'Nine die' in Libya cartoon clash

I can't believe these religious nuts don't see the irony in what they're doing.

is that if they followed the example of the Beloved Prophet (bpuh), then they would turn away and not do anything at all. Mohammed was attacked once with a stone and once someone tried to strangle him while he was praying. He merely kept his focus on God, and their efforts came to naught. When one submits their will to God's, then they must remember "not my will, but Thine alone, oh Lord."

Murder.

and influence based on fear and hatred. I do not believe they are following the teachings given in the Qur'an any more than Falwell and Robertson are following the teachings of Jesus.

It's the cops protecting the Western interests. That's been the case in Afghanistan and Pakistan, and it's the case here. From the news story cited in the OP:

Speaking by telephone from inside the besieged consulate, Italian consular official Antonio Simoes-Concalves told the Associated Press a crowd of some 1,000 protesters had surrounded the building.

Libyan police tried to keep them back by firing bullets and using teargas, he said.

"They are still continually firing," he told the AP in Rome at 2100 GMT. "They haven't managed to block them."

He said nine protesters had been killed and several more had been wounded.

Libyan officials put the casualty figure at 11, which included some dead.

isn't exactly peaceful.

A Muslim cleric has offered a million dollars as reward for murdering a Danish artist.

I don't disagree that "authorities" have killed people during the protests (violent or non), each of those cases should be looked at individually and reasonably. And I'm fairly confident they will be, in a court of law. The violent protester's point of view deserves more attention than you're giving it, i think.

When you have religious fundamentalists from all areas of the globe justifying the murder of their God Granted Mortal Enemies by solely citing their religious beliefs, it's time to wake up and smell the incense.

edit: impact

to take back their faiths, as moderate Christians and Muslims are trying to do. Unfortunately, unless you listen to State of Belief on AAR on Sunday, you aren't going to hear the moderate point of view on many radio or TV stations.

at some point in the past.

I don't think they ever did have, what is meant in the above, "their faith".

Additionally, this is where intellect deserves a prominent front seat to faith, don't you agree?

God concepts are like bugs
Some live and die in their own dirt
Some fly

but then I am sure that my spiritual experiences have been far different than yours. I have learned long ago to let arguments of intellect vs faith lie, as the people arguing their particular point of view usually can never see eye to eye because their inner experiences are so vastly different. As a popular saying goes, "Let those asleep remain asleep."

As for moderates "having faith"--are you implying that only fanatics have faith? I'm sure Rev. Graddy and other moderate and progressive people of faith would disagree with you. I certainly do.

"I have learned long ago to let arguments of intellect vs faith lie, as the people arguing their particular point of view usually can never see eye to eye because their inner experiences are so vastly different."

Seriously, how in the damn world do you expect moderates to "take your religion back" peacefully unless you appeal to the radical's intellect?

My pov is that Islam did not start as some grass roots movement of 'spiritual' people.
(just like the other salvationist religions)

"The accepted faith" is dictated by people with power to gain and protect.

the Danes.

Stupid fucks.

Redstone

.

nm

which now are being used mainly as an excuse. In the case of a couple of countries, Syria being one, the "demonstrations" are at the very least condoned by the government, if not organized by the government. Perhaps the governments see it as a "safe" way of protesting the US while, at the same time, silencing the moderate religious elements (easy to do when you control the media) and bolstering those who bolster the governmental cause. In other places, the riots are being fueled by fundamentalist minority parties (as in Pakistan)wishing to get a larger share of supporters.

Realize, too, that to some extent, the riots are a reflection of resentment of the colonial sentiments of the West towards people in the Middle East and East.

I think you're correct. At this point, the anger is simply being manipulated by the fanatics and extremists.

There were colonial injustices perpetrated by the US and Europe all over the world for hundreds of years - from India, China, Japan, Latin America, sub-Sahran Africa, and the Middle East. Yet only the Muslim world reacts like this, mired in failure, blaming everyone else.

The Far East was colonized and oppressed, yet those countries have a culture that allowed them to embrace Western ways, and therefore, subsequently succeed. Islam is stiffling the progress that those countries would otherwise be making. The only way to move forward is for those societies to reduce Islam's role, as Ataturk recognized.

Perhaps the Freepers and the Christian Fundies can set up a counter-protest next to all the cartoon protesters Even better, maybe random guns and ammunition can be placed on the ground so that the two sides can "communicate in a meaningful way."

Bonus points if people know that I stole that line from George Carlin!

you're rotten, I love it. I wish the far right (wrong!) of my faith, would just shut the heck up. they're an embarrassment to the Christians who mostly (mostly, because we all make mistakes) obey God and accept people of all different views. I think bringing together the two fanatical sects of the two major world religions, let's say, oh, in Texas, and letting them discuss their differences, would be FANTASTICAL!


hehe..

what would be the point?

could behave this way...at least they talk tough. You are right though - their bark is much worse than their bite as they are mostly armchair and Internet warriors.

wouldn't you try to destroy that enemy?
Especially if you 'knew' God was on your side?

but I will tell you the only enemy here is the one attacking the freedom of expression & speech I'm begining to think the clerics inciting these violent protests are on the CIA payroll.

I hastily posted my idea that anyone will take the life of another, when their own survival is threatened.

Every functional biological creature on the planet fights back, iow.

I think fundamentalist extremists exist. (some Christian ones buy time on my local tv channels)

snip
They were said to be angry at Italian minister Roberto Calderoli, who had worn a T-shirt displaying the drawings.

It values having an enemy to kill in the name of God, peace be with it.

at the West - now all coming out. It's not the cartoons, it's so much more than that. But that's just me.

it would goad them to violent anger.

Riots and protests are exactly what Bush and Berlusconi want. It helps stoke the anger in the USA for another war. Why else would a professional diplomat wear such a shirt?

http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20060218/ts_afp/europeislammediaitaly_060218111550

The government of Prime Minister Silvio Berlusconi and opposition leaders said Reforms Minister Roberto Calderoli, a member of the anti-immigrant Northern League party, should resign immediately. They said he stoked Muslim anger by reproducing the Danish cartoons that have caused widespread outrage in the Arab world.

"The entire government is asking the resignation of Calderoli," Foreign Minister Gianfranco Fini said on Saturday.
http://go.reuters.co.uk/newsArticle.jhtml?type=worldNews&storyID=1090129§ion=news&src=rss/uk/worldNews

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very well ... for a god that demands so much and is emeshed in every second of of every day and night.. and is so merciful..

but then i always felt that religion was simply extorsion anyway.. but what do i know.. what does anybody know for sure.. maybe i just lack faith,

Muslims into violence

The world really doesn't need people who can be goaded into deadly violence by a t-shirt, or a cartoon.