More men with guns at Obama event

Source: MSNBC

From NBC's Scott Foster
In a situation similar to last week in Portsmouth, N.H., cameras caught a protester with a pistol holstered to his leg outside of today's event with the president.

Police on the scene were standing right next to the gentleman and were keeping a close eye on him. He's well behind a security barrier outside the convention center in a crowd of protesters.

A second man, who appeared to be interviewing some of the protesters, also had a pistol strapped to his leg. He was also being watched by police.

To reiterate, there appears to be NO CAUSE FOR SERIOUS CONCERN from local authorities on scene.

Read more: http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/archive/2009/08/17/2032801.aspx

He wouldn't have had to hunch down in a book repository. Fuck, he could've just stood in the crowd and waited for a better shot at the motorcade. Mother of God, how did one country produce so many inbreds? "No cause for concern" my motherfucking ass!

It's the ones with the rifles 500 yards away that should be of concern.

Pistols at anything beyond 25 yards are useless for the vast majority of people......and useless altogether against the limousines.

The cowards showing up at rallies with firearms get their jollies out of spooking people just like you.

I went to a thingy in Seattle last with the intention of calling some scumbag a coward for packing a gun at a health care rally, but none showed up.

Laughing at, and ridiculing these peanut brained limp dick wannabes is EXACTLY the best defense.

do you really support that kind of intimidation?

Domocrats have & carry firearms too - see some of the DU gun polls.

Personally, if I were to attend a representative/congressional/POTUS town hall I would be concealed carrying (if permissable). No different than any other day going to any other place.

unless I know i'm goin somewhere it's prohibited. (Ohio has a set outline of prohibited places)
If I find myself somewhere where I cannot carry, I usually lock it in the console of my car.

Just another measure of being prepared, I suppose. If I'm driving my car I have a spare tire, jack, Fixaflat, basic tools/sockets, electrical stuff, quart of oil, gps, and a hand powered flashlight. I find the security one can be afforded that fits into a milk crate in the trunk is great peace of mind - knowing that you can handle most problems encountered. Carrying a firearm is just another tool, like a pocketknife.

0.1%

office once, and nonchalantly put it on the table, I asked him to take it out of there immediately. He did. I would not want one in my home, place of work, or near me. in a car doesn't bother me. Unelss, of course, it is a crazy person who might shoot people, of which there are way too many.

someone uncomfortable with firearms? Most people carrying concealed should do so discreetly and be mindful that others may disapprove or feal uneasy. I mean, you wouldn't walk around spewing obscenities in front of grandmas... why flaunt a firearm?

I have friends who don't mind guns at all (I'll toss it on the coffe table or something) and friends who either do not know or I feel they might be uncomfortable... so it stays tucked. Once again, if a problem is forseen it stays in the car.

IMO, there is nothing wrong with responsible licensed carry. The kind of people willing to go through the classes and hassle of getting a permit, knowing all the new laws they must follow and are curteous to others' predispositions are not the people anyone should worry about.

My BIL came in wearing one a few months ago. I told him to put it in his car. No guns allowed in this house.

Some folks are just a bit more prepared for the unlikely, but nasty, events that might occur.

There are no guarantees; but since you are stuck playing odds, why not push them a bit more in your favor by giving yourself another self-defense option should the need arise?

that you think you need to have a fucking GUN!!!

jeesusfuckingchristonahalfshell...

I've never even THOUGHT of "needing a gun" let alone having to carry one all the time...

I pity you...and people like you...

in fact, if you tried to sneak it in and were caught at it, it could result in some big problems for you.

I mentioned if it were legal to carry somewhere I wouldn't have a problem doing so. If it were not legal then yes, there would be problems.

I highly doubt the secret service lets anyone into a close up meeting being armed. I'm sure everyone in close proximity goes through metal detectors or are under close surveillane at the least. All these cases we're hearing about nutjobs open carrying have been very far away from the president to consider a them threat.

I would be very uncomfortable with someone equipped with firearms in that kind of setting.

I think you are just asking for trouble in my opinion.

Clown make up would be great.

I refuse to be intimidated by assholes who feel the need to display their weapons at an Obama event.

That you have to carry a weapon with you practically all of the time. I'm a female, living in Atlanta, who drives all over the city, day and night. Yet I don't feel the need to carry a weapon. How sad to live in such constant fear.

By the way, what exactly are "Domocrats?"
(I think I saw that on one of those signs at a teabagging rally)

A concealed handgun is just another tool that can be used to escape danger in the unlikely event that you need to do so.

you need to see a THERAPIST.

Pronto.

People who live in CONSTANT FEAR need serious HELP.

but you have yet to point out who are these people who life in fear.

What danger? The danger you are in when you are attacked, should you not be able to avoid that unlikely event.

What escape? The one everyone hopes for if they are attacked.

Just because you are prepared for unlikely events does not mean you are afraid. It means you have thought through the possibility and come up with a plan that you hope you will never need to use. This is how one relieves the fear, if they had any fear to start with.

some people are fucking walking COWARDS and don't even know it...

Gun militants aren't driven by fear. But one of the things they are driven by is the need to make the public believe there are things they should be afraid of.

There are bogeymen lurking under beds. There are crazy people on campuses. There are bad guys after your stuff. No, not just your stuff. They want to RAPE you.

There are all sorts of horrible things just waiting to happen to YOU. Not them.

Life is nasty and brutish and will be short if you don't join them in their crusade.

Mandatory minimum sentences. Three strikes. Enforce those laws. You got trouble with a capital T. You need to have a gun about your person at all times. Actually, the gun is incidental.

Fatten that prison-industrial complex, and disrupt and disenfranchise those minority communities.

The guns? They're just the shiny objects. They're the magic door to the rest of it.

Shopkeeper shoots robber. Pedestrian shoots mugger. Helpless little old lady shoots burglar. Just think of all the mayhem that would have been wrought if they had not had guns! Bad guys everywhere! Out to get YOU.

And the police won't help you. When seconds count, the police are minutes away. The Supreme Court says the police have no duty to protect you. You're on your own in this world. And if the police aren't gonna protect you, you need guns.

Or at least - you gotta let them have guns. You gotta let them have their way. In every way.

La la la. They're just exercising their rights.

There is no public interest.

There is no democracy.

Guns, don't you know, are Man in a State of Nature.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=118&topic_id=247994&mesg_id=248034

I kid you not. This is not the 21st century, you are on your own, universal health care is not found in nature. You are not entitled to anything, not even a voice in how your society is organized, and it's time you realized it.

The gun is just the tool for that job, and the job isn't shooting people. And the gun thugs are just one part of the well-organized, well-directed advance party.

at assholes who carry guns to rallys.

Read the freaking post, will ya?

Oh, and by the way - They WANT you to be afraid of them.

that would be my status if I saw some guy packing a couple of guns at any event! YIKES! :nuke:

:kick:

Do you really think anyone at these events is going to shoot the President. Witnessess, police and secret service everywhere. I love the suggestion of pointing and laughing at them. Ridicule is the answer.

Do I think there is a chance that something could go awry and the police could shoot at these jerks and I could be caught in the crossfire? Yes.

As someone else pointed out, in some cases, local police are keeping an eye on the guy. Well, I don't know about where you live, but here, the local police are a bit trigger happy and shoot first and ask questions later.

It's a big game to them, and they take a mile for every inch. Some one of these morans is going to cross the final line, and there will be tragedy, yet again.

I am outraged/dumbfounded by allowing people to openly display firearms at a presidential event. A lot of these right wing nut bags are certifiably crazy.

The SS has already revealed that Obama gets a record breaking number of death threats a day, and then they allow these nut bags to get close with firearms? The guns on display are only the ones we see. What about the ones that are hidden? How many threats can the SS track at one time?

From a psychological perspective, Obama is only encouraging the bullies to take a shot at him. I no longer think Obama is brilliant, just extremely lucky. He doesn't understand anything about bully psychology.

First, we have displays of uncontrollable shout downs at town hall meetings (The bullies are name calling)
Obama does nothing (emboldens the bullies next act)

Next, we have open displays of guns (the bully is waving his fist at you)
Obama starts back tracking on public options etc (more emboldening) It doesn't matter if it is simply a
coincidence, the bullies interpret it as justifying their tactics.

With no righteous display of anger, no smack-down from Obama, the next step is inevitable: a real assassination
attempt.

What does Gandhi say? First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win? It should be added in between fighting and winning is the dying part. This is the price of being so nice, so anti-confrontational. Ask Gandhi, Jesus, or MLK. If Obama wants to be Mother Theresa he should've been a nun, not POTUS.

to rallies is intimidation. Won't be long before Obama supporters will start carrying guns also. In that event I wouldn't want any of my family in the crowd. When two opposing hot-head groups resort to open confrontation with guns on the hip, it could very well mean big trouble.

"Police on the scene were standing right next to the gentleman and were keeping a close eye on him. He's well behind a security barrier outside the convention center in a crowd of protesters.

A second man, who appeared to be interviewing some of the protesters, also had a pistol strapped to his leg. He was also being watched by police.

To reiterate, there appears to be NO CAUSE FOR SERIOUS CONCERN from local authorities on scene."

The last sentence in this article is bullshit, how much easier would it be for a sniper or assassin to elude detection if the police have their attention focused on the scumbag cowards; serving as distractions and how many scumbag cowards at one event does it take to cause serious concern?

To my knowledge guns aren't allowed at schools so allowing them at Presidential events is the height of folly, considering we've had four Presidents assassinated by guns and at least three; that I'm aware of having been shot at or shot and surviving.

.. many AR-15s qualify as an 'assault weapon' under the now expired '94 Assault Weapons legislation. 'Assault Rifle' usually refers to a select fire rifle like an M-16 that can fire either semi-automatic or full automatic/burst.

completely fucks up the hysterics.

whether carrying any kind of deadly weapon. Whether in a crowd or anywhere it is a concern when used to intimidate and cause fear in other people. Reaction to fear and distrust can cause trouble also. Peanut brained limp dicks are known to be unstable, doncha' know?

plans. They are the largest group of people I notice carrying weapons openly in the US. In Afghanistan, the military tends to be the largest group.

I support both groups by the way and don't refer to them as scumbags.

On the off chance you meant private citizens, what other rights will you disparage? Shall we go after those 1st amendment scumbags who speak, pray and assemble openly? How about those 4th amendment scumbags who insist on a warrant for a search or my personal favorite scumbags - those 5th amendment scum who exercise their right to remain silent. At least they don't preach about it....

(24601 knows about being locked up for petty theft - it was only a loaf of bread.)

Cheers.

i think we should arm ourselves and to to right-wing events in the same way.

then we'll see some weeping right-wingers show up on fox complaining about how horrible and intimidating the left is becoming.

Photo proof:

an BUSH events? No one would ever have heard from any of them again!

Or were planning to stand up and turn their back on Obama once he was introduced. Now that would get you thrown out of an event under the Bush regime. And if you made an intemperate comment about a "burning Bush"? Three years in the slammer, dude!

These guys are just carrying holy relics of the High Church of Redemptive Violence. No cause for serious (or any other kind of) concern.

and if you see one, you've got a hundred ...

The police will be so distracted by the people flashing their strap-ons that they'll fail to check more thoroughly for the person who has his hidden.

security resources that are needed elsewhere in he crowd. How many gun-toters does it take before security gets overwhelmed and a SERIOUS shooter slips past?????

There is no reason a person in the crowd should carry a gun to an event such as this. There should be no guns at an event with the POTUS (except for Secret Service)!

What would have happened to them?

the ones handling it doesn't make me happy.

It's not like they have the same level of training as the Secret Service. And let's not even get into issues of competence and motivation.

And even if we take these guys at their word that they mean no harm (doubtful, given the pro-assassination poster the guy in NH had), they are a drain on security resources. If the cops and the feds are scrambling to "keep a close eye" on a bunch of armed yahoos, it could make it easier for a real attacker to get through. In fact, I wonder if that is the point.

But apparently MSNBC has no problem with it.

Police on the scene were standing right next to the gentleman and were keeping a close eye on him. He's well behind a security barrier outside the convention center in a crowd of protesters.

I would think "subject" would be more appropriate here. I mean, why would the police be standing right next to him keeping a close eye on him if he wasn't a "subject" of interest?

In how many states is this legal? NH allows it, obviously, and I think Arizona does. I imagine some of the other "cowboy" states allow people to walk around strapped. Is this going to become a regular occurrence now?

Open Carry: (Carrying a firearm in plain view)



Concealed Carry Map: (Carrying a gun completely hidden from view)

Six states (plus DC) have a blanket prohibition on open carry of firearms. It is legal in the other 44 states to some degree, although specifics vary from state to state.

Allowing people who are carrying loaded guns into a potentially volatile situation doesn't seem like such a great idea.

>Allowing people who are carrying loaded guns into a potentially volatile situation doesn't seem like such a great idea.<

I've said the same thing previously, but that just gets me taunts of "gun grabber". After all, how dare I have the right to be free from a nut with a handgun?

It's impossible to distinguish this place from the NRA's website some days...

:sarcasm:

who are attending the event. What's to keep one of these nuts from opening fire on the crowd.

off to gitmo

The crazy one not being watched by the cops is the one for concern.

How many cops will we need during the next election cycle?

A cop for every gunnut...???

created a clear and present danger for the hosts/attendees at the meetings.

Most gunshot wounds are accidents that injure freinds and family. Thinning the herd, that's all.

assassin had a concealed gun.

Man with assault rifle joins crowds outside president's Phoenix venue

Reporter John Faherty observes that one sight that is "perhaps a little unnerving" to those in charge of keeping order is a man with a pistol on his hip and an AR-15 semiautomatic assault rifle on a strap over his shoulder.


http://blogs.usatoday.com/ondeadline/2009/08/man-with-assault-rifle-joins-crowds-outside-presidents-phoenix-venue.html

I'll take the flames. But the only reason one would want or carry an automatic weapon is to kill people...there are no game animals at these public events. This country is nuts and to pretend that the 2nd Amendment was not referring to state militias defies English grammer.

.. the regulations enacted by the 1934 National Firearms Act and the attendant price explosion after the McClure-Volkmer act closed the registry to new weapons seems to have made crime with a legal full automatic weapon almost mythical (~4 cases since 1934.)

they are semi-automatic. The AR-15 is a civilian version of the M-16 - not the same weapon.

unless you have passed a FBI background check, and have $20,000 you cant get an select fire M4, the same one the Army paid $700 for. So assault rifle refers to any scary looking replica of an already heavily regulated (basically banned) weapon.

No one had an automatic weapon. They did have some bad judgement.

At least except for the super-rich and well-connected.

Why, why, why, why don't those passionate about gun control learn the current state of the law?

I work at blood drives and register the donors. I'm in Idaho and in some areas I have a lot of people show me concealed weapons permits for ID. You have to show a picture ID to donate blood.
I think it's a joke that these guys are so proud of their permits. They could just as easily show me their drivers license.
Many of them are trying to look mean in their pictures too. I almost wish it wasn't considered a legal ID so I could tell them, "that's no good. I need to see a real ID." Or maybe, "Ok Mr. Death Wish, I'm intimidated. Now can I see a real ID?"
If I did that though they'd get mad and walk off.
I'm also part owner of a vending business that operates at a lot of motorcycle rallys. I've considered getting a hand gun and permit for protection at some events. If I did, no one would know about it. I'd only show it if a cop pulled me over. I would expect someone that meant me harm that knew I was armed to only be more violent if they tried to jump me.
Bikers are actually pretty well behaved and I've never had any trouble. What I hate are rodeos. You see more trouble at those.
The jokers with the guns at the health care rallys are just punks trying to look tough.

We shouldn't take any chances at these Obama rallies -

or with any GOP/NRA gun nuts --

I know someone with a permit and he does the same thing. Could just as easily pull out his driver's license, but no. He has to use that for ID. It's pretty pathetic because he's old and his picture, if he is trying to look tough, is just funny. He's also the type who would shit his pants if anyone even looked at him cross-eyed. These kinds of guys need a gun to give them a false sense of courage.

Two of the biggest bed wetting mamas boys I know are also total gun nuts. One says flat out that it's his equalizer.
He was on vacation and a guy cut him off or something. He freaked out and got beside the guy and was reaching for his gun in between the seats. His girlfriend fought him to keep him from pulling it out.
He's a notorious bad driver. Tailgates and road rages. Rear ended a guy and threatened to sue the car maker because he claimed the anti-lock brakes didn't work. They just paid for the damages but anyone that knows him assumes it was his fault.

There is a difference between a reasonable citizen who carries a gun for his or her own protection, and one who decided the open-carry is the way to go. I'm not living a fearful life and I don't carry a gun, but were I genuinely concerned about my safety and carried I'd keep it hidden because WTF would I want to make everybody feel uncomfortable and suspicious about my state of mind? Yeah, it's legal, but it's stupid and should be avoided at all costs, like a number of other legal substances/businesses/attitudes I can think of.

No fucking common sense. Who are you people defending these punks?

People were getting arrested for just being there. These psychos have guns... you got to be whacked to use a gun to intimidate.

quite a ways back -- we filled the streets for dozens of blocks . . .

And, they had to try desperately to even give a hint of anyone making a problem --

basically it was some of their guys trying to create a problem.

Very minor coverage of that as I recall --

but let the right wing have a hangnail and it's 24/7 --

:)

:eyes:

Indict them, convict them, let them become felons for life, and then be ineligible to own a gun again. Idiots.

in this case being really stupid would lead to some event that would be posted on live leak. Mainly moron drawing a pistol and then getting his head split open with a rifle round fired by a man he can not see.

They should be wearing clothing to go with their substitute penis that says: Will work as Patsy.
At best they are getting detained big time if ANYTHING untowards happens.

And why are their permits not being checked? Even some places with open carry have to have permits, right? You bring weaponry to a peaceful event expect to get asked for your permit. You would have to show it to get on an airliner, right? Couldn't walk into a school with it could you? But you can carry it around kids and old folks at a peaceful public event?

Rights are rights, no doubt, but to me common sense Public Safety says go wear your penis extension down by the railroad tracks or somewhere else... if not, show me your fucking permit.

-- the update to the original news bulletin:

*** UPDATE *** After reading our post, the Brady Campaign's President Paul Helmke issued the following statement:

Bringing loaded firearms to any Presidential event endangers all in attendance. Even though our weak national and state gun laws may allow this dangerous behavior, we should use a little common sense. Individuals carrying loaded weapons at these events require constant attention from police and Secret Service officers, thus stretching their protective efforts even thinner. The possibility that these weapons might be grabbed or stolen or accidently mishandled increases the risks of serious injury or death to all in attendance.

The National Rifle Association and other 'gun rights' groups need to send a message about 'gun responsibilities' to their members and all gun owners. Loaded weapons at political forums endanger all involved, distract law enforcement, and end up stifling debate. Presidential protesters need to leave their firearms at home -- no exceptions."

Looks like a case of fuckin duh to me.

It is legal for non-disqualified individuals to carry loaded firearms openly in some locations.

Who in those locations knows whether any individual is disqualified???

Police are not allowed to ask them.

So police, in a situation like this, get to spend time watching them.


These individuals are thugs. Plain and simple.

My usual full description is: racist, misogynist, right-wing gun militants.

:hi:

Those assholes were looking for trouble and causing trouble of their own. What IS it with these old white men and their guns? Is there no Viagra in the red states?

In these states? In other words, can a shop owner post a sign saying "no guns"?

Are airlines obligated to allow guns through security in these states, if the flight is staying within the state?

Can't there be a gun-free perimeter around Obama? I mean a bigger one than there is now?

Private property owners can and do restrict carrying on their property. Airports are also private property, and per faa regulation, make the same prohibitions in the secured areas of the airport.

The secret service establishes 'rings' of levels of protection around those they protect. Within effective firearm range, they've screened the crowd and disarmed them (or escorted them out) and secured all the locations that could be used for a longer range attack.

There is no right to be in a gun-free zone In these states?

Nope, there is no right to be in a gun-free zone, or a racism-free zone, or a homophobia-free zone, or a misogyny-free zone, or a bigotry-free zone ...

The entirety of your public spaces are free-fire zones. Places where the public, and any and all vulnerable groups and individuals, are to have it rubbed in their faces on a daily, and preferably minute-by-minute, basis, that they don't have the right to go about their lives and their business, bothering no one, in peace. That their insecurity is the standard aimed for, for how they are to feel when they leave their homes ... or turn on the radio or television ...

All your public spaces are belong to them.

La la la. We're just exercising our constitutional rights here, folks.

We're racist, misogynist, bigoted, gun-militant right-wing assholes, and we're here where you are. We just thought you all might want to be reminded of that every time you turn your head.

They're no danger to Obama. They're a danger to the entire concept of democracy.



html fixed

It may be easier to see from this side of the border. ;)

The guns are the shiny object meant to distract -- like "free speech" on campus and in cartoons and in front of abortion clinics.

The agenda is a Gorgon, with many heads. Unless one stands back and looks at them as a unit, complex though the web among them may be, one is going to be playing whack-a-mole forever.

"Liberals" don't really have to just say "but it's their constitutional right". They can also name them and name what they are doing, and yup, be totally intolerant of it.

Guns are male enhancement tools unless somebody is threatening us with one.

The violence is now all but being explicitly signaled, and overt threats are being presented as rights. If the Secret Service doesn't do what the local police aren't doing, then Obama will be shot. It will happen.

I'm thinking we should probably let Arizona know what it might be like to try to exist as a sovereign nation for a while.

Three men were carrying guns outside the Phoenix Convention Center Monday morning during President Barack Obama’s visit, but there were no arrests, according to Phoenix Police. One man was carrying an assault rifle and pistol and two others had handguns, according to police.

Obama spoke at the Veterans of Foreign Wars convention at the center Monday. Protesters in downtown Phoenix focused on the health care reform debate. It is not illegal to openly carry weapons in Arizona, but police kept close tabs on the men, said spokesman Andy Hill.

Security was heightened but not intense in downtown Phoenix during the president’s visit. Hill said there were no arrests related to the protests.

http://www.bizjournals.com/phoenix/stories/2009/08/17/daily20.html

It takes a second to pull the gun and aim it. In the meantime, what are the cops supposed to do if that happens? Tackle the guy? Shoot into the crowd?

Really, in the Ol' West, like Tombstone, AZ, it was illegal to carry guns into the town without checking them. It was a town ordinance. Part of the reason why the gunfight at the OK Corral happened is that the Clantons and company did not check their weapons when they came into town and Wyatt Erp then tried to arrest them for it. (I know conservatives will say "You see? Did that law prevent the gunfight?")

Nobody took this to the Supreme Court. It was considered common sense-- in the Old West.

Letting people be armed in the presence of the President. I would say its stupid, but, no, I think law enforcement of Arizona, et al, wants somebody to take out the President.

We're still trying to piece this together. But according to CNN's Ed Henry, who was there in person, there was not one but TWO men outside the Obama event in Phoenix today with AR-15 assault rifles. It's like a fad.

One man, whose presence we noted earlier, was an African-American man who didn't seem to make completely clear what his political position was. But the second, who we haven't seen any pictures of, was apparently holding his assault rifle while chanting against socialism and denouncing Obama's policies.

http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/archives/2009/08/more_guns_the_merrier.php?ref=fpa

unless you want to stir up some drama this is a non event. These people are stupid and reacting to them is stupid. If they present a real problem they will be shot dead.

It is not productive and fans the flames of subversion.

It lets all the reasonably normal people see what thugs their gun militant neighbours really are.

I say let the thugs continue their thuggery apace, and they'll soon be finding people shunning them all over the neighbourhood, and being just a little less likely to listen to their attempts to portray themselves as anything other than thugs.

but when they do- I'm afraid I'll have to post a "we told you so...."

how should we respond?

What would they say about this business?

I'm thinking that we can all agree that this isn't a healthy trend that we're seeing.

goes off and decides to shoot someone of someone in the crowd grabs the guy's gun and then we'll get serious about this.

And I'm normally one of the pro-gun DU'ers. But if this level of hate rhetoric and intimidation continues we will either suffer a political assasination or mass shooting.

I feel like its a weird combination of deja-vu between the hate rhetoric of the 90's raised ten or a hundred fold and the blinking red lights of August 2001.

it is like responding to a child intentionally trying to get some action by acting out. Reasonable steps should be taken.

Kinda makes ALL gun thugs look bad, don't it?

Casts the ones showing up at their kids' soccer games, and putting on their thuggish displays in family restaurants, and yelling for the "right" to festoon themselves in firearms as they use public parks and traipse around educational institutions, in a slightly different light, in which they can more clearly be seen for exactly what they are. Thugs.

and material engineers thugs. These people are morons, like people who drive drunk or text they are just idiots. Stupid is not illegal, regretfully. Kind of like rapists demean the entire population of males?

These people are morons, like people who drive drunk or text they are just idiots.

Are those people texting for the purpose of intimidation?

Yeah, if only these things were ONLY morons. Morons the footsoldiers undoubtedly be. The thugs-in-chief aren't.

Way to go, Matthews.

when he said "you brought a goddamn gun to an event!" I let out a little yelp. I couldn't believe it... it was awesome. Of course watching that idiot with the gun from NH was great, because he came off as such a moran with paranoia that it worked in our favor.

they use it to intimidate people. This has nothing to do with protection. If it is, they are paranoid and shouldn't even be able to buy a gun.

- or any weapon, they'll never get into the building so they're no threat to the president. The Secret Service are good at what they do.

That, and they're seeking to intimidate as many people as possible. There is no healthy reason for open carry of firearms at a highly emotional, politically divisive event like this. You gun obsessives who are defending this sort of behavior are idiots......

:)

The more people give them, the less likely they are to stop what they are doing.

There aren't any thugs with guns over there, engaging in a display of force designed to intimidate people who disagree with their politics.

Noooooooo. Don't give them any attention, and they WON'T EXIST.

I fear for the lives of our elected leaders... and I've never felt that way before. These fuckers are doing this to INTIMIDATE us. The asshole talking heads are deliberately stirring up the criminally paranoid. These people are insane.. I mean, you all know that, right? They're paranoid and they've been groomed to believe that Obama is a Nazi, and that they will be rounded up in death camps. I mean this sincerely. There has been no effort to do anything to their guns, but the soulless fuckers at the NRA have been stoking this since President Obama was elected... that's why the crazies all stocked up on weapons.

Please.. remind me why I don't just totally hate mankind lately....

much. It is sick. Really sick.
They need to ban weapons at these events totally no matter what the law is.

any reaction, especially a grabastic broad reaction banning legal carry is the intended response. They want people to refocus on guns rather than health care. No one has been injured, nothing has happened. In the time since this story broke thousands have been killed in accidents.

This is just media spun drama. Dont take the bait.

find out won't we. I am btw able to concentrate on several things at once. Too bad the press isn't.

and acting. one person is capable and they probably would not be wearing a pistol open carry. These people are morons and distract the rest of the usa today crowd from the real issues.

This is a scary time and our side needs to wake the fuck up.

http://volumeone.org/blogs/The_Daily_Shakedown/post/1044/Trendy_small_town_gun_picnics_are_all_the_rage.html

Very scary.

about these wingnuts. Savage and Limbaugh are going apeshit on radio about martial law, wingnuts are carrying loaded weapons to town halls and now people with guns (1 with a military rifle was found--Yahoo News). This wingnuttery is going to only get worse unless something is done.

and sold to people who do not realize they are buying a replica. Best thing to do is ignore these morons and get on with business.

There really are a lot of people in this world, and even in that part of the world, who really don't give a flying fuck about guns. They don't spend every waking moment studying flashcards of guns and testing one another on their gun-recognition abilities. They see a gun, and they think: "That's a gun."

And you know what? They're right. It's a gun. Being displayed in a public place. By someone who very obviously has a reason for displaying a gun in a public place.

Never mind "ignore these morons". Think about them and what they are doing. (No, not you. I'm sure you've thought about it and you know as well as I do what they are doing.)

People who display guns in public places know exactly what the effect of their behaviour is.

And people who are not children intend the effects of their actions.

These people intend to intimidate.

in this country. Then there's the gun nut who goes crazy and shoot their spouse or enemy every single day in the news. Oh wait, there's a whole lot of those gun nuts, not just one a day.

I'm pretty sure the GOP is behind getting these people to arm up and go protest - most protests are organized by the other side of the party they're protesting.

The GOP already called for Obama to be assinated many times. Now they are simply rallying their base - some of which are insane, to carry it out. Imagine doing this when Bush was president - when they arrested people for simply wearing anti-bush tee-shirts.

Were you seriously intending to address me?


I'm pretty sure the GOP is behind getting these people to arm up and go protest - most protests are organized by the other side of the party they're protesting.

It and its fellow travellers.

Just a tiny example. We all know how allowing students to pack on campus would stop those crazies in their tracks, right?

http://deletionpedia.dbatley.com/w/index.php?title=Brett_Poulos_(deleted_25_May_2008_at_10:14)

ed - you have to copy and paste both parts together:
http://deletionpedia.dbatley.com/w/index.php
?title=Brett_Poulos_(deleted_25_May_2008_at_10:14)

Brett Michael Poulos (born 1987) is an Ultraconservative Republican with an array of Political Knowledge. Poulos has had his Civil Liberties violated by a Public College in the State of Texas. His College has recieved notice from the Foundation for Individual Rights in Education pertaining to the violation of Poulos's First Amendment Rights. His story has been published by the Associated Press and has aired on National News Stations. He plans to take his College to Court and fight the Unconstitutional ruling. He serves as a National Media Liaison at Students for Concealed Carry on Campus and is most notably known for his involvement with the Foundation for Individual Rights in Education (FIRE). He served on Presidential Candidate, Mike Huckabee's College Campain Team. He has appeard for Interviews on countless National Public Radio shows as well as T.V. News Programs. Poulos also writes opinionated articles on the topic of the Second Amendment. While in College, Poulos received his ordination as a Baptist Minister.

Just one of the public faces of the thugs.


The people who kill their families and strangers in public places aren't generally "gun nuts", by which I assume you mean the crowd that I call gun militants: ceaselessly agitating to advance what is really a racist, misogynist, right-wing agenda, gun militancy being just one way of doing that.

They are problematic individuals with access to firearms with which to commit acts that in many cases could not be committed without firearms, or would not be committed without firearms. (Multiple homicides in public places are difficult to do by suffocation; murder-suicide, ditto.)

The thugs displaying firearms at political rallies are not likely members of that class. They are political thugs ... although that's not to say they don't also have the kinds of antisocial/narcissistic personality disorders that characterize the mass murderers. ;)



Note: in case the thread of the discussion really wasn't apparent, when I said "who cares?" I was responding to:

He had a semi auto 22. Designed to kill groundhogs

and the suggestion that he be ignored. He could have had a toy that he put together from a kit. It didn't matter what he had, when his intention was not to shoot anyone, it was to intimidate the public in a public place.

filled with hate for our government and president. It is naive to believe that they don't pose a threat to security.

I'm Unrec'ing every "armed men at political event" thread today.

displaying their firearms at children's sports events, in family restaurants, in public parks, in the grocery stores and movie theatres and, if they had their way, the educational institutions of every community in the land.

Nothing to see here, folks. No right-wing thugs with a racist, misogynist right-wing agenda, occupying every inch of public space, putting on a display of force and driving home that they, not the public, are in control. Just some nice folks exercising their constitutional rights. Just like the ones publishing racist cartoons. Just like the ones harassing women at clinics. Just exercising our constitutional rights here, nothing for you to worry about. Move along.

Put 'em on the television, put 'em in the newspapers, put 'em all over the internet, and hope that the public sees what they are, all of them, and starts waking up.

gun-toting haters, who live in fear that our government is 'out to get them', pose no threat. United we stand, divided we fall is pertinent today more than ever. Trouble ahead unless people come to their senses and I don't know if that will ever happen.

it will be innocent bystanders who end up getting hurt because the likelihood of these wonks getting close to Obama is low.

...that was the least bit anti Bush, or any way at all critical of Republican agendas, you were escorted out, arrested, sent to Siberia (the protest zone - far, far away from the event).

But these jerks can carry guns? And the secret service isn't yanking them outside for even a little intimidating chat? Come on, this is ridiculous, anyone showing up in the vicinity of one of Obama's events with a gun needs to be detained in a safe place, without the weapon.

And that guy who had to identify himself as a member of the NRA before asking Obama a question yesterday? Was that supposed to be a tacit threat? I agree with Jon Stewart that the SS guys were probably starting to reach inside their coats when they heard that...at least I hope so!

The person who has festooned himself with firearms may think he's "making a statement" or trying to intimidate others, but overall I imagine the idea of mindlessly blasting away isn't their purpose.

However...

If I were a white supremacist and in my anger saw the opportunity to grab a weapon and beginning killing those who aren't "real Americans" (i.e., white males and subservient wives), I might take it. A lot of killings occur when an unarmed suspect wrestles a policeman's weapon from him and uses it against the officer. I don't see where these circumstances are appreciably different.

And it seems strange that no one ever brings up the safety of the children who attend these rallies. If I had a child and saw one of these guys I would move as far away as possible, or leave if necessary to ensure my child's safety.