House Votes to Toughen Laws on Immigration

I read the article and I couldn't find anything. However, I found other sources that referred to the same bill with regards to making it a felony.

At any rate, this is despicable.

It is a bill to enforce laws.

If you don't want a border, then petition Congress to do away with it.

"Opponents from both parties said the House had approved a punitive measure that could criminalize not only undocumented workers but also their families and employers, while doing nothing to bring some 11 million illegal aliens out of the shadows and into lawful society."

We are now treating people like stray dogs. That doesn't bother you? Please....

The Senate will provide a guest worker program, & they will combine the 2 versions.

The Senate is owned by Corporate interests. They won't let their supporters down.

The Senate may provide a guest worker program. However, even IF they do, the House has said it will oppose it.

"The future of the immigration bill is unclear. In the Senate, bipartisan support is growing for legislation co-authored by Sens. John McCain (R-Ariz.) and Edward M. Kennedy (D-Mass.) that would combine border enforcement measures with a guest-worker program. But a large number of House conservatives say they will never accept such a measure."
(from the same WaPo article)

The House is full of anti-immigrant reactionaries. They won't let their twisted aims go to the wayside.

This bill was opposed by all the business interests, because it will be tough on companies.

Why did so few Dems support this bill?

Someone said sarcastically to me, "Yeah, they're the party of the people! Right!"

If there are unlimited workers, people at the botton wage scale will continue to be hurt. Why hire an American when you can pay much less to illegals, plus no taxes, no bennies, etc.

However, the businesses pay a fine; the immigrants get deported. Businesses could easily make up a $25,000 quite quickly by using undocumented workers. Fair? Hardly.

The fact is that no one goes after businesses, it is the workers that suffer. This will hardly change with these new measures. What we need is to target the employers, not the employees.

"The measure would end the "catch and release" policy for immigrants other than Mexicans who are caught entering the country illegally and then released with a court date."

So they are still going to do the catch and release with Mexicans? How can they tell the difference? I mean, isn't it pretty easy to get Mexican documents saying you are a Mexican citizen? Lou Dobbs had a show on how you can get Mexican documents. Soooo, I'm confused about this.

House Republicans overcame deep divisions Friday to approve a sweeping border security bill that would crack down on undocumented immigrants by erecting fences and setting stiff fines for employers.

"Securing our nation's borders is an imperative, and this bill does it," said Rep. James Sensenbrenner, R-Wis., chairman of the House Judiciary Committee.

Democrats were angered at several measures in the bill, including one that would make felons of 11 million people in this country without papers and subject them to criminal, not civil, laws.

"This is driven more by partisan politics than sound policy," said Rep. Silvestre Reyes, D-El Paso, a former Border Patrol section chief.



http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/politics/stories/MYSA121705.01A.immigration_bill.223a9124.html

"Republicans have proposed a bill that is an abomination of the worst kind. It calls upon the worst political and most craven impulses," said House Democratic Leader Nancy Pelosi, D-Calif.

"Securing our nation's borders is an imperative, and this bill does it," said Rep. James Sensenbrenner, R-Wis., chairman of the House Judiciary Committee.

what makes them think a f*cking fence is going to keep anyone out? These people swim across the Rio Grande just to get here!! Why would they let a little fence stop them?

Think of the meat packing industry. Think of agriculture. Think of restaurants and hospitality. Think of all those Republicans who rely on undocumented aliens to tend their yards, clean their houses, and so forth.

Not saying all of that is right and proper, mind you, but all those industries have a wake up call coming.

They've probably already planned and begun the tunnels. The only thing of value in this legislation is fines for employers. Unfortunately, I suspect that will quickly and quietly become another unenforced law.

...Democrats were angered at several measures in the bill, including one that would make felons of 11 million people in this country without papers and subject them to criminal, not civil, laws.

:(

This has been tried before with Operation Gatekeeper.

That one actually ended up increasing undocumented immigration- by making it so that people felt like they had to stay- rather than simply go back home when their seasonal work was over.

Not only did they stay- they brought their extended families!

The INS knows this well- but as I mentioned, never underestimate the ability of Republicans to waste billions to try to implement simple minded solutions to complicated problem- even after their solutions are proven to be a failures- or even create more serious problems than existed before.

what is wrong with building a fence to curtail the mass entry of illegals into the country?

One right off the top of my head: we're a nation of immigrants. Your forbears came here from somewhere else, and so did mine.

Another right off the top of my head: it's a very expensive placebo. Won't achieve anything but spending money.

A third: like it or not, several major industries have grown dependent on this source of labor. We aren't going to like the backwash frrm this.

That's three things right off the top. There's many more.

has to say it. The discussion would not be complete without that one poster who points out that quite a few Mexicans are simply descendants of "indians" who were driven out of this country ages ago by imperialist white folks back in the day. Deservedly, they should be allowed to come back.

Btw, this country was fucking founded on the principle of immigration.

This might be racist to say, but there was a Rage Against the Machine t-shirt that said, "Who are you calling an immigrant, Pilgrim?" I'm finding myself more and more inclined to say that lately, especially since I found out I am "enough" Native American Indian that my mother was able to change my race.

Beside those points, I'd like to leave everybody who reads this post with the lyrics to a song that may enlighten you as to why I think this fence building idea is an expensive nationalist socialist endeavor that wreaks of gentrification.

"Signs"

And the sign said "Long-haired freaky people need not apply"
So I tucked my hair up under my hat and I went in to ask him why
He said "You look like a fine upstanding young man, I think you'll do"
So I took off my hat, I said "Imagine that. Huh! Me workin' for you!"
Whoa-oh-oh

Signs, signs, everywhere a sign
Blockin' out the scenery, breakin' my mind
Do this, don't do that, can't you read the sign?

And the sign said anybody caught trespassin' would be shot on sight
So I jumped on the fence and-a yelled at the house,
"Hey! What gives you the right?"
"To put up a fence to keep me out or to keep Mother Nature in"
"If God was here he'd tell you to your face, Man, you're some kinda sinner"

Sign, sign, everywhere a sign
Blockin' out the scenery, breakin' my mind
Do this, don't do that, can't you read the sign?

Now, hey you, mister, can't you read?
You've got to have a shirt and tie to get a seat
You can't even watch, no you can't eat
You ain't supposed to be here
The sign said you got to have a membership card to get inside
Ugh!

And the sign said, "Everybody welcome. Come in, kneel down and pray"
But when they passed around the plate at the end of it all,
I didn't have a penny to pay
So I got me a pen and a paper and I made up my own little sign
I said, "Thank you, Lord, for thinkin' 'bout me.
I'm alive and doin' fine."
Wooo!

Sign, sign, everywhere a sign
Blockin' out the scenery, breakin' my mind
Do this, don't do that, can't you read the sign?

Sign, sign, everywhere a sign
Sign
Sign, sign

There weren't all that many. The Spanish didn't really try hard--there were some that sought refuge in Mexico from New Mexico over near the Texas/NMex border (using current geographical terms), but not really in California, Arizona, or Texas.

The O'odham straddle the border, but I'm not sure they weren't there long before the colonial powers came in and set up Mexico or drew the current borders.

The Spanish policy was mostly one of convert-in-situ and make into good colonial/Catholic citizens. It failed rather spectacularly, at least in Texas, and lead to the presidio system, mostly because tribes were rather astute. Why convert, and why give trade/land concessions that didn't make sense. They also did some things that, in hindsight, were rather stupid, of course.

The Texan and US policy in Texas was mostly drive them north. The SW of Texas wasn't heavily populated. I'm unaware of any drive south in California or Arizona.

So I'm confused.. are we gonna be the next China or the next Germany with our shitty wall? :shrug:

bout the only logical explanation...

What a retarded and xenophobic idea.

or us in?:shrug:

What a crock.

"We're a nation of immigrants," my wife just remarked.

I guess we used to be.

"Perhaps the time will come for a limited foreign worker program," said Rep. Lamar Smith, R-San Antonio, "but that is only after we have secured our borders and put the interests of American workers first."

Oh yeah, the Pugs are SOOOOOOOOOO GODDAMNED CONCERNED about the interests of American workers, aren't they?!

:sarcasm:

Why is there money for a new Berlin Wall, but no money for housing displaced Americans?