ABC names Bill Clinton and George H.W. Bush its

persons of the year.

It was just on at the end of the World News tonight broadcast.

For what?

tsunami and Katrina. Say what you want about Poppy and the fact that Bill is hanging out with him, but they've been doing an enormous amount of good. Give them some credit for being able to put aside their old differences in the name of helping people. So what if they've become friends. Should they keep disliking each other and not help the people of the world in their time of need? If I were Poppy, I'd be happier hanging out with Bill than with *, too. I think he's realized his own son is an idiot and an awful president, but he can't come right out and say so.

for a very good cause

It's great to have you with us!:toast:

And, as hard as it is for me to give Poppy credit for anything, you make a very good point. But, as far as I'm concerned, Bill Clinton is capable of accomplishing pretty much anything that he sets out to do...:patriot:

:puke:

:puke::puke:

:puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: the whole thing makes me violently ill!:puke: :puke: :puke:

I always find it tough to watch this without feeling pretty sick, myself...:eyes:

those silly Japanese went and seated his WIFE within view while he was trying to EAT, so of course he blew chunks.. at home she has to eat under the table, out of a bowl with her name on it in studded diamonds.. right next to Pickle's Bowl.. zirconium..

From what I saw it looked like Bush Senior had been eating babies again - he always told the cook to DICE them, smaller baby chunks are easier to digest..

like that.

Are they just playing at Old America? Is it sort of a Bush noblesse oblige, now that the Bush's have once and for all, pretty much irrevocably (unless we get trustworthy media and voting systems) seized America, are they simply being gracious in victory, as "someone with breeding" would perceive themselves to act?

I guess, until the natural course of Empire degenerates us further, we will still have this pale shadow of Old America.

Old America...with torture and secret gulags and unlimited warrantless searches and Lying Pravda Media and the fake War on Christams and so much more (or less, as the case may be).

But it is just a shadow. I should be enjoying it...it may be the last time America even sees a pale shadow of it's former self, but I cannot get over that it's not real anymore.

Perhaps if he is worthy enough, Poppy will raise him to the purple too.

and I know I'm less than thrilled that he aspires to be in the BFEE.

He's the smartest son GHWB never had.

Assuming you could get one of the sheep to wrap his mind around the idea in the first place. You know: "Gosh, a US politician that wants untrammeled power? What a strange idea."

And it wasn't purple...more of a mauve.

William Jefferson Clinton was the Last President of the Old United States. Whatever his faults and flaws (and there were more than a few)...he was a True American...with a True American Story.

Born in poverty...drunk Dad. Raised himself up to the highest office in the land. He was a rabble, and I think it snapped the brains of the Imperials and their lackeys.

Thus, the voting system and the Constitution have been... disconnected. For our own good of course.

Whatever his actions in the future, he will always be Last President of the Old United States.

:thumbsup:

Nevertheless, it seems clear he is comfortable with the new arrangement.

maybe soften up the right wingers toward Hillary

And I'll say it again.

I really don't have a problem with their "tag team" style effort to bring relief to those affected by the tsunami.

In fact, it makes me have even more respect for President Clinton. He was called everything but a child of God by the Rethugs. Yet, there is no evidence that he has become a bitter man.

The Rethugs were NOT able to break his spirit or steal his joy.

Besides, the tsunami effort really isn't about George H.W. Bush or Bill Clinton.

It's about those who were effected by a natural disaster of biblical porportions.

perhaps even forgive the injustices done to ourselves in order to help others who have been/are in a desperate situation.

I'd be delighted to see the same kind of efforts made for those in the Gulf region for those who were so devatated by Katrina.

It could be that Poppy is learning some real humanity in his partnership with Clinton.

And I'm sure that when supping with the devil, Clinton has remembered to use a very long spoon.

Would have it within us to forgive those who have carried out injustice against us?

I know that Nelson Mandela has served as a great example for the Clintons.

I think it was Hillary Clinton who said she was absolutely astounded when she went to the inauguration ceremony of Nelson Mandela, and he (Mandela) mentioned to her that he had invited some of his former jailers to his inauguration ceremony.

And I think the Clintons have tried to live by that same example Mandela set.

See my post below in response to Andromeda's post.

blah, blah, blah - what a bunch of horseshit coming from the head of the 1st family of smear tactics.

"Poppy" bush is responsible for a thousandfold many more deaths than any lives he ever helped to salvage after the tsunami.

do without the puke emoticon? You'd have to think up something more original I suppose.

If some good can come from this relationship and people can be helped as a result of Poppy Bush and Bill Clinton's efforts then I believe it's a good thing.

Why would you deprive innocent people of assistance and a helping hand from this disaster that injured and killed so many people? Families were torn apart and homes destroyed and the only way they can get help is through high-profile individuals willing to put in the effort.

Not everything is about politics. In a perfect world we wouldn't judge everyone by their political beliefs but since it's become so adversarial, members of the same party are fighting with each other when we should be standing up to the other side.

You said it much more eloquently than I did, but the sentiment is the same. I knew I'd probably start a flame war when I started this thread. I'm surprised it didn't get worse. Sometimes we need to put aside politics and just do what's right -- and that's what the Big Dawg and 41 did. I commend them both and don't think anything is wrong with the fact that it resulted in a friendship and mutual respect. It's what we needd more of in this world and they're setting a good example for others.

If Bill Clinton can rise above petty politics for the greater good, I think we should give him the benefit of the doubt instead of assuming that he is somehow selling out his Democratic principles because he's trying to help people restore their lives.

It would be a shame if he turned his back on the poor because his carping critics don't think he should be on friendly terms with a former Republican president.

I think people who complain about Bill Clinton probably never liked him in the first place and it's doubtful that he could ever do anything to "redeem" himself in their eyes.

The Clintons are sellouts!!! Both of them!!!:puke:

This must be one of the Signs of the Apocalypse.

He's a REAL President and I admired him for a long time, but isn't it possible that he could be working for Carlyle now? I mean they have people from ALL parties and nations doing their deeds..

We might not know, but there seems to be a LOT we don't know.. could explain Hillary voting FOR the war which instantly lost my vote forever.