Bodies of 2 (Actually 3) more Katrina victims found

In both cases, residents were assured the homes had been searched, in the Times Picayune version, the cops are blaming the Feds. This couple's home was marked as if it was searched on Sept 14th and "0" bodies were found. They could have still been alive, but the autopsy coming so late isn't going to tell us that now. How convienent for the Feds.


"Returning to the home on Monday for the first time since August, the caretaker found the bodies of the 97-year-old man and 89-year-old woman.....
snip....

Officer Garry Flot, New Orleans police spokesman, said their identities and causes of death will be determined by the coroner's office, which will perform autopsies and try to contact the family.....snip.....


On Sunday, the body of an 83-year-old man was found by relatives inside his Port Street home in the Ninth Ward. The man had not been seen since Aug. 28, a day before Katrina struck, according to police.

The house had been flooded, officer Juan Barnes had said, and it appeared the man might have drowned. Family found his decomposing body in the front of the house."


more....

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/front/3506176.html

"Police said while the New Orleans Police Department assisted in the search for the dead or for those who survived the storm, it was not their primary duty.
The responsibility for kicking down doors and smashing through windows looking for signs of life or death was with military forces, such as the National Guard and a federal contractor."




http://www.nola.com/news/t-p/metro/index.ssf?/base/news-12/1133852248209270.xml


clarified quote's source (which is missing from latest version of this story on TP online). grrrr.

who was supposed to be checking this house on Sept14th? The Feds know.

'"So, perhaps the question is not, why was -- why wasn't this house checked, but why was there a zero painted on the front. To that, we don't have an answer tonight -- Anderson.

COOPER:....snip....
But what's amazing to me, Keith, is that we know the state stopped house-to-house searches officially on October 3. I asked the governor a couple of weeks, what -- who made that decision, and why was that decision made? Because, clearly, there were so many houses which hadn't been gotten to. She didn't know who made that decision, and she couldn't tell me why that decision had been made.And we know the sheriff from Saint Bernard Parish was complaining. Even back then, he said -- back on October 3, we are still going to find more bodies.
The death toll has risen by more than 100 since October 3. Is there -- I mean, are searches still going on in houses?

OPPENHEIM: Well, only if there's a cause to do so.

snip.....

COOPER: It's just -- you know, so sad, looking at your piece, how it started off, with that picture of that lovely lady. It looked like a picture of the '40s or -- or -- or '50s, that that is the only thing people are going to remember her by. That's the only thing left of her. She certainly deserved better than to just be left in -- in that house for all this time. '

more....

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0512/05/acd.01.html

This is just third-hand information, but a friend told me her cousin is now working as a forensic investigator in New Orleans. He is very angry because Gov. Blanco issued an order that said that locked homes could not be entered by search parties. This means even if a neighborhood is "searched" many people could be left behind if the front door is locked. This, combined with the arbitrary decision to stop searches on Oct. 3, makes me wonder if the Governor is trying to cover up this mess as much as FEMA.

funny first time i'm seeing it attributed to Blanco is purely anectdotal 4th hand info. well, that's cute.
The "arbitrary" decision was to pull out 10/03 the Feds, Fema.... and you think that's Blanco's fault? They feds have punished NO for not giving up the state to the military. They are still punishing NO.

Well, it's ancedotal 4th hand information that's being circulated, so if I can debunk it, that's a good thing. I don't know if it's FEMA or La., that's why I asked. If it's purely FEMA, I have to wonder why La. & Nagin went along with it. Couldn't the National Guard continue doing searches? They weren't federalized, so FEMA couldn't tell them what to do. Couldn't the state searchers follow their own guidelines & break into these homes, go past the Oct. 3 deadline? I blame FEMA 100% for the tragedy in New Orleans, but I'm not sure they had that much power that they could stop searches by the city or state.

since Fema pulled out in Oct and called it quits. They did a 1/2 assesd job and bailed too soon. they called knocking on windows- a month later searching? That is sick!
They also argued $$$ with the state for 6 weeks trying to get the (nearly bankrupt) state to pickup a big % of the cost of DNA testing. so that's only due to begin now. they have been playing nickle and dime games with NO all the while while denying free volunteers the opportunity to help.
welcome to the privatized federal govt, Marie. Fema just cares people get paid- the Red Cross- who also did squat, those ghouls who dump bodies to hide them, etc etc etc... it sucks. The Gov begged for help, and all they did was screw her over and lie about that too.

I'm also very angry about the way that people were abandoned & degraded in New Orleans. So I really just want to know the truth; whoever's fault it is. The Governor's memos are just heartbreaking - she was trying so hard to get FEMA to help, but they wouldn't (or couldn't). FEMA is probably a good example of Bush's shining new America - more interested in contracts & cronyism than governing or helping Americans. But I still can't get over all those people silently waiting for someone to find them, and I still wish the state or local gov. could have done more to allow those people some dignity at the end. Somebody, anybody.

Too bad what the Feds called searching did not mean to go inside, but the fireman have been since the Feds left.
Not such inside info you got there, is it?

"Nearly every home in the Lower 9th has been searched at least once, first by rescue teams and again by other crews as the months wore on after the storm. But conditions inside make the searching painstaking and slow. It can take a half-day to search some homes, because firefighters have to practically excavate many of the felled buildings.

Firefighters also have come upon some homes that are simply too dangerous to search.

"We're not going to enter those. They've been searched by dogs," Fire Department Capt. George Delpidio said."

http://www.nola.com/news/t-p/neworleans/index.ssf?/base/news-4/1132299892115270.xml

- it took relatives of an 83 year old man more than three months to check on his whereabouts?

I seriously doubt if they expected to find him in his lounge chair fiddling with the remote after that length of time.

the house was checked and hoped for the best their folks were relocated.
People were not allowed back for a month-and are only allowed back during the day even now- they were aware people were scattered to 15 other states. heck i'm sure they were scattered too. you assume they have the resources to come back and double checkon the govt, when they couldn't do this at all until it was too damned late? they were not allowed back to save their own. just as Fema didn't allow the Red Cross to help em. And these houses were marked as searched.
there are 6000 still missing, you want to blame all their families too?

- to look for them as they were being cared for by a caretaker according to the story.

But the old man who was found by "relatives" is different. Three weeks is one thing but three + months is quite another. I do not believe that someone couldn't have found a way to either get to NO to check on that man or have the Red Cross or other organization check on him if they really gave a damn about him.

house had been checked out- there were marks on the outisde made by Fema or Nat Guard yet there was the body, right smack in the living room. She had been calling trying to locate them since immediately after the storm and told the house had been checked, tried to get her kids to go in, as they came back earlier, but they believed the marls on the outside "0" bodies were there.
i have no reason to think the other man's family did any different. the government stopped people from going back for a month, yet they weren't taking care of much themselves. i believe that's why they didn't want anybody to go back. to see the incompetence. the "ran out of paint" bullshit.
i'd say the family is the last to blame here. they shouldn't have to go pick through a disaster zone when the govt says they are on it, and also prevents them from doing so.
everybody was dead by the time they let residents back, a month later.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x4967951

where did you get the stats on the 6000 missing? I have tried on and off to get good stats on this as I feel it should be reflect in the final death count to get a true picture of the catastrophy. In the Grear Galveston Hurricane, they always include the missing and presumed dead. If we do this...Katrina WILL be the worst ever. I think we need to be honest with ourselves. By low balling the numbers-it works against the people of NO. It makes it seem less of a disaster.

http://www.newsday.com/news/nationworld/nation/ny-uskids1204,0,8331.story?coll=ny-nation-big-pix

i believe people have been trying to cross reference the two or three major lists the Red Cross and another to get the full number- but here's the sad stat on kids as of two days ago.

I never believed the total we were given. The 6 thousand seems right and reasonable. We just have not been given a true accounting and media has white washed it. I am sure bodies were washed out to sea, decomposed, etc and this continual 'discovery' of bodies justifies my instincts. I am sure fishermen will be dredging up skeletal remains for a while. It hurts my heart that so many people are uncertain as to their loved ones where abouts. I feel too many people know instinctively we have been lied to and this is why Bush has suffered in the polls. I think he will NOT recover from this. In retrospect, I think Bush's downfall will be calculated from Katrina forward (although for me it was Camp Casey). Thanks for some solid links.

They may well have not known where the people were, they may be listed among those thousands missing. Now that they have finally been allowed back in, they know.

:kick:

Based on what I've seen here in town. You can tell by the markings that were sprayed on the property. There's an X and in that the date, unit, # of people found, and either "ext" (most cases) or "int"

I feel horrible for people finding their loved ones in such a state.

what is this the fucking dark ages where ewe bring out our own dead.
i hope blanco opens her mouth now that she's vindicated herself.
it's so wrong.

was rescued 2 weeks after the hurricane when the CA National Guard DISOBEYED these FEMA orders when they saw his hand in the window. He was in a coma, barely alive. (He later died at the hosipital of the effects of starvation and dehydration.)

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x4769370
thread title (9/14 GD): FEMA has ordered searchers NOT to break into homes?

Of course, no one's really in charge anyway.

Easy to find dozens of accounts of them refusing volunteers help, putting people in pens so they couldn't leave NO if they wanted to, stopping the searches after just a month, easy to find if you need to.

dKos diary entry: http://www.dailykos.com/story/2005/9/14/12516/3649



Of course by that time, survivors would likely be in a coma, or at least too weak to see the search parties and call for help. Mr. Hollingsworth was in a coma when they broke in and found him.

were. i couldn't. everyone kept telling this woman the house had been searched.
i believe people assumption would be that searched means searched. CNN doesn't seem to know that this is the case. at least anderson expected they break a window and do a sniff test at very home. i guess not.

areas since the beginning, usually by families returning. See replies #63, 66, 75 in this current thread:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x5523802#5529991
thread title (12/5 GD): Anderson Cooper - Story on Katrina families returning finding dead bodies

There has never been enough national outrage about it.

We know this has been one big lie and white wash by the media. When they control the means of communication, it is hard to get the message out.

body dumping elsewhere and operated by a Bush family crony:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x1778107
thread title (Sept 13): FEMA outsources Katrina body count to firm implicated in body-dumping!



Note the clarification on this article if you intend to cite it:
Clarification: After FEMA began working with Kenyon, they were subsequently contracted by Louisiana Governor Blanco. It was Louisiana that signed a formal contract.

I was also struck by this quote in the article:
Upon learning of Kenyon’s contract, Buckner {a mortician} expressed puzzlement. He told the Shelbyville Times-Gazette, "Volunteers would have gone at no charge."

obvious from the RESCUES that happened, always against FEMA orders or by foreign or citizen heroes:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=5523802&mesg_id=5530126

For the collection of links. It's heartbreaking and outrageous that the bodies are still out there. Tks for spreading the news- it ain't so easy to find, is it?

I have been noodlen around on the web for accurate stats of the missing and stopped around mid Nov. It has been like an itch you can't scratch though and these links are helpful. God Bless those that don't give up on this and continue to demand an accounting and try to locate the missing loved ones.

It took a bit of digging to find something recent, but otherwise I would be relying on another DUers # and not remembering the source, USA Today. Hard to argue with them, huh?
I wrote a Times Picayune reporter (the one who did the fireman story upthread that shows the city of NO is now doing better searches now that Fema's stopped)...and asked her some questions about the searches and how they are counting and categorizing the dead.
I'll let you know if I hear anything interesting.

LIVING people might have been found and rescued and then started working with a "scandal ridden" crony company with a history of body dumping.

You know what folks? Why don't we all just start using the rule of common sense? Does the policy above sound like they WANTED to rescue people? Is this the way you would have structured things if you had been in charge of a search and rescue mission in your very own neighborhood? Of course not. Not only were they not interested in "rescue" they also were not interested in "recovery".

The living people would have provided embarrassing testimony of their abandonment if they had survived. The bodies provide silent testimony, but not if they can't be accounted for or if their causes of death cannot be determined. (I personally bet more died of starvation and dehydration than died from drowning but I guess we will never know.)

sue for permission to come along on body searches - and then the press were forbidden by the feds to take pictures or write stories from these searches. I have links for that, too, if you want them.

Oh now, this was done in a consistent way from the first - the priorities were always clear, and they did NOT include saving lives or identifying victims quickly. Or, I believe, getting an accurate count of the victims, let alone determining whether they died of drowning or from FEMA's deliberate neglect.

I believe far more died from FEMA's abandonment than from the hurricane. And then there are the issues of why the levees had not been maintained (cut federal funds) and why there were no filled sandbags ready to move in. (????never asked, apparently - I'm guessing the answer would be embarrassing.)

Well, we can't. We're not done with this yet.

Whatever our differences, LOOK AT WHAT BUSHCO IS DOING. Just LOOK.

Kicking for our Katrina families.

:kick:

:cry:

:kick:

:kick:

Antonio "Toni" Jackson,
Fema vicitm


you have to click on the link in the fourth paragraph:

http://www.cnn.com/2005/US/12/06/katrina.dna/

Maybe the stories of the levee being bombed or blown up are true. The ninth ward was not the only place that explosions were heard according to reports in the Times Picayune; they were reported at the other levee break on the ritzy side of town, in Lakeview, at the 17th Street Canal. It's clear as glass why the White House hounded Blanco. Rove wanted marshall law declared. Why? Once the state (Blanco)relinquished control to the federal government, marshall law would be declared. Once marshall law was imposed, all citizens rights are suspended; elections are suspended.
This was a thinly gloved grab for the ultimate in power; to suspend all rights and freedoms guaranteed by the Constitution, up to and including suspension of elections. It would insure the republicans would retain their hold on power. I now believe it was all a set up and only my anger supercedes my fear.

Quote from President Andrew Johnson about marshall law:

"The Bill places all the people therein named under the absolute domination of military rules, and the Preamble undertakes to give the reason upon which the measure is based, and the ground upon which it is justified. It declares that there exists in those states no legal governments and no adequate protection for life, property, and assets; and asserts the necessity of enforcing peace and good order within their limits.
"This is not true, as a matter of fact. The excuse given for the Bill in the Preamble is admitted by the Bill itself not to be real. The military rule, which it establishes, is plainly to be used not for any purpose of order, or the prevention of crime, but solely as a means of coercing the people into the adoption of principles and measures to which it is known that they are opposed, and upon which they have an undeniable right to exercise their own judgment.

"I submit to Congress whether this measure is not in its whole character, scope, and object, without precedent and without authority, in palpable conflict with the plainest provisions of the Constitution, and utterly destructive to those great principles of liberty and humanity for which our ancestors on both sides of the Atlantic have shed so much blood and expended so much treasure.

"The authority here amounts to absolute despotism. Such a power has not been wielded by any monarch in England for more than 500 years. It reduces the whole population, all persons of every color, sex, and condition, and every stranger, to the most abject and degrading slavery. No master ever had a control so absolute over the slaves as this Bill gives.

"This Proposition is perfectly clear that no branch of the federal government, executive, legislative, or judicial, can have any just powers except those which it derives through and exercises under the organic laws of the union. Outside of the Constitution, we have no legal authority more than private citizens, and within it, we have only so much as that instrument gives us."

People need to know!

:kick: