Schools fight families over autism service dogs

Source: MSNBC/AP

CHICAGO - Like seeing-eye dogs for the blind, trained dogs are now being used to help autistic children deal with their disabilities. But some schools want to keep the animals out, and families are fighting back.

Two autistic elementary school students recently won court orders in Illinois allowing their dogs to accompany them to school. Their lawsuits follow others in California and Pennsylvania over schools' refusal to allow dogs that parents say calm their children, ease transitions and even keep the kids from running into traffic.

At issue is whether the dogs are true "service dogs" — essential to managing a disability — or simply companions that provide comfort.

School districts say they are not discriminating, just drawing the line to protect the safety and health of other students who may be allergic or scared of dogs.

"The school district has 650 students, not just one. So we have to balance," said Brandon Wright, attorney for the Villa Grove district in central Illinois, which objected to 6-year-old Kaleb Drew's plan to bring his yellow Labrador retriever, Chewey, to school.



Read more: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/32511651/ns/health-kids_and_parenting/

:popcorn:

I'm on a slightly different schedule from most people.

Gather up all the kids that insist on taking their dogs to school from all around the USA and build special 24/7 housing/school for them. Otherwise go to school and leave your dog at home just like all the other kids!

or dogs who warn epileptic children before seizures?

Blind kids with their seeing eye dogs (if they have them) normally are not in regular grade school.
They go to schools for the blind, not to regular schools where they expose other 'little' kids to big dogs.

Big institutional schools for the blind (and deaf) are outmoded dinosaurs. Have been ever since IDEA (Individuals with Disabilities Education Act).

There's quite a bit of overlap between autism (particularly the classic "Kanner/regressive type") and epilepsy. Indeed, I just had a very productive chat a couple of hours ago with a fine young lady who has both. :loveya:

Only kids with disabilities, and dogs that are trained to help them manage those disabilities. In this case, it is a dog that helps a kid with autism.

Would you deprive a blind kid of his guide dog?

People with disabilities are mainstreamed in the same schools as everyone else, and they have a right to whatever resources they need in order to function. If that is a dog, then let them bring the dog!

If you would require that they leave these dogs at home, what other tools and aides would you demand that disabled kids leave at home. Should kids with mobility impairments be forced to leave their wheelchairs at home? Or their crutches? If a kid is required to wear a helmet because of balance problems or a head injury, would you require that he leave the helmet at home?

:shrug:

Be aware that there are many autistic posters here on DU and this one thinks you are an ass.

:thumbsdown:

I had a hearing/signal service dog come to work with me everyday. Employees who were scared of dogs ended up loving her. Through my dog, Shane, they learned. I did not appreciate people screaming scared of my dog at some places. My dog wasn't interested in them at all. They need to be educated about service dogs and it's their parents' job, teachers', too.

You sound like one of those who jumps and screams at sight of a service dog like a fool.

I worked in a school where a handicapped student had a dog to assist him. It worked fine. The dog did his job, didn't bark or otherwise disturb class. And this kid got some special attention from other students because of it.

The only problem we had was to keep kids (and myself too) from talking to and petting the dog while he was on the job.

So why not? As long as the dog is certified to be trained for that purpose.

And they would have to demonstrate significant and specific benefits, not just it made the kid happy to have a dog around.

The only down side I see, assuming the above was adopted, would be that sooner or later it would get written into a kid's IEP and the school district would wind up having to pay for the dog as well as put up with it in school.

ASDA is a non-profit, community based organization that provides uniquely trained service dogs to children living with autism and their families. The placement of a dog with the child enables the child and family to increase their mobility and socialization as a family, and the child individually. In most cases the dog accompanies the child at all times when the child leaves home. The dog goes to school with the child and the presence of the dog calms the child, reduces emotional outbursts and serves as a positive social link for the child to their home, school and community.

http://www.autismservicedogsofamerica.com/

I will look into this for my kid.

and they seem to do just fine.

what is your definition of "do just fine?" What if they could do better if they had a dog? Would you deny it to them just because you thought they were doing well enough to suit you without it?

If it can be shown that a dog helps, then there is no legitimate reason to deny it.

I am referring to the kids w/ASD who are able to do what they need to do throughout the school day with the support of school staff when needed.

What if they could "do better with a dog"...define what you mean by doing badly or doing better.

Would I deny it to them? Oh come on, bait much? What makes you think I make the decision?

There could be legitimate reasons for not including a dog in a kid's school day but something tells me you might not want to consider those reasons so why bother.

when blind kids first wanted to bring guide dogs to school?

What new legitimate reasons are you proposing now?

and are generally a part of a specialized program that teaches the children how to work with the dog. They are used for functional pragmatic purposes that are significantly different from the needs of children with ASD.

Public schools serve the public, all of the public. There are children who are allergic to dogs, others that are very much afraid of them. Under the law these kids have rights too. Moreover, even if a dog has a calming effect on a child in the home, that does not guarantee that an animal will have the same effect in the school.

Can schools collaborate with parents? Yes, they can and they should. I will remind you however, that unless you have worked in a school setting, you have little idea of how difficult this can be with parents of students with ASD. On the one hand they want their son or daughter to be a part of a regular school environment for socialization and on the other some parents, surely not all, fail to appreciate that it is a process that is both beneficial and difficult to attain. Parents may attempt to make the school more of a treatment/therapeutic setting and that is not possible in a classroom with 20-28 kids. Schools are learning and offering more of what they know and that is good. To attack schools en masse not only lacks legitimacy, it encourages an adversarial relationship that is not productive for the student.

All of these issues can only be resolved on a case by case basis.

are generally NOT there in a program teaching the children how to work with the dog. That is done elsewhere. Dogs in the school are there as mobility aids and go wherever the children go.

Do you think kids that use guild dogs leave them at home when they go to school?

:wtf:

You are making this shit up as you go.

Would you like to spend 26 years with my kid? Get to know what you might be opining about? How about 26 minutes? I thought not.

After all, can a wheelchair be put into an IEP?

In fact, at our school, a wheelchair bound student has a table in class, rather than a desk. The table costs $90, desks $247.

I go to 50+ ARDs a year as the regular ed teacher, so please allow the dog in for student success.

Or we could make the kids with crutches leave 'em home, because other students are bothered by the sight of them. Right?

Good gawd! In the 60s, a girl that rode our bus scalded her arm in a hot water heater explosion at home, leaving a large scar. She was put into the special ed segregated campus downtown, never to be seen again by us. Because her arm was ugly. Her brain was fine.

Yeah, let's go back to those days!!

Anyone who thinks I need to signal sarcasm here cannot read well enough to be posting on a board.

:eyes:

valium poster children. I was in a convention hall with many junior high and high school students and viewed a service dog a few weeks ago. That sweet animal was not affected by the loud boisterous noises and would 100% attended to the blind girl's needs-commands."

Service dogs CAN BE smarter than some of those so-called honor roll brats ... especialy when you're measuring "emotional intelligence." :evilgrin:

Those K-9s are awesome!

There is a blind guy who sometimes rides the same bus I do when I go to work who has a service dog. The dog is amazing he/she just sits there underneath a seat and doesn't bark.

this is not the usual family pet - this is a dog that is very disciplined and performs a special service. It takes long periods of intensive training and just the right personality of dog.

Putting an assistance dog in the same category as the family pet is like putting a wheelchair in the same category as a scooter.

are asses.

then "asses" is a very mild description. I would call them criminally negligent in meeting that child's needs, willfully hostile, and bureaucratically obnoxious just for starters. :grr:

These are genuine service dogs, yet they may well cause difficulties for other students. The school will be sued whatever they do.

I love your cynicism. And you're probably right.

Seriously, it went something like this:

"My child has an irrational fear of dogs, and he shouldn't be put into a screaming fit for someone else's pleasure."

She was talking about the people who dared to walk their dogs on sidewalks in the residential section of Georgetown, DC without concern for the fact that there might be a fucking idiot who has reproduced and is walking the product of her neuroses down the street.

Letter to the editor of the Washington Post circa 1990.

:puke:

so how could they be sued for allowing a service dog for a student with autism? I don't see how there is any grounds for a valid lawsuit.

:shrug:

children with allergies, children with severe anxiety disorder, and children with post traumatic stress disorder related to a dog attack would all have severe difficult functioning in a classroom with a dog and these are all valid concerns. as a child i would NOT have been able to learn in a classroom with a dog, and would have gone into a panic attack. I have struggled with anxiety disorder since I was a child and dogs have always been one thing that has sent me into panic although now that I am older I can cope with some dogs (such as smaller or calm dogs, or dogs that I know very well) but as a child it would have been pure HELL for me. I've also babysat when I was a teen a couple of kids with severe allergies to dogs that could not be anywhere near where a dog had recently been so I can see that being a serious concern as well.

They certainly would not deny that other child the right to have his service animal because you need to be away from dogs.

That still isn't grounds for a lawsuit. Your anxiety isn't grounds to deny someone else something that is medically necessary.

:shrug:

an anxiety disorder is a psychiatric disorder, it is not a normal level of fear, it is as much a disorder as autism is. allergies are also a medical condition and could be even more problematic because the child with anxiety or PTSD could just be assigned to a different class/schedule but the allergic child might have trouble being in a place the dog recently was.

and what would you do in a small school with only 1 class per grade? whose disability/medical condition wins?

where you can deprive some kid of a service animal?

How many schools still exist with one room per grade? Really? :eyes:

The school district would have to find a way to accomodate both of you. You would be kept away from the dog, but you would NOT have a right to deprive someone else of a medically necessary service animal under any circumstances. Why are you so gung ho to try?

read this article:

http://www.bnd.com/news/local/story/891188.html

there is a child in the same class as the autistic child with a very severe allergy to dogs, and the school hasn't offered any suggestions besides using some sanitizers, because it's the only special ed pre-k at that particular school.

that child's mother says if the dog is in the classroom there is no possible way her child will be able to attend.

guess her kid's rights don't matter do they?

If it's only the kid's mother, then of course the school isn't going to do much. Lot's of people have allergies to dogs, but that is no reason to deny a kid his right to a service animal, and that is what this looks like. A whiny mother using a common dog allergy to deny a kid a right to a service animal, and you're backing her up.

Get a doctor behind it, certifying that the allergy is severe enough to be a medical necessity and that the kid MUST be kept away from all dogs, and then the school will find a solution that keeps that kid away from the dog.

the kid has severe allergies and lung disease and in the past when he was near dogs/cats he had to be HOSPITALIZED I think that sounds pretty f-ing serious.

but of course you want to automatically accuse her of LYING while testifying before a judge huh?

because of your issues?

Pretty much a no brainer.

It always calls for popcorn when you get a "My impossible-to-objectively-diagnose disability is more important than your impossible-to-objectively-diagnose disability" catfight.

:popcorn:

Autism and anxiety disorers are certainly objectively quantifiable and diagnosable. But hey, that means you don't get to make fun of those less able-bodied than you currently are, so why not label and judge?

is strictly an art. There is no objective test to measure the presence or the amount of either. There is no hierarchy between the two conditions, such as cancer being widely viewed as worse than H1N1 flu, although both can kill you.

It becomes a shouting match between "my right to have a dog in the classroom for something that didn't even exist a few decades ago" fans, and "my right to be free of the threatening presence of your well-trained dog, just because I have the right to be afraid" aficionados.

What's not to find entertaining?

and therefore, per this line of reasoning, the student who is blind is just as unjustified as teh student who is autistic.

However, with your statement that autism didn't exist a few decades ago ... well, what can one say to that kind of ignorance?

Not to paint with a broad brush, but you are *exactly* the stupid, loudmouthed reason why I left New York.

It was purely an art about a hundred and fifty years ago, then they found something odd called "science". People started finding germs, and tests for the germs, and vaccines to prevent the germs from getting a foothold in the body.

Of course, the world always has a need for an artist, so the "in my very expert opinion" people started moving on to the mental health realm. That way they are free to create their own definitions, diagnoses, and "this might work" cures for things that only they were 'qualified' to find and fix.

And as far as my state of residence, I'm a fairly recent immigrant to NY, spent most of my life out in the Pacific Northwest, especially in the rural country. We sure didn't have as many people running to shrinks there as they do here.

In any case, I'm sorry for interrupting your 'discussion', just here to watch. Pardon the expression, but I don't have a dog in this fight.

But if being anxious makes someone feel real special, who are we dealing with autism to deprive them of their unique personal qualities?

At least not in any way having a service dog around is going to realistically prevent.

I have moderate allergies to pet dander. About ten minutes in a room where a dog has been recently and I start choking on post-nasal drip. I lose my voice in about twenty minutes and have a screaming migraine in about half an hour. More than an hour, I get hives (worse if the dog licks me... I'm severely allergic to dog saliva). The congestion makes me dizzy and exhausted. I can't concentrate, I'm nauseous... the only thing that works is going home and trying to sleep it off.

Daily exposure to that kind of environment gives me sinus infections from the constant congestion which become ear infections which impact my ability to hear. I'm mostly deaf in my left ear from a four month long ear/sinus infection brought on by mold in a classroom I was teaching in. Drugs don't work. The only thing that works is getting out of the environment.

And those are moderate allergies. Kids with asthma end up in the hospital all the time. Anaphylactic reactions are severely and immediately life-threatening.

Many kids can't function if they are put in a room with something they are allergic too. If the autistic kids are already going to school, then they are functioning to a certain extent without the dog already.

Sorry, but being able to breathe trumps animal companionship in my book. I don't agree with a blanket ban on service dogs, the school does need to make accommodations for all kids, but it's total ignorance to minimize the impact of allergies on kids and to tell them to suck it up.

who has been frustrated beyond the ability to cope.

Physical violence should never trump political correctness (or lawyers).

:shrug:

My school is one round, meaning we have one 1st grade, one 2nd grade, etc.

We had to get rid of peanuts because of the kids with peanut allergies. We have had a drastic increase in the number of kids with asthma and many of them are also allergic to dogs. In terms of numbers only, the kids with allergies would greatly outnumber the kids who need a service dog. We have to serve all the kids but I don't see the kid with the service dog winning this one.

and tell them to find another school? :shrug:

If that's how your school district handles it, as long as the kid ends up in a school that can accept the dog, then the kid would be in a better school anyway.

Sounds like this kid would be better served there.

But if there are kids in that program who are allergic to dogs, then I guess you believe they should be banished.

with disabilities. I don't think school districts can take the easy escape of writing off any child because a disability is too complicated or unpopular.

How do we accommodate kids who are allergic to dogs and the kids who need service dogs?

then I guess you choose which kid you want to keep, and the other one gets shipped to another school. I can guess which one you'll choose to get rid of.

It's actually a team decision.

Other factors that need to be considered are the layout of the building and transportation.

It's not as easy as putting two kids names in a hat and deciding which one stays and which one goes.

Just asking.

I don't teach in Kansas. And it's pretty OT as well.

A fact they learned when she was three, and a neighbors friendly dog came up and licked her on the face. Her heart stopped three times over the next several hours, but some very good doctors managed to keep her alive, and she's a healthy 9 year old today.

The thing is, dog allergies aren't like cat allergies. Dogs don't produce allergens in dander the way cats do, and allergen generally requires direct contact with the dog. Saliva is one of the worst vectors for allergens.

A year or two ago she was put in a classroom with a blind child and a seeing eye dog. When her parents pointed out to the school that they were creating a potentially life threatening situation, the school transferred the blind child to another classroom. It was a simple accommodation that kept both kids safe and happy. Few schools nowadays only have one classroom for each grade level, so these kinds of accommodations are easy to make.

I don't think that objecting to the dogs presence on campus ever occurred to him. He didn't care that she had a seeing eye dog, he just didn't want the dog in the same classroom with his deathly allergic daughter.

... there could easily be only one classroom in the district set up to accommodate him. They cannot always put autistic children in general-ed classes.

autistic child knows how hard they have it. If these dogs are helping kids to learn, behave and be safe, what's their fucking problem? rec'd

The Americans With Disabilities act is not just a guideline, IT'S THE LAW! Schools don't get to flout laws because they think it's inconvenient. that kind of attitude made school hell for me.

Schools don't get to flout laws because they think it's inconvenient.

Apparently Hawai'i schools aren't the only ones slow to get the message. :grr: :banghead:

I still have PTSD from the emotional abuse by faculty.

then those schools better be ready to make accomodations for students that CANNOT be in a classroom with a dog.

and it will just go on and on and on.

but there are valid medical/health/safety reasons why some students just CAN'T be around a dog.

the same dog that calms one autistic child may send another child in that classroom into a panic attack, or cause anaphylactic attack in another child.

And since they will outnumber the kids with service dogs, guess who will likely win this one?

There are dogs who are hypoallergenic. My Schnauzers are and my Mom has sold them, over and over, to people with dog allergies. Never has one been returned. I have never seen a Schnauzer as a service dog but if this whole allergy thing is an issue then it could possibly be resolved. As for the whole anxiety thing with dogs, perhaps the parents should get therapy for their kids since dogs are everywhere and it will be a hardship on the child to go through life so afraid. Heck, having a dog in the classroom may even help. Schnauzers are great with kids and may even help some children alleviate their fears. In the rare one room per grade classroom the child with anxiety would be on one side of the classroom and the child with the Schnauzer would be on the other.

:shrug:

I hate dogs, they are so overrated. Cats are so much better,cleaner, and cuter.

Back to the story, if the kids really need these dogs they should be allowed to go to school with them.

because I HATE CATS ... (well, save for my part time tabby who behaves, IMO, acts like a dog :blush:).

And your point is ? :(

I know that had nothing to do with the issue, just being cheeky. Geez, some people on this board are so sensitive and have no sense of humor.:eyes: :eyes:

IMO, less that thoughtful. As you can tell I don't HATE felines.

There are good people who STRONGLY prefer one over the other. However, I bantered with you for being *over the top.*

I'm sorry if your sensibilites were tested but you brought it upon yourself. :shrug:

:-) :hi:

I have an anxiety disorder, which was particularly severe when I was young, and one of the things that triggered it when I was a child was dogs. I was deathly terrified of dogs, and I still am of certain kinds to this day though I'm ok around small or calm dogs now. I would have had a panic attack if there was one in my classroom. I would not have been able to learn or function at all if there was a dog there because I was so deathly terrified of them and it caused me anxiety attacks. Although perhaps an option would be to assign children who have severe anxiety or allergies, and students who need the dogs for valid reasons, into seperate classes? Surely allergies and severe anxiety are just as valid concerns as autism.

if there is a child with a fear of dogs in the classroom. But what if the child needing the dog is blind rather than autistic?

I see the "other side" in this particular debate not as one student with an allergy or medical condition versus a child with a disability, but rather as the school board versus "yet another" demand from a family with an autistic child. These conversations/discussions/fights are new, institutionally speaking, to school administrators, and very often their first reaction (this is based on my family's personal experience and experiences related to me by parents of my child's schoolmates) is "No; we've never had to do this before and law notwithstanding, you can't do it."

Secondly, I am glad to know that you have your condition under better control now than when you were a child. I have to wonder how to manage around service animals nowadays?

but part of that is I know as an adult I have the power to remove myself from the situation, if a dog is making me nervous I can just walk away. If a dog started jumping on me or barking loudly at me I'd freak out but otherwise I'd just be able to walk away if I needed.

trained dog in a classroom may actually help all the students. I have a vague notion that most kids respond well and settle down in the presence of a nice dog.

Though, concealed carry with a labradoodle might be a little hairy.

:spray:

On a more serious note, what happens when there are two autistic kids
in a class and their dogs don't get on? Sounds like a recipe for a riot ...

Dogs are very sensitive to rising blood sugar levels in diabetics (probably based on the smell of ketones but other factors may be involved). My daughter was paired with Butch a trained service dog, again a Labrador retriever. He was her constant companion during her senior year in high school and alerted us several time before she suffered from high blood sugars which were not detected by her glucose meter. We are now working with the university to determine if Butch will be able to room with her in the dorm.

when placing students in classes?

if parents can ask that their child not be taught by a teacher they dislike or not be in a class with another particular student that harasses their child (or vice versa), then why shouldn't parents be able to specify that their child not share a classroom with a service animal because of an allergy?