sea of red. A couple of months ago, we had some cross burnings. I've doubted seriously that the perps in that case were from Durham--they just came here to make a point. If you want to pick on, bully and intimidate people, you've got to hit them where they live, which is what these losers did.

I believe the guy, though his attacks on ID lacked the class I'd like to see from a member of the academy. Nonetheless, the fact he got beat on by a couple of right-wing hoodlums is not a reflection on Kansas. It could have just as easily happened in Texas, Arkansas, Mississippi, Louisiana, Alabama, Tennessee, North Carolina, South Carolina, Kentucky, Virginia, West Virginia, Indiana, Georgia, Wyoming, Utah, Montana or Idaho.

They're mad that facts reveal their utter ignorance of reality - so, of course, beating up someone who deals in facts rather than unproven bullshit mythological nonsense is a reasonable response.

And people wonder why organized 'revealed' religion is feared.

beatup anyone that opposed their way of thinking.

who worship the Jesus of intolerance, vindictiveness, violence, and hate.

capital of the world. Very sad.

Ever since the Kansas-Nebraska Act of 1854 and Bleeding Kansas, the place has had more than its share of wackos. ("The first shot of the small war was fired by the colonel Rob McHell when he shot his neighbor in the face when he learned he would not be voting for slavery," according to Wikipedia.)

Not to say that everyone in Kansas is a wacko. But it seems to attract them.

KS was pretty progressive when I lived there. Dem governors back to back for years. It all changed drastically around Reagan's time.

"The sheriff’s department is looking for the suspects, described as two white males between ages 30 and 40, one wearing a red visor and wool gloves, and both wearing jeans. They were last seen in a large pickup truck."

Hmm...two angry white men, wearing jeans and driving a pick-up truck.

Unbelievable.

that description!

Heeyuck!

I live in an area with a fair amount of people described that way. I tell you what, if I'm tailgaited by an angry aggressive driver they are almost ALWAYS a guy in that age range, white, pick up truck, and right wing stickers. Why do you find that hard to believe? Do you think the story would be more credible if they were wearing suits?

Yes, people have been known to resort to thuggery against those who don't share their views.

But people have also been known to tell lies.


If (for instance) there had been witnesses who could confirm Mirecki's claim, or if he'd been brought to the hospital with severe injuries (less likely to be self-inflicted), then it would be more reasonable to assume that Mirecki had indeed been a victim of violence. But under the circumstances, I'm not assuming anything.


:think:

"The sheriff’s department is looking for the suspects, described as two white males between ages 30 and 40, one wearing a red visor and wool gloves, and both wearing jeans. They were last seen in a large pickup truck."


Let's see. Two white males wearing jeans traveling in a large pickup truck.

Shouldn't have any problem finding those two!

much to find out this story is true. Because the fundie contingent is very angry, because the Repubs have been smearing this man and saying he hates Christians, and because many RW types have a deep resentment of academia to begin with. Left-wing college profs are the enemy ... their pundits and preachers have been telling them so for years. I'm not suggesting that this attack was the result of a conspiracy. It was most likely the act of a couple of resentful locals who saw a chance to take out their aggression on someone they thought deserving.

I'm not saying 'It couldn't happen,' because it definitely could... Look at the pondscum who killed Matt Shepherd, for example. And plenty of other nasty incidents.

Just...

...something about the way this story is related and presented doesn't quite convince me that the whole story is being told.

It's like one instrument being out of tune in a whole orchestra-- you can't put your finger on it, but there's something odd.

Maybe it's just inadequate reporting. Is that area way rural, with no traffic at all between 6:30 and 7:00 on that road? How did they know he'd be driving there at that hour? If it's worth making that kind of effort to assault Mirecki, why would they stop before inflicting more damage, and just drive away?

I dunno, it's just like there's relevant parts to this story that aren't being reported.

Just, like I said, odd.

unsatiatedly,
Bright

We already know that Mirecki has a penchant for dramatic overstatement: It's right there in the email where he described his class as a slap in the big, fat faces of conservatives in Kansas.

So I'm going to be skeptical until I hear more. Douglas County isn't at all remote. Lots of professors have acreages in the country, rush hour hits about every road in the surrounding country, and an attacker wouldn't have much time on most roads to act without being witnessed.

When I lived in Lawrence, rednecks surrounded me though. Two were cops, and the third was a hunter. Overall, the city is a liberal theme park, founded by Massachusetts abolitionists who wanted to keep Kansas from becoming a slave state, and burned once or twice by pro-slavery Missourians. It's got an extraordinarily strong liberal identity for Kansas, and it's the nicest town within 600 miles in absolutely any direction.

Of course, the student body is primarily snot-nosed slumlord spawn from the Johnson County suburbs of Kansas City, whose daddies put them through college by endlessly screwing over tenants and foreclosing on rent-to-own suckers in KCMO's and KCK's endless, rotting single-family housing slums. Then there's the rich country kids from across the windy plains who aren't smart enough to go to K-State and become veterinarians.

But it still bothers me that the color of the truck was never mentioned.

Even people who post on this board don't grasp what the tali-borg will do if given free rein. They are some nasty yellow shirts and beating up a uppity professor is what they'd do for fun.

Professor beaten; attackers cite KU creationism class

Associated Press

LAWRENCE - A professor whose planned course on creationism and intelligent design was canceled after he sent e-mails deriding Christian conservatives was hospitalized Monday after what appeared to be a roadside beating.

University of Kansas religious studies professor Paul Mirecki said that the two men who beat him made references to the class that was to be offered for the first time this spring.

Originally called "Special Topics in Religion: Intelligent Design, Creationism and other Religious Mythologies," the course was canceled last week at Mirecki's request
The class was added after the Kansas State Board of Education decided to include more criticism of evolution in science standards for elementary and secondary students.>>>snip

http://www.kansas.com/mld/eagle/living/education/13337930.htm

Beat someone up for disagreeing with him?

Good job, fundies. You've managed to take the Christ out of Christianity again.

all Kansas Universities. During the Viet Nam protests they set fire to the student union.

http://www.kuhistory.com/proto/story.asp?id=73

There had been serious unrest there for years prior to this event: extreme tension.

But this is no sign of the apocalypse, is it? Slapping a guy in the face after he bragged about slapping people in the face sounds like good old fashioned hooliganism.

fundyism.

n/t

LAWRENCE, Kan. - A professor whose planned course on creationism and intelligent design was canceled after he sent e-mails deriding Christian conservatives was hospitalized Monday after an apparent roadside beating.

University of Kansas religious studies professor Paul Mirecki told the Lawrence Journal-World that two men who beat him were making references to the class that was to be offered for the first time this spring. Originally called "Special Topics in Religion: Intelligent Design, Creationism and other Religious Mythologies," the course was canceled last week at Mirecki's request.

The class was added after the Kansas Board of Education decided to include more criticism of evolution in science standards for elementary and secondary students. "I didn't know them," Mirecki said of his assailants, "but I'm sure they knew me."

One recent e-mail from Mirecki to members of a student organization referred to religious conservatives as "fundies," and said a course describing intelligent design as mythology would be a "nice slap in their big fat face." Mirecki has apologized for those comments.

http://www.joplinglobe.com/story.php?story_id=213656&c=87

They are beating scientists now.

.. doing Jesus' work of violence and intolerance.

and they can't?

I don't think he deserved to be beaten up.

The class he was going to teach was announced only a few weeks ago and already had 25 students sign up for it. What a shame they canceled it.

but offhand I don't remember who is offering it. I could look it up, but I am feeling lazy right now.

I teach in KC. I LOVE snow days. :woohoo:

And I had to walk up the Louisiana St. hill--the one that gives Mt. Oread the right to be called Mt. Oread. It was like climbing the glass mountain, and I was exhausted when I got to my office. Lawrence doesn't even plough that hill!

and the city didn't even own a snow plow.

They must figure the heavy traffic will keep it all packed down flat, but it is slick as anything. I don't thing the city even has the money to cleared most of the streets. A friend drove me down 9th St. today, one of THE main thoroughfares in town, and it wasn't cleared--just packed by traffic. Cars were sliding all over the place.

But what do I care? If the buses can't run, we don't have school. And I can stay here over in Kansas all snug and warm - where they plow our streets. :)

1. he's driving to breakfast (ok so far)
2. he sees 2 men tailgating in a "large" pickup truck at 6:40am (no other vehicle description provided)
3. he pulls over, hoping they would pass (reasonable enough)
4. they pull over, and get out of the truck (uh oh)
5. instead of driving away at that point, this supposedly intelligent man gets out of his car (nope)
6. "the men beat him about the upper body with their fists, and he said he thinks they struck him with a metal object" doesn't read like any other description of battery I've ever encountered. What, no blows to the face? No kick in the nuts? But they struck him (where?) with "a metal object"?
7. they "were making references to the controversy", what does that mean?
8. assailants are "two white males between ages 30 and 40, one wearing a red visor and wool gloves, and both wearing jeans" who "knew me," the latter only by reference to his very public positions.

This are utterly useless descriptions of both the assailants and their vehicle.

For instance, the truck. What is the make and model? OK, he's a religious studies professor, so maybe he's not that in-touch with car culture. So how about COLOR? License plate? If not the license plate numbers, was it a Kansas plate or a Missouri plate or what?

Then the attackers. We have descriptions of two articles of clothing -- notably a red visor (so he's not colorblind, he could have identified the truck's color too) and wool gloves (what color were they?), both accessories easily discarded. AND THAT'S IT. What, the jeans? Probably 99% of Kansans have jeans. White males between 30 and 40? Well, that probably narrows it down to about 10% of the population. What about height and weight? If someone's up-close enough to smack you around, you're going to see how tall they are. What about appearance? Clean shaven or beards, blonde or redhead, big nose, floppy ears, anything? No? What about the other guy, was he wearing a hat or not? Did they have accents? High voices? Low, gruff voices? C'mon, man, throw us a bone.

I'm beginning to have a different theory, based on the premise that the article is not omitting "large" chunks of Mirecki's statements, possibly to protect the attackers. I think Mr. (Dr.?) Mirecki decided his "controversy" was insufficiently controversial, and put a little whoop-ass on himself on the way to breakfast. That's why he didn't end up with a broken nose and two black eyes and maybe 12 stiches for a gash on the back of his skull from the "metal object". That's why his attackers are described like shapeless ghosts in a phantom truck such that no one could ever hope to identify them and call the Crime Stoppers number. They did not exist. When Mirecki is exposed as a fraud, it will do immense damage to his reputation and set back the causes he represented. He's making a huge mistake.

but this doesn't qutie ring true for me either. I'm reminded of a gay pastor in New England (Vermont, maybe) who set his own house on fire to make the locals look like wingnuts. He only hurt the cause of gays in the church.

If the guy was beaten, that's a tragedy...and a crime. But it just doesn't sound altogether credible to me.

Ockham's razor just shreds this guy's story -- as reported in the OP -- to bits.

It's possible that the reporting is crap, and there was actually much more detail, but with only this much to go on I can't help but reach the conclusion that the prof is pulling some shite to get himself back in the headlines while making his opposition look like thugs.

Most people who end up on the wrong end of a violent attack simply aren't in an "eyewitness" mindset when the event occurs, and frequently have incomplete of inaccurate memories of the event. This happens all the time in criminal trials, where the victim/witness will testify that the suspect was wearing a white hat and another witness will testify that the hat was black. It doesn't mean that the event didn't happen - it just means that most people don't have 100% accurate recollections of such events. A big part of the training of police officers is training them to be effective and accurate witnesses to crimes and accidents - they need the training because it is not the disposition of normal people to be able to provide the kind of details you are expecting from Prof. Mirecki.

I have to admit that your theory of this being an "inside job" did cross my mind at first, but the fact that he is not serving up pitch-perfect pre-fab evidence of the crime on a silver platter actually bolsters his credibility with me somewhat. Usually when smart people try to stage a crime, they actually over-plan it and provide much more detail and consistency than real-life witnesses actually can.

It will be interesting to see where this story leads. I'm not buying his version of events without some skepticism, but I'm willing to extend the benefit of the doubt at this point.

Why the fuck would he get out of his car to talk to 2 strangers that had been stalking him. Dumbass:spank:

Surely they'd feel more at home someplace like Iran.

but my son pointed out that at 6:20 a.m. it is still dark out, and with the truck's headlights shining, he would not have been able to see its color at all. He's right.

I see his crime was that he asked that intelligent design be removed from the cirriculum.

this is NOT the Lawrence I used to know and love