Third most-wanted Nazi suspect charged in Germany

Source: AP

BERLIN – The world's third most-wanted Nazi suspect, who lived undisturbed for decades after World War II, has been charged in Germany with participating in the murder of 430,000 Jews while serving as a low-ranking guard at a death camp.

Samuel Kunz, 88, had long been ignored by the German justice system, partly because of a lack of interest in going after relatively minor Nazi figures. But in the past 10 years, a younger generation of prosecutors has sought to bring all surviving suspects to justice.

Authorities recently stumbled over Kunz's case as they were studying old documents from German post-wars trials about an SS training camp named Trawniki. The papers were being reviewed in connection with the trial of John Demjanjuk, the 90-year-old retired autoworker on trial in Munich for allegedly serving as a guard at the infamous Sobibor camp.

Kunz was named the No. 3 suspect in April by the Simon Wiesenthal Center. He ranked fairly low in the Nazi hierarchy, but he was among the most-wanted suspects because of the large number of Jews he is accused of helping to kill.

Read more: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100728/ap_on_re_eu/eu_germany_nazi_suspect

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Breaking Uncensored Activist News - http://activistnews.blogspot.com

Wow, and I know DU'ers that are just positive that soldiers killing others in war under any circumstances is fair.

Don't you know how accurate bombs and missiles are these days? War is a safe, sanitary, and above all, law-abiding normal and ordinary function of the US government. Pursuant to Article XXVIII of the US Constitution: WAR IS PEACE

Did you miss school when they were covering the 3rd Reich? Is making stupid comparisons to the Nazis giving you some kind of weird rush, like oooo man I am such a radical look at me!!!!!!

the knowledge that my government has engaged in illegal acts of aggression and bombs civilians in "theaters", inside and outside of declared war zones, and sacrifices its young for nothing more than political games, does not give me any "weird rush". Knowing my government has engaged in systematic torture, and continues to commit the crimes of war and to cover up for the crimes of past administrations --war crimes, torture, the systematic destruction of constitutionally protected civil liberties--does not give me any "weird rush". It fills me rather with sorrow and pity.

I believe that I probably learned "this attitude", which pains you so much as to attack me personally, in the church my parents attended. And that is all I have to say to you.

Preach it!

:)

have you missed the news lately? "I was just following orders" is now an acceptable excuse to avoid war crimes charges. War crimes are what OTHER countries do. We just interrogate people who sometimes just happen to die during interrogation.

Back in the day lawyers went to prison for doing what John Yue did. Newspaper editors went to prison for doing what Fox News does.

But that was then and this is now.

Did you miss school when they were covering the 3rd Reich? Is making stupid comparisons to the Nazis giving you some kind of weird rush, like oooo man I am such a radical look at me!!!!!!


And if you haven't learned it, maybe you have some reading to do. I suggest you head to this thread:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x8830605

which tells how $14 tax dollars goes to war for every $1 that goes to investing in the human resources of our country.

How sick is that? How dare you question the sensitivities of this longtime DU poster when this outrage continues year after year after year. Those of us who have been around this forum have protested and campaigned against these endless wars and now that we have a Democrat in the office of the presidency, we see no end to the wars. It is BAU. Can you not understand the attitude?!????

Your comment disgusts me.


Cher

never be diminished to make the obvious point about war.

who wants to "look forward" when it comes to crimes committed by the Bush Administration. I suppose it's the president's way of covering his own ass given his decision to continue the policy of endless war.

Killing soldiers in combat is not a war crime and the killing of civilians in war time is usually not a war crime. Killing prisoners is a crime and that is what this guy is accused of doing. D-day (the invasion of France) resulted in thousands of casualties. Were they war crimes?

Correct me if I'm wrong but weren't we trying to rid them of foreign rule that had invaded them 4 years earlier and had murdered over 100.000 civilians? Sometimes war kind of sucks.

I guess you think we should have just sat back and said, "Your cool" just don't invade anyone else. That seemed to work earlier. After all. The Germans only occupied/invaded the Rhineland, Austria, Czechoslovakia (twice), part of Lithuania, Poland and after the Brits and French declared war Albania, Austria, Belgium, part of Britain, part of the USSR, Denmark, Estonia, France, Greece, Latvia, the rest of Lithuania, Luxembourg, The Netherlands, Norway, Poland and Yugoslavia. Were the efforts to fight them at risk to civilian casualties war crimes?

prosecuted. And when prosecution is unavoidable, punishment by us is a slap on the wrist. (Lt. Calley.) Still, it is a war crime.

A clash between one nation's military and another usually is not a war crime, so I'm not sure why you're lumping D-Day or any clash between Axis Forces and Allied Forces in with killing of civilians and killing of prisoners.

war tragedies with war crimes. There is a difference. Whenever there is war awful things will result. It is that which makes war a thing to avoid. Having a wide definition of war crimes to include all civilians killed during war, does minimize the real war crimes that are codified in international law treaties.

No one is getting prosecuted for that either.

The US government policies HAVE in fact changed since the Bush/Cheney torture days.

When the government in power modifies the definition of torture, blames lower level people, etc. it may just be the case they can escape from court prosecution. Although they did suffer politically and likely will in the future.

I am not sure what you expect to be done at this point but I am guessing it is something that is politically unwise as well as unfeasible and that you just want to be a pain in the ass of the Democrats.

and Obama has said he will not prosecute or even investigate members of the Bush Administration for crimes.

And if you want to pretend that war crimes are not being committed in Iraq and Afghanistan now because we're the good guys, you go right ahead.

that war crimes are being committed today, then go right ahead.

I mentioned D-day because it is often unavoidable to kill a nation's military without killing their civilian's as well.

When you bomb a factory making war materials there may be civilians working inside of it. That is not a war crime.

When you bomb a city that has many factories in it people will be killed. That is not a war crime.

When you destroy a dam that provides power to factories or stores water to irrigate farms that grow food for both civilians and the armed forces, as a result people go hungry or starve and people down stream either drown or lose their homes. That is not a war crime.

When you impose sanctions against a country for their actions and as a result both the military and the civilians suffer that is not a war crime.

When you send a teenager strapped to a bomb and blow up a bus loaded with civilians that is not a war crime. It is terrorism.

In war time very often the military and civilian population are co-mingled. Since 2001 over 8,600 unguided rockets have been launched against Israel killing at least 28 people mostly civilians. Israel counter attacked killing over a thousand Palestinians many if not most were civilians. That was not a war crime.

When you kill or starve prisoners that is a war crime. Once someone is in your custody they are your responsibility.

non-combatants, that is a war crime. The tactic is not the dispositive factor. And non-combatants are not always civilians - for example military Chaplains & Doctors are non-combatants. If captured, officially they are detainees instead of POWs.

Blowing a dam might be OK or it might be a war crime - the OSD lawyers look at the circumstances & military objectives and determine if the military effects are appropriately proportionate. Killing a million non-combatants to take out one national guard armory would not pass the test.

Targeting a hospital marked with the red cross/red crescent is a war crime. Hiding combatant forces behind the red cross or red crescent is a war crime. Intentionally shooting a medic who is wearing the big red cross on his/her helmet or arm band is a war crime.

Targeting people with white phosphorous (WP) is a war crime. Targeting their equipment with WP is not.

The most common war crime is an illegal combatant - one not carrying arms openly and wearing a readily-identifiable uniform are examples - but an illegal combatant essentially is combat action by one not legally entitled to engage in combat. A Chaplain who picks up a rifle and storms the hill is an illegal combatant.

Terrorism may or may not be a war crime. Terrorism that intentionally targets non-combatants (chaplains, doctors, most civilians) is a war crime. Terrorism that blows up the enemy command post or civilian war production factories is not.

Most of the Nazi concentration camp guards technically weren't committing war crimes but were instead committing crimes against humanity - but since it happened during WWII, it is casually called war crimes.

posted wrong place.

WAY too long for my tastes.

This guy was 23 at the end of WWII, how much command authority would he have had?

Yes, I know the Germans pressed young teenagers into service at the bitter end, but do we hold them responsible for the atrocities of that time, or do we blame those who gave them absolutely zero choice about the matter?

The longest-lived man ever died at 115. So, 18 in 1945 + 97 years = 2042.

Stop hunting Nazis in 2042.

Works for me.

the North Vietnamese feel about any MIA's they haven't returned yet.

:wtf:

They should be able to hunt him down and deal with him in their own way as they see fit.
He was given a slap on the wrist by the US. Our Govt had no intention of punishing him. It was as if a German court gave Adolph Eichmann a $100 fine for his crimes.
In Lt Calley's case, justice was not served. He still walks among us, a depraved animal that should be put down.

they surely would have exacted a penalty of him.

Funny thing is, one of his greatest defenders was Jimmy Carter.

there is still hope that the previous administration and their war hounds will be prosecuted. It has been proven they lied about all of the evidence they claimed against Sadam.

We're too busy with "important stuff" to bother with the frivolity of war crimes - that we commit. We'll bank the appropriate outrage for when such crimes are perpetrated against US.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/opinion/2010/0729/1224275691999.html

This week we had a conviction of one of the Killing Fields criminals - Kaing Guek Eav. That is GOOD news in the sense that some justice is being done, and should give Americans who have participated in war crimes, and ordered killings and torture in violation of international law something to think about.

The BAD news is that, at the rate justice moves on atrocities in Cambodia, Argentina, and (of course) Germany, it could be in the 2030s or 2040s before the international community can actually get some of these folks arrested and convicted. That means they might nail someone like Yoo, but Cheney will be long gone, and Bush will be gone or be a very, very old man.

Bushco, our nationals, off the table and we shut down the Spanish judge who wanted them brought to justice, because we're powerful. I am not sure what hope there is for prosecution of Bushco.

May justice come to all who participated in the Holocaust and the mass-murders of untold millions more -- then and to this present day.

I have always been sensitive to the plight of our Jewish brothers and sisters and the inhumanity of the German 3rd Reich against them. Yes, I am a Catholic and a bleeding heart liberal and quite proud of it, but I am always incensed by that act of savagery against these people. I detest those who mnimize the horrors of that hellish time. I come from a small impoverished New England village. One of my teachers was Jewish and I love and respect her to this day. She always represented to me what the Jewish people are, beautiful, bright, caring, nurturing, Godly people. I have never forgotten her because her heart was so much bigger than life. She was the best teacher any school could have. If she were alive today she would be I suspect 95 or so. I hope and pray she is alive and well. I can't quite grasp the totality of the Nazi reign of terror except that the world has been deprived of 6 million Sarah Smalley's. I think of her often when I grapple with my English even at my tender age of 66. I also recall reading a horrific story about another Jewish woman I read about in the Palm Beach Post a couple years ago of a concentration camp she survived. The story featured her life since being liberated from the death camp and of her struggle to pick up from nothing to make a life for herself. She ultimately found her way to south Florida, married and raised a family. Photos depicted a beautiful woman in her 80's, proud to have raised a family of high achieving children. Still bearing the Nazi concentration identification numbers on her arm a reader can only thank God she survived to bear witness. Only the hardest of the heartless in the same county that houses the infamous Stormfront Nazi organization could read this story and not labor through a wet eye to get to the end. She was well loved by everyone who ever knew her, she was highly respected, she was kind. She was somebody's loving daughter, somebody's sister, and embodied the humanity that is so lacking in so many people. As a human family on this 3rd rock from the sun, the world has been diminished by the loss of so many at the hands of a maniacle homicidal clutch of the worse vermin among us.

I want every last one of the Nazi's responsible for their criminal acts prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law regardless how old or feeble they might be. We should never be complacent. Our brothers and sisters cry out from their graves for justice and we owe them that much!

in fact, the reverse happened under guidance of America -- Operation Paperclip !!

This is the history which the world is still ignoring and which many Americans are

still ignorant!

it really makes me angry that they got to do whatever they wanted in life until their sixties, seventies, eighties and even nineties. thr 1930's and 1940's were a lifetime ago.

program to not only save them but to funnel them into the American government --

CIA/FBI/NASA, etal --

And the running of Nazis thru the Vatican's "rat holes" --

all remains shocking --

In a book called "The Secret War Against The Jews --
How Western Espionage Betrayed The Jewish People --"

http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias%3Dus-stripbooks-tree&field-keywords=The+Secret+War+Against+the+Jews&ih=27_5_0_0_1_0_1_1_0_1.15_166&fsc=-1&x=19&y=22


The title is kind of a misnomer -- and it's quite a book!

Still haven't gotten thru it 100% -- and have owned it for years --

but it mentions that in the push for a Jewish homeland for Jewish War Refugees . . .

evidently Nelson Rockefeller was KEY in the discussions -- his say was final . . . ????

And, he did finally agree to the "homeland" proposal with the proviso that in return

there would BE NO PURSUIT OF NAZIS - no effort to bring them to justice!

Simon Weisenthal somehow wiggled thru that agreement -- but there were no nationwide

manhunts in any of the effected nations -- that's for sure!!

Always amazed me!

:)

be a good move. he never repented, ever.

Which one is that?

to help with our space program. he has his name on a building I think at the Johnson space center. He is Werner Von Braun. He never was repentant and he often spewed shit.

He was the head of the Marshall Space Flight Center in Huntsville, Alabama, and that center and Houston were rivals for dominance within NASA. As NASA funds dried up toward the end of the Apollo program, the rivalry grew very bitter. Jobs and possibly the continued existence of one of the centers were at stake.

I almost bumped into von Braun when I worked at NASA in Houston during that era. "Almost" because I stepped aside. He kept walking, glaring at me and everyone else there. I suppose politics might have dictated naming a building at JSC after him, but I bet the JSC people were forcing their smiles and kind words.

(I was born in England during WWII, and I was tempted to jump up and down in front of him, saying, "You missed me! You missed me!" But I didn't.)

Not that I mind fascist bastards getting what is due to them, but, ......eh. Nazi scum getting what is coming to them is fine in whatever form it takes, but the heirarchy seems odd. Barak or Livni almost certainly have a higher body count than this flunky. :shrug:

You actually believe that?

Interesting that you would use this as an opportunity to try to compare Israeli leaders to Nazis. Even though the article posted has nothing to do with Israel.

They're responsible for the murder of a large number of Palestinian civilians and should be brought to justice. While they're not Nazis or comparable to Nazis, I strongly believe and hope you'd agree that it's not only Nazis who have committed war crimes and should be held responsible for them...

So age 23 at the end of the war. How high up could he have been?

:shrug: