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sabra Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-21-09 10:28 PM
Original message
Harsh Tactics Readied (by Bush Admin officials) Before Their (Legal) Approval
Source: WP

Intelligence and military officials under the Bush administration began preparing to conduct harsh interrogations long before they were granted legal approval to use such methods -- and weeks before the CIA captured its first high-ranking terrorism suspect, Senate investigators have concluded.

Previously secret memos and interviews show CIA and Pentagon officials exploring ways to break Taliban and al-Qaeda detainees in early 2002, up to eight months before Justice Department lawyers approved the use of waterboarding and nine other harsh methods, investigators found.

The findings are contained in a Senate Armed Services Committee report scheduled for release today that also documents multiple warnings -- from legal and trained interrogation experts -- that the techniques could backfire and might violate U.S. and international law.

One Army lieutenant colonel who reviewed the program warned in 2002 that coercion "usually decreases the reliability of the information because the person will say whatever he believes will stop the pain," according to the Senate report. A second official, briefed on plans to use aggressive techniques on detainees, was quoted the same year as asking: "Wouldn't that be illegal?"

Read more: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/04/21/AR2009042104055.html
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Solly Mack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-21-09 10:28 PM
Response to Original message
1. K&R
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ixion Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-21-09 10:35 PM
Response to Original message
2. "Wouldn't that be illegal?"
Why, yes, yes it would.

May we PLEASE move on with frog-marching these war criminals to the Hague?

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stillcool Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-21-09 10:37 PM
Response to Original message
3. My favorite parts so far..
(U) On December 17, 2002, two weeks after the Secretary authorized the interrogation techniques for use at GTMO and with the Khatani interrogation underway, David Brant, the
NCIS Director informed Navy General Counsel Alberto Mora about recent objections raised by
CITF.825 The next day, Mr. Mora met with NCIS Chief Psychologist Dr. Michael Gelles, who
had been to GTMO and was familiar with the interrogation techniques in use there. Dr. Gelles
provided Mr. Mora excerpts ofinterrogation logs reflecting detainee mistreatment. Dismayed by
what he read and heard, Mr. Mora met with Steven Morello, the Army General Counsel, and for
the first time had the opportunity to review the October 11,2002 GTMO request, LTC Beaver's
legal analysis, and the Secretary of Defense's December 2, 2002 authorization of interrogation
techniques for use in GTMO interrogations, which included stress positions, removal ofclothing,
dogs, deprivation of light and auditory stimuli, 20 hour interrogations, forced grooming, and
grabbing, pushi~ and poking detainees. 826 Mr. Mora testified to the Committee: "hen I saw
the December 2 Rumsfeld memo, and then reviewed Lieutenant Colonel Beaver's legal
memorandum, when I saw that the memorandum was completely unbounded concerning the
limit ofabuse that could be applied to the detainees, I knew instantaneously ... that this was a
flawed policy based upon inadequate legal analysis.,,827



The following day, Mr. Mora briefed Navy Secretary Gordon England on the NCIS
report ofdetainee mistreatment and received authorization to meet with DoD General Counsel
Jim Haynes.828 That afternoon, Mr. Mora met with Mr. Haynes and advised him that in his view
"some ofthe authorized techniques could rise to the level oftorture.,,829 He recalled urging the
DoD General Counsel to "think. about the techniques more closely" questioning him "What did
'deprivation oflight and auditory stimuli' mean? Could a detainee be locked in a completely
dark cell? And for how long? A month? Longer? What precisely did the authority to exploit
phobias pennit? Could a detainee be held in a coffm? Could phobias be applied until madness
set in?,,8~O

814



IIIn his January 9,2003 memo, CDR Gallotta concluded:
Category III techniques that threaten death to the detainee or his family (#1) or
which create the misapprehension of suffocation (#3) would likely be judged to
constitute torture under the statute and customary intemationallaw. They reflect
conduct specifically defmed as torture in <18 U.S.C.> § 2340 and recognized as
torture in international law. Category III, technique #4, mild, non-injurious
grabbing and poking, is an assault under the UCMJ. Absent lawful purpose, these
techniques may be per se unlawful.
Category II techniques could also, depending in their implementation, i.e.,
frequency of use, degree ofpain inflicted, or combinations oftechniques, rise to a
level where they could be detennined to be torture.
Thus, additional analysis with
specific guidance for implementation is recommended.838
-------------------------------------
In the First Bybee memo, the OLe had asserted that "any effort
by Congress to regulate the interrogation ofbattlefield detainees would violate the Constitution's
sole vesting ofthe Commander-in-Chiefauthority in the President.,,932 In keeping with that
finding, the March 14, 2003 fmal OLC memo held that the power to detain and interrogate
enemy combatants arose out ofthe President's constitutional authority as Commander in
Chief. 933 "In wartime," according to the memo, "it is for the president alone to decide what
methods to use to best prevail against the enemy
.,,934
(U) In the March 14, 2003 final opinion, the OLC used its broad reading ofthe
Commander-in-Chiefauthority to conclude that "even if' federal criminal statutes "were
misconstrued to apply" to interrogations, the "Department ofJustice could not enforce this law
or any ofthe other criminal statutes.,,935 According to the OLC, "ven ifan
interrogation method arguably were to violate a criminal statute; the Justice Department could
not bring prosecution because the statute would be unconstitutional as applied in this
context.
,,93
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givemebackmycountry Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-21-09 10:42 PM
Response to Original message
4. Drip, Drip, Drip....
Soon we will see the flood gates open my friends.

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bleever Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-21-09 10:54 PM
Response to Original message
5. Washington Post, no less.
K&R.
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Snazzy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-21-09 11:09 PM
Response to Original message
6. holy crap
Edited on Wed Apr-22-09 12:01 AM by Snazzy
From article:

By late 2001, counterterrorism officials were becoming frustrated by the paucity of useful leads coming from interrogations -- a meager showing that was linked, according to one Army major, to interrogators' insistence on "establishing a link between al-Qaeda and Iraq," the report said.

....

--------

Now that's a smoking gun if I saw one. Uh, motive.



http://www.flickr.com/photos/66726692@N00/100545349/

"2:40
Resume Statement:

Best info fast
judge whether good enough
Hit S.H@ same time -
Not just UBL

Tasks Jim Haynes to talk w/ PW
for additional support v/v Usis &
connection w/ UBL



- Hard to get a good case

- Need to move swiftly -

Near term target needs -
- go massive - sweep it all up
- Things related & not


Need to do so
to get anything
useful"

----------

and fast forward:


Rumsfeld okayed abuses says former US army general
25 Nov 2006 15:58:24 GMT
Source: Reuters

MADRID, Nov 25 (Reuters) - Outgoing U.S. Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld authorised the mistreatment of detainees at Abu Ghraib prison in Iraq, the prison's former U.S. commander said in an interview on Saturday.

Former U.S. Army Brigadier General Janis Karpinski told Spain's El Pais newspaper she had seen a letter apparently signed by Rumsfeld which allowed civilian contractors to use techniques such as sleep deprivation during interrogation.

....

http://www.alertnet.org/thenews/newsdesk/L25726413.htm

------------

Edit to add the whole ball of wax, recounted here for example:

Posted on Thu, Jun. 05, 2008
Senate committee: Bush knew Iraq claims weren't true
Jonathan S. Landay | McClatchy Newspapers

last updated: June 05, 2008 08:27:55 PM

WASHINGTON — President Bush, Vice President Dick Cheney and other top officials promoted the invasion of Iraq with public statements that weren't supported by intelligence or that concealed differences among intelligence agencies, the Senate Intelligence Committee said on Thursday in a report that was delayed by bitter partisan infighting.

...

The Senate report, the first official examination of whether top officials knew that their public statements were unsubstantiated when they made them, reviewed five speeches by Bush, Cheney and former Secretary of State Colin Powell between August 2002 and February 2003. It also dissected key statements made by them and other top officials, including Rumsfeld and then-national security adviser Condoleezza Rice.

The committee found that the administration's warnings that former dictator Saddam Hussein was in league with Osama bin Laden, a highly inflammatory assertion in the wake of the Sept. 11, 2001, al Qaida attacks, weren't substantiated by U.S. intelligence reports. In fact, it said, U.S. intelligence agencies were telling the White House that while there'd been sporadic contacts over a decade, there was no operational cooperation between Iraq and al Qaida, the report said.

The administration's repeated statements "suggesting that Iraq and al Qaida had a partnership, or that Iraq had provided al Qaida with weapons training, were not substantiated by intelligence," it said.

Contentions by Bush and Cheney that Saddam had to be removed because he could give terrorists weapons of mass destruction to strike the United States were "contradicted by available intelligence information" that found that the late Iraqi dictator was unlikely to make such transfers, the report said.

Cheney's assertions that Mohammad Atta, the chief Sept. 11 hijacker, had met months before the attack with an Iraqi intelligence officer in the Czech capital, Prague, were also unsubstantiated, the inquiry found.

....

http://www.mcclatchydc.com/227/v-print/story/39963.html

So, torture them to get to a 9/11 link to Saddam was the plan. Torture and the faulty intel it provides could be used to make the connection to Iraq they wanted that would conform to their (PNAC) worldview, like we saw them do on so many other occasions. Curveball/Chalabi whoever says it and they tortured to confirm it.

Next question: did info from torture sessions get fed to Congress before IWR?

(sorry multiple edits, blown away I missed the motive before. Thought they were just sadistic creeps).
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Snazzy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-22-09 12:12 AM
Response to Reply #6
8. wow, McClatchy's story on this
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SurfingScientist Donating Member (237 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Apr-21-09 11:12 PM
Response to Original message
7. tick... tick... tick... !!! k&r!!!
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Norquist Nemesis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-22-09 12:15 AM
Response to Original message
9. Well, duh! Make the plan then have the lackey's make it seem legal.
Par for the course with the Bush mafia.
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ConcernedCanuk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-22-09 12:22 AM
Response to Original message
10. USA tortured, and invaded illegally. The whole World knows it.
Edited on Wed Apr-22-09 12:23 AM by ConcernedCanuk
.
.

We are just waiting for those responsible to be punished.

The "superpower" loses face every day it delays,

it's that simple IMO

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Mnemosyne Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-22-09 09:27 AM
Response to Original message
11. War criminals. knr n/t
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