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sabra Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-26-06 04:32 PM
Original message
Bush creates an "out" before signing bill banning torture

http://www.kare11.com/news/national/national_article.aspx?storyid=128050

Bush creates an "out" before signing bill banning torture

Sen. John McCain thought he had a deal when President Bush, faced with a veto-proof margin in Congress, agreed to sign a bill banning the torture of detainees.

Not quite.

While Bush signed the new law, he also quietly approved another document: a signing statement reserving his right to ignore the law. McCain was furious, and so were other lawmakers.

The Senate Judiciary Committee is opening hearings this week into what has become the White House's favorite tool for overriding Congress in the name of wartime national security.

"It's a challenge to the plain language of the Constitution," the committee's chairman, Sen. Arlen Specter, R-Pa, said in an interview with The Associated Press. "I'm interested to hear from the administration just what research they've done to lead them to the conclusion that they can cherry-pick."

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aquart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-26-06 04:33 PM
Response to Original message
1. Bush don't need no steenkeen Congress.
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Redstone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-26-06 04:34 PM
Response to Original message
2. Where the fuck, in the Constitution, is the "signing statement?"
Where did this bullshit maneuver come from? I'm genuinely mystified.

Redstone
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Frank Cannon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-26-06 04:42 PM
Response to Reply #2
7. It's in an Amendment to the Constitution
Oh, it's not in any of the enumerated Amendments. It's in the new one that's classified due to security reasons, the one that says that the Bush gang can do anything and everything they want.
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Redstone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-26-06 04:47 PM
Response to Reply #7
10. Aha! That explains it. I should have known.
Redstone
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54anickel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-26-06 06:50 PM
Response to Reply #2
19. They've been around for a long time, but Ray-gun really started the
ball rolling.

http://www.slate.com/id/2134919/
President Ronald Reagan, guided by his Attorney General Edwin Meese III (and urged on enthusiastically by a young lawyer called Samuel Alito), launched a concerted policy to start to use signing statements as a means of reinforcing the executive's message and consolidating its power. Meese arranged to have them published for this very reason. Until the Reagan presidency, the executive branch had only ever issued a total of 75 signing statements. Reagan, Bush I, and Bill Clinton deployed them 247 times between them. (Clinton issued more statements than Bush I, but fewer than Reagan). According to Cooper, by the end of 2004, Bush had issued 108 signing statements presenting 505 different constitutional challenges. He has yet to veto anything.


There's been lots written about Dubya's abuse of the signing statement, just not picked up much by the MSM.

The Problem with Presidential Signing Statements: Their Use and Misuse by the Bush Administration
By JOHN W. DEAN
http://writ.news.findlaw.com/dean/20060113.html

Presidential signing statements are old news to anyone who has served in the White House counsel's office. Presidents have long used them to add their two cents when a law passed by Congress has provisions they do not like, yet they are not inclined to veto it. Nixon's statements, for example, often related to spending authorization laws which he felt were excessive and contrary to his fiscal policies.

In this column, I'll take a close look at President Bush's use of signing statements. I find these signing statements are to Bush and Cheney's presidency what steroids were to Arnold Schwarzenegger's body building. Like Schwarzenegger with his steroids, Bush does not deny using his signing statements; does not like talking about using them; and believes that they add muscle.



But like steroids, signing statements ultimately lead to serious trouble.

Relying On Command, Rather Than Persuasion

Phillip Cooper is a leading expert on signing statements. His 2002 book, By Order of the President: The Use and Abuse of Executive Direct Action, assesses the uses and abuses of signing statements by presidents Ronald Reagan, George H.W. Bush and Bill Clinton. Cooper has updated his material in a recent essay for the Presidential Studies Quarterly, to encompass the use of signing statements by now-President Bush as well.

By Cooper's count, George W. Bush issued 23 signing statements in 2001; 34 statements in 2002, raising 168 constitutional objections; 27 statements in 2003, raising 142 constitutional challenges, and 23 statements in 2004, raising 175 constitutional criticisms. In total, during his first term Bush raised a remarkable 505 constitutional challenges to various provisions of legislation that became law.

more...
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liberal N proud Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-26-06 04:35 PM
Response to Original message
3. "reserving his right to ignore the law" ???????
What the F... is that?
:wtf:
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elehhhhna Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-26-06 04:43 PM
Response to Reply #3
8. Most of the signing statements say the same thing.
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Supersedeas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-27-06 11:23 AM
Response to Reply #3
25. the Executive's right to create, ignore, and determine constitutionality
of the law.

Who needs the two other branches?
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partylessinOhio Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-26-06 04:36 PM
Response to Original message
4. Spector talks in circles and is hogging the spotlight again. We know he
is a phony.

Impeachment is the only way to shutdown the evil one.
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Frank Cannon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-26-06 04:44 PM
Response to Reply #4
9. Specter just needs to put on a ringmaster's outfit
As many dog-and-pony shows as he runs.
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Mandate My Ass Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-26-06 04:38 PM
Response to Original message
5. Specter is such a tool
He's interested? He should be outraged. He'll listen and pass a law saying Bush is "The Decider" and anything he does is legal by virtue of his saying so. Bush cannot interpret laws or the Constitution, that's for the courts.
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Stuckinthebush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-26-06 04:40 PM
Response to Original message
6. He can't do that
That's all the congress has to say.

"You don't have that power Mr. President. If you break the law you just signed you will be held accountable."

But you see, Bush knows that congress has no intention of holding him accountable for anything. He can break the law all he wants and call it National Security. The congress won't bat an eye.

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babydollhead Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-26-06 05:34 PM
Response to Reply #6
15. after the 2004 election...
I put a road side memorial kind of sign. Fake flowers,ribbons,etc. and to it I nailed a handwritten sign, "Accountability
R.I.P."
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Stuckinthebush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-26-06 05:34 PM
Response to Reply #15
16. Nice
I may have to "rip" that idea off!

:D

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Child_Of_Isis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-26-06 06:32 PM
Response to Reply #6
17. That's because shrubbie has their phone and bank records. n/t
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pinto Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-26-06 04:52 PM
Response to Original message
11. Agghhh. More from the article:
<snip>

But Specter and his allies maintain that Bush, in practical terms, is doing an end-run around the veto process in the name of national security. In the sixth year of his presidency, Bush has yet to issue a single veto.

Rather than give Congress the opportunity to override a veto with a two-thirds majority in each house, he has issued hundreds of signing statements invoking his right to interpret the law on everything from whistleblower protections to how Congress oversees the USA Patriot Act.

"It means that the administration does not feel bound to enforce many new laws which Congress has passed," said David Golove, a law professor at New York University who specializes in executive power issues. "This raises profound rule of law concerns. Do we have a functioning code of federal laws?"

http://www.kare11.com/news/national/national_article.aspx?storyid=128050
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superconnected Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-26-06 05:02 PM
Response to Original message
12. Again, proof of how Bush really feels about torture.
Edited on Mon Jun-26-06 05:02 PM by superconnected
What a world embarassement Bush is.
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Guaranteed Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-26-06 05:03 PM
Response to Original message
13. This is very near revolution-type stuff. nt
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MasonJar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-26-06 05:27 PM
Response to Original message
14. This is not a war; Congress should remind him that he is NOT a
wartime pResident.
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RoseMead Donating Member (953 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-26-06 06:41 PM
Response to Original message
18. Can we PLEASE IMPEACH him yet?
Is is even possible at this point?
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HuffleClaw Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-26-06 06:53 PM
Response to Original message
20. ok, so its not really NEW news, but its sure nice to see it again
SOOO many of bush's evildoings get swept under the carpet by the media, but these 'signing statements' are very much newsworthy, considering the contempt they demonstrate for the laws of the land.
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Rex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-26-06 06:56 PM
Response to Original message
21. Lame duck Congress!
Repukes are all the same, 'okay now you need stop ignoring the law, pretty please.' A REAL Congress, with REAL statesmen/women would have sooooo impeached this Worthless Wart on society by now!!!!

Wish we had some REAL Congresspeople who had guts and a backbone.
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Bush_MUST_Go Donating Member (378 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-26-06 07:00 PM
Response to Reply #21
22. This wouldn't be a problem if all soldiers went AWOL like bush did.
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mandomom Donating Member (327 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-26-06 08:43 PM
Response to Original message
23. Why is Specter interested in more lies and manipulation from the
Bush administration? He's all hot air; no real desire to set the country straight by subpoenas and indictments against them.
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struggle4progress Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-26-06 10:39 PM
Response to Original message
24. Everybody shoulda expected this shit after the December 2000 coup
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rman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-27-06 11:55 AM
Response to Original message
26. Isn't torture prohibited already?
Then why create a new bill that does the same thing?

Any research the admin has done into this is completely irrelevant, since it's not the president's business to create laws - especially not laws that place the president outside the law.

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Az_lefty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-27-06 12:00 PM
Response to Original message
27. Being furious means nothing unless their willing to act...
this little asshole is totally out of control and they know it. They need to start impeachment proceedings or just shut the hell up and go home.
:grr:
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cain_7777 Donating Member (417 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-27-06 05:12 PM
Response to Original message
28. He'll have a signing statement for the bill against signing statements
All hail king George, ruler of all branches of government, and faithful servant of the Lord! :puke:
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Higans Donating Member (819 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Jun-27-06 07:19 PM
Response to Reply #28
29. I think he answers to a Lower Power.


www.bushisantichrist.com
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tanyev Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jun-28-06 09:44 PM
Response to Original message
30. Awww, what'sa matter, John?
Did your dear friend stab you in the back once again? How many will it take before you learn?


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