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Postmanx Donating Member (524 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-15-06 01:05 PM
Original message
Secret Saddam WMD Tapes Subject of ABC Nightline Special
CNS – for the squeamish


(CNSNews.com) - Secret audiotapes of Saddam Hussein discussing ways to attack America with weapons of mass destruction will be the subject of an ABC "Nightline" program Wednesday night, a former federal prosecutor told Cybercast News Service.

The tapes are being called the "smoking gun" of weapons of mass destruction (WMD) in Iraq. The New York Sun reported that the tapes have been authenticated and currently are being reviewed by the U.S. House Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence.

On Tuesday night, Loftus told Cybercast News Service that ABC's "Nightline" would air an "extensive report" on the tapes Wednesday night. Loftus also described an ABC News "teaser," which reportedly contains audio of Saddam Hussein discussing ways to attack America with WMD. "Nightline will have a lot more," said Loftus.

The tapes are scheduled to be revealed to the public Saturday morning at the opening session of The Intelligence Summit, a conference which brings together intelligence professionals from around the world.

----

Regardless of one’s feelings toward CNS, it appears that these tape are going to be aired on Nightline tonight.
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Laura PourMeADrink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-15-06 01:06 PM
Response to Original message
1. dupe
Edited on Wed Feb-15-06 01:07 PM by Laura PackYourBags
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seriousstan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-15-06 02:53 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. It is not a dupe, this is the first post in LBN. Others don't count.
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Wordie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-15-06 03:28 PM
Response to Original message
3. Something about this is suspicious.
Edited on Wed Feb-15-06 03:28 PM by Wordie
The article says that the tapes were provided to the House committee by former federal prosecutor John Loftus. The article describes Loftus like this:
Loftus is president of The Intelligence Summit. Its advisory council includes generals, a former F.B.I. official, a former senior Israeli Mossad officer and the former chair of the British Joint Intelligence Committee, according to information posted on the summit website. Currently a private attorney, Loftus says he works pro bono to help intelligence agents obtain lawful permission to declassify and publish the "hidden secrets of our times."

And the OP quote also made reference to how this was a "smoking gun." Well, the obvious question then is, if this info only just now came to light, where the hell was it all this time?

Loftus has been tight-lipped about the tapes, telling the Sun only that he received them from a "former American military intelligence analyst." However, on Wednesday he told Cybercast News Service, "Saddam's tapes confirm he had active CW and BW programs that were hidden from the UN.":

...On Tuesday night, Loftus praised a Cybercast News Service article published on Oct. 4, 2004, entitled Saddam Possessed WMD, Had Extensive Terror Ties.

The exclusive report featured documents showing numerous efforts by Saddam Hussein's regime to work with some of the world's most notorious terror organizations, including al Qaeda, to target Americans.

The documents also demonstrate that Saddam's government possessed mustard gas and anthrax, both considered weapons of mass destruction, in the summer of 2000, during the period in which United Nations weapons inspectors were not present in Iraq. The papers showed that Iraq trained dozens of terrorists inside its borders.


If the tapes are the smoking gun (which implies that the evidence was not there previously), then what was Loftus doing way back in 2004, praising an article purporting to show the very ties that he only now claims to have found evidence for? This sounds to me like a guy with a preconcieved political bias.

This all just seems a little too convenient to me...
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Wordie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-15-06 03:38 PM
Response to Original message
4. Has this been moved up for airing tonight to distract from Cheney shooting
Edited on Wed Feb-15-06 03:40 PM by Wordie
perhaps?

Additional details, found on a right wing blog:
First of all, a word of caution is in order.

The Duelfer report made clear that interviews with dozens of Saddam loyalists revealed that his top aides routinely lied to the dictator about having WMD. (emphasis mine) However, this could be a cover story by the aides who could have worked one up prior to the invasion. Or, it could be the truth. It could very well be that Saddam was talking about WMD he didn’t have.

...Another aspect of this story that should give us pause is that the tapes come to us via a man named John Loftus. Loftus is known as something of a gadfly in intelligence circles and his book about the Nazi connection to the Vatican and American intelligence has been criticized for sloppy research. That said, Loftus really has nothing to gain from trying to perpetrate a fraud and the House Intelligence Committee felt them important enough to verify and examine.

http://rightwingnuthouse.com/archives/2006/02/15/saddam-tapes-require-a-cautious-approach/


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stepnw1f Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-15-06 05:12 PM
Response to Original message
5. Bullshit RNC Driven Propaganda
....
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Wordie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-15-06 06:41 PM
Response to Reply #5
12. Worse...it may be PNAC
I was looking through the Intelligence Summit site (they're the ones who are putting on the conference, and announcing this newly found wmd evidence), and guess what I found???

This is on their "Speakers & Organizers" page.


SPEAKERS
Bruce Aitken
Alex Alexiev
Luis Gil Armendariz
Maj. Eitan Arusy
Jed L. Babbin
Dr. Shmuel Bar
Zeyno Baran
Marshall Beddoe
Grant Begley
Ilan Berman
Jean-Charles Brisard
Dr. Parris Chang
Saber H. Chowdhury
Peter Clegg
Kevin G. Coleman
Victor Comras
Dr. Michael H. Corcoran
Col. Bill Cowan
Col. Gordon Cucullu
Michael W. Cutler
Nonie Darwish
Olavo de Carvalho
Bill DeGenaro
Dr. Jill Dekker
Andre DeMarce
Simon Deng
Robert M. Eisenberg
Dr. David H. Ellis
Beatrice Fernando
Brigitte Gabriel
Lance Gaines
Daveed Gartenstein-Ross
Dave Gaubatz
Mike German
Rebecca Givner-Forbes
Andy Green
Alain Grignard
Kim Guevara
Olivier Guitta
Wesley O. Hagood
Col. Jonathan Halevi
R. Mark Halligan, Esq.
Dr. Tawfik Hamid
David Hamon
Tom Harb
David Hardingham
Selina Hayes
Cptn. Richard Horowitz
Maneeza Hossain
G. Ken Hunter
Art Hutchinson
Alireza Jafarzadeh
Sunil James
Avi Jorisch
Shaykh Kabbani
Joe Kaufman
Hari H.S. Khalsa
Evan F. Kohlmann
Ali M. Koknar
Gen. Yossi Kuperwasser
Kenneth Kurtz
Dr. Michael A. Ledeen
Col. Juan C.F. Linares
Clare Lopez
Steven Lutz
Cdr. Richard Marcinko
Ryan Mauro
Linda McCarthy
Dr. James E. Miller, Jr.
Richard Miniter
Dan Moniz
Laurent Murawiec
Malcolm W. Nance
GySgt. Bob Newman
Kevin O'Connell
Sheikh Palazzi
Dr. Richard Parton
Joseph P. Payne
Richard Perle
Dr. Walid Phares
Walter Purdy
Entifadh Qanbar
Jamie Reid
Dr. Richard Reiner
Dr. Angel Ribasa
Billy Robinson
Rev. Keith Roderick
Ted Russell
Jesse Sage
Saleem Samad
Frank J. Sauer
Ken Sawka
Michael Scheuer
Stephen Schwartz
Brian Seymour
Dr. Hanan Shai
Eric Shawn
Walid Shoebat
Michael Shrimpton
Wayne Simmons
Erick Stakelbeck
Clark Staten
Joseph J. Stephanides
Alon Stivi
Hollice Stone
Mark A. Tanner
Dr. Peter E. Tarlow
Joseph Tenaglia
Tamar Tesler
Kenneth R. Timmerman
Dennis Treece
Maria Velez de Berliner
Lorenzo Vidino
Dr. Marta Weber
Christopher Westphal
Ira Winkler
Alexandre Winter, Ph.D.
Mark Zaid, Esq.
Jeremy Zakis

ORGANIZERS
Dr. Robert Katz
John J. Loftus
Steven Lutz
Lee Mason
Adam Shaneson
Scott Swanson

...We are especially grateful to our International Advisory Council
whose leadership will ensure that we maintain the highest standards.


Yossef Bodansky, former Director, Congressional Task Force on Terrorism Brent Budowsky, former Senior Staff Democratic Leadership
Dr. Rachel Ehrenfeld, Director, American Center for Democracy
Yoram Hessel, former Senior Mossad Officer, Israel
John Loftus, President, The Intelligence Summit
Lt. General Tom McInerney, US Air Force, (Ret.)
Dame Pauline Neville-Jones, former Chair, Joint Intelligence Committee, UK Steve Pomerantz, former Deputy Director and Director of Counterterrorism, FBI
Col. Oded Shoham, IDF (Res.), Israel
Major General Paul Vallely, US Army, (Ret.)
B. Raman, former Chief of the Counter-Terrorism Division of the Research & Analysis Wing (India)
http://www.intelligencesummit.org/speakers/
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bemildred Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-15-06 05:20 PM
Response to Original message
6. Why should I care if they rehash all this stuff again? nt
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AlCzervik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-15-06 05:20 PM
Response to Original message
7. i jus read some snips from abc and these tapes prove nothing
aside from the fact Hussain thought he was a badass.
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Dr Fate Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-15-06 05:21 PM
Response to Original message
8. Maybe Bill Frist should get first crack at "the tapes."
Show me the physical weapons- supposedly there were "tons" of them to pick from.
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VegasWolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-15-06 05:22 PM
Response to Original message
9. ABC News is worthless. nt
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Roland99 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-15-06 05:23 PM
Response to Original message
10. Threads DEBUNKING these tapes in General Discussion >>>>>>>>>>>>
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Mugsy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-15-06 05:24 PM
Response to Original message
11. Here's a possibility: Saddam knew he was being bugged.
Depending on what was said, where and how, (and assuming the tapes are real) there is always the possibility that Saddam went into a room he knew was bugged and made the "announcement" in order to deter an attack.

Note, that IF the tapes are real, and IF he was telling the truth, then where did the weapons go?

Saddam maintained the myth for years that he had weapons because the "myth" was the only thing keeping his enemies at bay. It's far easier to "hide" weapons from inspectors if there are no weapons to be found. Likewise, the exact same bluff would apply to saying you'd use weapons you know you don't have if you knew someone was listening in on the conversation.
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Up2Late Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-15-06 07:25 PM
Response to Original message
13. This is 100% Bogus, Grade A, BS! This is NOT LBN!
CNS, formerly "Conservative News Service," is just a better organized "Talon News" (Jeff Gannon)! And to top it off, it's almost 16 MONTHS old "news"! It's part of the RW "Media Research Center"

Here's the Source Watch article and related links:

<http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Cybercast_News_Service>

<http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Media_Research_Center>

(More links at bottom of this post)

Cybercast News Service - SourceWatch
Cybercast News Service (CNS) is a subsidiary of the conservative news monitoring group, the Media Research Center (MRC). Originally calling itself the "Conservative News Service," CNS changed its name to Cybercast in 2000.

History

CNS was launched on July 16, 1998, by founder Brent Bozell, as an "alternative news service" to mainstream news sources which reports by MRC claim have a "liberal bias."

CNS says it strives to "cover stories that are subject to the bias of omission and report on other news subject to bias by commission," and "endeavors to fairly present all legitimate sides of a story."



CNS claims proof Hussein had WMD and ties to Al Qaeda

On October 4, 2004, CNS reported that a "senior government official who is not a political appointee" provided CNS with 42 pages of Iraqi Intelligence Service (IIS) documents which were then translated from Arabic by two CNS translators. CNS reports that the official told them that the documents answer "whether or not Iraq was a state sponsor of Islamic terrorism against the United States. It also answers whether or not Iraq had an ongoing biological warfare project continuing through the period when the UNSCOM inspections ended."

CNS further claimed three experts reviewed the documents and said they were likely geniune: Laurie Mylroie, author of the book Study of Revenge: Saddam Hussein's Unfinished War against America; Bruce Tefft, a retired CIA official; and an unnamed former UNSCOM weapons inspector. The named "experts" are both individuals with a history of making ideologically charged and controversial statements in support of the war in Iraq neoconservative agenda. The anonymous individual who supplied the documents is quoted as saying it is "unlikely" that others in the U.S. government "even know this exists." The article does not explain how this is possible if this source is indeed a "senior government official." The timing of the news story, which appeared near the end of the U.S. presidential campaign, suggests that it was written with the intention of shoring up support for Bush, whom the article notes has been hurt politically by the failure of investigators to find weapons of mass destruction in Iraq.

CNS says the documents show that Iraq bought "five kilograms of mustard gas on Aug. 21, 2000 and three vials of < anthrax > on Sept. 6, 2000." from what appears on the documents as "Saddam's company," which "Tefft said was probably a reference to Saddam General Establishment, "a complex of factories involved with, amongst other things, precision optics, missile, and artillery fabrication." which were received by IIS. It is worth noting that five kilograms of mustard agent would only fill up to three artillery shells. <1> (http://www.gulflink.osd.mil/muhammadiyat_ii/muhammadiyat_ii_s03.htm)<2> (http://www.fas.org/irp/gulf/cia/970825/970613_dim37_91d_txt_0001.html)

A memo in the alleged documents from 1993 includes "Saddam's directive" that "the party should move to hunt the Americans who are on Arabian land, especially in Somalia, by using Arabian elements ..." CNS then connects this to the Mogadishu attack in Somalia nine months later, as the rebels involved were Arab. CNS also mentions in passing the "warlord" of southern Mogadishu's (Mohammed Farah Aidid) alleged connections to Osama Bin Laden and Bin Laden's "network."

CNS additionally provides much more commentary from Tefft regarding the nature of the documents.


<http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Cybercast_News_Service>

<http://nashuaadvocate.blogspot.com/2005/03/new-gopusa-news-service-cybercast-news.html>
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Ecumenist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-15-06 09:38 PM
Response to Reply #13
15. Somehow, this doesn't surprise me at all...
They keep using different permutations of the same old, warmed over, one trick pony crap, hoping against hope that noone notices the obvious age and dubious pedigree of the material.:banghead:
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Ecumenist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Feb-15-06 09:35 PM
Response to Original message
14. This is bull sh-t.
All this represents is an attempt to try to get people to believe that the lies and reasons they gave for going into Iraq were genuine. If these tapes were real, why are we just now hearing about them?
Why weren't they released PRIOR to the invasion when it was a a priority to convince the critics of the chief liars? And most importantly, why haven't they been presented before now? This has everything to do with the loss of their base, the abysmal poll numbers and their bloodthirsty desire to invade and /or bomb Iran. Somehow, I wouldn't be a bit surprised to hear that Saddam just "happened" to mention a conspiratorial plan with Iran and dare I say it, SYRIA, to conceal those weapons for a future attack on the US... The hard core idiots who already believe them will fall for it but the rest of the thinking public won't be fooled.
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rfkrfk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-16-06 06:35 AM
Response to Reply #14
20. we have no idea, where these tapes came from
lots of countries have an intelligence agency

the motive for someone chosing now to release, is unknowable

I am not necessarily saying the tapes are legit,BTW
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Ecumenist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-16-06 01:57 PM
Response to Reply #20
21. Ain't it the truth...
Edited on Thu Feb-16-06 02:00 PM by Ecumenist
These people don't even know how to tell a convincing lie. My 6 year old nephew tells more believable "fibs". the fact that cheney claimed that the reason that Ms Armstrong was chosen to go forth with the latest lies about the "shooting accident" because, as he implied, he wouldn't be believed if his ass was notarised tells everything about these people.
It's as if they come up with things without first thinking about how it appears to Joe Schmoe and Susie Q. They need to keep a file of the lies they tell. If you say that something is blue and reinterate that point over and over again then turn around and suddenly change that colour to yellow and your cohorts say the same thing, why are you surprised when people no longer believe a damn thing you say? Only the idiotically mislead and delusional in deep denial buy this trash.:banghead:
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HuffleClaw Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-16-06 01:58 AM
Response to Original message
16. suuuuuuuure
'authenticated' hmmmm. by the same folks who created them i suppose.
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Judi Lynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-16-06 02:16 AM
Response to Original message
17. John Loftus goes from one impressive pinnacle to the next! Whatta wingnut.
You may remember his name blazing its way across our newspapers last year with this triumph!
August 27, 2005
Fox Contributor Fired After Endangering Innocent Family
John Loftus, Fox News Contributor, carelessly gave the address of an unsuspecting family because he thought a terrorist lived at their address. He was wrong and the family has been tortured and terrorized since his irresponsible statement. Chrish reported this story and at that time the family was waiting for an apology from Fox News. This morning 8/27/05, CNN reported that Fox had fired Loftus and issued a written apology to the family who have gone through hell.

The Voricks are now recieving police protection because the harrassment has been so severe. Mrs. Vorick claimed that she is afraid to leave her teenage child with the younger kids while she works. Someone actually spray painted " terrorist" on the wall next to their front door while they were home. A steady stream of people drive by screaming at them. Their lives have been turned upside down because John Loftus and Fox behaved so recklessly.
(snip/...)
http://www.newshounds.us/2005/08/27/fox_contributor_fired_after_endangering_innocent_family.php

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Family Hassled After TV Report

LA HABRA, Calif., Aug. 25, 2005

(AP) A couple whose home was wrongly identified on national television as belonging to an Islamic radical has faced harassment, and police are providing special protection.

After the report ran on Fox News on Aug. 7, people have shouted profanities at Randy and Ronnell Vorick and spray-painted "terrorist" (spelling it "terrist") on their property.

"I'm scared to go to work and leave my kids home. I call them every 30 minutes to make sure they're OK," Randy Vorick said.

John Loftus, a former federal prosecutor who appears on the Fox News segment "Inside Scoop with John Loftus," gave out the house address during the broadcast.

He said the home belonged to Iyad Hilal, whose group, Loftus said, has ties to those responsible for the July 7 bombings in London. But Hilal moved out of the house about three years ago.
(snip/...)
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2005/08/25/national/main795609.shtml

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~




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magellan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-16-06 05:01 AM
Response to Reply #17
18. GAK!! Loftus looks like
...he regularly terrorizes Big Macs and Super-sized fries!! No wonder he regurgitates such dreck.
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yasmina27 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Feb-16-06 05:11 AM
Response to Original message
19. Just because he talks about WMDs
Doesn't mean he had them! I seem to remember reports that advisors, etc. close to Saddam, after they were captured and interrogated, said that they told him what he wanted to hear. Not the truth, which was that they did NOT have any WMDs.

Will find a link later as I have to get ready for work.
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