Chavez: Israel and US 'Empire' Are Enemies

Source: Associated Press

By THE ASSOCIATED PRESS
Published: June 27, 2010

Filed at 8:26 p.m. ET

CARACAS, Venezuela (AP) -- Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez denounced Israel as a ''genocidal'' government on Sunday as he hosted Syrian President Bashar Assad on his first visit to Latin America.

Chavez has drawn close to Syria and Iran, and cut ties with Israel last year to protest its military offensive in the Gaza Strip.

''We have common enemies,'' Chavez said, describing them as ''the Yankee empire, the genocidal state of Israel.''

Chavez had particularly strong words for Israel throughout Assad's visit. He reiterated his view Saturday that the Golan Heights -- captured from Syria by Israel in the 1967 Mideast war -- should one day be returned to Syria.


Read more: http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2010/06/27/world/AP-LT-Venezuela-Syria.html?_r=1&ref=news

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Isn't this the same guy who thinks the U.S. caused the earthquake in Haiti?

"On January 18, 2010 the television channel ViVe, communication organ of the Venezuelan government(es:Govierno Bolivariano de Venezuela) published a note accusing United States of America of producing the earthquake as a series of experimental earthquakes. The note also links US navy to an earthquake that hit the city of Eureka, California as well as the earthquake in Sichuan, China, May 12 of 2008. The note claims that these earthquakes were produced by a combination of explosions and technology developed within the HAARP."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_%E2%80%93_Venezuela_relations

Sounds as implausible as Iraq having WMD, doesn't it?

the tsunamai.

...and less on supporting his "brothers" Mugabe and Ahmadinejad and now Assad.

Anyway, this is sure to garner the support of all the Israeli haters, so probably a pretty clever effort on his part at solidifying his international base of kooks.

But we have warships on the coast of Iran.

And yes we should be focusing more on our failing economy also. In case you haven't noticed, we are headed toward 3rd world status ourselves... continuing loss of jobs, infrastructure still falling into disrepair.

Some of us have a different list of 'international base kooks'.

1st world V 2nd world V 3rd world means.


Although some people like to think that has something to do with financial situations, it is a cold-war classification based off alliances.

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to be my enemies, too. Nothing that these corporate rulers and war profiteers do is for my benefit, nor for the benefit of most people, and, indeed, much that they do causes great harm to me and mine, and to my country, the USA--and very likely to most people in Israel as well. And I'm sure, if questioned, Chavez would make the same distinction--between the people and their ideals, and the real rulers of these countries: multinational corporations, banksters and war profiteers.

we have a winner,right here sir, you correct,its time our citizen were told who the real thugs are.

But I could only see it after drinking enough MD 50/50 to melt the brain cells where I retain information about Kim Jong-Il.

The two are nothing alike. Aside from being chubby and needing better barbers, perhaps.

The dissimilarities are profound and numerous.

One inherited the leadership from his father, one was democratically elected from the people.
One starves his people and constantly threatens to blow up his neighbors, the other works to improve the lot of the common people and makes alliances with his neighbors.

I could go on and on, but I doubt your talking points will be affected.

I don't see the parallel.

Have we supported a coup attempt against Kim Jong-il like the one the U.S. backed against Chavez in 2002?

Was Kim Jong-il democratically elected?

You do it every time, Z! I've learned to push my keyboard to the side and swallow all liquids before I read your posts.

Thanks for the giggle.

and both need the US boogeyman to blame for their economic policy failures.

Venezuela, Syria, and Iran...allies. This has Three Stooges-type comedy potential.

Please let this go on. Please.

but a report by the RUSSIAN NAVY. The Ven government had it up briefly and then pulled it. Russia Today attributed it to Chavez in a film clip that showed him giving some other speech. He never said it and probably still doesn't know you think he did. lol

coffee table book with illustrations. I'd love to do it! lol

that identifies that earthquake report prepared by the Russian Navy.

http://www.abc.es/20100119/internacional-/chavez-acusa-provocar-seismo-201001191332.html

And this is a link to the Russia Today video which uses file footage of Chavez, and not a video of him making this claim because he never did.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=385&topic_id=426368

Once more, the same pattern replays itself. Simply pathetic beyond endurance.

Thanks for your comments on both threads.

He is getting more and more desperate to get headlines. He is a troll that will be forgotten.

..and the reason there are such ferocious arguments about Chavez here on DU is because there is a relatively small, but very vocal group on the left that actually think what Chavez is doing in Venezuela is a good idea, and those people would support such policies here.

There is a militant, socialist wing whom really believe government, top down, command and control economies are a wonderful idea. The fact that these fail everywhere does not dissuade these folks - they just blame the failures on this, that or the other.

As the Venezuelan economy continues to falter and these marxist style schemes Chavez has been trying to implement all fail, the Chavez cheerleaders will blame it all on the CIA, some international conspiracy, the "banksters", etc, etc. Sadly, there are a group of people that just can't comprehend the idea that the government will never be able to run farms, shops, etc, nearly as well as the private sector. There really are still people that think that any private sector is a bad thing.

The domestic policies of the Venezuelan government don't concern me, because I'm not a citizen of Venezuela. They are strictly the business of Venezuelans, therefore I have no right to criticize them, even if I do disagree with them. The only thing that concerns me, is that they have a genuine democratic process, which they do. But I have a certain amount of respect for the sovereignty of other nations.

Your second paragraph tells me it is you who has an ideological agenda, not necessarily the "militant, socialist wing" (which is rightist code for 'progressives').

Your third paragraph is an attempted denial of the well established pattern of interventionist policies in Latin America by the U.S. government. Extensive historical documentation renders it utter nonsense.

Because we are not venezuelans we can't even comment or express an opinion about chavez or venezuelan politics?

Wow. Until I read your post I though I was over being suprised at what I read on DU.

Also, they didn't say anti-Venezuelan Americans can't comment - what he said was that domestic Venezuelan politics wasn't a concern of his. Not sure at all how that gets turned into isolationism. As far as I'm concerned, domestic Australian politics isn't the concern of Americans either. There's actually a huge difference between what the poster said and what you then turn around and claim they said.

I've yet to see anyone on DU say that anti-Venezuelan types can't express an opinion about Chavez. I actually find the gnashing of teeth and OTT hysteria by some quite hilarious to watch in action...

The domestic policies of the Israeli government don't concern me, because I'm not a citizen of Israel. They are strictly the business of Israelis, therefore I have no right to criticize them, even if I do disagree with them. The only thing that concerns me, is that they have a genuine democratic process, which they do. But I have a certain amount of respect for the sovereignty of other nations.


Are you willing to stop posting about domestic Israeli policies? Because as you well know, we have an entire sub forum where DUers comment, criticize, and second-guess DOMESTIC ISRAELI POLICY.

Funny how at DU Venezuela is treated as a special case, I wonder why that is.

The reorganization of the economy and the popular reforms that took place in Venezuela under the leadership of a democratically elected president, can, in no way, be accurately compared to what transpires in Israel. The policies you are referring to in your analogy, are not really 'domestic', as they concern another nation of people, for whom there is definitely no democracy.

I'll say no more about that topic on this thread. You should choose another analogy.

It's not, though I suspect those who believe in that revolting Greater Israel rubbish would be confused and think the Occupied Territories was a domestic issue...

Regardless of that, you incorrectly claimed the poster you were replying to had said something they hadn't...

Seeing I'm aware of yr very strong and unquestioning support for Israel, what I'd like to know is what are yr criticisms of the Venezuelan government. I just don't get how someone who can support what the Israeli govt does could find anything to criticise the Venezuelan government for, unless the criticism is that they're not extreme RW enough...


Funny how there's some DUers who blindly support just about everything an extreme RW Israeli government does, then turn around and have head explosions about Venezuela. I wonder why that is?

have regional, and frequently global, ramifications. Think Greece, Portugal, Hungary, Spain . . . Venezuela does not act in a vacuum, and its "politics" are as much a global concern as the "politics" of any other country with transnational economic and alliance reach.

but that is still not a logical rationalization for intervening in the affairs of other countries. Covert war and political/economic coercion only generate more conflict. Differences over how to organize a global economy, should be settled through dialog and negotiation, with respect to the sovereignty of others.

It's all about strategic advantage and control over resources and markets, anyway. The premise for your reality -- a world where U.S. political elites operate out of a sense altruism, with a concern for democracy and "free" markets -- is a bunch of hooey, to begin with.

Covert war and coercion? Sheesh. I was responding to a poster who suggested that Americans have no business criticizing, discussing (or perhaps even just taking an interest in) the domestic policies of Venezuela.

And "the premise for (my) reality"? Thank you, Uri Geller, but as usual, you're famously full of it.

you cited the "global ramifications" of Venezuelan "politics" as a reason for "concern", seemingly echoing attempted justifications that I have heard many times.

I apologize for any confusion on my part.

Anyway, following, is a sample of the level of 'discourse', one can expect from your average 'concerned' Chavez detractor:

- "troll"

- "Israeli haters"

- "Kim Jong-il"

- "Three Stooges"

- "president for life"

- "F'ing Dictator-Wannabe"

Not a whole lot of substance.

This one is about Chavez denouncing Israel while hosting Syrian President Assad.

(And thanks so much for those examples. But if you're going to rattle off irrelevancies, next time make it a list of good chocolate chip cookie recipes. At least that would be useful.)

Have you absolutely nothing to say about the topic under discussion?

I think I can understand why you have posted only 37 times in seven years.

The statement by Chavez that Israel and the U.S. "empire" are enemies is stock stump speech material for his fans, akin to the very examples you provided of unhelpful and non-substantive criticism of Chavez. In addition, Chavez's statements, made in connection with a meeting between Chavez and Syrian President Assad, cannot remotely be categorized as "domestic politics." Hence, even if one accepts the admonition that Americans have no business commenting on Venezuelan domestic politics (the proposition that I took issue with in my original post), Chavez's statements fall outside that allegedly forbidden category.

While you rather obviously feel the need to fight someone, anyone apparently, I'm still at a loss as to why you chose my original post as a launching pad for your vitriol. Ah well, such is the nature of internet discussion boards.

because of the violence they perpetrate in the world, and he declares the U.S. an empire, because the U.S. government has an easily traceable history of imperialism. It's really that simple.

"Fight"? "Vitriol"? I like to read and occasionally make comments about the topics under discussion. I have no interest in getting personal. If you feel intimidated about being inadequately informed - and clearly you are - you can remedy that by simply reading and informing yourself about the given topic and avoid posting nonsense.

Good day to you, LTX.

You have no interest in getting personal. You're just identifying my "reality" for me, declaring that my few posts mark me as having nothing to say, patently implying that I am sympathetic to name calling as a substitute for meaningful critiques of Chavez's government, and kindly informing me that I am "inadequately informed," "intimidated" by my own ignorance, and "posting nonsense." All of this triggered only by my comment that the domestic policies of Venezuela, as well as the domestic policies of any other country with transnational economic and alliance reach, are fairly subject to discussion and critique. But hey, nothing personal.

As for Chavez's non-substantive and inflammatory comments, they are of no help to the negotiation and diplomacy you identified some posts back as the sine qua non of global health. Indeed, it was not that long ago that the U.S. had a president prone to such injudicious juvenility. He was roundly and properly criticized here for his alienating language about Islamofacism, the "axis of evil, etc. It is not beyond the pale to suggest that Chavez's language is of equal impropriety.

all 'inflamed' over the truthful words from the leader of country that has itself been victimized by U.S. intervention.

And another comparison between President Chavez and George W. Bush; as if words are in any way equal to the orgies of death and destruction unleashed by Bush and his predecessors (the U.S. became an empire in earnest, many, many years ago, not under the Bush regime) It isn't really "inflammatory" language that makes diplomacy difficult, it's the NED, USAID, IRI, CIA and so on, along with all the other pieces of the apparatus that institutes U.S. imperialism, along with U.S. foreign policies that focus on militarism and dominance, instead of dialog and respect for sovereignty.

It is very difficult to take seriously the prattling of rightists. Even when they do attempt to learn something about history, their ideology makes it impossible for them to properly analyze and interpret the facts.

I've had my fill of you, LTX. See ya. :hi:

Now I'm a "prattling rightist" as well. Next, I suppose, I'll be a baby-killer, for some damn reason. You have a curious definition of "personal."

Perhaps someday you'll explain what actually triggered your sociopathic reactions. It certainly couldn't have been my original comment, which was simply an observation that discussion and critique of other governmental policies is appropriate (not to mention one of the purposes of this discussion board). In the meantime, I've had my fill of you as well. Conversing with self-important, insufferable, and paranoid half-wits isn't very productive. Nothing personal.

We just aren't allowed to argue on the same playing field as you. it took harsh rules for you to get what you wanted, an echo chamber of right wing garbage.

A social system based on equality and social justice, with common ownership of the means of production and distribution...

(Economics) an economic theory or system in which the means of production, distribution, and exchange are owned by the community collectively (for the dense among you - Community = all the people together). It is characterized by production for use rather than profit, by equality of individual wealth, by the absence of competitive economic activity, and, usually, by the community determining investment and production levels...

Learn what the fuck you're talking about before displaying your utter ignorance! OK?!!??

as if it is only a matter of opinion; as if the U.S. doesn't have hundreds of military bases all over the world, and doesn't impose its political and economic will on other nations. Only the profoundly ignorant and/or stupid, cannot see that the U.S. is, in fact, an empire.

Be good enough to review post #19, from EFerrari:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=4444762&mesg_id=4444965

I'd claim I was misquoted too if I said something that stupid.

Video: http://showhype.com/video/hugo-chavez-us-navy-created-haiti-earthquake-haarp/

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q9QtZkT8OBQ

but nice try. It was the Russian Navy that issued that claim and Russia Today attributed it to Chavez.

ETA: He wasn't "misquoted" because there is no quote at all and you yourself are "quoting" the Iranian state controlled news outlet.

continue to promote this lie?

http://www.caribbeannetnews.com/news-23751--12-12--.html

but if Chavez declares the US his enemy, Obama certainly has the green light to continue ignoring him. no problem

He gets the green light for sure.

the people around him. The people in the planning ministry, and PDVSA, aren't firing on all cylinders. This is why the Venezuelan economy is a wreck.

in a peaceful transition of power. His economy is collapsing and he is talking about israel. What a moron.

I see... the right wing ok, the left wing bad. No bias there...

Does Israel even play baseball?

Down with the corporate press!

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