Convicted ex-diplomat: Sex with teens OK in foreign cultures

Source: Associated Press

Convicted ex-diplomat: Sex with teens OK in foreign cultures
By Associated Press
Thursday, July 10, 2008 - Added 4m ago

ALEXANDRIA, Va. - An ex-diplomat convicted of having sex with teenage girls in the Congo and Brazil and taping the encounters is asking a judge for leniency, claiming that cultural differences in those countries make sex with girls more acceptable.

Gons G. Nachman, 42, pleaded guilty in April to possessing child pornography after admitting that he had sex with 14- to 17-year-old girls while serving as a consular officer in Brazil and Congo and documenting the encounters in pictures and videos.

The judge has agreed to delay Nachman’s sentencing until Aug. 22 so that he can be examined by noted forensic psychologist Stanton Samenow. Defense attorney Stephen Stine said in court papers that a psychological examination might show that cultural differences led Nachman to believe that sexual contact with teenage girls was acceptable, and that should have an impact on what kind of sentence he receives.

Prosecutors rejected the notion that Nachman’s victims somehow deserve less protection because they were not born or raised in America.






Read more: http://www.bostonherald.com/news/national/general/view.bg?articleid=1106277

for child-rape I've heard yet.




How can a judge even entertain such a ridiculous motion?

When I was in Japan, some of them would regularly make trips to Thailand to have sex with underaged girls. At the time, it was perfectly legal to do so. A law was passed prohibiting it in the mid-90s. I cut out an article in Stars and Stripes about it and stuck it right in the face of one of the guys in my department who liked to make those little junkets.

and should have conducted himself in a manner befitting the mores and standards of this culture.

And the drug-addled warmongering racist didn't spend a night in jail over it, either.

Remember that other turd they busted in Thailand? John Mark Karr allegedly got the VIP treatment from the State Department and Homeland Security.

PS: A most hearty welcome to DU, Truth4Justice! Would that it were under better circumstances!

That's the slippery slope we go down when we take this argument too far about "respecting other cultures". It's one thing to admire foreign art, music, dance and food.

But when we are told to "respect" other cultures that abuse women, sexually molest children and ostracize other religions, then we are led down a dangerous path that contrdicts basic human rights.

Respect for other cultures is fine... *except* in cases where that culture has accepted practices like this... practices that are unfair and hurtful.

One of my fave feminist bloggers, Twisty Faster, did a brilliant post about "culture". Definitely worth a read.

Fuck Culture

"Culture, despite the hallucinations of those who yearn for a simpler, gentler time, isn't static and cannot be sustained unchanged. People like Fiji's assistant minister for culture and heritage who wish to mummify it for its own sake, presumably against the ravages of feminism or the homo agenda or the swarthy Muslims or global homogeneity, are suffering from nostalgia and delusion and xenophobia. We should look the other way when those quaint Saudi dudes stone their women to death. It's their culture!"

and:

"odds are those dear old traditions were oppressin' somebody. So fuck'em."

This is not a slippery-slope.

This is a wild tangent.

Are you exploiting another culture if you participate in it? While I think this is disgusting and he should have his rocks cut off, I can't follow what you are saying here.

http://www.internethaber.com/news_detail.php?id=137380&interstitial=true

From a search on Nachman:

Saturday, February 16, 2008
FSO Charged in U.S. District Court
There's bad news about a visas-for-sex scandal involving a U.S. Foreign Service Officer in Brazil. A variety of charges were unsealed against one Gons G. Nachman at the U.S. District Court in Alexandria today, and he is being held pending a hearing on Tuesday.

A quick Goggle search indicates that Gons Gutierrez Nachman is a samba dancing enthusiast ("I'm going to work in Brazil in May ... And, I think it's a wonderful way to introduce myself to the country") who also dabbled in amateur photography while stationed in the Congo from 2003 to 2005, where he took pictures of "displaced people," "traditional and modern Congolese dancers," and "children." He is probably the same Gons Gutierrez Nachman who was active in the University of Pennsylvania Naturist Student Association during the 90s.

http://skepticalbureaucrat.blogspot.com/2008/02/fso-charged-in-us-district-court.html

Link to Free Republic thread on Nachman:

http://oglobo.globo.com.nyud.net:8090/blogs/arquivos_upload/2007/03/138_1753-cemiterionapraia%20045.jpg

U.S. Diplomat Accused of Pressuring Visa Applicants for Sex
Fox News ^ | February 15, 2008 | AP

Posted on Saturday, February 16, 2008 10:12:25 AM by khnyny
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1971436/posts

~~~~~~~~~~
Covered here:

Blue_Tires (1000+ posts) Fri Feb-29-08 08:44 AM
Original message

New charges expected against diplomat in sex case
Source: The Associated Press (in the Virginian-Pilot)

ALEXANDRIA, Va. (AP) -- Prosecutors are planning to bring additional child pornography charges against a U.S. diplomat who allegedly pressured visa applicants for sex while stationed in Brazil.

Gons G. Nachman, 42, who has addresses in Alexandria and Washington, was arrested earlier this month and charged with possession of child pornography, misuse of his diplomatic passport and making false statements.

In court papers, prosecutor Ron Walutes said he expects a superseding indictment in early March that will add charges of producing child pornography - charges that carry a mandatory minimum sentence of 15 years, unlike mere possession charges which have a maximum of 10 years and no statutory minimum.

The child pornography charges stem from videos Nachman allegedly made of himself having sex with girls as young as 15 in Congo and Brazil, where he was stationed as a vice consul. According to the criminal complaint, Nachman required his maid to film and photograph the sex.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x3203923

Both William Irey (who was much worse) and Mark Foley got Republican only "Rehabilitation" (of their names I guess) and never saw the inside of a prison. Watch the judge use any excuse to bail him as well. Perhaps that is why there are so many of them.

William Irey sentenced to federal prison on sex charges
By Scott Beveridge
Staff writer

sbeveridge@observer-reporter.com

A former Monongahela man was sentenced Tuesday to 171/2 years in federal prison for having sex with young children overseas and then posting photos of the acts on the Internet.

William Irey, 50, of Orlando, also was sentenced to supervised release for life and cannot own a computer or subscribe to the Internet under the terms of his sentence in the U.S. Middle District of Florida. Irey was president of Frank Irey Construction Inc., a company that performed construction at Walt Disney World.

He was indicted in December 2006 after authorities seized a computer from his Orlando home and found it to contain numerous images of child pornography, court records show.

He pleaded guilty in July 2007 to one count of producing child pornography.

Irey is part of a prominent Washington County family. His late father, Frank, was chairman of the county's Republican party, and his sister-in-law, Diana L. Irey, is a county commissioner. His company also built Hong Kong Disneyland.

More:
http://www.observer-reporter.com/OR/Print/02_01_William_Irey_Sentenced



Another Republican hero.
Prominent Republicans 5,432 children 0
They do seem to squeak by, don't they?

Welcome to D.U.! :hi:

that young goats are ok too.x(

I don't believe this is even worth the judge's consideration. I'm disgusted with this case.

OMG! Dude, you are more screwed than the poor victims!

Under the jail with this creep.

if it's with an accepting culture :puke:

He's incapable of seeing that what he did was wrong.

The age of consent in Canada is 16.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ages_of_consent_in_North_America#Canada

Just thought I'd point that out. :)

I'm a 33 year old Californian. I could drive to Nevada, pick up a 16 year old in Reno, and legally have sex with her. The same act in California would get me arrested, imprisoned for at least 5 years, and registered as a sex offender for the rest of my life.

Funny thing is, I can have sex with that girl in Reno all I want, but if I take one photo I can be charged federally and again, spend many years in prison and be registered as a sex offender. Having sex with a minor is legal, but recording it isn't.

Yeah, our laws are convoluted.

imagine the situation of a diplomat from some tight-ass Muslim country coming over here and having an affair with someone of legal age, then going back to their homeland and being threatened with the death penalty, because adultery is a capital offense in that country. I sure would expect the diplomat to use the "when in Rome" defense, and I'd agree with him.

It's not hard to imagine US drug laws being applied to people coming back from Amsterdam with a micromolecular amount of marijuana in their systems, under the same logic.

difficult to know what this bloke's situation was. Was he paying them and were they actively working as prostitutes ?

What is the age of consent in these countries ! For instance Spain the age is 13 !! Germany 15 ??

I have no problem with people working as prostitutes although in third world countries they obviously get taken adavntage of..I hope if this was the case-at least he paid them well. I don't believe they were damaged-you are right -it's us in the west with basically a British puritan ethic that affects everything we do-from work to sex.

But it seems his main offence here is producing child pornography-the law is pretty well fixed the world over for this at age 18 !
And did they know he was filming them or did he do it covertly (which would be diabolical.)

PS: I don't think this guy send much of a message to anyone else in the world-George Bush is the one destroying the image of America !

that Gitmo is ok as is torture because "they are not americans"?
If so then its pretty interesting to read "Prosecutors rejected the notion that Nachman’s victims somehow deserve less protection because they were not born or raised in America.".

As far as the headline goes, the diplomat is right. The age of consent varies around the world, and most countries are far more tolerant of their teens engaging in sex than are repressed Puritanical Americans. The ages mentioned in the article, 14-17, run the gamut of borderline legal to completely legal, depending on the country and culture. There is no culture more anti-sexual than the one derived from the English and their far flung colonies. When one looks at the HotBird satellite, one can see channels advertising all sorts of sexual fantasies and adventures in German, Italian, Arabic, Turkish, French, and many others, but not a single one in English.

As far as recording his escapades on tape, that was kind of dumb and probably something the girls regret doing. I tend to think he was paying these girls and not relying on his virile attractiveness, which is not a problem, unless again, you are a repressed Puritanical American who has been taught over and over that prostitution is an evil crime. One has to remember that the Congo has a French cultural tradition and women exchanging sex for money and other favors is NOT A PROBLEM.

Is he a cad who took advantage of young girls in the countries he was stationed in? Undoubtedly. Are these girls going to be damaged for life as some hand-wringing American busybodies think? No. First off, the girls have not been polluted by American Puritanical attitudes and probably think of this as an interesting fling with a foreigner. If the girls are prostituting themselves for a living, well then, this one trick probably paid more than a dozen of the local men would.

Get over it. You like to say the government doesn't belong in the bedroom. That should go triple for bedrooms outside of the country.

:puke:

What the fuck does prostitution have to do with sexual repression? Expect possibly, for entitled sexist first world asswipes scared of the loss of the sexual access they have anywhere, anytime, either sex and any age. Must sound mighty repressing not to be able to get that young ass or mouth on demand.

We're talking exploitation, young girls and boys without choices. What a totally fucked thing to say.

For the sexually repressed, money for sex is a crime, an abomination, a transaction that is outside the narrow definition of being for the procreation of children within the confines of marriage.

People the world over exchange sex for money, status, favors, and yes, simple enjoyment. Get used to it, prude.

Just call everybody prude because they don't believe in buying human beings. That's called the slave trade. I've worked with hundreds of current and former prostitutes over the years. It's an ugly, sick world and I'll work to end it until the day I die.

consenting people of proper age (can't really use the word 'adults' here) doing whatever behind closed doors = fine...

taping and photographing said encounters = gray area...

trading visas for sex (allegedly) = very bad

asking the judge presiding over the case to marry him and one of the girls he met = extremely poor taste, and an indication that he is not taking this seriously at all...

using a plum position in the state department to play the role of a sex tourist (and amateur pornographer) on the taxpayers' dime = unprofessional at the least, and criminal at the worst...

14 year old girls having sex with 40 year old pervs for money is not a good thing. Ever.

In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right to a speedy and public trial, by an impartial jury of the state and district wherein the crime shall have been committed,

Did they had a jury full of people from the Congo or Brazil? They also have to hold the trial there. Unless he was stupid enough to do this at the embassy. Then he's squarely within American jurisdiction. If he took them to a hotel. Then he's on Brazilian soil and Brazilian law applies.

the guide wanted us to go to a bar where there were teenaged girls dancing topless. This would be illegal in the US. I am uncomfortable with the idea that a teenage girls first paying job is exposing her breasts in a bar... and I can't make the "these girls are different" leap. Their culture objectifies women even more than ours does. A couple of us didn't go but the rest did and enjoyed themselves.

One the one hand, I think juveniles should be protected from exploitation by adults, allowing for the fact that the change from one to the other is gradual, a decade long process. On the other hand, unless somebody is able and willing to provide for the food, clothing, shelter, and education of said juveniles, i.e. to take some responsibility for their economic well-being, then we ought to STFU and let them pursue their means of economic support. The notion that starvation is better than sexual exploitation is at least open to debate. Unless we are willing to take care of them, to accept responsibility, we ought not interfere. FWIW, I am 100% in favor of guaranteeing food, shelter, clothing and education as absolute and "inalienable" rights to every person on the planet. But if we are not willing to implement that sort of guarantee, we ought to let people decide for themselves whether to die for innocence and chastity or not.

and I'm sure they aren't doing it for fun. In one area there were children in boats holding animals-some with large birds, and one with a sloth. I started taking pictures and the guide yelled at me to stop because they would expect money for it, and it was wrong to encourage 8 and 10 year old kids to handle wild animals. But he had no problem with the teenaged girls dancing topless for money. The girls dancing frankly bothered me more than the children handling animals, but I can see there are a lot of angles to this.

Who is going to feed them? If you don't have an answer to that question, all the posturing about how they obtain food is somewhat hypocritical. But I'm not defending the status quo by any means, it think it's despicable.

Full of shit.