Murtha rips administration 'dishonesty'

What is it with the Dems that they cannot say the word LIE....BUSH LIED....Come on dems, say it with me....BUSH LIES.

Every day for 8 years the repubs and the media called Clinton a liar.....why can't we call Bush a liar?

It is a tough call, because the repukes have broken all rules of courtesy-but the fact that Murtha uses it raises him a bit with me-he's not sinking to their level. Sadly, some will say that being polite is appearing to be weak. If we buy into this, our society is lessened, imho

people are dying because of his lies....there is no time for Senatorial courtesy.....

There's a lot less "courtesy" there. I appreciate Murtha's keeping the pressure on. And I agree that use of the word "lie" might be counterproductive right now.

Interesting that "impeachment" is not being similarly avoided. That's probably because the rethugs impeached Clinton over nothing.

I grew up being raised by people who were always telling me I needed to show the respect other people didn't show. I was told I had to tolerate being teased and tormented, because if I ignored it it would eventually stop and by responding I was lowering myself to their level.

What happened? Well, for the first twenty years of my life everyone who wanted to was able to just walk all over me, because I didn't bother striking back at them or stopping them in the first place.

To the people who have the MODERN bully mentality, doing nothing, not striking back and just continuing to let it happen DOES embolden them. It DOES make you weak in their eyes. It INVITES further adverse treatment.

The only thing these people understand is to be given exactly what they give out. That's what they 'get', what they understand. They see kindness as foolishness and refusal to "stoop that low" as weakness.

It's a serious problem which can only be countered by being as crude and stern- to them- as they are to everyone else.

Dems should watch that old Bing Crosby-Ingrid Bergman movie, Bells of St. Mary's.

Bergman plays Sister Mary Benedict, and she believes.. at first.. in turning the other cheek,
while Father O'Maley (Crosby) believes in fighting back. One of the boys is a bully who
punches another boy out every time because Sister has told the other boy not to fight.
However, she finally sees the value of fighting back and gets a boxing book to teach the
little boy how to fight, he finally wins, and he and the bully make friends.

I liked that movie.

Sue

Absolutely the truth - bullies only understand bully-speak. Everything else in their eyes is weakness and snivelling.

Couldn't agree more. I, too, played nice and kept my mouth shut for the first 30 years of my life. Then I realized that I needed to grow a backbone and stand up for myself. That's the only way to win against people who torment you - FIGHT BACK!

However, now is not the time. Courtesy directed at a schoolyard bully only encourages them all the more to bloody your nose and take your lunch money. We need to smack them down hard and for now, courtesy be damned!

It needed saying. WTF? Dems and the press are like a bunch of snake-bit supplicants around monkey boy. How bad does he have to screw the pooch to start the feeding frenzy?

:dem:
powwowdancer out

If he'd said "lied" nobody would have listened.

By saying the same thing without the hot-button word "lied" he will be heard and listened to.

It's called keeping your eyes on the prize.

he's trying to talk to the center. i'd rather hear him say "bush did lie, and is still lying about iraq", but right now it might be smart for him to avoid it. even moderates who have turned on bush tend to tune out "bush lied" statements.
and being who Murtha is he's going to be careful about what he calls the CIC when troops are on the ground. he ain't Paul Wellstone:)
Murtha made the play that counted. now everyone is talking withdrawl, even rummy.

When it suits his purposes, he's a hands-on, involved kinda guy; when it suits his purposes, he was out of the loop, relying on others for information that, sadly, was flawed.

Never underestimate their ability to focus on someone and crucify them. They've done it to top generals, Wilson, Kerry, and even Cindy. If you give them the tiniest opening, they will instantly change the entire discussion to mudslinging, and if necessary, threats. Look what they did to their own finance guy; threatened to prosecute him for stealing classified documents, which later turned out to belong to him. But they knew that; they will happily get their attorney general or their pet judges to rewrite the laws and absolutely crush anyone they can.

he didn't 'lie' about the 911=iraq stuff, he was ever so careful to do everything BUT lie outright. this stuff was subtle, and thats why it succeeded and that poll showed something like 70% thought iraq was involved with 911. murtha describes it well, bush would say 911 and then talk about iraq repeatedly. over and over and over. but he never came out and claimed iraq did 911.

if you do it effectively, you don't have to blatantly lie, the results are the same. If you have a dominating propaganda machine working for you (see corpwhorate owned MSM), it's easy. Bush once said he could not spell subliminal, but he sure as hell knows how to use it.

We need to call them LIARS and them let them try to tell us how they are NOT liars.

but, I just can't figure out HOW to snap. The last several days have frustrated the hell out of me.

I watched live the stripping out of ANWR live last night on C-SPAN and thought to myself, "Well, at least we have that...for now".

Feeling quite a bit pessimistic these days.

Olafr

It was not faulty intel. It was overt and intentional lying and propaganda conceived and presented in a cold and calculated way.

GENERAL WESLEY CLARK: Well, it cuts both ways, you know. About 90, 95% of the insurgency, they're not jihadists. They're not foreigners. They're not terrorists. They're people who are resisting the US presence and resisting the hand-over of Iraq, as they see it, to Iran. So, what we have to do is split apart those resistance fighters from the jihadists and then get them to turn on the jihadists, and that's the end of the terrorists threat. As the President said last night, the terrorists weren't there in the beginning. Our presence gave them an opening.

http://securingamerica.com/node/397

The Courier is owned by the Tribune Review, one of Richard Mellon Scaife's newspapers. It's probably killing Scaife to have to mention the "dishonesty of the administration".

I would have loved to have heard the whole news conference. Murtha says an awful lot in his plain-spoken way. The public connects with him.

He has now awakened to what precisely is going on with the bush administration and he is pissed! This is not a man to trifle with. He has been commanding respect for many, many years within the military community.

Why he hasn't spoken out before, however, baffles me. george w. bush is so transparent you can spit right through him.