U.S. soldiers divided over Saddam’s execution

Commander AWOL Bush & Republicon cronies decide to ignore the Bible.

As usual.

"What the hell, it's only the Bible." - Commander AWOL

US intell reports.

Stupidest MFers on the planet and the only people they fool are each other.

And that's pretty fucking stupid.

A far more accurate way to read it is "thou shalt not murder". Killing in war is considered heroism, not murder.

It's not the "Christian Bible" being "unequivocal" by any reasonable standard. If anything it's just a few things glossed over in the translation.

under "Thou shalt not kill."

It seems plain and unambiguous to me.

If you change the wording "creatively" they way you did, you could twist it to read any old freaking way you want.

I do not excuse the Biblical Jews, George AWOL Bush, or any man-made governments for their creative excuses and academic deconstructions.

There are no subclauses to the Biblical Ten Commandments

The commandment is not: Thou shalt not murder.

Check the Bible again. It reads: "Thou shalt not kill."

If you profess to be a Bible-believing Christian, then you better live up to it.

Otherwise you are a hypocrite and a Pharisee.

I know what "kill" means in English. I don't know what the original word was or meant in its original context.

Until then, I won't go off on everyone else being a hypocrite and me being the only true believer. What you do is your choice.

The hebrew verb "rastah" is much closer in meaning to "murder" than killing in a general sense. Otherwise all of those laws that require stoning in Leviticus and Deuteronomy make no sense, nor would Joshua's millitary campaigns or hundreds of other acts by biblical heroes. It's a mistranslation much like Matthew mistranslates "alma" to mean "virgin" instead of the much more accurate meaning of "young woman". (Matthew 1:22-23 vs Isaiah 7:14)

I've been preaching this to my fundamentalist relatives for years but no one seems to want to hear.

Thanks for the info.

says: "Thou Shalt Not Kill."

You can dig up all the archaic references you want to source or whatever.

In my view, that does not apply.

The Bible that George Bush, the republican evangelicals, and almost all modern Christians embrace and use says simply and unequivocaly: Thou Shalt Not Kill.

If you subscribe to a religion with a blunt commandment like that, especially a religion that you are trying to shove down other people's throats with a crusade, then you damn well better live up to the commandment, and not go adding any excuses.

Otherwise it is hypocricy.

12 "Anyone who strikes a man and kills him shall surely be put to death. 13 However, if he does not do it intentionally, but God lets it happen, he is to flee to a place I will designate. 14 But if a man schemes and kills another man deliberately, take him away from my altar and put him to death.
15 "Anyone who attacks his father or his mother must be put to death.

16 "Anyone who kidnaps another and either sells him or still has him when he is caught must be put to death.

17 "Anyone who curses his father or mother must be put to death.

18 "If men quarrel and one hits the other with a stone or with his fist and he does not die but is confined to bed, 19 the one who struck the blow will not be held responsible if the other gets up and walks around outside with his staff; however, he must pay the injured man for the loss of his time and see that he is completely healed.

20 "If a man beats his male or female slave with a rod and the slave dies as a direct result, he must be punished, 21 but he is not to be punished if the slave gets up after a day or two, since the slave is his property.

22 "If men who are fighting hit a pregnant woman and she gives birth prematurely but there is no serious injury, the offender must be fined whatever the woman's husband demands and the court allows. 23 But if there is serious injury, you are to take life for life, 24 eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot, 25 burn for burn, wound for wound, bruise for bruise.

26 "If a man hits a manservant or maidservant in the eye and destroys it, he must let the servant go free to compensate for the eye. 27 And if he knocks out the tooth of a manservant or maidservant, he must let the servant go free to compensate for the tooth.

28 "If a bull gores a man or a woman to death, the bull must be stoned to death, and its meat must not be eaten. But the owner of the bull will not be held responsible. 29 If, however, the bull has had the habit of goring and the owner has been warned but has not kept it penned up and it kills a man or woman, the bull must be stoned and the owner also must be put to death. 30 However, if payment is demanded of him, he may redeem his life by paying whatever is demanded. 31 This law also applies if the bull gores a son or daughter. 32 If the bull gores a male or female slave, the owner must pay thirty shekels of silver to the master of the slave, and the bull must be stoned.

33 "If a man uncovers a pit or digs one and fails to cover it and an ox or a donkey falls into it, 34 the owner of the pit must pay for the loss; he must pay its owner, and the dead animal will be his.

35 "If a man's bull injures the bull of another and it dies, they are to sell the live one and divide both the money and the dead animal equally. 36 However, if it was known that the bull had the habit of goring, yet the owner did not keep it penned up, the owner must pay, animal for animal, and the dead animal will be his.


http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?book_id=2&chapter=21&version=31

I belive you're correct...

"Kill" in English is an all-encompassing verb that covers the taking of life in all forms and for all classes of victims. That kind of generalization is expressed in Hebrew through the verb "harag." However, the verb that appears in the Torah's prohibition is a completely different one, " ratsah" which should be rendered "murder." This root refers only to criminal acts of killing.






(Christian-Theistic Evidences, Phillipsburg, N.J.: Presbyterian and Reformed Publishing Co., 1978)

It really should be more like, "thou shall not murder." There is lots of stuff on this on the 'net. So, I think that is not a good argument against taking SH's life. There are others and basing one's criticism on the hypocrisy of Christians taking his life is not a good place to start.

Just, taking a mistranslation too literally, is not one of them.

Plenty of good reasons besides though...

First let's tell them the FACT that Hussein & Iraq had nothing whatsofuckingever to do with 911.

THEN let's ask them how they feel...and not just about this fake trial & execution.

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

US Troops in Iraq
Almost 90% think war is retaliation for Saddam’s role in 9/11
http://www.zogby.com/NEWS/ReadNews.dbm?ID=1075

Amnesty International;
Saddam Hussein's trial deeply flawed and unfair
http://www.amnestyusa.org/youth/plugged_in/0611/hussein_trial.html

Amnesty International deplores the decision of the Supreme Iraqi Criminal Tribunal (SICT) to impose the death sentence on Saddam Hussein and two of his seven co-accused after a trial which was deeply flawed and unfair.
http://news.amnesty.org/index/ENGMDE140372006

Human Rights Watch
Saddam Hussein's trial for crimes against humanity was undermined by so many flaws, including political interference and failures to disclose evidence properly, that his conviction is unsound.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story/0,,1952845,00.html

UN Rights Group: First Saddam Trial Flawed
http://www.voanews.com/english/2006-11-28-voa22.cfm

...really added to the holiday cheer. The MSM spin on death row interest story was that the Iraqi people would see their government in action and really appreciate this "justice."

I thought the time machine slipped and Nazi Germany developed television before WWII. Nice touch seeing a row of guys hanged together. Also reminded me of SS meat hook shots and Japanese occupation shots of Korean college students hanged with wire together in a neat row.

This is as provocative as it could possibly be made. Summary acts of execution for non capital offenses? Saddam's appeal should take years given the legal issues, but a summary execution insures that the violence will be aggravated as much as possible. In the context that this is being played out, the backlash won't be a surge or a spike, although superficially it may have that appearance. The real intent is to create fissures and chasms so deep, that the civil strife cracks throughout the political and social geography of the Islamic world to the generations to come.

Shrines and independence museums will have pictures of the hanged who will be venerated as a cassus belli for all time. This should give our defense contractors more to do.

Happy holidays!

What's there to prevent him from becoming a cultural icon to the Sunnis like Che became to all anti-imperialists?

I can remember reports that in post-Soviet Russia there were many who looked back favorably on the leadership of Josef Stalin. It would have been easy to understand in Georgia, his birthplace(?), but my recollection has it that a significant minority in Russia thought that was what the country needed.

IMHO Saddam wouldn't have been a pimple on Stalin's butt and we all know what a nice :sarcasm: guy Stalin was.

about it heating up. And it's troops like him who will pay the price, along with the Iraqi people. :(