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Roland99 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 05:03 PM
Original message
Grass Makes Better Ethanol than Corn Does
Source: Scientific American

Grass Makes Better Ethanol than Corn Does
Midwestern farms prove switchgrass could be the right crop for producing ethanol to replace gasoline
http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?id=grass-makes-better-ethanol-than-corn

Farmers in Nebraska and the Dakotas brought the U.S. closer to becoming a biofuel economy, planting huge tracts of land for the first time with switchgrass—a native North American perennial grass (Panicum virgatum) that often grows on the borders of cropland naturally—and proving that it can deliver more than five times more energy than it takes to grow it.

Working with the U.S. Department of Agriculture (USDA), the farmers tracked the seed used to establish the plant, fertilizer used to boost its growth, fuel used to farm it, overall rainfall and the amount of grass ultimately harvested for five years on fields ranging from seven to 23 acres in size (three to nine hectares).

Once established, the fields yielded from 5.2 to 11.1 metric tons of grass bales per hectare, depending on rainfall, says USDA plant scientist Ken Vogel. "It fluctuates with the timing of the precipitation,'' he says. "Switchgrass needs most of its moisture in spring and midsummer. If you get fall rains, it's not going to do that year's crops much good."

But yields from a grass that only needs to be planted once would deliver an average of 13.1 megajoules of energy as ethanol for every megajoule of petroleum consumed—in the form of nitrogen fertilizers or diesel for tractors—growing them. "It's a prediction because right now there are no biorefineries built that handle cellulosic material" like that which switchgrass provides, Vogel notes. "We're pretty confident the ethanol yield is pretty close." This means that switchgrass ethanol delivers 540 percent of the energy used to produce it, compared with just roughly 25 percent more energy returned by corn-based ethanol according to the most optimistic studies.




Read more: http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?id=grass-makes-better-ethanol-than-corn
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Lisa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 05:06 PM
Response to Original message
1. at last a use for all those acres of grass that we plant, on lawns etc.
Supposedly it's one of the largest "crops" per acre in North America.

Weird thing is -- according to the documentary "The Power of Nightmares", one of the original Islamic extremists who inspired bin Laden (Kutb) once wrote a diatribe against North American consumerism ... amongst the things he criticized was the amount of money and effort spent on lawn care (which he saw as frivolous, given the number of starving people in the world, when the land, water, and fertilizers could have been used to produce food instead).
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eallen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 06:32 PM
Response to Reply #1
10. Not that kind of grass. Switch grass grows taller than you do.
Even if you played for a pro basketball team.

:hippie:
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Lisa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 06:34 PM
Response to Reply #10
11. so, we get people off Kentucky bluegrass onto this?
If they still want short lawns, they can just set their mower blades low!
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yellowcanine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 08:09 PM
Response to Reply #11
49. Well no it doesn't work for lawns. It would die if you mowed it that short.
If you want a warm season grass for lawns, Bermuda, Zoysia, or St. Augustine grass (if you live far enough south) are your basic choices. Choose varieties for local adaptation.
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Lisa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 08:48 PM
Response to Reply #49
50. aren't there a huge variety of native grasses in various heights?
Edited on Fri Jan-11-08 08:48 PM by Lisa
Some ecologist friends of mine have mentioned working in shortgrass prairie areas, where conditions are semi-arid and the grass species just do not grow above a certain height. They don't need to be irrigated like introduced varieties -- they take some getting used to because they are kind of bunchy and not that standard green color, but they do provide surface cover.

And then there are species growing in less-arid areas that are human-height if unmown -- and evidently the types of switchgrass being considered for cellulosic ethanol production are even taller. I've seen landscaping that's almost entirely based on different lengths of grass -- so instead of having a lawn of a uniform height, there are some patches or pathways that are kept short, and then there are outcrops of taller grasses that add some variety. So instead of having a landscape that's entirely lawn-type grass, you could split it 50-50 and still have the green look that some people really like, but at the same time produce a switchgrass biomass crop.

As other posters noted, if it's a golf course, there might be some resistance because people are used to seeing those vistas of short grass ... but in situations where it's an office park or university campus, growing swathes of switchgrass might not run into as much opposition.

Crazy idea, but who knows?
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Chulanowa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 07:39 PM
Response to Reply #1
22. And he's right, on that point
We waste an untold amount of water and energy on low-growing grasses for our lawns, parks, and - worst of the lot - golf courses. The net result is less water for human use and natural cycles, invasive plant species mixed in seed plus the grass itself, much less habitat for native plants and wildlife, and for what?

'Cause it fits someone's aesthetic of "pretty". I'm not sure who's, 'cause if I thought flat monotone green was pretty, I would just pave my front yard with dyed concrete.

Personally I get ill whenever I'm flying somewhere and see a big green golf course sprouting out of Arizona or somewhere. Old rich people gotta play with hteir balls, I guess.
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LiberalFighter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 10:56 PM
Response to Reply #1
32. Monsanto will probably patent the grass and sue anyone growing more than a years worth
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Occulus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 02:20 AM
Response to Reply #32
35. You called it first n/t
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puebloknot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 05:14 PM
Response to Original message
2. K&R What an inspiring idea. The car may not be obsolete after all! nt
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Puckster Donating Member (74 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 07:00 PM
Response to Reply #2
16. And....
if we get around to growing hemp for paper, cloth, fuel, food, the tree might not become obsolete, either!
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stubtoe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 07:03 PM
Response to Reply #16
17. Yes to hemp!
I really like the idea of trees not becoming obsolete, either. :)
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puebloknot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 12:32 AM
Response to Reply #16
34. What a clever idea! Didn't I read that the Constitution is written on hemp paper?
If not, it should have been!

Puckster, where'd ya get them brains?

In all seriousness, it's really heartening to see that there are good alternatives that we can develop to solve our energy problems.
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Tesha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 07:30 AM
Response to Reply #34
37. Your informant must have been high; it's written on parchment with iron gall ink.
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puebloknot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 06:54 PM
Response to Reply #37
46. Thanks for that correction. My informant didn't have to be high to be mistaken, unless...
he'd been rolling and smoking one leg of his hemp jeans! :)

Some interesting commentary aboout the uses of hemp, including for the making of paper, in this country:

http://www.hempmuseum.org/SUBROOMS/HEMP%20PAPER%20CHRON.htm


A.D. 1776. From Hunter=s text p.16: Thomas Jefferson's rough draft of the Declaration of Independence is written on four pages of Dutch paper and may have been from any of a dozen mills. The original Declaration was adopted on July 4, 1776. The officially signed Declaration of Independence was engrossed upon parchment by order of the Congress of July 19, 1776.

A.D. 1782. First Bible printed in America in the English language, by Robert Aitken, Philadelphia. The volume embraces more than 1400 unnumbered pages, the page size being 3 2 by 6 inches

A.D. 1916. United States Department of Agriculture Bulletin 404, Hemp Hurds as Paper Making Material, by Lyster Dewey and Jason Merrill, gave a dire warning about the dangers of using tree pulp for paper. Our forests are being cut three times as fast as they grow. It is advisable to investigate the paper-making value of the more promising plant materials before a critical situation arises. Bulletin 404 proved the value of hemp hurd or pulp for paper. The report noted that hemp produces a new crop every season, while trees took 20 years to be ready for cutting, and hemp yielded more than four times as much pulp per acre as timber, making it a cheaper and more sustainable source for all grades of paper. It also declared that hemp is easy to produce, treat, and transport and is fully adequate to the task: The permanency of the supply of hemp seems assured.@ Bulletin 404 noted that hemp hurd (pulp) stock acts similarly to soda-poplar stock, but will produce a somewhat harsher and stronger sheet and one of higher folding endurance. In fact, the hurd stock might very possibly meet with favor as a book-stock furnish.

The conclusions of USDA Bulletin 404, 1916, are timely today and bear repeating:
There appears to be little doubt that under the present system of forest use and consumption the present supply can not withstand the demands placed upon it. By the time improved methods of forestry have established an equilibrium between production and consumption, the price of pulp wood may be such that a knowledge of other available raw materials may be imperative.

A.D. 1938. Popular Mechanics magazine dubbed hemp the A New Billion Dollar Crop and predicted a bonanza for farmers and industry alike, in a report prepared in 1937. With its 25,000 viable uses, hemp will provide thousands of jobs for American workers throughout the land, reported the magazine.]




Hope springs eternal!

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Tesha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 07:30 AM
Response to Reply #34
38. (Duplicate removed by author)
Edited on Fri Jan-11-08 07:30 AM by Tesha
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pipoman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 05:18 PM
Response to Original message
3. I have been wondering why we must use food to make alcohol
to burn when freaking garbage can be fermented into alcohol. At least use the entire corn plant not just the grain for cris sake, the corn stalks contain quite a lot of sugar. Does anyone know why we aren't making alcohol out of paper trash, corn stalks, sorghum, or some other crop that is more efficient?
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saigon68 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 05:21 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. Follow the Money=== Thats why
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Tesha Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 08:10 AM
Response to Reply #4
42. Bingo. Archer Daniels Midland won't get rich from sawgrass ethanol. (NT)
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IronLionZion Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 06:40 PM
Response to Reply #3
12. Think about why we do anything
somebody somewhere is making money off of it. That's America.
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eowyn_of_rohan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 07:54 AM
Response to Reply #3
39. Didn't I see that done in a movie?
Back to the Future!
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pipoman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 02:39 PM
Response to Reply #39
45. Mother Earth News (the magazine who has advocated green living since way, way before it was cool)
has had many articles over the years about alternative fuels including alcohol distilled from trash.
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eowyn_of_rohan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 06:34 AM
Response to Reply #45
51. embarrassed...
as soon as I wrote that about seeing it in the movie I knew I sounded like an airhead.
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pipoman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 11:59 AM
Response to Reply #51
52. LOL, don't be embarrassed, this board needs levity, especially right now
and yes I do remember that scene in Back to the Future. That movie came out when I was in college so I didn't have the $ to go to the movies but have seen it many times since.
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damntexdem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 05:32 PM
Response to Original message
5. Even if it didn't, we should not be using food to make fuel.
That it is better should make use of grass a no-brainer.

Unfortunately, the no-brainers in charge push corn, because grass doesn't nave big corporate interests behind it.
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pattmarty Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 05:34 PM
Response to Original message
6. Gives you a better high too!!!!!!!!!
IT'S SATIRE FOLKS.
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lurky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 05:47 PM
Response to Original message
7. Food ethanol is suicide, cellulosic ethanol is brilliant.
Look at all the plant waste we have - wood chips, grass clippings, corn cobs. Combine that with crops like switchgrass, and we could be golden.

Too bad the corn lobby will never let it happen... :(
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lovuian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 08:17 PM
Response to Reply #7
30. Brilliant is right
I like it
take all that grass in the median of highways and use it for ethanol
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boricua79 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 05:51 PM
Response to Original message
8. hmmm...wouldn't this solve the dilemman of using food for energy sources?
Or is there a danger with the mass cultivation of non-edible grass?

Can DU's environmental experts post on this?
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diane in sf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 06:58 PM
Response to Reply #8
15. Goes back to succession farming. Farming grains in the arid parts of the
midwest and growing cattle is being somewhat replaced by running buffalo on native prairie grasses. The grasses don't require the chemical inputs and enrich the soil. The buffalo is grass-fed and offers healthier meat. Seems you could do grass harvesting in the fall when it is about to dry out then be covered with snow.

The prairies supported millions of buffalo in beautiful balance with nature for thousands of years before white people farmed it.
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pipoman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 10:39 PM
Response to Reply #15
31. Interesting theory
Edited on Thu Jan-10-08 10:40 PM by pipoman
but not happening. While buffalo production is up from 20 years ago, beef production goes up every year and isn't going away any time soon. The biggest problem with buffalo production from a producers standpoint is finding a consistent market willing to pay the difference in price because meat production is lower per animal than cattle, the buffalo require more acreage per animal, and live value of the animals keeps the price of the buffalo higher. True that the prairie where I have lived my whole life did sustain millions of buffalo. That was before the plains began efficiently sustaining millions of humans.

Not trying to argue mind you just not quite the way it really is.
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David Zephyr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 05:55 PM
Response to Original message
9. Wow! Marijuana makes better ethanol than corn does.
:hippie:
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IronLionZion Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 06:43 PM
Response to Reply #9
13. DUDE!!! We should make ethanol from grass, but smoke the corn! nt
Edited on Thu Jan-10-08 06:43 PM by IronLionZion
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FreeState Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 06:44 PM
Response to Reply #9
14. And Cord Dogs too! n/t
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OneSelf Donating Member (167 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 07:07 PM
Response to Original message
18. Don't step on the grass, Sam.
;-)
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ozone_man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 07:08 PM
Response to Original message
19. Al Gore in Inconvenient truth tells about that.
Switchgrass that is. I've got a few decorative switchgrass plantings in my back yard.
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dapper Donating Member (755 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 07:34 PM
Response to Original message
20. High Frucose Corn Syrup....
I know many people feel that Ethanol should not be made using "food"... just some food for thought... Sugar has been getting replaced by High Frucose Corn Syrup because of the tarriffs on sugar, HFCS ends up a cheaper alternative.

So... this engineered crap instead of Natural Sugar!?!?

I know there was a point here somewhere...
Maybe we should save the Corn and Sugar for our food, get rid of the HFCS and use switch blade grass for the ethanol!

Dap
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DLnyc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 07:37 PM
Response to Original message
21. Very interesting, but doesn't help that much with C02, as far as I know.
Edited on Thu Jan-10-08 07:38 PM by DLnyc
Combustion

Combustion of ethanol forms carbon dioxide and water:

C2H5OH + 3 O2 --> 2 CO2 + 3 H2O

from wiki:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethanol
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ozone_man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 08:07 PM
Response to Reply #21
24. But there is an uptake mechanism with biofuel.
Replanting the switchgrass takes back the CO2.

The biggest problem with fossil fuels, aside from it being a finite resource, is that there is no recapture mechanism, only release.
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DLnyc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 08:16 PM
Response to Reply #24
28. Okay, point well taken.
Although solar/wind generated power to eletric transportaion seems better (but harder to get to in the short run).
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ozone_man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 11:12 PM
Response to Reply #28
33. I like wind and solar best too.
I don't know a lot about Biofuels, but there are some that are much better than others. Switch grass is one of the better fuels I know of.

I think the most important thing now is to increase tremendously the amount of R$D in renewable energy technologies. The oil industry and politicians have fought that all the way. I think the next administration will be the one to change that.
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Traditional Liberal Donating Member (36 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 08:09 PM
Response to Reply #21
25. better than carbon neutral
Oh it makes a big difference for climate.

One, it grows massive root systems that sequester carbon the natural way. So just growing it pulls carbon out of the cycle and stores it under the surface. And two, the part you harvest and use merely stays in the carbon cycle. A user is not taking carbon from where it used to be stored (coal and petro deposits) and adding it to the troposphere.

Carbon neutral does not mean "does not use carbon." It means it nets out, and does not contribute to excess carbon in the carbon cycle.

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Thor_MN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 08:17 PM
Response to Reply #21
29. You have to consider where the carbon came from.
Edited on Thu Jan-10-08 08:20 PM by Thor_MN
If plants pulled it out of the air, putting it back into the air is a zero sum game(providing you use no fossil fuels in the production of the ethanol.)

Opposed to pulling fossil carbon out of the ground (oil, coal, natural gas) and releasing it to the atmosphere, ethanol derived from plant sources is very "Green".

Still, it is a crappy headline. Ethanol is Ethanol. You can say making it from grass is a better process, but the ethanol itself is the same.
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Auggie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 07:47 PM
Response to Original message
23. This is great news, but I wonder what the corn lobby will say
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Honeycombe8 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 08:09 PM
Response to Reply #23
26. They'll probably use various substances to make ethanol: sugar, corn, grass. nt
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JerseygirlCT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-10-08 08:09 PM
Response to Original message
27. I imagine that since it's native, it's also easier on the land, too? nt
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Historic NY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 03:12 AM
Response to Original message
36. Switching would help in lowering the price of food..........
and grass requires less extensive planting and harvesting mechanics.
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Seabiscuit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 08:00 AM
Response to Original message
40. Dude, the OP should have said "switchgrass" instead of "grass"
Edited on Fri Jan-11-08 08:02 AM by Seabiscuit
To us aging hippies, the word "grass" has only two meanings: the kind you walk on barefoot and the kind you smoke.

:hippie: :smoke:
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Roland99 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 08:08 AM
Response to Reply #40
41. Alas, I had to follow LBN rules.
;)

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0007 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 12:32 PM
Response to Reply #41
44. Dude!!
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0xDEADBEEF Donating Member (71 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 12:21 PM
Response to Original message
43. So Bush wasn't lying about Switchgrass?
You mean Bush was right, in his State of the Union Address a couple of years ago?

Aw man...I hate it when someone tells you the truth, when you're used to them lying about everything.

It's just like being lied to!
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sakabatou Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 06:57 PM
Response to Original message
47. Well yeah
I knew about this before the article came out.
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Jersey Ginny Donating Member (549 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-11-08 07:54 PM
Response to Original message
48. Excellent news. This will help the erosion/run off problems too
I hope that Switchgrass continues to be expanded, researched and found to be a positive source of clean energy.
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Didereaux Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 12:48 PM
Response to Original message
53. All well and good, but ADM(the Halliburton of agriculture) doesn't have a lock on it.
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rayofreason Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Jan-12-08 12:52 PM
Response to Original message
54. A positive development...
...but you still need cellulosic biorefineries and that technology is in its infancy. Fortunately DOE is funding a lot of research in this area.
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