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True_Blue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 11:37 AM
Original message
The Return of the Draft
Uncle Sam wants you. He needs you. He'll bribe you to sign up. He'll strong-arm you to re-enlist. And if that's not enough, he's got a plan to draft you.

In the three decades since the Vietnam War, the "all-volunteer Army" has become a bedrock principle of the American military. "It's a magnificent force," Vice President Dick Cheney declared during the election campaign last fall, "because those serving are ones who signed up to serve." But with the Army and Marines perilously overextended by the war in Iraq, that volunteer foundation is starting to crack. The "weekend warriors" of the Army Reserve and the National Guard now make up almost half the fighting force on the front lines, and young officers in the Reserve are retiring in droves. The Pentagon, which can barely attract enough recruits to maintain current troop levels, has involuntarily extended the enlistments of as many as 100,000 soldiers. Desperate for troops, the Army has lowered its standards to let in twenty-five percent more high school dropouts, and the Marines are now offering as much as $30,000 to anyone who re-enlists. To understand the scope of the crisis, consider this: The United States is pouring nearly as much money into incentives for new recruits -- almost $300 million -- as it is into international tsunami relief.

"The Army's maxed out here," says retired Gen. Merrill McPeak, who served as Air Force chief of staff under the first President Bush. "The Defense Department and the president seem to be still operating off the rosy scenario that this will be over soon, that this pain is temporary and therefore we'll just grit our teeth, hunker down and get out on the other side of this. That's a bad assumption." The Bush administration has sworn up and down that it will never reinstate a draft. During the campaign last year, the president dismissed the idea as nothing more than "rumors on the Internets" and declared, "We're not going to have a draft -- period." Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld, in an Op-Ed blaming "conspiracy mongers" for "attempting to scare and mislead young Americans," insisted that "the idea of reinstating the draft has never been debated, endorsed, discussed, theorized, pondered or even whispered by anyone in the Bush administration."

more....
http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/story/_/id/6862691?pageid=rs.Home&pageregion=single7&rnd=1106949643712&has-player=true&version=6.0.12.872
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pstans Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 11:45 AM
Response to Original message
1. It is good that this is in Rolling Stone
The issue pertains to the lives of young people and many young people read Rolling Stone. If this article was in say the Wall Street Journal, it would not have as big of effect.
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flamin lib Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 11:47 AM
Response to Original message
2. I was drafted in 1969.
It was a very interesting time to be in the military. Did not serve in Nam, all the action I saw was in Washington D.C. in a riot control battalion.

I didn't enjoy the experience but have come to think that maybe a draft isn't such a bad thing. It has a number of positive aspects.

It makes young people much more politically aware. When you can be shot at you tend to pay attention to those who can control your life.

Short timers come back and tell family and friends what is REALLY going on.

It would make Mom and Dad America pay more attention if their kid is placed in harm's way. My Mom was all for "killin' some commies" until her little boy had to put on the uniform.

It may not be a bad thing.
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globalvillage Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 12:05 PM
Response to Reply #2
4. OMG
You don't have draft-age kids, do you?
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infusionman Donating Member (191 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 10:08 PM
Response to Reply #4
11. I have one boy...
who is eligable as of June 2nd graduation)

I have another eligible in two years.

For all of that, I have a twenty Four Year old daughter just graduating from college in the spring who will be eligable if the draft is re-instated. I say this because I believe the next draft will be politically correct. Except for King Georges daughters that is.
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signmike Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 12:52 PM
Response to Reply #2
7. I was drafted in '66
When I saw "Greetings", I immediately ran down and joined the Navy, and did not go to Nam. I have mixed feelings about the miiltary service. It is an unbelievably confused, obsolete, stupid beauracracy run largely by peope who can't get a job on the outside. Telling the folks at home what really goes on should be a good thing, but I doubt they'd ever believe what you could tell them, I know my people never did. Sometimes I'm not so sure I remember it correctly, myself. ;-) What a waste of 4 years of my life.

While I was in I always felt that if anybody could dodge that experience by any means necessary, by ALL MEANS, do so! In retrospect...and on the other hand...as I look upon the younger generation, I also think SOME TIME in the service of the government would do them some good.

Not war!

Maybe not even the military, and not necessarily 4 years of it, maybe two. And every single person regardless of gender, social status or physical handicap. The mentally challenged are already in.

In charge.
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globalvillage Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 01:46 PM
Response to Reply #7
9. I hear what you're saying, but
the younger generation shouldn't be stereotyped, any more than we should be. My beautiful baby is NOT going to fight in any of GWB's wars, and there is no peace time in this admin's plans.
Sorry, no draft for my child. Let * send his girls.
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Laurab Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 08:58 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. Nor are mine - draft or no draft
I think I already have a damn good idea of what is going on over there. I don't need my kids to come back (if they were lucky enough to come back), to tell me. If there's a draft, it should be a repuke draft only. The ones who back this jackass and his wars of choice, should be the ones who fight them, STARTING with Jenna and Barbara.
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DemoTex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-13-05 05:30 PM
Response to Reply #7
18. I got the "Greetings" in 1968.
I ran down an signed up for pilot training. I ended up flying over 250 air combat missions in Vietnam, Cambodia, and Laos.

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noamnety Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 11:50 AM
Response to Original message
3. The skills draft will have unintended consequences
If they start drafting the people with medical and computer skills, we're going to have some longterm economic problems, as people start shifting away from those career options. It will incentivize people to chose careers that require less education and less critical skills - another push against science, really, as anyone who goes into that field will be putting their life at risk.
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nightperson Donating Member (550 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-13-05 02:35 AM
Response to Reply #3
14. Very good point.
I've been wondering about this for a while.
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fasttense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 12:06 PM
Response to Original message
5. Sorry, I don't buy the lie.
This administration has continually lied and lied about their lies. Sure they say that now. But when they are getting ready to attack Iran and realize there is no other way to get the people they need into the Military they will institute a draft without a second thought. As Rumsfeld said himself,"People lie all the time. They change their minds. It's done all the time in Washington."

He's just telling the draft aged population what it wants to hear, but he is not not telling them the truth.
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illflem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 12:29 PM
Response to Original message
6. Why don't they just outsource
the military to China or India. Save a lot of money and get more qualified people to boot.
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signmike Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-12-05 12:54 PM
Response to Reply #6
8. "to boot' . . . camp? Or to kick around...
heh heh ;-)
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dbeach Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-13-05 01:43 AM
Response to Original message
12. small laff at rense..Drafted in 69..the chikenhawks partied..
http://www.rense.com/
and supported the war that they would NEVER serve in..I forgive everyone for war but its really bummer to see these neo-conthradal chikenhawks screaming for more blood...
I guess that I am ambivalent about the "D' but the middle class would bring an important voice back into the military which is lacking..we can't let the poor and underprivleged do all the dirty work..lots of returning NGs and Reservists are anti-bush...
I screamed and hollered for 2 yrs and made a few good buddies and learned much about life and politics...
I got one daughter who is almost 18..I pray she gets through college..IF I could do it again iI would go to OCS and have more power to criticize the military follies..
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EST Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-13-05 02:12 AM
Response to Reply #12
13. If they are gonna start the draft, it needs to be soon
By the looks of it, the confrontation with Iran is about 1-2 years off and that's the amount of time needed to plan it, finish the bases in Iraq (the reason they need fourteen of them) mobilize the hardware ( the misplacement of nine billion here and four billion there looks way too convenient) and it will take that amount of time to conscript and train the half million troops the chickenhawks think they will need. That 2.3 trillion in bonds the SS is holding must be the big bag for financing the terror for the next ten years.

I am nearly convinced that even now this monster has simply gotten too big and entrenched to kill. Only the destruction of a major part of the world and the larger percentage of the population will provide the blood necessary to satiate the beast and provide the fundies with sufficient companions on voyage to hell...

If (should say when) Iran has the requisite enriched uranium and other weapons, even a non-A war will be dirty enough with dispersed radioactives and chem/bio munitions to poison all but those in especially sealed hermetic shelters. If said conflict goes from merely cold and "dirty" to hot, the resulting nuclear winter should be sufficient to guarantee a new start for whatever biological residue still remains. The beast will be satiated.
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dbeach Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-13-05 11:06 AM
Response to Reply #13
17. Hell is the destination...
and they fully intend to drag us all there...
is there any good and patriotic individuals remaining in govt and the military ???or has it all sold out for that bag of silver...?
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Nimrod Donating Member (999 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-13-05 10:52 AM
Response to Original message
15. Hmm, I wonder
The volunteer millitary has historically been composed mainly of the poor. People with such low earning potential that joining the millitary is one of the few ways they can get a reliable paycheck.

Ever wonder if they're hoping/planning that a side effect of all these budget cuts will be to "encourage" more desperate people to sign up? A draft would be inconvenient for them - how do you explain why wealthy children never seem to get their letters?
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dbeach Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-13-05 11:03 AM
Response to Reply #15
16. great pt
kinda blackmailing the lower middle class into war machine..
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gordianot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-13-05 10:34 PM
Response to Original message
19. My son just completed his para-medic training.
Paid for it himself. Th instructor warned them in their last class, if the draft returns they will be among the first.
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optional Donating Member (6 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-13-05 11:10 PM
Response to Original message
20. The Draft
Liberal Democrats in Congress put the draft on the table last
year to force the issue of who serves. I suppose they figured
that if they broadened the exposure, they'd get a more
responsible use of the military. Of course, they were
forgetting that the sons and daughters of the connected never
have to serve in a combat zone.
There's very little question that this administration has
imperial ambitions in the wider mid-East. An attack on Syria
would be doing Israel's dirty work; while, an attack on Iran
would be another step in pursuit of dominance of the world's
"unfriendly" petroleum reserves (interestingly, Abd'
el Mahdi negotiated resource rights (as opposed to contracts
for extraction) with major petroleum companies in the closing
weeks of the last year -- so much for the Iraqi people's
ownership of their countries resources). If the administration
 seriously believe that the other powers in the world are just
going stand by while it corners the market on this vital
commodity, this is nothing but evidence that they're
delusional and a danger to all life on this planet.
Presumably, mental illness is adequate grounds for
impeachment. 
If impeachment won't work, it seems to me that they're only
going to be able to push the American military establishment
so far before they begin inviting a coup. Although there
doesn't seem to be a lot of talk about this, their policies
have seemed to really open up this possibility over the last
couple of years.
If we're lucky, though, Congress will get some sense and reign
in the executive branch before it really digs us all a long,
not to shallow hole.
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dbeach Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Feb-14-05 01:11 AM
Response to Reply #20
21. Yep
and Welcome..kinda new myself..
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