The brutal truth about America’s healthcare

Source: The Independent (UK)

An extraordinary report from Guy Adams in Los Angeles at the music arena that has been turned into a makeshift medical centre

Saturday, 15 August 2009

They came in their thousands, queuing through the night to secure one of the coveted wristbands offering entry into a strange parallel universe where medical care is a free and basic right and not an expensive luxury. Some of these Americans had walked miles simply to have their blood pressure checked, some had slept in their cars in the hope of getting an eye-test or a mammogram, others had brought their children for immunisations that could end up saving their life.

In the week that Britain's National Health Service was held aloft by Republicans as an "evil and Orwellian" example of everything that is wrong with free healthcare, these extraordinary scenes in Inglewood, California yesterday provided a sobering reminder of exactly why President Barack Obama is trying to reform the US system.

The LA Forum, the arena that once hosted sell-out Madonna concerts, has been transformed – for eight days only – into a vast field hospital. In America, the offer of free healthcare is so rare, that news of the magical medical kingdom spread rapidly and long lines of prospective patients snaked around the venue for the chance of getting everyday treatments that many British people take for granted.

In the first two days, more than 1,500 men, women and children received free treatments worth $503,000 (£304,000). Thirty dentists pulled 471 teeth; 320 people were given standard issue spectacles; 80 had mammograms; dozens more had acupuncture, or saw kidney specialists. By the time the makeshift medical centre leaves town on Tuesday, staff expect to have dispensed $2m worth of treatments to 10,000 patients.

Read more: http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/the-brutal-truth-about-americarsquos-healthcare-1772580.html

---

As I've said before, there should be a TV reality show made about these guys and the wonderful work they do. Also, President Obama should be there right now making an 0fficial visit to highlight the need for reform. Surely he must know about this event in LA?


The LA Forum in Inglewood, California, hosted dental and medical examinations, for
thousands of people thanks to the charity Remote Area Medical.


Some people waited for 36 hours to see the medical staff

Remote Area Medical Are also featured in these videos:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=385x354298">3rd World Country? Nope - This is the sad state of health care in Los Angeles

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=385x351050">In Rural Virginia, Relief is Rare for Uninsured

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=385x349255">Fault Lines: The Battle To Transform Health Care In The US

Or Rush Limbo?

I hope some DUer sends this article to Rachel and Keith.

Hekate

One first must have a sense of morality and a sense of duty to the community to be ashamed.

...population should be ashamed of the other half.

I told them: "We Are"

In their minds, there are worthy humans and subhumans/animals. The subhumans/animals have no value (other than chattel/slaves), no feelings, no needs, no morals (as if THEY had any morals, hah), no control, no "humanity" and therefore they fake their suffering, should be grateful for the smallest bone they are thrown, and deserve everything they get.

...then its a different story.

although they don't think they will ever be in need and if, by some horrible circumstance, they are in need, THEY are worthy ... because, remember, they are the humans, not the sub-human/animals. Government is here to protect their exalted position above the hoi polloi and to help them cement their power. They swore fealty to a central government in exchange for the government confirming their superiority and ownership of land, resources, and people.

Nothing should stand in the way of these people receiving healthcare. Obama should do a live satellite feed so as not to inconvenience the proceedings.

Don't forget the attention factor. Not even FOX News would be able to ignore this if President Obama went to it in person. It would be the perfect way to assure universal health care would be enacted and in the long run would save many millions of lives. Many millions more than who are there now. And these people will all get their turn.

If there are offended Teabaggers outside they should also get plenty of coverage.

"If the mountain won't come to Mohamed, Mohamed will go to the mountain."

As the corporate media; don't seem to have any motivation to cover these real life dramas with the same journalistic enthusiasm they use in approaching lesser or synthetic stories, a health rescue clinic press conference might be what it takes to punch their ticket.

just as the GOP is doing with their NRA/"pro-life" murderers -- and fake health care

protesters!

but supports keeping the companies who are blocking people's access to health care should remain a big part of the system.

It is very sad that, as an American living in Britain, I am experiencing the wonders of Public Option without the fear of paying huge bills. I just had my daily checkup with my GP and the only correspondence I got was a letter telling me my checkup went well.

In America, it's pretty much the same except I get a bill alongside that.

I just watched Newsnight last night and I was extremely disappointed with both the Labour and Conservative representatives. This is the one issue I think all the political parties should unite and try to defend in America (after that idiot Daniel Hannan spouted his idiotic views on Fox news). The Labour guy was all smug and kept trying to place the blame on Cameron (Hannan is a Tory MEP) and putting a political slant on it and not trying to defend the NHS.

The Tory guy was nearly there until he said that America had the best health care there is. I told my husband, "The best health care, yes, IF you can afford it!"

The best health care, yes, IF you can afford it!

Those who are against the change seem to not care if we cannot afford it. We obviously don't deserve to be alive - or at least we don't deserve to be alive in this country. However, who are they going to turn to to do their bidding when we're all dead?

:fistbump:

Undermining people's government and social programs -- unions, etal --

Any DUers fancy taking their gloves off over there?

these freeps sure aren't readers of The Independent.

I am a musician who has traveled all over the world for thirty years. In 1990 in England I had a tooth break. I went to a dentist in Brighton, UK and was seen right away and it was repaired that afternoon at no cost. Great health care. In 1993 I was in Montreal, Canada and had a cyst on my lip. I went to Queen Elizabeth Hospital and explained my situation. The doctor on duty saw me right then and there and removed the cyst. No charge. It took less than an hour. In 1997 I was living in Athens,Georgia and had health insurance with an HMO. I strained my prostate. The Urologist misdiagnosed me twice so I went to a different urologist. The HMO considered it an "out of service" procedure and refused to pay even though their Urologist misdiagnosed me twice. I paid $2000 even though I had insurance. Recently (2008) I had a toothache. I needed a root canal. I have insurance with a $1500 dental limit. I ended up paying $1200 out of pocket as the crown was a total of $2700. Something not mentioned in all the debating is how the cost of health insurance in the US is basically an extension of their tax rate. If a family of 2 adults and 4 kids pay $500 a month for health insurance that has caps and copays then they pay about $8000 a year if they have basic health procedures done. In England the tax rate is slightly higher but at least they are guaranteed care at no cost. In the US if you have a serious health issue ,and eventually everyone will, it breaks you financially all at once. The reason the middle class is going broke is because they can't afford to pay when the cows finally come home. Those ranting on this message board about losing their country, socialism, immigration and such are what are known in the US as right wing Freepers. They gather at a place called Freerepublic.com They are racists, anti abortionists, anti stem cell research, Psuedo freaky "christian" types who believe President Obama is not a legal US president. They are "Freeping" this thread in large numbers. They want to derail the presidents health care plans. They were all cheerleading for the 1 trillion dollar hole in the desert that was the illegal, immoral Iraq war in which 1 million people died. They put Bush in power and drained the US economy for the last 8 years. Their guy Bush destroyed what was left of the US economy with his bank bailouts/daylight robbery. They lost the 2008 election (thanks to Bush/Cheney) and now they are very upset. They are not screaming about healthcare really. They are screaming because, like a pedantic child, they want their toy back. They acted like spoilt children, the toy was taken away and now they demand it back. Don't give it to them America. They stand in the way of progress. The are against stem cell research. Against tolerance and equal rights. Against change and true free thinking. They profess to be christians yet vote for war. They are the real problem. Sadly they continue to vote against their own best interests as the insurance companies, oil companies and pharmaceutical companies bleed them dry. The southern states are the least educated states by the way. They consistently wave their flags and continue to stay dumbed down and broke. America needs change if it wants to truly have respect in the world. The great capitalist experimment that is the US is failing as it's going right now. Due to ignorance and a dumbed down population. In capitalism the cream isn't rising to the top. The crud is. Hence the messed up media, the bad music, the monopoly utilities, the expensive unreliable healthcare, the inability to get mediacations out of country, the lying about the cause for war, CIA rendition and torture, the tolerated killing of abortion doctors by the right wing, violent uneducated under payed police who taser at any opportunity. Leading this charge is Fox "News" and Freerepublic and Rush Limbaugh. Reject them America if you want to truly be good.

Now come on DU who's with me.

Thanks for sharing your experiences with health care in other countries and the comparison. We need more of those stories to he heard.

This story about the people lining up all night to recieve needed medical services in the richest country in the world, cries out for more coverage by the media. It should be getting equal time as the Town Hall specticals, but I guess that's not realistic in a country where entertainment is more valued than real news and profits are more valued than real people.

:puke:

"Land of the Greedy, Home of the Gullible" and apparently we like it this way. x(

Yeah, right. Keep telling yourselves that, morans.
:puke: :puke: :puke:

does that mean that the people in the UK or Canada or many other coutries aren't free? Only in aMerika we're free?

"I'm proud to be a Canadian, where at least my healthcare is free!" (I know... they do pay taxes for it.)

Dutch, Belgians, French, Germans, British, Irish, Italians, Canadians, etc, etc, etc, because they're not free. Only Murkans have freedom.

Schoolkids sing this shit at school programs (my husband went to a neighborhood kid's program and witnessed it firsthand - yet another one of the reasons I'm glad we homeschooled for so many years... See also Tom Paxton's "What Did You Learn in School Today" for my feelings on the subject)

:puke: :puke: :puke:

indoctrination at its worst. I will check it out.

Thanks for the post!

...most Repugs would take one look - if any at all - and say, tough. They made their own choices and failed...it's not my responsibility to bail them out of their misery...if they die, they die. Yep, that's pretty much the attitude. What I pray is that there will never again be enough of them to elect a majority in any of the houses - the HR, the Senate or the White.

Of course when one of them 'hits the skids' their tune changes pretty quick.

or some other country with universal healthcare, they would be sure to use them to condemn the evils of "socialized medicine."

We are with you. Fully aware of what's at stake if meaningful health care reform does not happen. I'm suspecting those who are raging against change will, if they succeed, soon realize what they've done to themselves. Too bad they won't be able to afford the medical care they'll need for that shot in their own foot.

Peace.

1. "They're all illegal immigrants."

2. "Look how overweight they are. I bet most of them smoke, too."

3. "They should get better jobs."

4. "They shouldn't have kids if they can't afford them."

5. "I hope they're not providing abortions."

6. "Free drugs for the addicts, woohoo!"

How do I know this? I've been fighting on my local paper's website under a different name for several months.

I bet ya there's some freepers in that crowd to.

If you can't pull yourself up from the gutter, by yourself, with no assistance and no complaint - all the while maintaining the highest standards of morality (Christian) and integrity (Capitalist based) - you are of no worth and deserve nothing but scorn and a kick in the teeth.

Mark Twain summed it up best:

--------------------
The man lived in Philadelphia who, when young and poor, entered a bank, and says he: “Please, sir, don’t you want a boy?” And the stately personage said: “No, little boy, I don’t want a little boy.” The little boy, whose heart was too full for utterance, chewing a piece of licorice stick he had bought with a cent stolen from his good and pious aunt, with sobs plainly audible, and with great globules of water rolling down his cheeks, glided silently down the marble steps of the bank. Bending his noble form, the bank man dodged behind a door, for he thought the little boy was going to shy a stone at him. But the little boy picked up something, and stuck it in his poor but ragged jacket. “Come here, little boy,” and the little boy did come here; and the bank man said: “Lo, what pickest thou up?” And he answered and replied: “A pin.” And the bank man said: “Little boy, are you good?” and he said he was. And the bank man said: “How do you vote?”—“excuse me, do you go to Sunday school?” and he said he did. Then the bank man took down a pen made of pure gold, and flowing with pure ink, and he wrote on a piece of paper, “St. Peter”; and he asked the little boy what it stood for, and he said “Salt Peter.” Then the bankman said it meant “Saint Peter.” The little boy said: “Oh!”

Then the bank man took the little boy to his bosom, and the little boy said, “Oh!” again, for he squeezed him. Then the bank man took the little boy into partnership, and gave him half the profits and all the capital, and he married the bank man’s daughter, and now all he has is all his, and all his own too.

My uncle told me this story, and I spent six weeks in picking up pins in front of a bank. I expected the bank man would call me in and say: “Little boy, are you good?” and I was going to say “Yes;” and when he asked me what “St. John” stood for, I was going to say “Salt John.” But the bank man wasn’t anxious to have a partner, and I guess the daughter was a son, for one day says he to me: “Little boy, what’s that you’re picking up?” Says I, awful meekly, “Pins.” Says he: “Let’s see ‘em.” And he took ’em, and I took off my cap, all ready to go in the bank, and become a partner, and marry his daughter. But I didn’t get an invitation. He said: “Those pins belong to the bank, and if I catch you hanging around here any more I’ll set the dog on you!” Then I left, and the mean old fellow kept the pins. Such is life as I find it.

Source:
Mark Twain, “Poor Little Stephen Girard,” in Carleton’s Popular Readings, Anna Randall-Diehl, ed., (New York, 1879), 183–84.

sadly.

..." and you need that more than health care of some such nonsense. His/Her thinking is that we need food and water more than we need health care and we pay for that, we should pay for health care because we need it less? Poster also claims we have the "BEST" care in the world and that we can't use life expectancy because we have so much more violent crime here. Apparently, that has nothing to do with "health".

What it all comes down to for these self-centered morans is that they don't want people they don't like getting care on their nickel. As you can guess, that means poor, black, homeless, immigrant, (fill in blank) people. They don't realize they are already paying for this...through their stupid insurance plans and the excessive rates charged by health care organizations to pay for all this crisis care in the Emergency Room.

Damnit I want single payer.

that the USA is the only developed country which puts commercial interests above the health of its population.

Just plain unbelievable.x(

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

Thanks!

pnorman

This makes me cry.

Why isn't the US media covering this? Is it not interesting enough for them because there is no confrontation? Perhaps these people patiently waiting in line for free care should be getting in to fist fights and shouting so it would be deemed newsworthy. That's sarcasm for those who can't tell. I don't advocate violence although perhaps we'd have a lot more luck getting true health care reform in this country if the uninsured took to the streets. Instead we have the comfortably insured ("I got mine, tough luck on you") people showing up at town halls with their metaphorical pitchforks and torches. I don't like relying on intimidation, but maybe our country would be better off if our elected officials feared their constituents more than lobbyists.

Are these people are seen as "wretched refuse" and we no longer believe the poem inscribed within the pedestal of lady liberty? Do too many Americans think these people "yearning to breathe free" are all illegal aliens, or otherwise somehow "deserving" of their fate for not working hard enough?

Excuse me, I think I have to throw up.

He was fantastic and needs to become a spokesman for reform; the WH need to tap into it. To CNN's credit it was a good piece.

Here's a bit more about RAM (Remote Area Medicine) and Stan Brock:

http://bringthehope.typepad.com/bring_the_hope/2008/07/stan-brock-brin.html

The media has been covering the town hall protests almost non-stop. They need to cover the plight of the uninsured that much too.

yesterday - I think it was The Today Show. I doubt Fux News would feature it:)

Oddly enough we were flipping channels and caught a story on it on the local news.

One good quote from someone who worked there said something like "It's just as bad as the third world countries I've seen."

I don't watch the news much but I doubt it was as plastered on the msm as it should have been. Heck, it took two or three days after the local news picked it up for it to appear here on DU.

Anyway, as someone who has no insurance and has plenty of health problems I kinda wish I were in CA but considering the amount of people who showed up I probably would have been wasting my time. They said they had to turn away a lot.

Why at the very same time these people are lining up for care are we making huge concessions to the industry that willingly caused this, giving up medicare for all.
These people could set up anywhere in this country and get thousands with no access to care.

The majority of people want medicare for all- 58% despite the 24/7 three decade long corporate propaganda campaign to convince us otherwise.

The majority of people do not like nor want to keep their insurance co. The majority of people are working class and they are getting screwed.

The majority of americans are not interested in what the elites describe as a "uniquely american system" which is unique only in that it allows for profit insurance corporations to control access to care.

I don't want a pony, I don't want perfect, I want fair.

Leaving the very same industry that has killed over a million americans in the last 4 decades and caused the tragic situation in these pictures, in the drivers seat is not reform and will lead nowhere except longer lines at these kinds of events in the future.

CORPORATE OWNED/CONTROLLED MEDIA showcases. We are being screwed over by the loud-mouthed minority and the so called 'librul' media. AGAIN! ALWAYS!

Would they see it any different if those people had been lining up for food?

caused too much commotion and disrupted the proceeding. Where were your representatives? Where was the Sec Of Health, Ed and Welfare? How about a satellite feed just to personally thank the health care professionals and other volunteers donating their time? How about just fucking acknowledging the existence of these people?

President Obama I think you're punking us. I think YOU know we will get health insurance "reform" that will be meaningless. The insurance companies will be able to continue making obscene profits at will. Congress (both sides) will be able to claim "victory". You will be able to say you have achieved something no other President has done in over 40 years so you deserve another term. You and your family will have a guaranteed lifetime income, lifetime personal protection and LIFETIME HEALTH CARE all at the expense of the people you couldn't even acknowledge.


No Mr. President, you have got to do better than this.

:applause:

SOMEONE representing the Obama administration should have been there. They need to use footage and info about this in the townhalls. The Dems are really missing the boat on this one.

They might be friends to Max and Barack and their Beltway world, but the Insurance Companies and Drug Companies did this to our country, and it is worse than a violent attack could ever be. But what do Max and Barack care? This is Inglewood, home of the poor. And the poor do not matter to them at all, they are instructed by their brand of 'faith' that the way to help the poor is to starve them and make them pay for premiums they can not afford, and fine them if they can not pay up to your paymasters. God is in the mix, defend that marriage, piss on the least of these!

...but the Insurance Companies and Drug Companies did this to our country, and it is worse than a violent attack could ever be. :thumbsup:

President Obama--I just love typing that--should visit this clinic.

Want to hear something even sadder than this: In Wise County Virginia they hold an Annual Free Clinic like this. The patients are seen in animal stalls at the county fairgrounds.

a$$hole$ who control our health care system.

In the greatest country on earth, the richest by far, and our citizens have to line the streets to get medical care.

30 years of Reagonomics and de-regulation, wars in Iraq and Afghanistan and the ever popular war on terra, the bailout and the stimulus.

Legs!

:kick:

Forwarded the link to multiple skeptical friends.

Thanks,

Healthcare compared

Health spending as a share of GDP

US 16%

UK 8.4%

Public spending on healthcare (% of total spending on healthcare)

US 45%

UK 82%

Health spending per head

US $7,290

UK $2,992

Practising physicians (per 1,000 people)

US 2.4

UK 2.5

Nurses (per 1,000 people)

US 10.6

UK 10.0

Acute care hospital beds (per 1,000 people)

US 2.7

UK 2.6

Life expectancy:

US 78

UK 80

Infant mortality (per 1,000 live births)

US 6.7

UK 4.8

Source: WHO/OECD Health Data 2009

And that is all that matters. x(

really rich people who own really wealthy companies get to dispense health care. Oh wait. Still reading....

It doesn't say that at all.

How sad that all those screaming about the Constitution, have no clue.

I don't even consider them human anymore. They're a lower life form like flies or cockroaches.

just die. The greedy, selfish bastards have no interest in anyone but themselves, and they aren't shy about saying so.

Give us your tired, your poor by Raymond A. Foss

The hope of America, in the words of liberty
the hope of a new life, in freedom
“Give us your tired, your poor,
your huddled masses, yearning…”

All of them, praying, hoping,
for the abundance of freedom
freedom from want, from oppression
from tyranny of all kinds

That we would be for the world that same beacon
that we would offer that refuge
that land of opportunity
this land of plenty

No one should be hungry,
in this connected world,
none should have that fear of starvation,
of privation any longer

The storehouses should be emptied
hope given in the bread, the water
the essentials of life given
out of our bounty

None should know hunger, poverty
all should give, and all should receive
so all will never know need again
On this day, this is my prayer.

true, I don't watch all day and nite, but what I did watch, nary a mention.

CNN constantly repeats the other crap they propagate.

It's all part of corporate America's health care companies scheme to preserve their cash cow. Those people screaming at the Town Halls have insurance and greedily just don't care about the unfortunate 50 million Americans who don't.

Obama should be prepared to ask them...Do you have insurance? Have you used it and are you happy with it? Do you care that 50 million Americans are uninsured?

as the wingnut mobs are getting.

I have to agree with all who have posted asking "where is the President on this? Where is Secretary Sebelius? Where is the media spotlight that only the President and his advisors can generate?"

The failure to effectively use an example that is this visual and this massive is an indication of the true commitment of the Obama administration to getting a meaningful health insurance reform bill through Congress. And it's sickening.

Recommend highly.

that they are not seriously interested in meaningful healthcare reform.

Fucking sellouts. I am disgusted (but I guess not really surprised). :banghead: :banghead:

They make me ashamed to be an American.

I think we pay too much attention to these Republican goons and by doing so give them credibility. Most of what I hear about on radio is what they are doing not what we should be doing. Ignore them and they will fade. I think I felt the earth move a little this week when a bunch of activist stopped
a foreclosure eviction and got the bank to renegotiate. Removed the sheriffs locks and held our ground. So we need to keep pressure on congress. I'm convinced the whole thing is just a rearguard action by skirmishing troops while the fat cats escape. Some Indians were willing to ride with the calvary. So what. We've got the numbers. We've been living in fear too long. Be willing to do what it takes. They'll only win if you chicken out.

Healthcare compared

Health spending as a share of GDP

US 16%
UK 8.4%

Public spending on healthcare (% of total spending on healthcare)

US 45%
UK 82%

Health spending per head

US $7,290
UK $2,992

Practising physicians (per 1,000 people)

US 2.4
UK 2.5

Nurses (per 1,000 people)

US 10.6
UK 10.0

Acute care hospital beds (per 1,000 people)

US 2.7
UK 2.6

Life expectancy:

US 78
UK 80

Infant mortality (per 1,000 live births)

US 6.7
UK 4.8

People who would deny care to other human beings are beneath contempt.

I'm not a Christian, but think this might sum up what seems to be lacking in the Conservative argument: Matthew 25:40 And the King will make answer and say to them, Truly I say to you, Because you did it to the least of these my brothers, you did it to me.

at all? Anything on TV so-called "news"?

Links:
http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=5240932n&tag=related;photovideo
http://www.hulu.com/watch/89130/nbc-nightly-news-with-brian-williams-crowds-overflow-la-forums-free-clinic

I had to go googling to find these. Contrast the sparse coverage of this event with the blanket coverage of morans-on-Medicare spouting off about death panels.

:cry:

1. What is the real scope of the problem? Is it that no one in the US receives decent care, or is it that some people don't have health insurance?

2. If it's the latter, then isn't the solution to expand government provided health insurance for those who can't afford it themselves, rather than having government completely take over the system?

3. Why will a big government bureaucracy be any more compassionate than corporate bureaucracies? Corporations at least have to be responsible to their profit margins, and compete for business. So they have some motivation to provide good service. Why does government?

4. The way the law last read, people who still had their own health insurance could keep it, but insurance companies couldn't sign up new insureds. Doesn't that indicate that the intent is to move to single payer over time? How could insurance companies stay in business if they can't sign up new members? Also, since many people have insurance chosen by their employer, and since the government program is likely to be cheaper than private insurance, while most people really have a choice?

They should answer some of your questions.

I haven't had a chance to see the Fault Lines video because it was taken down. However, the other two only point to the fact that there are some people in the US who are uninsured and under insured; something I already knew. But how many of those people are there? And going back to my original point, why is the currently mooted reform the best response to the problem?

What the two videos I saw pointed to is that there aren't enough health care professionals to service, on a timely basis everyone who needs care, but can't afford it. That's a function of life. There have never been enough doctors, and there never will be. There has never been enough of anything, and there never will be. That's why there is always some rationing of goods and services in society, and there always will be. The trick that I see is how does society even out some of the inequality for those who can't pay while not screwing up the system for those who can.

3. Why will a big government bureaucracy be any more compassionate than corporate bureaucracies? Corporations at least have to be responsible to their profit margins, and compete for business. So they have some motivation to provide good service. Why does government?

You think corporations do what they do out of compassion and not for massive profits?

In answer to your "big government bureaucracy" question, check out http://www.usconstitution.net/xconst_A1Sec8.html">Artcle 1 Section 8 of the Constitution - particularly the part about http://www.usconstitution.net/glossary.html#WELFARE">welfare.


http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=385x354791">Fault Lines: The Battle To Transform Health Care In The US - (Repost Due To Original Being Pulled)

Also, this really is a must see if you want to know how compassionate the corporate bureaucracies are: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vKI9be55N00

That's how many...

Almost ONE IN EVERY THREE PEOPLE in USAmerica is either un-insured or under-insured.

There will never be enough health care professionals as long as stingy, ignorant people continue to ration what they'll contribute to health care...especially Health Care for the unfortunate among us who need more of it.

The USAmerican health industry IS ALREADY SO FUCKED UP YOU COULDN'T MAKE IT ANY WORSE -- unless you allowed the for-profit insurance mafia and their fellow leeches in the drug industry continue to dictate the rules of the game.

The bogus "free market" DON'T WORK FOR SHIT when it comes to the requirements for humans to live and prosper...

Nuff said.

1. Yes to both of your questions here. Quality of care has suffered for almost everyone since we converted to a mostly for profit industry. Not saying no one gets decent care but a lot of covered people do not and it is not remotely as good as the care people got 25 years ago when the industry was largely not for profit. And a lot of people don't have health insurance and, for the most part, get no care.

2. Either of these options would improve things but neither is likely to happen.

3.Exactly the opposite of what you postulate. Responsibility to profit margins is the reason for denying all the care they can get away with denying. Competing for business generally means selling their plan to employers who are not looking at the quality of care but, rather, how to keep their cost for providing benefits down. Small comfort with the government in charge but you do, at least, have the option of voting out your representatives if you are not happy with the way they are voting on health care coverage. Try getting the CEO of a corporation removed because he denied a lot of care and increased the shareholders' dividends.

4. Not true that insurance companies could not sign up new insureds. The law to which you refer states that the currently insured could keep the same policies they have now for 5 years without the insurance company having to adjust these policies to conform with new reforms. After 5 years policies would have to conform to new law ie: unable to drop people when they get sick and lower out of pocket costs to the insureds.

You start with what you consider to be a rhetorical question: does nobody receive decent care or is the real problem that many people don't have health insurance? I suggest a much better question: Why is health insurance in this country SO COSTLY that we can not afford to provide coverage for a sixth of our population?

The chart at the bottom of the story makes it obvious that this is a clear statement of the problem:

Healthcare compared

Health spending as a share of GDP
US 16%
UK 8.4%

Health spending per head
US $7,290
UK $2,992

Another figure from the article speaks to your musings about the relative virtues of corporate bureaucracies versus government bureaucracies in providing low cost health care:

Public spending on healthcare (% of total spending on healthcare)
US 45%
UK 82%

Finally, the rest of the chart deals with broad comparisons of the quality of that health care:

Practising physicians (per 1,000 people)
US 2.4
UK 2.5

Nurses (per 1,000 people)
US 10.6
UK 10.0

Acute care hospital beds (per 1,000 people)
US 2.7
UK 2.6

Life expectancy:
US 78
UK 80

Infant mortality (per 1,000 live births)
US 6.7
UK 4.8

1. Millions of people have no health insurance, but that's just the tip of the iceberg. Millions more have insurance that is totally inadequate and leaves them with huge bills and even with health insurance many are forced into bankruptcy.

2. My understanding is that this is what the public option is about, it is being fought by the insurance companies with massive bribes to congress and the administration, somehow completely legal in our system, but condemned with a wink and a nod by the very recipients of the bribes.

3.There is NO real competition between insurance companies, there are laws that don't allow them to complete across state lines. Therefore major insurers "take-over" a state and crowd out the others. The insurance companies complain about this with a smile, it's exactly what they want, they control congress. Their profits come largely from denying care to their customers. Government employees incentive would be to help their client use the resources available, not deny service. Government employees would be considered to have done a good job when they managed to help their client get all the services available and needed, private insurance companies are exactly the opposite.

4.Yes they would have a really good choice and most would take it....the government plan. Most employers would love to get out of the health care business as it is very expensive for them and a distraction from their intended purpose. Anyone with any sense would hope the goal of all Democratic Party leaders would be to get us to a single payer as soon as possible.

1) 20,000 people die every year from lack of health insurance and thereby health care.

Many more thousands are killed by their insurance companies -- rescission and denial of care.

2) Because of economics and motivation. The motivating factor of for-profit insurance corporations (and drug companies and medical equipment manufacturers like G.E, etc.) is PROFIT. They exist to make a profit for their shareholders -- nothing more and nothing less. Their ENTIRE motivation is make a profit or die.

Not a good motivator for health care "providers"...

One single-payer or strict government regulation of non-profit companies (like Germany) whose ONLY reason for existence is providing Health Care (which is what the CIVILIZED world already has) can realized economies of scale and negotiating power to hold down costs while providing complete care.

THIS IS NOT A THEORY -- it's already been proven in EVERY CIVILIZED INDUSTRIAL FIRST WORLD COUNTRY except for one -- the USAmerikan Empire -- for, by and about Big Business...

3) See number 2 -- but again in what Friedmanesque alternate universe do corporations "have some motivation to provide good service?" Have you TRIED TO FUCKING CALL APPLE TECH SUPPORT LATELY? How about a health insurance company to "negotiate" for fairness?

I have recently gotten old enough to get on Social Security (I signed up on-line and only visited the office once to show them my birth certificate -- Get my money dropped in my bank account EVERY month -- like clockwork -- NO HASSLES), Medicare (ALL on-line - no birth certificate necessary since they already knew me from Social Security - I've GOT MY SINGLE-PAYER Health Care), Went to the local Motor Vehicles Department for a new license and registration upon moving to a new state -- VERY quick in and out, VERY good SERVICE!)...

So, I don't know who your government is but mine provides outstanding service...

MUCH BETTER than Apple or Verizon or Cox Cable every did!!!

4) ABSOLUTELY. ANYONE with half a brain and an ounce of compassion for their fellow human being would DEMAND that anything they pass lead directly to Single-Payer, a hybrid system like France or a non-profit government regulated Universal Health Care system such as Germany -- tout suite!!!

FUCK THE UNACCOUNTABLE INSURANCE COMPANIES and their fellow travelers in the corporate funded Congress and Big PhRMA! They don't have your interests or my interests or ANYONE'S interest in mind unless you happen to own a shit-pot of stock in their corporations!!!

Get a clue, my friend!

so the event got a fair amount of coverage.

Kinda surprising though, to a degree. 1500 people got $503,000 worth of treatment meaning that their average cost was only $335. It's not surprising that lots of people can't scrape together $335 to see a doctor. There are lots of poor people in this country after all. 10,000 people out of the population of LA is not really a huge number. It's about .25% if LA has 4 million people.

ABC News showed a grateful teenager getting the free medical care, but if this person needs medical care, then why wouldn't they qualify for SCHIP? Does SCHIP have waiting lists? Do they not know about SCHIP? Do they not want to fill out the paperwork for it? Same thing with medicaid. Don't poorer people get coverage through medicaid? Or is this a function of the California State budget cuts leaving many people without coverage?

In NY eg, at least last time I checked, that meant you had to be earning not more than, (I know this is unbelievable but it is true) $200.00 a month. Which means if you are a person earning $10,000, you still will not qualify. And if you own a house, that is taken into account. Iow, if you are working with no healthcare and get sick, you have no option but to use the ER after which you will receive thousand of dollars worth bills and if you owned a house, or have any savings, you may lose all that also. This is why there are so many bankrupcies as a result of health-care bills.

Some of the people who were at those free clinics DO have coverage but not enough to cover their families, as in the case of the single mom whose toddler needed teeth removed.

What other civilized country refuses to take care of the health needs of its children? Even dictators like Saddam Hussein did better than the US on healthcare, until we destroyed the country after the 1st Gulf War helping to kill over half a million Iraqi children. But they should not take it personally, we don't care much about our own children either.

There is simply zero excuse for this disaster that kills over 22,000 - 26,000 Americans every years while the greedy healthcare CEOS pocket millions of dollars in profits and the country goes bankrupt.

but the copays & deductibles are so high they still can't afford care.

Someone explain to me why it would be a bad thing if single payer disrupted this system?

Blessings on the health care professionals who take part in this. They may well have saved and changed lives. What a country (shaking head sadly and proudly at the same time).

And, would you look at those LINES?! I thought we didn't have long lines for health care in the US. /sarcasm

Actually, for $2 million, I think you only get a couple of spare tires. Kick it up a thousand, and build another B-1.

Who cares about health. We need bombs. Isn't that pretty much what this health care issue is about. Nobody is talking about it, but we spend a trillion a year on bombs.

One even wrote that the only media telling the truth is FOX.

... and they just took it over. Most Brits are too polite to tell these freepers to go forth and multiply.

It would a massacre. Watch this clip to see just how stupid Glenn Beck is.

http://progressnotcongress.org/?p=2545

And that's the way the republicans like it.

He has worked on this his whole life and now the creep has crept out of the woodwork and badmouthing any change in the health care "industry".

.... the British mainstream media, that is.

Ya' think?

so it's working out well for them.

IMO this would make a great backdrop for a Town Meeting-NO not actually being there but a live feed camera and a reporter used as that backdrop. That could make for a VERY INTERESTING Town Meeting!

A Secondary notion: VP Biden could use this same idea as a backdrop to do a "Fireside Chat" with America in support of the Health Care Reform President Obama is seeking.
:patriot:

a commentary pre-empting the lies/talking points about these people that even now, since it is getting some attention, the Think Tanks are preparing the lies and talking points for their minions to spread around.

They will claim that most of these people are 'illegal aliens' and use it to show why we need to get tough on immigration. This lie will 'kill two birds with one stone'.

They will also claim that Medicare is the culprit, destroying the healthcare system because of 'government corruption' and then go on to use THAT lie to attack 'Socialism'.

They will claim that many of these people HAVE access to coverage but are probably 'Lieberals' lining up and pretending to be desperate in order to trash the US and push for Socialism because they're 'America-hating Commie scum'.

Anyhow, these images have the potential to destroy much of their argument against healthcare reform, so they will attack them viciously just as they went after Michael Moore's 'Sicko', a movie described later by the Whistle-blower from Cigna as 'hitting the nail on the head' and he should know, he was part of the effort to discredit it.

They are ruthless! Because this is true and shameful and could be a turning point in getting support for reform, makes it all the more likely they have already begun to prepare to attack it.

When I say 'pre-empt' them I mean warn people watching to be prepared for the lies and talking points from the obstructionist healthcare profiteers. And then list a few so that when people hear them they will recognize the tactics.

Oh how I'd like to be the bird on our sides strategists' shoulder for that one! I'd want Rachel Maddow AND Pat Buchanan as the 'investigating anchors' on location with VP Biden as the one doing the "Town Meeting/Fireside Chat" VP Biden could force bumbling Buchanon to prove pretty much any of these right wing talking points. "...so Pat, how many undocumented workers have you seen taking advantage of this so far?"

I agree, it's true that the right wing will throw out it's typical trash and smear but may I remind you of the recent primaries? Trash and smear against the then Senator Obama pretty much backfired and arguably added support for his run. We The People have proven that we are tired of 'Politics as Usual'

I've a hunch that is exactly what underlies the reason behind our President's own recent town meetings. Not only is he disintigrating the right wing's smears against his vision for Health Care Reform but he is making the perpetrators of those smears look like the greedy bastards that they truly are!

I see this idea as a counter-punch to the right's arracks on our congress's town meetings-it's getting the truth out to where it is needed-out to the electorate.

Truth be told, my notion is nothing less than shining a bright spotlight exactly where the cockroaches don't want that light right now. The media could not ignore that spotlight. IMO if this were handled correctly, it could rally the Mother Of All grass-roots movement around our President! (as well as being a fabtastic ratings coup for MSNBC...hmmmmmm)

A tinge of brightness in an nearly all encompassing dark.

Not sure how to reply further but to say thank you for the support of my odd notion.

to provide the truth about health care and the uninsured in this country.

It's really sad that we have to read stories about this event from foreign news sources. I first heard about the event on Air America (a nod to them) and then I saw the Daily Show had a segment (a nod to them) but haven't seen it on the news or in the papers. Why? Am I not digging far enough or watching the right programming? And why isn't there a politician there like Boxer, Pelosi, or even Biden, to highlight the fact that thousands have no health insurance or inadequate coverage. This is just sad. The Democratic Party has no idea how to market itself nor its ideas in a way that the American public will buy. Or maybe they aren't there because they don't want the system to fixed...Geez, this just makes me sad.

This is probably another event that we'll have to push to get into the news. :hi:

the locals here at the lake of the ozarks, mo. Thanks you also.

is the health care industry/GOP outsourcing trolls too? You would think so by how badly written the reply was....

Ever!

That's real world evidence there.