Martin may visit Washington in January . Canada's new PM . . . .

. . OH dear, is this to be a prize for Junior's "poodle" collection ?

Martin may visit Washington in January

Canada's new PM has impressed members of the Bush administration

Friday, November 21, 2003

WASHINGTON -- U.S. officials have opened informal discussions with Paul Martin's transition team to arrange a possible visit by the new prime minister to Washington in early January, sources say.

Encouraged by Martin's recent promises to strengthen the relationship between the two countries, the White House may invite him to meet with President George W. Bush within weeks of his swearing-in on Dec. 12.

/snip/

While there has been some speculation in Washington and Ottawa that Martin may receive an invitation to Bush's ranch in Crawford, Tex., that scenario is unlikely for both logistical and political reasons.

The U.S. and Canada are sensitive to the topic of inviting Martin to the ranch, particularly because Chretien never made the guest list during Bush's three years as president.

"Everyone is saying Washington, with a slight chance that it will be Crawford," said the U.S. source.

/snip/

Aaah - the ever so enviable, elevated, enchanted Pig-Farm of the West

So what will happen to my beloved Canada if Junior get's His way here ?

I shudder to think

(sigh)

but he's far too smart to cave in to Bush. There'll be a change of style but not much of a change of substance. Martin may surprise us all with his social activism.

. . and my fears unfounded . .

That Martin's too smart a politician to buddy up to a despised American president. I sure as hell hope so.

Fortunately, it's not rocket science--recent memory will conjure up the specter of Brian Mulroney, :puke: who was 41's poodle during Gulf War I and wound up as the most detested PM in Canadian history. The Tories paid for it big time in the 93 election, and while I don't imagine there'll ever be a similar meltdown, it's still instructive.

Of course, Mulroney :puke: had his own personality problems, such as being an arrogant, corrupt, greedy, stupid, money-worshipping alcoholic wife-beater... but the poddle thing pretty much cooked his slimy goose.

unfortunately that will mean merely maintaining the appearance of distance, while he brings us even more into the Empire's stifling embrace.

I'll be thrilled to be proven wrong, but that's my prediction.

Dubya invites the new PM to the ranch. Believing that this will be a total change from Jean C. (after all, this guy is also the son of a wealthy politician, just like Dubya!), Bush smugly plies him with nachos, a cowboy band strumming away in the background ...

Anyway, he asks Paul Martin when they can expect to see Canadian troops in Baghdad. Martin shakes his head, puts down the margarita he's been nursing all evening, and the Canadian delegation walks out of Bush's living room, enters their vehicles, and drives out of Crawford, heading back up north.

I sure hope you're right!

if Martin goes in January, prior to the next election, he will make nice noises, take some votes from the Alliance and return home. I will, however, be watching carefully how Martin acts AFTER the election to see if he has been infected by his visit.

I recommend an innoculation shot for Martin to make sure he doesn't catch something ugly from his visit to the pig farm.

Don't legitimize the Rove regime!

He is his father's son...(His father was a cabinet minister with a very liberal social conscience) and he will live up to the obligations he spoke of in his acceptance speech....He's able to balance a bank book and he's compassionate too!...That's not all that unusual...So am I....So are many of you....Why can't the two go together?.....I don't believe he'll give anything away to George....Maybe it's just that George won't realize it!

edit--by the way, I just noticed this came from the right wing National Post.....

Martin will lead the most conservative Liberal government in modern Canadian history, Irish pop stars notwithstanding.

My gut feelings, watching him and listening to his speech and taking many other things into consideration (especially the fact he waited so long for his chance)...He wants to do it the way Canadians want him to!...:)

and making sure his left-wing vote doesn't migrate to the (thankfully) revived NDP. I don't see him risking getting too close to a hopefully doomed Bush.

I don't think Martin will be doing much substantively until after the US 04 election.

Not without a presence in Quebec. Canadians are for the most part Centrist and as long as that is the case we will have a Liberal Party government.

That's a reasonable goal. They can certainly destabilise the Liberals by taking a big chunk of their left-wing vote, as happened in 1988.

just 12 years ago. Would you have predicted that?

Layton's Montreal-born, fluently bilingual, and with the BQ faltering the NDP could become an attractive, legitimate option for Quebec social democrats.

One is either seperatist or federalist tout simplement. The separatists vote for the Bloc, the Federalists vote for the LP. Everything else is just noise. As for Martin who also happens to be my MP ;) his popularity in Quebec surpasses even Trudeau.

Layton's gotta do more than speak French.

but then he's my former city councillor and future MP, so there. ;)

Not as long as anyone remembers Bob's RAEn of terror.

NDP could form next opposition (Calgary Herald)

http://action.web.ca/home/ndpnpd/en_ndpinthenews.shtml?sh_itm=3360398ae6bcf8d9bafa799f0483cb4a

Very interesting.

. . nope - I don't necessarily share ALL the views here

- but thought it might interest you

. . some of the information/opinions here helped to "feed" my fears so to speak -

either way, aggree or disagree

- It's a good read -

Bay Street's boy is in, but lame-duck Chrétien spoke for Canadians

PM's farewell warning about the power of the right wasn't just about the new conservative party, but about forces within his own

/snip/

I saw the farewell speech, twice

- I'm gonna miss that old battle-axe, kept us out of a "dirty" war

and nope, I didn't pay too much attention, or had too much affinity for our Mr. Chretien until he took a very solid, and somewhat unpopular stance angainst the involvement in the Iraqi/US fiasco

- THEN - I was proud beyond words

Day by day he is being proven correct in keeping us out of the Iraq attack....I think that, and the Clarity Bill will be his legacies....Quebec shit disturbers wouldn't dare have another referendum, now that they, by law, have to ask a question where the people will actually KNOW they are being asked to leave Canada...They know they can't win on that question!...I predict...No more referendums!:)

...was to hang onto power for as long as possible. His legacy in a nutshell?

1. Signing NAFTA

2. Averting Quebec sovereignty

3. Not plunging Canada into the Iraqi war

Time to move on.

A task Martin is likely to complete.
Plus ridding us of Conrad Black. For that, I salute him.

:)

There's only about five other Canadian PM's you could say that about.

. . n/t

. . and I see his "sole" priority increased from TWO to THREE in less than a few minutes !

. . our Country is still basically solid ( in comparison with many others )

. . and we sure ain't anywhere NEAR being the most hated and disrespected country in the world

. . in fact, alot of countries look UP to Canada as a result of Jean's decision to NOT cowtow to the BFEE

and just as a basic biased opinion of my own

- Canada is still a GREAT country, not by force, but by spirit.

- and Jean helped us keep it that way for the last 30 years

Just My Humble ( well I guess NOT so Humble )Canadian Opinion

Hanging onto power was his sole priority, the rest was just background noise that will be polished and presented as some kind of legacy. Quebecers call him a petty man.

. . he came through when the "chips were down"

. . for that - I will respect him forever

He will be recognized for the good things he's done in Quebec too, once the B.Q., P.Q. and their ilk are gone, and no longer spreading lies about him....:)

Let's keep our fingers crossed that he doesn't suck up to Bush.

I predict Matin will not suck up to Junior. He will be able to handle him far more effectively than Chretin.
Other predictions;
1.Better Canada/US relations. This will steal votes from the right. They should start looking for new jobs soon.
2.Canada will deal with the US as equal countries. We're grown up now, we no longer define ourselves by how we're different. We are proud to be Canadian.
3.Pro-active foreign policy, attention to African and under-developed nations.
4.Commitment to social programs...but, spending within our means. Bay Street already loves Martin,he doesn't have to work hard to keep them happy. Layton will force Martin to stay left on social reform...he's gotta hang on to vote rich GTA.
5.An honest attempt to engage the West and deal with issues that matter to them.
6.Better provincial/federal relations. Not hard to imagine really with Liberal governments in Ontario and Quebec. Jean Charest take the lead role in this area. He may emerge as Martin's sucessor.

Chretin didn't do a bad job, but he's reflective of the old way. Constantly sticking his finger in Bush's* eye allowed him to be dismissed as insignificant. Staying out of Iraq wasn't hard for him to do. We had nothing to contribute and since he was retiring there was no politcal risk. It's not hard to do what's morally right. Hanging on to power far too long and splitting the party was a sad end to his career. We're Canadian so we'll remember him better than he was. Martin reflects a new age for Canada. A Canada secure of our place in the world and ready to participate. This Canadian feels good about Martin and the Canada that we will be.

When Canada refused to support the invasion of Iraq without the UN, we grew up and drew a line, in the eyes of others.

I feel passionate about this and have not felt so positve since Trudeau.

lightly....He did the best thing domestically, that's been done by the government in many years...He brought in the Clarity Act (against the wishes of many in his own party) which has put an end to the phony referendums the Quebec troublemakers will be holding....They don't dare ask and honest question...hence...no referendum....That's my belief...:)

Perhaps Chretin's greatest contribution will be leading us to maturity. And for that I thank him.

after reading the most civil disagreements I've seen in awhile!

to be very civil and accepting of others' ideas too...But thanks anyway....:)

edited to say: this was meant to be a reply to glarius! How did that happen?

But you're right, for an internet forum DU is very civil.

Our discourse has gotten pretty mean down here though, not just on TV but also among the people. It started with Reagan justifying the 'I got mine' attitude, then the ugly vendetta against Clinton, and now Bush has enabled another level of nastiness.

There are still lots of nice people of course, but the atmosphere is definitely different.

are likely to set people off. Of course, that might be all of them!

. . from the Vietnam War

. . I expect new "draftees" to be coming to Canada in the near future,

. . but I expect the BFEE has sumthing in their "Patriot Act" that may make that a "terrorists act" to prevent that

. . short version

- Americans will not be ALLOWED to determine what freedom means

- only the Government has the power to decide that

- welcome to Bu$hco's version of "democracy"

- The USA has been taken over by their own Military

- that's what Hitler did

Just My Humble Canadian Opinion

either way, we will be a haven if needed, I have little doubt!

. . we can do it for the Nigras, the Eyetaleyans, the Chyenese, the Japanese, and I know I left out many

- but most important I think, even the country it really belongs to,

the Natives of this Great Land - (tho not enuf yet really)

- we can do it for the Americans !!

(and have in the past)


OR

- We could do like GeeDubya and label the USA as a "clear and present danger to Canada"

- (which in reality they ARE with their firepower and also their power over the Canadian Economy, coupled with their agressive attitude)

and wage war on the USA

- (obviously not with superior firepower - we KNOW there are other ways)

BUT

We are that "peacefull" Country to the North

But we WILL only take so much

We put millions of soldiers into WW2 (ahem - BEFORE the USA even got involved)

We can do it again if need be

- WITHOUT a draft !!

In that I believe

...explain to Quasident Bush that legalizing marijuana is a step in the right direction. Oh, and give him hell about this unilateral, pre-emptive crap, while you're at it...