Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

Venezuela protests Colombian troop "incursion"

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Latest Breaking News Donate to DU
 
Judi Lynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-17-08 06:26 PM
Original message
Venezuela protests Colombian troop "incursion"
Source: Reuters

Venezuela protests Colombian troop "incursion"
Sat May 17, 2008 7:08pm EDT

CARACAS (Reuters) - Venezuela accused 60 Colombian troops on Saturday of entering just inside its territory in what it said was a provocation by a warmongering government seeking to destabilize the region.

In an incident likely to stoke already high tensions between the two South American neighbors, Venezuela said the soldiers were intercepted 500 yards over the border and immediately made to return to the Colombian side.

Colombia did not immediately react to the accusation.

The alleged incursion occurred on Friday, a day after President Hugo Chavez vowed to review diplomatic and trade ties following an Interpol investigation that helped reinforce Colombian charges he supports Marxist guerrillas in Colombia.



Read more: http://www.reuters.com/article/worldNews/idUSN1734541020080517?rpc=401&
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
Judi Lynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-17-08 06:31 PM
Response to Original message
1. DU'ers have discussed some incursions in the past. One of the events
was serious enough that Uribe had to meet with Chavez and apologize to him in a meeting which lasted six hours.

Previous information discussed at D.U.:
The Venezuelan elite imports soldiers
by Marta Harnecker
May 23, 2004

~snip~
Since 'the conspiracies against Venezuela do not end with the capture of mercenaries in Caracas,' there must be many other infiltrators in other areas of the country; since this is not an isolated action, but one whose efforts to stop the process continue, one can reach but only one conclusion: it is necessary to prepare oneself for self-defense. This is why the President considered it opportune to take advantage of the occasion and to announce three strategic lines for defending the country. The most radical proposal was a call for the population to massively participate in the defense of the nation.

A week earlier, on the 9th of May, on the outskirts of Caracas, a paramilitary force was discovered, dressed in field uniforms. Later, more were found, raising the total to 130, leaving open the possibility that there are still more in the country. The three Colombian paramilitary leaders of the group are members of the Autonomous Self-Defense Forces (AUC) in Northern Santander state in Colombia.

Some of the captured Colombian fighters have a long history as members of paramilitary forces. Others are reservists of the Colombian army and yet others were specifically recruited for the task in Venezuela and were surely tricked. Among these there are several who are minors.

A colonel of the Venezuelan air force was also detained, as well as seven officers of the National Guard. Among those implicated in the plot is a group of civilians headed by the Cuban Roberto Alonso, creator of the 'guarimbas,'<1> and Gustavo Quintero Machado, a Venezuelan, both who are currently wanted by the Venezuelan justice system.

What the real objectives were is now being discussed. One of them could have been to steal weapons so as to then attack the Miraflores presidential palace and President Chavez himself.

The government denounced the existence of an international plot in which the governments of the United States and of Colombian would be involved. U.S. Ambassador Shapiro denied that his country had any participation in the incident. And the Colombian president, for his part, solidarized himself with the Venezuelan government, affirming that he supports its actions against the members of the irregular Colombian military group, which then caused Chavez to publicly announce that he was convinced that President Alvaro Uribe did not have anything to do with the plot, even though he insisted on leveling charges against a Colombian general by the name of Carreño.

Even though the oppositional media conducted a big campaign to minimize the issue, trying to accuse the government of having organized a montage, so as to have a pretext for taking forceful measures that would impede a confrontation at the voting booth, every day more evidence surfaces that confirm the official version.

The Colombian attorney general's office has evidence that proves that paramilitary fighters were recruited and then transported to Venezuela and that extreme right-wing groups infiltrated intelligence services in the border town of Cúcuta. The proof was shown on the news program 'The Independent Network.' The program broadcast some intercepted recordings of paramilitary soldiers in Cúcuta, in which the operations they carried out in Venezuelan territory are reviewed.
(snip)
http://www.zmag.org/content/showarticle.cfm?ItemID=5579

By the way, the recently removed head of Uribe's national security department has ADMITTED recently he knew of this. It was discussed fully here, over and over.



Colombian paramilitaries captured at a ranch owned by Cuban right-wing “exile” Roberto Alonso
January 25, 2005

The Granda Kidnapping Explodes
The US / Colombia Plot Against Venezuela
By JAMES PETRAS

A major diplomatic and political conflict has exploded between Colombia and Venezuela after the revelation of a Colombian government covert operation in Venezuela, involving the recruitment of Venezuelan military and security officers in the kidnapping of a Colombian leftist leader. Following an investigation by the Venezuelan Ministry of Interior and reports and testimony from journalists and other knowledgeable political observers it was determined that the highest echelons of the Colombian government, including President Uribe, planned and executed this onslaught on Venezuelan sovereignty.

Once direct Colombian involvement was established, the Venezuelan government demanded a public apology from the Colombian government while seeking a diplomatic solution by blaming Colombian Presidential advisers. The Colombian regime took the offensive, launching an aggressive defense of its involvement in the violation of Venezuelan sovereignty and, beyond that, seeking to establish in advance, under the rationale of "national security" the legitimacy of future acts of aggression. As a result President Chavez has recalled the Venezuelan Ambassador from Bogota, suspended all state-to-state commercial and political agreements pending an official state apology. In response the US Government gave unconditional support to Colombian violation of Venezuelan sovereignty and urged the Uribe regime to push the conflict further. What began as a diplomatic conflict over a specific incident has turned into a major, defining crises in US and Latin American political relations with potentially explosive military, economic and political consequences for the entire region.

In justifying the kidnapping of Rodrigo Granda, the Colombian leftist leader, the Uribe regime has promulgated a new foreign policy doctrine which echoes that of the Bush Administration: the right of unilateral intervention in any country in which the Colombian government perceives or claims is harboring or providing refuge to political adversaries (which the regime labels as "terrorists") which might threaten the security of the state. The Uribe doctrine of unilateral intervention echoes the preventive war speech, enunciated in late 2001 by President Bush. Clearly Uribe's action and pronouncement is profoundly influenced by the dominance that Washington exercises over the Uribe regime's policies through its extended $3 billion dollar military aid program and deep penetration of the entire political-defense apparatus.

Uribe's offensive military doctrine involves several major policy propositions:
1.) The right to violate any country's sovereignty, including the use of force and violence, directly or in cooperation with local mercenaries.

2.) The right to recruit and subvert military and security officials to serve the interests of the Colombian state.

3.) The right to allocate funds to bounty hunters or "third parties" to engage in illegal violent acts within a target country.

4.) The assertion of the supremacy of Colombian laws, decrees and policies over and against the sovereign laws of the intervened country
(snip)
http://www.counterpunch.org/petras01252005.html



More captured Colombian paramilitaries
Published on Monday, May 17,
by the Agence France Presse
Thousands Protest Colombian Paramilitary Presence in Venezuela
Chavez to Set up 'People's Militia'

President Hugo Chavez announced his government would establish "people's militias" to counter what he called foreign interference after an alleged coup plot by Colombian paramilitaries Caracas claims was financed by Washington.

Chavez also said he would boost the strength of Venezuela's armed forces as part of a new "anti-imperialist" phase for his government.

"Each and every Venezuelan man and woman must consider themselves a soldier," said Chavez.

"Let the organization of a popular and military orientation begin from today."

The president's announcement came a week after authorities arrested 88 people described as Colombian paramilitaries holed up on property belonging to a key opposition figure.
(snip/...)
http://www.commondreams.org/headlines04/0517-04.htm

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
12.30pm update

Colombian paramilitaries arrested in Venezuela

Jeremy Lennard and agencies
Monday May 10, 2004

Venezuelan police have arrested more than 70 Colombian paramilitary fighters who were allegedly plotting to strike against the government in Caracas, according to the country's president, Hugo Chávez.
Opposition leaders, however, were quick to dismiss the president's claim, calling the raids on a farm less than 10 miles from the capital a ruse to divert attention from their efforts to oust Mr Chávez in a recall vote.

During his weekly radio and TV broadcast, Hello Mr President, Mr Chávez said that 53 paramilitary fighters were arrested at the farm early on Sunday and another 24 were picked up after fleeing into the countryside.
The country's security forces were uncovering additional clues and searching for more suspects, he said, adding that the arrests were proof of a conspiracy against his government involving Cuban and Venezuelan exiles in Florida and neighbouring Colombia.
(snip/...)
http://www.guardian.co.uk/venezuela/story/0,,1213445,00.html



More captured Colombian paramilitaries
Three Venezuelan Officers and 27 Colombians Sentenced for Assassination Plot
A Venezuelan military court sentenced three Venezuelan military officers and 27 Colombians to two to nine years of prison for plotting an assault on Venezuela’s presidential palace and the assassination of President Hugo Chavez.Another 73 Colombians and 3 Venezuelan officers, who had also been suspected of participating in the plot, were freed after spending 17 months in prison.

118 Colombians were captured in May 2004 on a ranch just outside of Caracas, wearing Venezuelan military fatigues. Many of them appeared to be Colombian paramilitary fighters who had been recruited for a mission in Venezuela to attack the Chavez government and to kill the president. Six Venezuelan officers were also arrested in the course of the investigation.
Some of the Colombians were peasants who had been lured to come to Venezuela with the promise of jobs. Upon arriving, though, they were forced to engage in paramilitary training exercises and were forbidden to leave the ranch. 18 of the Colombians were released immediately after the capture and returned to Colombia because they were minors between 15 and 17 years. The ranch belongs to Roberto Alonso, a prominent Cuban-Venezuelan opposition activist. The highest level officer to be sentenced was General Ovidio Poggioli, who had been charged with military rebellion and was sentenced to 2 years and ten months of prison. The other two Venezuelan officers are Colonel Jesús Farias Rodríguez and Captain Rafael Farias Villasmil, who were each sentenced to nine years of prison. The 27 Colombians were each sentenced to six years prison.
When the group of Colombians were first arrested, many opposition leaders argued that the government had staged the arrests, in order to make the opposition look bad. They pointed out that no weapons were found with the paramilitary fighters and that the whole operation looked far too amateurish to have any chance of success. Also, it was argued that it is practically impossible to transport 120 Colombian paramilitary fighters undetected all the way from Colombia to Caracas, considering that there are numerous military control points along the way.
(snip)
http://www.voltairenet.org/article130297.html


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Peace Patriot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-17-08 07:00 PM
Response to Original message
2. Interpol did NOT "help reinforce" those charges! Jeez! The corporate news monopoly LIES!
"The alleged incursion occurred on Friday, a day after President Hugo Chavez vowed to review diplomatic and trade ties following an Interpol investigation that helped reinforce Colombian charges he supports Marxist guerrillas in Colombia." - Reuters

This is simply NOT TRUE. Interpol specifically disavowed ANY intention to authenticate the CONTENTS of the computer. They merely verified ownership. They hired non-Spanish speaking analysts to PREVENT any analysis--or even understanding--of the CONTENTS. They furthermore found that 48,055 files had been "accessed, created, modified or deleted" by the Colombian military BEFORE they gave the laptops to Interpol. This, and analysis by other groups of docs leaked by the Colombian fascists, bring ALL of these fascists' allegations into question. And the "deletions" are the most interesting part of it, in my opinion. For Raul Reyes may well had info and opinion on Uribe's death squad and drug trafficking crimes. Over 50 of his political cohorts, including his relatives, are under investigation, indicted or in jail for such crimes. And he himself is under investigation. (He is former Medellin Cartel; now Bush Cartel). Why would the Colombian military DELETE any files from these laptops?

----

"Using their forensic tools, they (the Interpol experts) found a total of 48,055 files for which the timestamps indicated that they had either been created, accessed, modified or deleted as a result of the direct access to the eight seized exhibits by Colombian authorities between the time of their seizure on 1 March 2008 and 3 March 2008 at 11:45 a.m."

http://www.ipsnews.net/news.asp?idnews=42391
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
judasdisney Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-17-08 11:10 PM
Response to Reply #2
4. Alvaro Uribe has Death Squads & Mass Graves. Chavez doesn't. Where's Interpol? Amnesty? HRW?
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Judi Lynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-18-08 12:08 AM
Response to Reply #4
5. One long squint at Yair Klein will leave you confounded over how the HELL he was allowed to wreak
Edited on Sun May-18-08 12:11 AM by Judi Lynn
the kind of havoc and calamity he's created all over the world. He trained death squads in Colombia, and supplied them with illegal weapons:
~snip~
In late April, Yair Klein was released from a Sierra Leone prison where he spent 16 months on charges that he was smuggling arms to rebels from the Revolutionary United Front (RUF).

Klein is a former lieutenant colonel in the Israeli Army. In the 1980s he established a paramilitary mercenary company called Spearhead Ltd. Through this company, Klein began providing arms and training to forces in South America.

In 1989, Klein, along with several other former Israeli officers, was charged by authorities in Colombia of providing paramilitary training and arms to drug lords running international cocaine cartels. He is also accused of training Mafia assassins whose targets have included Colombian politicians. Klein is also suspected of involvement in the explosion of a Colombian airliner in November 1989.

In 1991, Klein was convicted by an Israeli court of illegally exporting military arms and information to a Colombian group. He was fined $13,400. He has denied all charges.

In 1998, Klein was officially indicted in Colombia on charges of training paramilitary units in terror tactics in the late 1980s. He was allegedly one of four Israelis hired by the late drug trafficker Gonzalo Rodriguez Gacha, one of the Medellin cartel’s most violent bosses.

The evidence against him includes a training video that he used to instruct death squads in Colombia. The main leaders in the infamous Carlos Castano’s paramilitary groups were trained by Yair Klein.

Massacres, assassinations of politicians and other terror tactics now used by paramilitaries in Colombia were part of the instruction that Yair Klein gave in his training camps.

(interview follows)
http://www.democracynow.org/2000/6/1/who_is_israels_yair_klein_and

http://www.elpais.com.co/historico/ago292007/fotos-periodico2/COaAAGO29-07N1,photo01.JPG


Yair Klein
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Yair Klein (Hebrew: יאיר קליין‎; also known as Jair Klein) is an Israeli and a former lieutenant colonel in the Israeli army, who established a private mercenary company called Spearhead Ltd.

Through Spearhead Ltd, Klein provided arms and training to armed forces in South America.<1>

Klein and his company have been accused of training the death-squads of drug traffickers and right-wing militias in Colombia in the 1980s.<2>

Klein was convicted by judicial authorities in Colombia for training several members of Colombian paramilitary groups and the militias of drug traffickers such as Gonzalo Rodríguez Gacha and Pablo Escobar Gaviria in 1987.

Klein was convicted in 2001 by a Colombian court, and the Colombian government made unsuccessful attempts to obtain his extradition from Israel. In a 2007 interview with Caracol TV, Klein claimed that he was sent to Colombia by request of the National Police in order to train its members, and stated that he was willing to go back and help destroy the FARC guerrillas.

He also criticized the demobilization of the paramilitaries, saying it was "stupid" to do so while the guerrillas remained a threat. <3>

Yair Klein spent 16 months in a Sierra Leone prison between 1999 and 2000 on charges that he was smuggling arms to rebels from the Revolutionary United Front (RUF).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yair_Klein
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
judasdisney Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-18-08 05:20 PM
Response to Reply #5
10. Very helpful info, thanks. Looks like the Ruling Class is an organized International Front
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ronnie624 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-18-08 01:17 AM
Response to Reply #4
7. Jose Miguel Vivanco of HRW
Edited on Sun May-18-08 01:21 AM by ronnie624
has made clear in no uncertain terms that he supports U.S. policy in Latin America. Amnesty International is partial to including hearsay in their reports. Neither organization receives automatic credence from me. Just like any other source, their claims must be verified by other sources.

Your messages tell me that you are probably aware of these facts. I just wanted to say it out loud.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Judi Lynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-18-08 02:49 AM
Response to Reply #7
8. Jose Miguel Vivanco has expressed his belief the US should be able to plow tons of US taxpayers'
dollars into Venezuelan political parties, which is strictly against Venezuelan law, and, if the situation were reversed, would be TOTALLY AGAINST U.S. LAW. That's just not allowed here. NO other country would even begin to be allowed to get by with that crap here, yet Bush is stuffing our tax dollars into opposition anti-Chavez groups, stepping up their funding every passing year.

As has been explained, USAID and NED are doing the work now the CIA used to do. Doing it right out in the open, and they're all happy as clams.

Jose Miguel Vivanco couldn't be more satisfied with this arrangement and says so. If he's willing to look the other way for important laws like this in favor of the Bush administration, he's just not up to the ethics his job should demand.

A few wry observations pounded home in this article:

Venezuela: The Gang's All Here
by Alexander Cockburn
The Nation magazine, July 12, 2004

http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/South_America/Venezuela_Gang_Here.html

~~~~~~~~~~

Vivanco Wants Foreign Money in Venezuela Campaign

Posted by Al Giordano - July 15, 2004 at 11:52 pm Human Rights Watch "Americas Division" chief José Miguel Vivanco falls deeper down the slippery slope of anti-democracy lobbying now with his claim that foreign government funding of partisan electoral groups in Venezuela is okey-dokey by him.

First, a reality check and public service announcement for those who might not be familiar with United States campaign finance laws:

If you want to make a donation to the campaign of George W. Bush in the United States (we're not recommending it, for the record) and you go to Bush's website and click "donations" and you will find that, before you can give him money, you have to affirm:
"By clicking on this box I acknowledge that contributions from corporations and foreign nationals are prohibited."
Likewise, if you want to make a donation to the campaign of John Kerry in the United States (neither are we recommending this) go to Kerry's campaign website and click "contributions," and there you will have to affirm:
"I confirm that the following statements are true and accurate:

1. I am a United States citizen or a permanent resident alien...
Those who have violated these laws against foreign contributions have been prosecuted in the United States…More:
http://narcosphere.narconews.com/notebook/al-giordano/2004/07/vivanco-wants-foreign-money-venezuela-campaign


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
judasdisney Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-18-08 05:21 PM
Response to Reply #7
11. Thanks for bearing witness to these facts
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
bluesmail Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-17-08 10:01 PM
Response to Original message
3. Sounds like what happened to the forlorn
who got lured to Dubai looking for jobs. "Some of the Colombians were peasants who had been lured to Venezuela with the promise of JOBS. Upon arriving they were forced to engage in Paramilitary exercises." Not only does history repeat itself, it's with lightening speed.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Judi Lynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-18-08 01:01 AM
Response to Original message
6. In the meantime, the government of Venezuela has to contend with US-financed "rebels"
like this wealthy young clown who just was awarded a $500,000.00 prize by the Cato Institute on behalf of the mahvellous "Milton Friedman Liberty Prize!"
Grow Them Young, Pay Them Well - Anti-Chavistas, That Is
May 18, 2008 By Stephen Lendman

Who said crime doesn't pay? Read on.

The Washington-based Cato Institute is all about "Individual Liberty, Free Markets, and Peace," or so says its web site. It's been around since 1977 preaching limited government and free market religion with plenty of high-octane corporate funding for backing. It better have it for the award it presented on May 15. It was to a 23 year old fifth year Venezuelan law student at Universidad Catolica Andres Bello. Yon Goicoechea was the fourth recipient of the "Milton Friedman Liberty Prize" in the amount of $500,000. For what? What else. For serving the interests of capital back home and leading anti-Chavista protests.

Goicoechea is leader of Venezuela's "pro-democracy student movement" that in Cato's words "prevented Hugo Chavez's regime from seizing broad dictatorial powers in December 2007." The reference is to the narrow defeat of Venezuela's reform referendum last December. Goicoechea led student-organized street violence against Venezuela's democracy, but don't look for Cato to say that.
(snip)

His "non-violent advocacy" and "peaceful" protesting went like this - promoting class warfare; wanting Chavez toppled; and following CIA diktats to:

-- "take to the streets; protest with violent disruptive actions across the nation; create a climate of ungovernability; provoke a general uprising; isolate Chavez" internationally; destabilize the government; disrupt the constitutional process; sustain aggressive agitprop; build unity among the opposition; and end Chavismo and Bolivarianism so capital can get back in control.

Last year, Goicoechea responded by engaging in violent street clashes; targeting pro-Chavez students, police and the National Guard; smashing windows; turning over and setting cars alight; starting other fires; burning tires; throwing rocks and bottles; engaging in a shootout at Caracas' Central University; seeing Venezuela's business media report "peaceful, civic and democratic" students were attacked without provocation; and getting full US (and Cato) backing for all of the above.
More:
http://www.zcommunications.org/znet/viewArticle/17668


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Judi Lynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-18-08 04:49 PM
Response to Original message
9. Colombia denies Venezuelan claim that its troops crossed border
Colombia denies Venezuelan claim that its troops crossed border
By Toby Muse
ASSOCIATED PRESS

2:07 p.m. May 18, 2008

BOGOTA, Colombia – Colombia's defense minister on Sunday denied a Venezuelan claim that Colombian troops had crossed into that neighboring country.

“I've investigated and there was no incursion,” Defense Minister Juan Manuel Santos told Bogota-based Caracol radio. Rough terrain along the border would have “made it practically impossible for (the incursion) to have happened the way they say it happened,” he said.

But Venezuelan Information Minister Andres Izarra told Venezuelan state television that officials had photographs showing “a military incursion in our territory.”

Venezuela's foreign ministry sent Colombia a diplomatic note Saturday demanding an explanation for what it called an “illegal incursion” of 60 Colombian soldiers into Venezuela's western Apure state. The troops were found about 875 yards (800 meters) from the countries' shared border on Friday, the note claimed.

More:
http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/world/20080518-1407-colombia-venezuela.html



One of these figures is Colombian Defense Minister, Juan Miguel Santos.
I just can't remember which one it is!

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
ronnie624 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-19-08 09:49 AM
Response to Reply #9
13. Hmmm.... I pick the one on the right. n/t
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
cal04 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun May-18-08 11:27 PM
Response to Original message
12.  The US Dilemma Over Chavez
http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,1807217,00.html

(snip)
A second reason the U.S. may proceed with caution is the regional furor caused by the operation during which the laptops were captured: Colombia's incursion into Ecuador was backed by the U.S., but was branded a violation of international law by the Organization of American States, and prompted a regional diplomatic crisis that left Colombia and the U.S. isolated. As a result, much of the region feels the U.S. lacks the moral authority in this case to label Venezuela a terrorism sponsor. Even the Republican staff of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee, in a report issued last month headed up by the office of Indiana Senator Richard Lugar, advised the Bush Administration not to give Chavez the kind of anti-U.S. tool he uses so well to his favor. "If Venezuela is found to be complicit, the U.S. would be wise to allow for the regional dynamic to take its course," the report wrote. "If the U.S. reacts too strongly, attention will go from Venezuela's transgressions to yet another example of 'American intervention' and strong-arm tactics."

(snip)
And then there's the possibility, albeit remote in the eyes of many observers, that Chavez might be right - that the laptops themselves might not be authentic. Interpol chief Richard Noble said he was "absolutely certain" that the computers "came from a FARC terrorist camp." But technically, all that Interpol did in its examination of the computers was to confirm that they had not been messed with post-March 1; it wasn't asked to investigate Chavez's allegations that the computers had been planted by the Colombian military in the first place. "The intelligence is mistaken," Venezuelan Ambassador to the U.S. Bernardo Alvarez insisted to TIME. "The evidence is a patrana - a tall tale - more anti-Venezuela propaganda from Colombia and the U.S." And the computer data itself, though certainly incriminating if true, is still open to interpretation: How much of the alleged Venezuelan support discussed in the computer documents, for example, was what the FARC was requesting rather than what Venezuela was actually willing to give? There's no doubt that Chavez has some explaining to do about the documents, but there are also doubts he can exploit.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
crickets Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon May-19-08 05:00 PM
Response to Original message
14. Kick
:dem:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Judi Lynn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue May-20-08 01:00 PM
Response to Original message
15. It's stupid of Uribe's Defense Minister to claim this didn't happen, when they've got the name of
the leader of the group and the base from where they came, and their commanding officer, and the exact point at which they caught them.

How odd on Uribe's part to have his Defense Minister simply deny it, but it certainly falls within the range of predictable behavior you'd expect from this scum.
Venezuela Denounces Illegal Incursion of Colombian Troops
May 20th 2008, by Kiraz Janicke - Venezuelanalysis.com



Satellite photo of the zone with blue marking showing where Colombian troops were found (Google Maps).

Caracas, May 19, 2008 (venezuelanalysis.com) – Venezuelan Information Minister Andrés Izarra, confirmed that the government has proof of that sixty Colombian troops made an illegal military incursion into Venezuelan territory last Friday. “We have photos and other materials that demonstrate the military incursion into our territory,” Izarra assured on Sunday after Colombian Defense Minister Juan Manuel Santos, denied the claims.

“There was no incursion,” said Santos in comments broadcast on Colombian radio on Sunday. “I looked into it and they were not doing anything,” Santos said of the Colombian troops.

“It appears that Minister Santos is not well informed of what his troops are doing,” Izarra countered.

On Saturday Venezuelan Foreign Minister Nicolas Maduro denounced through an official note of protest to the Colombian government that sixty Colombian troops had illegally entered 800 meters into Venezuelan territory. The incursion occurred Friday, May 16, in the Los Bancos sector in the municipality of Páez in the border state of Apure.

Maduro said the group was under the command of Colombian Army Sub-lieutenant Jhonny Ocampo Jurado, from the Cubará Military Base in the Colombian department of Arauca. Once they were intercepted the Colombian troops were forced to leave Venezuelan soil immediately.

“The commission of 60 men from the Colombian Army, under the command of someone who identified himself as Sub-lieutenant Jhonny Ocampo Jurado, assigned to Special Battalion Energético and Vial No 1, General Juan José Negro Velasco, from the Cubará Military Base, in the department of Arauca, Colombia, was intercepted at the coordinates N - 07° 02' 12,5'' - W - 072° 02' 6,4'', 800 meters from the frontier line in Venezuelan territory and was required to leave immediately,” the communiqué read.
http://www.venezuelanalysis.com/news/3463
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Sun May 05th 2024, 07:52 AM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Latest Breaking News Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC